The Christian Nation Utopia

Jane Orient, the executive director of the Association of American Physicians and Surgeons (that’s the wingnut version of the real doctor’s group), doesn’t seem to grasp basic logic. She quotes President Obama’s statement about America not being just a Christian nation, then fantasizes about the heaven-like utopia the country would be if it were a Christian nation.

Barack Obama said on June 28, 2006: “Whatever we once were, we are no longer a Christian nation—at least, not just. We are also a Jewish nation, a Muslim nation, a Buddhist nation, and a Hindu nation, and a nation of nonbelievers.”

To test whether this is true or not, we might consider what a Christian nation would look like.

Uh, no. Your fantasy about what a Christian nation might look like has absolutely nothing to do with whether the president’s statement is true or not. How do you graduate medical school and not understand such basic logical reasoning? And would you want a doctor this incapable of thinking logically to diagnose what’s wrong with you? And the fantasy she comes up with is simply hilarious in its utter delusion.

The nation would not be saturated with pornography. You could turn on the television without seeing programming that treats promiscuity as normal. Boys would be taught to respect women, and girls would demand respect from men. Women would not be for using, then dumping, or for enslaving. Faithful marriage would be the ideal and the norm. One-third or more of the young women would not have a sexually transmitted disease, or endure the heartbreak of abortion and abandonment by the father of their child. Men would be working to support and protect their families and their communities, not out seeking thrills.

Of course there would be still be some crime, which would be punished swiftly and justly. But drive-by shootings, gang rape, rioting, and looting would be virtually unheard of. Children could safely play outside and walk to school. No need for SWAT teams if children have fathers.

Everybody would know what a crime was: using force or fraud against your neighbor. Having a dissenting opinion or violating an obscure rule would not qualify. Government would imitate Jesus: “My yoke is easy, and my burden is light.” No ten thousand bureaucratic commandments. No prison terms for things like filling in a mud puddle or not filing a form. No excessive taxation to finance Leviathan and its wars and social engineering. A Biblical tax rate would be closer to 10 percent than to 50 percent. No Stasi-like agency collecting data on every tiny infraction from childhood onward that could be used to ruin lives. No Chinese Communist-style indoctrination or self-incrimination sessions.

Yes, yes, yes. Because all those officially Christian countries from the 4th to the 18th centuries were paragons of moral virtue, completely free of crime and lying and illicit sex and all that bad stuff.

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  • sh3baproject

    utopia is such an omtipistic person’s word :/

  • Chiroptera

    Utopians are dangerous. Utopians’ vision of utopia usually don’t take into account real human natura and how real people live in the real world. When they get into power, they are shocked that their utopia doesn’t come into being. Then they blame the dissidents and the traitors hidden in our midsts. Then the purges, witch hunts, gulags, and death squads go into action.

  • Randomfactor

    How do you graduate medical school and not understand such basic logical reasoning?

    Good memory and physical stamina. You do know what they call the guy who graduates last in his class at medical school, right?

  • Synfandel

    I’ve seen this one. The deputy keeps his bullet in his buttoned breast pocket and the drunk locks himself in the jail cell every Saturday night to sleep it off.

  • raven

    The heyday of xian nations was the era know as the Dark Ages.

    They weren’t much fun.

  • John Pieret

    To test whether this is true or not, we might consider what a Christian nation would look like.

    Uh, no. Your fantasy about what a Christian nation might look like has absolutely nothing to do with whether the president’s statement is true or not.

    Well, actually, it does. If we assume, for the sake of argument, that her fantasy Christian nation is what a Christian nation should be, she has just proven that neither this country nor, indeed, any other country in history has ever been a Christian nation.

  • Mr Ed

    … and each week the Beaver would get into some light hearted, harmless trouble and in the end everyone would learn a lesson.

  • https://www.facebook.com/mary.shira.14 Shira Mary

    This is a perfect example of what I call “grandpa religion” — the nostalgia for the religious practice that one imagines was happening when their parents were small children and one’s grandparents were in their prime. People always remember the world being better ordered when they were kids — and why not, since kids are shielded from as much insecurity as possible? And one’s parents’ childhood memories are even cozier. Add to that the fact that America was in a period of economic prosperity, assured growth, and self-confidence from the end of WWII to the 70s, and the stage is set for an awful lot of wishful thinking!

  • Jordan Genso

    I don’t understand.

    Of course there would be still be some crime…

    Followed up by:

    But drive-by shootings, gang rape, rioting, and looting would be virtually unheard of.

    Is she suggesting that there are some crimes which are Christian-like (so they will “still be” around), and others which are not (they’ll be “virtually unheard of”)?

    Seems strange to suggest that a fundamental part of having a Christian nation would be to have criminal activity, but only certain types of criminal activity. And considering the only crimes that will apparently be eliminated are those strongly associated with inner-city minority communities, it makes me wonder if she thinks having a “Christian” nation also means having a “white” nation?

  • Loqi

    Uh…the tax rate for pretty much everyone already is closer to 10% than it is to 50%…

  • http://www.thelosersleague.com theschwa

    “No prison terms for things like filling in a mud puddle or not filing a form.”

    — No, instead it is eternal punishment for looking at your neighbor’s ass the wrong way.

    “No excessive taxation to finance Leviathan and its wars”

    — Like the crusades?

    “No Stasi-like agency collecting data on every tiny infraction from childhood onward that could be used to ruin lives. ”

    — You mean like the way God monitors everything we do and tracks every tiny infraction to ruin our eternal souls with eternal damnation?

  • matty1

    What I find fascinating is what you get if you invert her claims about this hypothetical Christian nation – which I take to be her view of America today. Apparently it is a place where.

    -Women find having an abortion heartbreaking

    -Men do not work

    -There are no or few fathers

    -Children cannot play outside or walk to school

    -Filling in mud puddles is an imprisonable offence

    -The tax rate is 50% (of what – income, wealth, expenditure?)

    -Maoist self criticism forms part of the education system.

    I suspect most of this is false but is any of it true?

  • dmcclean

    “No Chinese Communist-style indoctrination or self-incrimination sessions.”

    Does she mean sermons and confession?

  • dmcclean

    @12

    The mud puddle thing is probably true, if you do it without the right permits, and knowingly enough that you are prosecuted instead of warned.

    “Mud puddle” is the Wingnut word for “wetlands”. It turns out those are actually pretty important, and when we had only a godly “have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth”-level of understanding of ecology we filled a lot of them in. So we need most of the ones we have left.

    Luckily, now we know better, so we’ve decided to maybe not do that so much when there are ways to avoid it.

    In English this is known as “much needed progress”, in Wingnut it’s called “tyranny”.

  • Chiroptera

    No prison terms for things like…not filing a form.

    Is she talking about income taxes? ‘Cause I think that the IRS gives you the option of letting them figure out how much taxes you owe.

  • dugglebogey

    I happen to monitor the internet usage of a hospitals guest wifi in 20 locations all over the country, including one in Salt Lake City. Guess which one hits the firewall filter for ‘sex’ the most?

  • blf

    dmcclean, Thanks for explaining what is (probably) meant by “mud puddle” — that bit had me seriously befuddled. (The rest of the time I was attempting to pound my desk & keyboard into the increasingly concave floor by repeated, forceful, and rapid application of the forehead.)

  • chris69

    — No, instead it is eternal punishment for looking at your neighbor’s ass the wrong way.

    I would never look at my neighbor’s ass in the wrong way, their cow maybe.

  • dhall

    #7 Mr. Ed – Or maybe Wilbur would get himself into a jam that only a talking palomino could solve for him. Sorry, couldn’t resist.

  • http://en.uncyclopedia.co/wiki/User:Modusoperandi Modusoperandi

    Because all those officially Christian countries from the 4th to the 18th centuries were paragons of moral virtue, completely free of crime and lying and illicit sex and all that bad stuff.

    And, don’t forget, deregulation and low, low taxes.

  • hexidecima

    “No ten thousand bureaucratic commandments.”

    so, here we have again a TrueChristian who says that their god is wrong. I guess those 700+ plus bureaucratic commandments by their god e.g. what fabric you can where, who can work when, etc, are just horrible and wrong.

    Thanks, dear TrueChristian, glad to know that you aren’t about to follow all of JC’s dad’s commands like JC said to do.

  • http://Reallyawakeguy.blogspot.com somnus

    “girls would demand respect from men.”

    But they’d do so silently and obediently.

    “Women would not be for using… or for enslaving.”

    Has she read her Bible? Those are the exact roles it assigns for women.

  • Akira MacKenzie

    Having a dissenting opinion or violating an obscure rule would not qualify.

    Unless you wish to create or view erotic material, have no desire to to be forced into marriage or an unwanted gender role, want to decide when and with whom you have sex with, want absolute control of YOUR reproductive system, point out that “drive-by-shootings, gang rape, rioting, and looting” is right-wing code for “non-whites,” accept that a 10% top tax rate is fiscal suicide, and most importantly that your deity is a primitive myth and your filthy religion is a barbaric sham.

    I’m 100% sure you’d sic the SWAT teams on us, wouldn’t you Jane?

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1608524690 gregorypeterson

    Get thee to the Bible Belt.

    Oh wait…there was little things like terrorism to perpetuate slavery and Jim Crow…but I’m sure you can overlook little things like that. I call it “Bible Belt Amnesia.”

  • birgerjohansson

    A land without regulations….

    Just about every rule of the FAA is built on lessons from a crash. Other regulations may not be based on such spectacular disasters, but we no longer use asbestos for a reason. Tobacco is no longer allowed in every space because of the C word.

    Your landlord will be required to follow fire safety rules for a reason.

    The time without regulations was a time when human life was cheap.

  • Jared James

    Anybody not me think it non-coincidental that a classical scholar like Thomas More, who could read and write Classical Greek, would name his book Utopia (Non-Place or No Place) rather than Eutopia (True or Real Place)?

    Yeah, me either.

  • martinc

    raven @ 5:

    The heyday of xian nations was the era know as the Dark Ages.

    They weren’t much fun.

    Ms. Orient is quite correct, however, that in the Christian nations of the Dark Ages there wasn’t a single drive-by shooting, so … swings and roundabouts, I guess, right?

    Mr Ed @ 7:

    each week the Beaver would get into some light hearted, harmless trouble

    Actually I think that’s one of the things she’s complaining about.

  • eric

    and each week the Beaver would get into some light hearted, harmless trouble and in the end everyone would learn a lesson.

    Every time someone brings this series up, I hear June saying “gee Ward, don’t you think you went a little too hard on the Beaver last night?”

  • greg1466

    She’s almost exactly backwards on every point about a true Christian Nation. She clearly needs to do some serious studying of that document that describes how a Christian Nation should work. What’s it called? Oh yeah…the Bible.