Wingnut on Wingnut Crime: Beck vs Fundies

The Christian right has long had a dicey relationship with Glenn Beck. On the one hand, he speaks their language and shares most of their views. On the other hand, he’s a Mormon. Some have refused to work with him while others embrace him without a thought. And now he’s furious with those who criticized Liberty University for inviting him to speak there.

Last month, Glenn Beck was invited to deliver a Convocation message at Liberty University where, in addition to delivering a prophetic message that God was coming to settle scores, he also preached Mormon theology, which did not sit well with certain Religious Right activists, such as Janet Mefferd.

On his radio broadcast today, Beck lashed out at “people who claim to be followers of Christ” in “the so-called Christian Right” who are attacking Liberty U for allowing him to speak, saying that they are progressives and “there is no difference between you and the people who are trying to run other people out of the square.”

“You think you’re standing for something,” Beck said, “when indeed you’re standing for hate and bigotry.”

Well Glenn, that’s what they’ve always stood for. And you’re fine with that when the bigotry is aimed at gay people, immigrants and women. You just don’t like it when it’s aimed at you. You’ll pardon me if I don’t shed a tear.

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  • John Pieret

    You’ll pardon me if I don’t shed a tear.

    You’ll pardon me if I laugh my ass off.

  • raven

    NoLibery U. is Southern Baptist.

    The SBC does have an official position on the Mormons. They are Fake xians and all going to hell.

    They also have a long standing conflict. They are both missionary churches. The Mormons send missionaries to the south to convert Baptists. The Baptists send missionaries to Utah to convert…Mormons.

    That being said, their animosity is being toned down. They are both floundering and have found that they hate us more than they hate each other. In modern xian theology, hate conquers everything.

  • Kermit Sansoo

    Were I still a theist, I’d point out that the metaphor* of the Tower of Babble warned that trying to get to Heaven via a human construct (church and doctrine) will inevitably lead to folks babbling incomprehensibly at each other, and being driven apart.

    .

    Note that scientists, real historians, and other that study reality eventually arrive at a consensus. Folks who just make shit up always drift apart, because they have no anchor; they are limited by their imagination and emotional needs (and financial) needs.

    .

    * For sufficiently sophisticated theological philosophies, of course.**

    .

    ** I tried for a sophisticated theological philosophy as a teenager, but by the time I dropped all the bullshit, I had no religion left – only science. (I did almost stall out with Zen, but all the Zen koans seemed to affirm that any attempts to achieve satori were wasted, so…)

  • matty1

    Doesn’t Glenn have enough tears for all of us?

  • StevoR : Free West Papua, free Tibet, let the Chagossians return!

    Aww .. poor Beck.

  • http://timgueguen.blogspot.com timgueguen

    It’s the same accommodation they’ve reached with the more right wing elements of US Catholics over issues like abortion and gay marriage. Catholics may all be going to Hell, but some of them say the right things on those issues, so they’re useful allies. I suspect we’ll eventually see them making friendly with Muslims over similar issues.

  • http://artk.typepad.com ArtK

    “The enemy of my enemy is my friend” — at least most of the time.

  • raven

    SBC’s Richard Land: Romney Not a Christian, Compares …

    www. newsmax. com/Newsfront/romney-mormonism…/2012/…/431034

    Feb 29, 2012 – TV he does not consider Mitt Romney and other Mormons to be Christians — and … Asked whether the SBC views Romney and fellow Mormons, whose church is …. Officials from President Obama on down warned of the dire …

    Here is one example of what laughingly passes for thinking among the fundies. Richard Land is a vaguely humanoid toad, an all around hater, and a former high SBC official.

    The poll, which had a 3 percent margin of error, also found that 53 percent of evangelical Christians don’t consider Mormonism a Christian religion.

    Which is no big deal. The Mormon church also has an official position on all the other 42,000 xian sects. They are all Fake and the LDS church is the only true xian church.

  • D. C. Sessions

    It’s the same accommodation they’ve reached with the more right wing elements of US Catholics over issues like abortion and gay marriage.

    You do know that the Baptists didn’t give a hoot about abortion until it became a useful political tool, don’t you? Back in the 70s it was pretty much a Catholic thing. So the alliance with the Catholics preceded the agreement on abortion, rather than resulting from it.

  • Trebuchet

    I don’t consider Moronism a Christian religion either. Not that it matters either way. One cult is as good as the next.

  • raven

    One cult is as good as the next.

    As an ex-xian, I don’t care either.

    But they are cute when they try to think.

  • jba55

    I think “beck” should be the new “retarded”. Not the medical term but the junior high level insult that is now, rightly, on the outs for being so beck.

    @10: out of curiosity why do you not think they are christian? The whole religion is simply choked up with the Jesus.

  • matty1

    Absent Jesus wandering around telling people who is in his gang I can think of only two ways to tell if a group is Christian.

    1. If they say they are

    2. If they are more like other self declared Christians than they are like non-Christians.

    From a cursory scan I’d say Mormons pass on the first but maybe not on the second. Things like prophets after Jesus and separate scriptures* put them certainly on the edge of the Christian set if not outside it.

    *Yes there are disagreements between Catholics, Protestants and Orthodox about which books belong in the bible but these are mostly about the status of bits of the ‘old testament’, what the Mormons do is more akin to adding a third testament.

  • jba55

    @13 A fourth and fifth, too and those ones are even fruitier. For example the Pearl of Great Price lets us know that the throne of god is near a planet named Kolob. Or maybe it’s a star, there is a great deal of sophisticated theological debate about it.

  • StevoR : Free West Papua, free Tibet, let the Chagossians return!

    @jba55 :

    @10: out of curiosity why do you not think they are christian? The whole religion is simply choked up with the Jesus.

    I can’t speak for #10 Trebuchet but personally I think there are more than enough doctrinal / scriptural points of difference and the whole new fextra ounder in the conman talking through his hat that who founded it to say that Mormonism isn’t Christianity and is another cult instead.

  • StevoR : Free West Papua, free Tibet, let the Chagossians return!

    How the ‘f’ did that ‘f’ move from in front of founder to in front of extra there? Sigh.

  • http://en.uncyclopedia.co/wiki/User:Modusoperandi Modusoperandi

    D. C. Sessions “You do know that the Baptists didn’t give a hoot about abortion until it became a useful political tool, don’t you? Back in the 70s it was pretty much a Catholic thing.”

    It was called “the Catholic issue”.

     

    “So the alliance with the Catholics preceded the agreement on abortion, rather than resulting from it.”

    (Southern Baptists + Brown v Board of Education + [“Christian Academies” – tax exemption]) + (conservative American Catholics + Roe v Wade) = The modern Christian Right.

    Oddly, the SB became far more Catholic than the other way around, as could be seen most recently in the curfuffle over birth control.

  • Trebuchet

    @15:

    I can’t speak for #10 Trebuchet…

    Actually, you did a pretty good job of it. That’s pretty much it in a nutshell.

  • raven

    There is no xian central so who is a Real xian and who is a Fake xian is all opinion. Unless they fight a war like they used to and then the survivors get to claim to be the Real xians. Dead people don’t get to vote.

    1. A lot of serious observers of xianity, both insider and outsider claim there is no such religion as xianity. The various cults have evolved and speciated. It’s more correct to say there are many xianities, sharing few similarities other than the name “xian” somewhere or another.

    That is my own view. The fundies are about the exact opposite of my natal sect. We could call them devil worshippers and not be far off. Their main causes were world peace and social justice. The fundies’ are hate and lies.

    2. I wouldn’t call the Mormons xians either. No big deal, I find people calling me a xian insulting these days.

    A. Mormon god and jesus aren’t very powerful. They believe gods were just people who climbed the Celestial ladder. God is just a guy who has been around longer, lives with his father on planet Kolob, accumulated a herd of goddess wives, and produced jesus with one of them. Jesus is also just a guy who has been around longer. God and jesus only control one planet, earth.

    All 7 billion people on earth were spirit babies in heaven, made by god and his fleet of wives. Which means Mormon god spends all his time fucking. No wonder he isn’t around much these days. 7 billion children is a lot of sex.

    B. This is the big problem IMO. There are a large and maybe infinite number of gods and goddesses. It’s polytheism run amuck. Anyone who is a male Mormon polygamist can end up as a god, which is the big carrot in that religion.

    C. All the gods have herds of goddess wives. Which means that we all have a Celestial goddess mother as well as the dad god. These goddesses are so important that no one even knows what their names are.

    Sexism is alive and well in Mormon heaven. You can tell the whole religion was made up by an overaged adolescent. Their mythology is baroque and reflects garden variety 19th century stereotypes.

  • Michael Heath

    Ed writes about Glenn Beck:

    you’re fine with that when the bigotry is aimed at gay people, immigrants and women

    Along with black people, secularists, reasonable people, people who care about results rather than tribalism, non-nihilists, non-conservative Christians, people who did well in school, experts, etc., etc., etc.

  • Kermit Sansoo

    I would suggest that a Christian is someone who believe that Jesus not only existed, but that he was uniquely important to religious matters. Hence, for instance, although both Muslims and Hindus accept Jesus as an inspired teacher, neither see him as uniquely so.

    “The condition of being Christian” does not require conforming to anyone’s opinion on what the bible says, or anything like that. If someone says they are a Christian, I take their word for it.

  • naturalcynic

    Remember, it’s not a religion, it’s a philosophy

  • anubisprime

    Just goes to prove that when all ‘others’ have been burnt or deep sixed or disposed of in a typically biblical manner …then they WILL start on each other..it is what they do!

    Self destructive and fucking dangerous to the core…

  • tfkreference

    Kermit @3: thanks for mentioning that about the Tower of Babel. Not that any arguments from the bible are valid, but it’s fun to bring up the ones that contradict believers’ beliefs, just to hear them weasel their way around it (like Exodus 21:22 re abortion).

  • http://polrant@blogspot.com democommie

    “I suspect we’ll eventually see them making friendly with Muslims over similar issues.”

    Until they think that they’ve won, then the infighting will begin. I can see it now, though, a conference:

    “Hatred, The NEW Ecumenism!”

    “Which is no big deal. The Mormon church also has an official position on all the other 42,000 xian sects. They are all Fake and the LDS church is the only true xian church.”

    “what the Mormons do is more akin to adding a third testament.”

    I’m seeing a movie’s climax, something like the end of “Spartacus”. Except in this case the hills are covered with the assembled leaders of every Christian and KKKristianist sect. When the booming voice of GOD sez:

    “Who among yon multitude is a TROO BLEEVER(TM) and wil be allowed to take advantage of the eternal pay and benefits package at GOD, Inc.?”

    One preacher stands up and sez:

    “It is I, LORD; I am the leader of the ONLY group that follows the way laid out by you and JESUS*”.

    He no sooner utters those words then a largish rock flies out of he crowd, hits him in the head and kills him instantly. The stoner sez:

    “No, LORD, it is I who am the TRU BLEIVER (TM)**!”.

    Much hilarity, denunciation and mayhem ensues; sorta like Thunderdomedeathcage MurKKKin Idolator.

    * Just a minor quibble, DUDE, do you even know wtf “Googlemap” is? I mean, following your instructions 99.9999….% of everyone who ever lived is STILL going to burn in HELL, 4EVAAAAAAAAAAAAH!

    ** Only a complete effin’ moran would not know that using, TROO BLEEVER (TM), is like putting a sign on your back that says, “Smite me, I’m hellspawn!”.