Fischer: Jesus Would Support Torture

I find it amusing that some Christians point to Jesus’ command to love thy neighbor to get out of all the barbarism of the Old Testament, like slavery is wrong now because we’re supposed to love our neighbor. Now Bryan Fischer says that Jesus would approve of torture, because of course Bryan Fischer would say that.

Fischer argued on his radio program today that the Bible makes certain things permissible during times of war that would not be permissible during times of peace, adding that Jesus is a “warrior” who would probably approve of torture.

“Christianity is not a pacifist religion,” Fischer said. “The God that we serve is described in Exodus 15 as a ‘man of war.’ Now we often think of gentle Jesus, meek and mild, but let’s not forget, according to Romans 19:13, when he comes back … he will be riding a white horse and wearing his own robe, dipped in blood. That is a robe that is worn by a warrior who is inflicting casualties on the foe. So this is gentle Jesus, meek and mild; when we comes back, his robe is going to be dipped in blood because he too is a warrior.”

From “turn the other cheek” to “let’s waterboard those fuckers!” I’ll take sociopathy for $1000, Alex.

httpv://youtu.be/ai4tgTChw9c

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What Are Your Thoughts?leave a comment
  • roggg

    I think he might be confusing William Wallace and Jesus.

  • dingojack

    Oh that must be the special ‘extended version’ of the Bible — with the bonus chapters after chapter 16. 😉

    Dingo

  • Sastra

    Jesus always turns out to resemble the people who model themselves on him.

  • matty1

    He’d be especially keen on the use of beatings, withholding food and water and of course nailing people to things.

  • http://en.uncyclopedia.co/wiki/User:Modusoperandi Modusoperandi

    John 3:16 (revised): “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should treat his neighbor like shit.”

  • D. C. Sessions

    And don’t forget the rape. Jesus was big on rape.

  • busterggi

    Wonder how many times Fischer has mocked Islam for claiming to be the relgion of peace because Christianity is?

  • http://heb712.blogspot.com heddle

    Ed,

    I find it amusing that some Christians point to Jesus’ command to love thy neighbor to get out of all the barbarism of the Old Testament, like slavery is wrong now because we’re supposed to love our neighbor.

    There is no reason to be amused by that. It is perfectly sensible exegesis. As with all biblical interpretation there are competing, often opposite conclusions (often self-serving), but the conclusion that the second greatest commandment (and the first greatest commandment regarding how we are to treat one another) in the NT is “love your neighbor as yourself” would preclude slavery is, at the very least, arguable.

    According to the NT we are in the era of: a new (and better) covenant. A new (and better) law. A new (and better) citizenship. A new (and better) high priest. With new (and better) sacraments. It is not at all surprising that the rule of life for the OT, which was for a nation that ceased to exist, is radically different from the rule of life for the NT.

  • http://en.uncyclopedia.co/wiki/User:Modusoperandi Modusoperandi

    heddle, I was under a covenant once. It was comfy, like being covered by a warm hug. Goose down covenants are the best.

  • marcus

    Sastra @ 3 “Jesus always turns out to resemble the people who model themselves on him.”

    Funny that. The Jesus I grew up believing in was kind, forgiving, spoke about love and kindness, and helping the poor and oppressed. In fact, the main reason that i became an agnostic pagan atheist is that I couldn’t reconcile that person with the OT god that enjoyed torturing people (forever).

    The Fischer’s of the world are not even any good at their own religion, much less telling anyone else how they should live.

  • Childermass

    dingojack,

    Is it not written: “Blessed are the cruel, the vindictive, and those who don’t let the law get in their way”?

  • caseloweraz

    Yes, that’s in the Book of Alberto — or is it the Book of Yoo?

  • Mr Ed

    Who knew the Romans were the good guys using God endorsed methods against that no good, rabble rouser Christ.

    The takeaway on Easter should be that sometimes governments have to do things that make people uncomfortable to preserve society.

  • Childermass

    I thought it was the Gospel According to Dick.

  • http://festeringscabofrealityblogspot.com fifthdentist

    So Jesus is coming back for battle with a horse and sword?

    That will put him at a severe disadvantage against tanks, artillery, helicopter gunships, drones, jets fighters and rifles.

    Hell, the Italian army could defeat a bunch of guys on horseback armed only with ancient weapons. (Probably).

  • Michael Heath

    If Jesus = God and there’s only one God, then Fischer can reference the Bible and find examples that Jesus is OK with humans torturing given OT edicts from God to humans on their treating other humans.

    Fischer can also argue that Jesus is A-OK with torture given that’s what Bible has him threatening to do for all eternity. So in this case U.S. conservative Christian support for torture would be merely emulating the god they celebrate (though subconsciously). I don’t expect Fischer to make this argument because I’ve yet to meet even one Hell-believing Christian able to confront the ramifications of their god torturing some for eternity.

    However the last argument can also come with a twist; that it’s not OK for humans to torture, in spite of the Bible presenting Jesus as the ultimate torturer of all. That’s consistent with biblical morality, which is based on submission to God’s extortions rather than some behaving in a consistently objective standard – such as minimizing the suffering of humans and allowing life in general to optimally flourish. The Bible’s morality is also objective, submit, but it’s not consistent as we see throughout the Bible when it comes to how God treats people and how he commands we treat others.

    Biblical contradictions is exactly why we can make the case either way on whether the Bible’s OK with people torturing others or not. The Bible’s content is also why we can predict with high certainty that conservative Christians will support torture against ‘the other.’ The latest WSJ/NBC poll validates this as well given 77% of Republicans support sleep deprivation against detainees. A literally read Bible, or one perceived to be inerrant, inspires a pro-torture position. That and a culture that develops conservatives into authoritarians.

  • eric

    Heddle:

    the conclusion that the second greatest commandment (and the first greatest commandment regarding how we are to treat one another) in the NT is “love your neighbor as yourself” would preclude slavery is, at the very least, arguable.

    Ah yes, the new covenant of the NT. The covenant expressed in Philemon, in which Paul decides to send an escaped slave back to his master, telling the slaveowner to treat the returned slave better than his other slaves, because hey, the escapee he’s sending back is Christian now. So kinda treat him like a brother…but if your brother was a slave.

    You mean THAT new testament preclusion of slavery?

    You are right that there are competing and often self-serving conclusions one can draw from the bible. But it’s not a question of OT vs. NT. The NT itself – your “new covenant” – is filled with competing passages and lessons. Your exegisis is common and one I would frankly prefer all Christians agree with, but that doesn’t mean I think your exegesis is any more ‘true’ to the fundamental lessons of the bible than any other. Its all cherry picking – even the good interpretations are cherry picking. Because the fundamental lessons are inconsistent and contradictory.

  • anubisprime

    Christians seem ever so confused as to what kind of jeebus they want to worship…most moderates goes for the wishy washy turn the other cheek one while a few sociopaths prefer the blood and guts of a rabid god and a jeebus wielding sword and wearing a blood soaked tunics…

    They love to splutter and spit dire warnings of a doom befalling atheists, teh gheys, furriners’, wimmin’s and ‘merica depending on how much theater they can wrangle out of whatever they are raving about at that moment …

    I suppose when you make it up you are free to choose what suits depending on psychopathic tendencies and spittle available.

  • http://heb712.blogspot.com heddle

    eric,

    Ah yes, the new covenant of the NT. The covenant expressed in Philemon, in which Paul decides to send an escaped slave back to his master, telling the slaveowner to treat the returned slave better than his other slaves, because hey, the escapee he’s sending back is Christian now

    Really, why do you want to bullshit? If you want to make a point, at least try to be honest.

    In fact Paul doesn’t say “treat him better than his other slaves”. I call bullshit. Paul never mentions other slaves at all. You have some special secret Pauline correspondence? You have some unpublished history of Philemon that mentions other slaves? Or are you just pulling stuff out of your ass and using a snarky condescending tone because you have no argument? (I choose the latter.)

    In fact, Paul pleads for Philemon to accept Onesimus as a free man, offers to pay his debt, and even pressures Philemon that he “owes” him (Paul.) Paul was obeying the law, not endorsing it. A man sending back a slave because he endorsed the institution would have used much different language.

    I hate it when people can’t even try to fucking argue honestly. But thanks for reminding me why I spend less time on blogs than I used to. A total waste of fucking breath.

  • lorn

    This doesn’t surprise me.

    I’ve been brow beat into attending church services that would be, by any sane standard, considered torture.

  • Michael Heath

    heddle writes:

    I hate it when people can’t even try to fucking argue honestly. But thanks for reminding me why I spend less time on blogs than I used to. A total waste of fucking breath.

    I suggest taking on the best arguments and ignore the worst.

  • http://www.pandasthumb.org Area Man

    Just remember this when anyone tells you you can’t be moral without God. Know Jesus, no peace.