Ultra-Orthodox Jewish Sect Bans Women from Driving

In yet another example of how the extremists of every religion have far more in common with one another than they do with many of their own co-religionists, an ultra-Orthodox sect in London has forbid women from driving, saying that if they drive their children to school, the children will be turned away.

The education secretary has condemned an ultra-Orthodox Jewish sect’s decision to ban women from driving, saying the edict was “completely unacceptable in modern Britain”.

Nicky Morgan, who is also the minister for women and equalities, spoke as the Department for Education launched an investigation into the order issued by the Belz sect, which runs two schools in Stamford Hill, north London. A letter to parents said that, from later this year, children driven to school by women would be turned away.

Parents in the area defended the ban on Friday, saying it was part of the choice they made when they agreed to live within the Belz community. Women rejected the characterisation that they were oppressed, and the schools wrote to Morgan, saying the notice had been misrepresented.

The group runs Talmud Torah Machzikei Hadass, a boys’ primary school, and Beis Malka, a primary school for girls. Both have been rated good by Ofsted.

The schools had said that, from August, any child driven to school by their mother would be turned away at the school gates. The letter said the ban was based on the recommendations of Rabbi Yissachar Dov Rokeach, the Belzer spiritual leader in Israel.

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  • StevoR

    Well they wouldn’t be the first but shame on them anyhow..

  • StevoR

    Extremists and not mainstream. Let’s not forget or misrepresent. But yeah.

  • StevoR

    the ban was based on the recommendations of Rabbi Yissachar Dov Rokeach, the Belzer spiritual leader in Israel.

    says who eh?

  • John Pieret

    OK, in the US they’d be allowed to make their own stupid rules for a private school, supported by the religion and its adherents But, presumably, this is a government-supported school that taxpayers help fund. The solution in the US is simple … stop giving them government money! Try it UK!

  • John Pieret

    Oh, and BTW, isn’t this an imposition of Sharia law?

  • StevoR

    @ ^ John Pieret : Sharia nope. Kosher maybe?

  • John Pieret

    StevoR:

    There’s a difference?

  • StevoR

    @ ^ Yup.

  • StevoR

    Similarities plenty thereof sure but also a few differences too.

  • StevoR

    Jews rarely behead people for breaking Kosher laws for starters… in fact, y’know Jews rarely fucken behead anyone for anything. Sharia law advocates like the Saudi wahabis and Daesh JIhadists OTOH ..

  • John Pieret

    Jews rarely behead people for breaking Kosher laws for starters

    Have you read Numbers 31? (To be fair, I don’t think it is real history but that doesn’t mean that the assholes described herein don’t.}

  • StevoR

    @ ^ John Pieret : You seen Jews doing that lately?

    Midianites disappeared long ago. If they were – which probably yeah but thousands of years ago,. Let’s deal with the here and now eh?

    (The Palestinians have had a raw deal sure – but they’ve also had more than enough chances offered to them to make peace and just get along if that was what they really wanted. Israel withdrew from Gaza and gave that to ’em remember -and remember what happened next?

  • StevoR

    Hint : They fired rockets from there into Israel. Also voted Hamas into power.

  • StevoR

    Why? Still beats me ask them.

  • StevoR

    But you can’t say Israel didn’t try to make peace and sacrifice (relatively) huge areas if land it captured at high cost in lives , sweat and tears in doing so .. Have you looked at size of Israel vs its neighbours on an atlas or globe lately?

    Remember here Jordan was orignally part of the Mandate and also Israel returned the whole Sinai Peninsula to Egypt too ,,

  • John Pieret

    You seen Jews doing that lately?

    Look, I don’t want to get into this again … and I thought you had forsworn this argument. But the recent actions in Gaza were not so far from Numbers 31 as to make the Israeli government an innocent bystander in the Mideast. I’m sorry I can’t be an unappologic supporter of Israel and can’t make a case why people should be killed … but you can’t wash that away just because they are Arabs … any more than the Muslims can do the same to Christians.

  • dingojack

    Uh – Stevo, what lands did Israel give up?

    currently; UN partition proposal, April 1956.

    Dingo

  • dingojack

    Although what Israel’s territorial ambitions have to with a religious group banning mothers from picking up their kids from school…

    Dingo

  • zenlike

    O good, it was 2 seconds about how some jews are extremists but StevoR the islamophobe jumped in to divert attention away towards the eebil mooslims.

  • colnago80

    Re John Pieret @ #16

    Well, US Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, General Martin Dempsey opined that the IDF went to extraordinary lengths to minimize civilian casualties during the recent action in the Gaza Strip, to the extent that he sent a team to see what lessons could be learned from their experience. In my opinion, they would have been amply justified in applying Hama Rules to the denizens of that pesthole. By trying to be humane, they only encourage the Hamas terrorists that run the place to try again in the near future. The only language the Hamas terrorists understand is the mailed fist.

    http://www.haaretz.com/news/diplomacy-defense/1.625194

  • Al Dente

    Islamophobe #2 makes an appearance. Can’t have anything nasty said about the Jews, can you StevoR or colnago? You have to tell us “…but the ebil muslins….”

  • colnago80

    Re Al Dente @ #21

    Some Muslims are evil. Hizbollah, Hamas, ISILfor starters. Of course, to the politically correct, they really aren’t Muslims. No true Scotsman per chance.

    By the way, we may shortly be faced with a worse situation in Syria. An Arab news outlet in London is reporting that the Assad Regime is facing collapse and that Russia and Hizbollah are getting ready to throw Assad under the bus. As bad as the human rights situation is now in that country, collapse of the government will make it even worse. My question is, how the hell did we arrive at the current situation in the Arab World?

  • John Pieret

    General Martin Dempsey opined that the IDF went to extraordinary lengths to minimize civilian casualties

    Is that the same General Dempsey who condones killing American civilians with drone strikes without minimal rights to trial?

    Look … I’m not saying that either the US or Israel are “bad guys” … but neither are they the “good guys” … the world ain’t nearly that black or white.

  • colnago80

    Re John Pieret @ #23

    In the Middle East, there are no good guys, only bad, very bad, terrible, and horrible guys.

  • doublereed

    Why are we talking about Israel? This is in the UK.

    Which frankly amazes me. This is what I would expect from Orthodox crazies in Israel.

  • colnago80

    Re doublereed @ #25

    Which frankly amazes me. This is what I would expect from Orthodox crazies in Israel.

    Or certain parts of New York City.

  • Holms

    #18 dingojack

    Although what Israel’s territorial ambitions have to with a religious group banning mothers from picking up their kids from school…

    You’ve forgotten that this is War Crimes Apologist Stevor, who can turn anything that remotely references Judaism or Islam into Israel vs. Palestine.

    #20 War Crimes Apologist colnago80

    Well, US Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, General Martin Dempsey opined that the IDF went to extraordinary lengths to minimize civilian casualties during the recent action in the Gaza Strip, to the extent that he sent a team to see what lessons could be learned from their experience.

    He was either knowingly lying or fooled by lies. The whole ‘extraordinary lengths’ bullshit is being questioned even by Israeli soldiers.

  • jaybee

    Like that Christopher Walken skit on SNL, all I can say is this thread needs more StevoR. Christ, 11 of the first 15 posts were by the same guy.

  • colnago80

    Re Holms @ #27

    You’ve forgotten that this is War Crimes Apologist Stevor

    And this Holms, apologist for the Hamas murder boys.

    He was either knowingly lying or fooled by lies.

    Of course, the notion that those IDF soldiers might be exaggerating never occurred to Holms, who is ready at the drop of a hat to bash Israel. All I can say is that bad as things are for the Palestinians in the Gaza Strip and the West Bank, they are far worse in the Yarmouk Palestinian refugee camp north of Damascus which was attacked last summer by the Syrian Army and is now under attack by the ISIL.

    Now I’m no fan of the Palestinians but it has to be said that they gave a much better account of themselves then did the Iraqi Army in Ramadi.

    http://goo.gl/eGwkSq

    http://goo.gl/iPnCYF

  • eric

    I just love @21 followed by @22. It really drives home the point about just how right @21 is.

    @10:

    Jews rarely behead people for breaking Kosher laws for starters…

    Its not murder, but withholding education from children until the women in your community accept an unequal, subservient role is still pretty damn nasty, backwards, and bigoted.

  • colnago80

    Re eric @ #31

    Another apologist for the ISIL rears his head.

  • dingojack

    Is a mother driving to school to pick up their kids really, secretly an eevuuulll supporter of ISIL now?

    Dingo

  • eric

    @31 – you just can’t do it, can you? Just can’t stay on topic. Even when its pointed out to you, you reply with a reference to bad-behaving muslims. Its getting to the point of being farcical.

  • colnago80

    Re eric @ #33

    I hate to point this out to eric but the thread was sent off-topic by zenlike @ #19.

  • dingojack

    SLC – if you want blame someone — Stevo (#10)!

    Dingo

  • Holms

    #29 colnago80

    And this Holms, apologist for the Hamas murder boys.

    I have never, not once, condoned murder, indiscriminate fire etc. from Hamas or any other group. This is because unlike yourself and StevoR, I don’t excuse actions based on who they come from. Note the difference: I condemn such war crimes without exception, you condemn them unless they come from Israel or the U.S. in support of Israel.

    Of course, the notion that those IDF soldiers might be exaggerating never occurred to Holms, who is ready at the drop of a hat to bash Israel.

    Funny how people denigrating Israel are automatically assumed to be dishonest, with no such possibility admitted for Israel apologists. Hint: if people can lie or bee lied to on one team, it’s possible on the other team too because they are all human and humans lie.

    #31

    Re eric @ #31

    Another apologist for the ISIL rears his head.

    Notice a person that has not condoned anything done by ISIL, or even mentioned them, is dubbed an ISIL apologist purely for making a perfectly true observation re. keeping women uneducated and subservient being backwards and bigoted. It is apparent that only slavish agreement with everything Israel ever does will suffice for colnago80, anything less is characterised as agreeing with IS / Hamas.

    Fucking idiot.

  • zenlike

    colnago80 says

    Re eric @ #33

    I hate to point this out to eric but the thread was sent off-topic by zenlike @ #19.

    That was in reply to multiple posts by SteveoR.

    Is it just will-full ignorance or just blind hatred for anyone who makes a point against (extremist) jews?

  • zenlike

    Also, calling someone an ISIL sympathiser who just points out youa re not staying on topic? colnago, youan re a

    I think this thread is a prime example why colnago/SLC and StevoR should just not be taken seriously on anything to do with the middle east.

  • zenlike

    Woops posted too soon:

    Also, calling someone an ISIL sympathiser who just points out you are not staying on topic? colnago, you are a first class asshole.

    I think this thread is a prime example why colnago/SLC and StevoR should just not be taken seriously on anything to do with the middle east.

  • StevoR

    @ ^ & 19. zenlike :

    O good, it was 2 seconds about how some jews are extremists but StevoR the islamophobe jumped in to divert attention away towards the eebil mooslims.

    Except I’m NOT Islamophobic nor did I say it was all Muslims and I specifically started with stating in my (& the) very first comment here that the ultra-Orthodox Jewish sect was wrong – shame on them.

    (Since that OP issue was clear and indisputable and going unargued by anyone, things did get sidetracked by later comments – see below.)

    Also whilst people can take me or anybody else’s comments here as they choose, everything that I have written on this thread is factually accurate and, I think , entirely reasonable making fair points. I also think (unlike you?) that arguments should always be judged on their merits and against the evidence not judged or dismissed simply because someone you disagree with is saying them.

    @35. dingojack : “SLC – if you want blame someone — Stevo (#10)! Dingo”

    Or how about we blame ( #7) John Pieret for making the false equivalence of Sharia law and Kosher law saying effectively that the two are identical and equally bad when that is clearly NOT the reality? Sorry John Pieret but that really was a silly thing to say and did cause the derailment along with your Numbers 31 and then Gaza.

    @jaybee :

    Like that Christopher Walken skit on SNL, (1) all I can say is this thread needs more StevoR. (2) Christ, 11 of the first 15 posts were by the same guy. (3)

    (Numerals added for ease of reference.)

    (1) Haven’t seen that. Guess I’ll have to look it up now..

    (2) Why thankyou happy to oblige and glad you enjoy them!

    (3) So? This is a problem why exactly? Its hardly my fault if other people aren’t participating enough early enough and whilst my style isn’t your style or maybe to your liking, its how I post and converse here and isn’t hurting anyone or I think causing any problems and, if it was, then it’d be Ed Brayton’s place to say so not yours. I don’t ask that you necessarily like or agree with me but please don’t tell me what to do or how and why and how often to comment here any more than you’d like me to tell you what, why and how often to comment here either.

  • StevoR

    @ 30. Eric :

    @10 : “Jews rarely behead people for breaking Kosher laws for starters…”

    Its not murder, but withholding education from children until the women in your community accept an unequal, subservient role is still pretty damn nasty, backwards, and bigoted.

    Completely agreed – and if you read the very first comment here you’d see that I’ve already said so albeit not quite in those words. As you said, nasty , backwards wrong but NOT murder. There is a spectrum of bad, worse and worst y’know! Just as Kosher law whilst has similarities to Sharia law clearly isn’t as bad especially as practiced in this century.

    @27. & # 36. The Israel-bashing Anti-Semite Holms :

    #18 dingojack : Although what Israel’s territorial ambitions fight to survive against Islamist attempts at genocide (FIFY -ed.) have to with a religious group banning mothers from picking up their kids from school…”

    You’ve forgotten that this is War Crimes Apologist Stevor, who can turn anything that remotely references Judaism or Islam into Israel vs. Palestine.

    Ad hominem attacking Holms misses the point as per usual that it was John Pieret who brought Israel into this as well as making the false equivalence of Kosher and Sharia laws. Seems Israel-bashing anti-Semite Holms clearly thinks Israel and Judaism should always be attacked with impunity here and never have their reputation or even mere existence defended. Holms is pretty much stating that he thinks so and that comments wrongly attacking a minority ethnic and religious group should go unanswered. That Holms is why, for all your santimonious attacks on others, you are a horrible person and should be deeply ashamed of your anti-Semitic, Judaeophobic bigotry.

    Its quite simple, when you – or anyone else – unfairly attack and single out Israel and Judaism and you not only can expect an answering response but there damn well *should* be a response to such anti-Semitism! Not just from me but from all decent human beings.

    I have never, not once, condoned murder, indiscriminate fire etc. from Hamas or any other group.

    Except people could be fooled for getting that distinct impression that you do condone such things because you only point out the murder, indiscriminate rocket-fire, homicide-suicide bombers, etc .. from Hamas, Hezbollah, Islamic Jihad etc .. when you are grudgingly pressed and forced to do so and you minimise and overlook and generally gloss over it every chance you get whilst you also take every opportunity to single out and disproportionately criticise and attempt to delegitimise Israel every chance you get. This well observed and established pattern of yours Holms is why I think that you for all your santimonious attacks on others are a horrible person and should be deeply ashamed of and change your anti-Semitic, Judaeophobic bigotry.

    This is because unlike yourself (Colnago80 -ed) and StevoR, I don’t excuse actions based on who they come from. Note the difference: I condemn such war crimes without exception, you condemn them unless they come from Israel or the U.S. in support of Israel.

    See above Holms that simply isn’t true – you are very quick to condemn Israel and very slow to condemn its enemies and you spend a lot more time doing the former than the latter – please reflect on that imbalance of yours and what it tells the world about you and those others who do likewise.

    It is apparent that only slavish agreement with everything Israel ever does will suffice for colnago80, anything less is characterised as agreeing with IS / Hamas. Fucking idiot.

    You are the “fucking idiot” Holms because I have seen many times when Colnago80 here has criticised Netanyahu who is Israel’s PM among other things and Israel’s actions at times. Admittedly Colnago80 like some others feels Israel has been too soft rather than too harsh in its approach to some issues e.g. Iran which I would and have disagreed with him about.

    So again, Holms, you are not only wrong but also in denial about yourself and projecting it onto others, no doubt you would say the same is true of him and me but then we have the evidence that shows we are correct about this whereas you do not. Also once more Holms I challenge you to look at your own pattern of unfairly singling out Israel for doing what many, perhaps almost all other nations have done or would do inits place and unfairly arguing that Jewish extremism is as much of a problem for the modern world and as bad as Islamist extremism which simply is not the case.

    (Which, do note, is NOT the same as saying there are no Jewish extremists or that they aren’t a problem at all or that Israel is always perfect and right NONE of which are propositions that I hold or have stated / implied or am arguing for here.)