Preaching on the Magi and Other Questions for Brent Landau

This month in the Patheos Book Club, we’re exploring Brent Landau’s compelling new book, Revelation of the Magi.  In it, Landau reveals a forgotten ancient manuscript discovered at the Vatican that recounts a very different and suprising tale of the Wise Men’s journey to Bethlehem than we’ve learned from the biblical Christmas story.  Read more about the book here.

As part of our blogger roundtable on the book, we invited several authors to review the book and submit their questions to Landau for his response.  Our Q&A begins here.

Q.  Blogger Peter Wallace, Host & Founder of Day1.org:

I came away from reading this book appreciating once again the power of story or myth to communicate truth. What are the primary truths you see this story communicating to us today?

I’d also like to know if you found any other interesting documents in the Vatican library we don’t know much about!

A.  Author Brent Landau:

I agree with you that truth can be manifest in a story, whether or not that story is “historically factual.” This is certainly the case with the Revelation of the Magi, since this text–interesting as it may be–tells us nothing about the “historical Magi” (whoever they were). I think that the central truth communicated in the RevMagi is that trying to impose human limitations on divine revelation is bound to fail. Christ informs the Magi that the fulfillment of their long-awaited prophecy is but one isolated instance of his revelation to humanity. Indeed, the very fact that the earliest form of the RevMagi never uses the names “Jesus” or “Christ” may suggest that the author felt these designations to be too particularistic and culturally-bound to be helpful in describing this being. In this way, the RevMagi is a logical outgrowth of the Apostle Paul’s idea that the “Christ event” is truly cosmic in scale.

As for whether there are other texts still hiding in the Vatican Library: I hope so! The only way I ever learned about the RevMagi was because I was looking for a text like this to research for my dissertation. So I don’t know what other secrets the Vatican Library might be holding. However, it’s a very important reminder that some of the most fascinating ancient writings aren’t buried in the sand, but simply sitting on a shelf in a library or monastery somewhere, waiting to be found!

Q.  Blogger Carl Gregg, progressive Baptist pastor in MD, and Spiritual Director:

If you were asked to preach on a text from “The Revelation of the Magi” in an open-minded, progressive Christian congregation on Epiphany Sunday 2011, what text(s) would you chose and what are some highlights of the sermon you would preach?”

A. Landau:

If I were going to preach a sermon on the RevMagi, I would probably preach on what I consider to be the most pivotal verse in the entire text–what Christ says in his epiphany to the Magi:

“And I am everywhere, because I am a ray of light whose light has shone in this world from the majesty of my Father, who has sent me to fulfill everything that was spoken about me in the entire world and in every land by unspeakable mysteries, and to accomplish the commandment of my glorious Father, who by the prophets preached about me to the contentious house, in the same way as for you, as befits your faith, it was revealed to you about me.”

My sermon would ask whether this statement is a truly pluralistic theology. Yes, it does do quite a bit better than most ancient and modern Christian thought on other religions. But it does so inclusively, that is, it includes other religions within the framework of Christian revelation. In essence, it seems to suggest that everybody in the world is a Christian but doesn’t know it–a position that probably wouldn’t sit well with very many Buddhists or Muslims. But it is also possible to understand theRevMagi to be saying that the divine revealer that the Magi encounter is no more intrinsically “Christ” than intrinsically “Buddha” or “Krishna.” That is much closer to a truly pluralistic theology, but is this the religious vision that open-minded, progressive Christians should seek after? That is the ultimate question I would pose to the congregation.

Q. Blogger Amy Julia Becker from Thin Places:

Dr. Landau mentions the contemporary theological implications of this ancient text, and he mentions the influence of the text on art and, to a lesser degree, the conquistadors. I’m wondering if there is any sense of why this legend fell out of use, if it “lived” for a thousand years, and I’m wondering what it’s theological value was during those years of use.

Secondly, what does the role of silence– in the naming of the magi and the emphasis on silent prayer– tell us about the origins of this document and/or the theology within? I’m curious especially if there is any connection to the eastern orthodox tradition.

A. Landau:

First, the question of why it fell out of use. I’m still studying the reception history of the text, and I don’t yet have a sense of the precise moment when the text fell into oblivion. My best guess would be that it was connected with the Protestant Reformation, because that’s when many apocryphal texts and traditions became the victims of Martin Luther’s Sola Scriptura (“only the Bible!”) doctrine. But this is something I hope to understand better in the next couple years–and I do agree with you that it’s strange for a text that was so influential to have become almost totally unknown today.

As for its theological value during the years that it was in use; again, the reception history has not yet been fully documented. But I would mention two uses to which I know it was put–one theological, and one more “theo-political.” For the first, Thomas Aquinas found it very useful in his Summa Theologica for countering a possible objection to God’s providence. If one were to object that it was unnecessarily obscure for God to reveal the birth of Christ by means of a star because nobody would understand the significance of such a star, Aquinas counters that the Magi text indeed explains that the Magi were expecting such an event and did understand its significance.

For the “theo-political” influence of the text, the consequences have arguably been quite negative. The Revelation of the Magi was part of a complex of legends in the medieval world that claimed that powerful Christian kingdoms did exist in unknown parts of the world. So this text may have inadvertently contributed to the start of European exploration–the explorers could find these kingdoms, unify Christendom, and share in the material wealth of these communities. And of course we know how that turned out for the people who actually lived in such places.

Finally, the Magi’s practice of silent prayer. I don’t know nearly as much about Eastern Orthodox Christian traditions as I would like, but I have indeed received other suggestions that the Magi’s practice in this text may be related to the Orthodox practice of saying prayers that are purposefully made inaudible. I think that the Magi’s silent prayer is closely related to the overall theological outlook of the Revelation of the Magi. If God’s being and revelation are as boundless as the narrative as a whole claims, then perhaps the only suitable way of praising such a God is in silence, without words. It could be that the community in which the Revelation of the Magi was produced did indeed practice silent prayer, since it is obviously such a central feature of the Magi’s piety and it’s not otherwise clear why the Magi would be so closely associated with silent prayer. It’s also important to keep in mind that silent prayer in antiquity was relatively unusual–it doesn’t necessarily mean that a group that practiced this would have automatically been considered heretical, but it’s definitely not a typical mode of religiosity at this time.

Check back for more questions and answers in the coming days!

Return to the Patheos Book Club for more resources on Revelation of the Magi, including a book excerpt, book reviews and discussion questions.


Comments

  1. Ron Scott says:

    From reading this interesting text, it appears to me that the Magi were practicing astrologers with a knowledge of certain planets that were yet to be discovered, namely Uranus, of which can be, of course, seen with the naked eye, albeit with exceptionally good vision in optimal viewing conditions. The brightness of this “star,” when experienced by those intended, does exceed, as correctly told by the Magi, that of all the stars combined! Uranus is the “Father of Lights,” as known by certain individuals who’ve tracked its motion and aspects to natal positions. To identify the “Son of the Father” with the Father Himself, however, is to ignore the reality of Chiron, who is a separate Being in His own right. Lastly, the witness of that monument in the midst of Egypt, the Great Pyramid of Giza, of which the “stones” have spoken to a select few, were no doubt heeded by these Magi with respect to the exact time of this appearance of the bodily Christ.

  2. wctube says:

    From reading this interesting text, it appears to me that the Magi were practicing astrologers with a knowledge of certain planets that were yet to be discovered, namely Uranus, of which can be, of course, seen with the naked eye, albeit with exceptionally good vision in optimal viewing conditions.

  3. 1819516 says:

    1819516 beers on the wall. sck was here

  4. Valuable information and excellent website you got here! I would like to thank you for sharing your ideas and time into the stuff you post!! Thumbs up

  5. What a fantastic blog/post/article.After reading the article,I derive pleasure and benefit.I will continue to focus on your blog.

  6. ugg boots says:

    Good quality points you high light in this article. I’m not in its entirety together with you, though enjoyed to learn your view point on this subject.

  7. a266583 says:

    266583 beers on the wall. sck was here

  8. Good article , thanks and we want more! Added to FeedBurner as well

  9. I cherished as substantially as you’ll acquire completed ideal right here. The sketch is tasteful, your authored material fashionable. nonetheless, you command get bought an shakiness over that you just wish be delivering the following. unwell unquestionably come additional previously again as exactly exactly precisely the same nearly certainly normally inside situation you shield this hike.

  10. Awesome job on this post.

  11. Would you be all for exchanging links?

  12. I left my oven on, just to read this new posts of yours, its unbelievable anyways.

  13. There is a bundle to know about this. You made good points also.

  14. Thanks so much for providing individuals with an extremely nice opportunity to read from here. It’s usually so beneficial and full of a lot of fun for me personally and my office colleagues to visit the blog at the very least 3 times in one week to read the newest issues you have. And indeed, we’re at all times motivated for the stunning secrets you give. Some 3 points in this post are in reality the most effective we’ve had.

  15. You should take part in a contest for one of the best blogs on the web. I will recommend this web site!

  16. Hardly ever do I encounter a weblog that’s both educated and entertaining, and let me let you know, you may have hit the nail on the head. Your idea is outstanding; the problem is something that not sufficient people are speaking intelligently about. I’m very satisfied that I stumbled across this in my quest for something referring to this.

  17. Thank you for all of the effort on this blog

  18. Hello! I just would like to give a huge thumbs up for the great info you have here on this post. I will be coming back to your blog for more soon.

  19. Thank you for all of the effort on this blog

  20. Oh my goodness! an amazing article. Thank you!

  21. I simply could not go away your web site before suggesting that I really loved the standard info a person supply in your visitors? Is going to be again regularly in order to investigate cross-check new posts.

  22. Could there really be any longer material you possibly can give during this subject. It solutions a great deal of my questions but there is certainly nevertheless more info I need. I will drop an e-mail if I can acquire it. Never thoughts I will just email you employing the make contact with kind. Hopefully it is easy to support me additional.

  23. This was a great post, thanks for the info.

  24. Jone Derriso says:

    It’s good webpage, I was looking for something like this

  25. Thanks for spending the time to discuss this, I feel strongly about it and love reading more on this topic.

  26. quick weave says:

    First off, talking is amazingly very important. You have got noticed it frequency but still this amazing certainly is the required to keeping up with issues when you want specifically whenever it should visit a spousal relationship. With the capacity to point out to an individual’s reactions not to mention interior views nearer to each and every different, whether or not upbeat, you allow for on your own to possess to fully realize your partner a great deal more and even realise your pet on the more deeply collection. Plus simply by appropriate talks, there’s usually a possibility meant for concerns to generally be sorted out rapidly in contrast not likely communicating the slightest bit.

  27. you have a great blog here! would you like to make some invite posts on my blog?

  28. This site is often a walk-through for all of the information you wished concerning this and didn’t know who to ask. Glimpse here, and you’ll undoubtedly discover it.

  29. Nice post. I learn something on completely different blogs everyday. It should always be stimulating to read content from different writers and observe a bit something from their blog.

  30. That was clever. I’ll be stopping back.

  31. You should take part in a contest for one of the best blogs on the web. I will recommend this site!

  32. What are you saying, man? I understand everyones got their own opinion, but really? Listen, your website is awesome. I like the work you put into it, specially with the vids and the pics. But, come on. Theres gotta be a better way to say this, a way that doesnt make it seem like most people here is stupid!

  33. I NEED MONEY says:

    It’s not that I want to replicate your web page, but I really like the style and design. Could you let me know which style are you using? Or was it custom made?

  34. you’ve got an ideal blog right here! would you like to make some invite posts on my weblog?

  35. hotels says:

    pretty beneficial material, overall I believe this is well worth a bookmark, thanks

  36. You…are…my…hero!!! I cant believe something like this exists on the internet! Its so true, so honest, and more than that you dont sound like an idiot! Finally, someone who knows how to talk about a subject without sounding like a kid who didnt get that bike he wanted for Christmas.

  37. Nearly all of what you claim happens to be astonishingly appropriate and it makes me wonder the reason why I hadn’t looked at this with this light previously. Your piece truly did turn the light on for me personally as far as this particular subject goes. However at this time there is just one issue I am not really too comfortable with and while I try to reconcile that with the actual core theme of your position, let me observe just what all the rest of your subscribers have to say.Very well done.

  38. Wow, I enjoyed your neat post.

  39. Your place is valueble for me. Thanks!…

  40. Thanks for sharing this excellent article. Very inspiring! (as always, btw)

  41. I am often blogging and i really appreciate your content. The article has really peaked my interest. I am going to bookmark your site and keep checking for new information.

  42. This was a really nice post.

  43. msp training says:

    Thank you for all of the effort on this blog

  44. Windows 9 says:

    Pretty nice post. I just stumbled upon your blog and wanted to say that I’ve truly enjoyed surfing around your blog posts. After all I’ll be subscribing to your rss feed and I hope you write again very soon!

  45. Youre so cool! I dont suppose Ive read anything like this before. So nice to find somebody with some original thoughts on this subject.

  46. Agatha Flair says:

    Throughout the great scheme of things you’ll secure an A+ just for effort. Exactly where you confused us was in your specifics. As people say, the devil is in the details… And that couldn’t be more correct right here. Having said that, let me reveal to you just what did do the job. Your article (parts of it) is actually very convincing and that is most likely the reason why I am making the effort to comment. I do not really make it a regular habit of doing that. 2nd, while I can easily notice the jumps in reason you come up with, I am definitely not certain of just how you appear to connect your ideas which inturn make the conclusion. For the moment I shall subscribe to your point but hope in the future you connect your facts much better.

  47. Very nice post. I just stumbled upon your weblog and wanted to say that I have truly enjoyed browsing your blog posts. After all I’ll be subscribing to your feed and I hope you write again very soon!

  48. This is my Excerpt

  49. Congratulations on having one of the most sophisticated blogs Ive come across in some time! Its just incredible how much you can take away from something simply because of how visually beautiful it is. Youve put together a great blog space –great graphics, videos, layout. This is definitely a must-see blog!

  50. ac capacitor says:

    Never gave it too much thougt. But I like the blog design. Will definitely come back for more. Nice!

  51. Soila Kazan says:

    its excellent as your other posts : D, appreciate it for putting up.

  52. Doubly it is understood as that

  53. sbobet says:

    What an interesting text. I am really impressed. Keep writing mate

  54. sbobet says:

    Good article, didnt realize they blocked themselves on the issue.

  55. sbobet says:

    You are a very capable individual!

  56. I am very glad this content was available. It’s very thought provoking, informative and easy to read and understand. I know this information will be very helpful in the future.

  57. Planned to drop a remark and allow you to know your Feed isnt working today. Cleaning it once a including it to my Google reader account together with nothing.

  58. sbo says:

    Wow, amazing blog format! How long have you ever been running a blog for? you make running a blog look easy. The overall glance of your web site is wonderful, as smartly the content material!

  59. sbo says:

    That’s a good idea,like it!

  60. 301 Moved Permanently you will have an amazing blog here! would you like to make some invite posts on my weblog? Regards, Furniture Manufacturer

  61. ac capacitor says:

    Do you have a fan page on Facebook? You can increase your blog visitors that way! Cheers!

  62. I’m not sure where you’re getting your information, however great topic. I must spend a while learning more or figuring out more. Thank you for excellent info I was on the lookout for this information for my mission.

  63. eye surgery says:

    Helpful info discussed I am really pleased to read this particular post..many thanks with regard to providing all of us nice information.Great walk-through. I truly appreciate this article.

  64. Amaze! Thank you! I constantly wished to produce in my internet site a thing like that. Can I take element of the publish to my blog?

  65. you’ve a very nice blogs right here! would you like to make a number of invite posts on my blog?

  66. Fantastic items from you, man. I’ve remember your stuff prior to and you are simply extremely great. I actually like what you have obtained right here, certainly like what you’re stating and the way in which wherein you say it. You’re making it entertaining and you continue to care for to stay it wise. I can’t wait to read much more from you. That is actually a wonderful web site.

  67. I recently came across your article and have been reading along. I want to express my admiration of your writing skill and ability to make readers read from the beginning to the end. I would like to read newer posts and to share my thoughts with you.

  68. Lupe Littfin says:

    I’m just looking for place to start up a blog with a friend where we talk sports in Chicago as well as other things going on nationwide….just for fun. Any suggestions on sites would be great. Thanks..

  69. how’s life ? get-free-ipads.info owner found your website via Google but it was hard to find and I see you could have more visitors because there are not so many comments yet. I have discovered website which offer to dramtically increase traffic to your website

  70. read now says:

    All the explanation you needed on automated forex cash. The Internet proves to be

  71. Very well written post. It will be valuable to anybody who employess it, as well as me. Keep up the good work – for sure i will check out more posts.

  72. Evita Hoppin says:

    I have a video post in blogger then how can I put a repost link to that? I have already go to addthis but don’t know how to put the code in its proper place wherein the individual posts are being place with an embed this or repost this or share this. Please help..

  73. I apologise, but, in my opinion, you commit an error. Write to me in PM.

  74. Also – for everybody who said MJ was a sick man, take a sharp look at the video they shot during his rehearsals for his last show This is It. M. Jackson was active, really robust, and fully consistent. People need to let their excitement go and do some examination before they reply. I mean really.

  75. thank you for sharing with us, I think this website really stands out : D.

  76. George Ullum says:

    Do you mind if I quote a few of your posts as long as I provide credit and sources back to your website? My blog is in the exact same niche as yours and my visitors would truly benefit from some of the information you present here. Please let me know if this alright with you. Cheers!

  77. obat kuat says:

    Surely an arithmetic post. You add trouble, subtract pleasure, divide attention, and multiply ignorance….

  78. Thanks for your publiction. Another item is that being a photographer entails not only problem in recording award-winning photographs but hardships in getting the best dslr camera suited to your needs and most especially situations in maintaining the standard of your camera. This is very accurate and visible for those photography addicts that are into capturing a nature’s exciting scenes — the mountains, the actual forests, the wild or maybe the seas. Visiting these exciting places definitely requires a camera that can surpass the wild’s unpleasant natural environment.

  79. Dan Pfluger says:

    Valuable info. Fortunate me I discovered your site accidentally, and I’m stunned why this accident did not happened in advance! I bookmarked it.

  80. pan card says:

    Great blog! I really love how it’s easy on my eyes as well as the information are well written. I am wondering how I could be notified whenever a new post has been made. I have subscribed to your rss feed which ought to do the trick! Have a nice day!

  81. Certainly I like your website, however you have to take a look at the spelling on several of your posts. Several of them are rife with spelling problems and I find it very troublesome to inform you. On the other hand I’ll definitely come again again!Cheers!

  82. Thank you for another informative blog. Where else could I get that kind of information written in such an ideal way? I’ve a project that I’m just now working on, and I have been on the look out for such info.

  83. Can I just say what a reduction to search out someone who really knows what theyre speaking about on the internet. You definitely know the best way to deliver an issue to mild and make it important. Extra individuals need to read this and understand this side of the story. I cant believe youre no more popular since you undoubtedly have the gift.

  84. I have been reading out many of your stories and it’s pretty clever stuff. I will surely bookmark your site.

  85. AKO Webmail says:

    Extremely helpful information specially the last part :) I care for such info a lot. I was seeking this particular info for a long time. Thank you and best of luck.

  86. I am sorry, that has interfered… This situation is familiar To me. Write here or in PM.

  87. I have been exploring for a bit for any high-quality articles or blog posts on this kind of area . Exploring in Yahoo I at last stumbled upon this site. Reading this info So i’m happy to convey that I have a very good uncanny feeling I discovered exactly what I needed. I most certainly will make sure to do not forget this web site and give it a glance regularly.

  88. Real good visual appeal on this web site , I’d rate it 10 10.

  89. I needed to write you a little remark to finally say thanks a lot yet again on your pleasing methods you have provided at this time. It has been really open-handed of people like you to deliver extensively just what many of us might have offered as an e book to get some profit for their own end, mostly given that you could have tried it if you ever considered necessary. Those principles likewise acted to provide a easy way to comprehend some people have similar eagerness just as my own to learn more and more on the subject of this condition. I am sure there are several more pleasurable sessions in the future for individuals who scan through your site.

  90. Certainly I like your website, however you have to take a look at the spelling on several of your posts. Several of them are rife with spelling problems and I find it very troublesome to inform you. On the other hand I’ll definitely come again again!Cheers!

  91. Very nice post. I just stumbled upon your weblog and wanted to say that I’ve truly enjoyed browsing your blog posts. In any case I’ll be subscribing to your rss feed and I hope you write again very soon!

  92. I like the valuable information you provide in your articles. I will bookmark your blog and check again here frequently. I am quite sure I will learn plenty of new stuff right here! Best of luck for the next! poker network

  93. Enjoyed studying this, very good stuff, thankyou .

  94. mount athos says:

    I and also my pals have already been following the excellent information found on your web page and all of the sudden I had a horrible suspicion I never thanked the web blog owner for those tips. All the young boys were definitely certainly excited to learn them and now have undoubtedly been tapping into them. I appreciate you for indeed being well kind and also for deciding upon variety of great guides millions of individuals are really eager to be informed on. My sincere regret for not expressing gratitude to you sooner.

  95. This amusing opinion

Trackbacks

  1. Q&A with Revelation of the Magi Author: This month in the Patheos Book Club, we're exploring Brent Landau's comp… http://bit.ly/dGvjgf

  2. Angela says:

    Q&A with Revelation of the Magi Author: This month in the Patheos Book Club, we're exploring Brent Landau's comp… http://bit.ly/hkhfzG

  3. Achtung Aeon says:

    Preaching on the Magi and Other Questions for Brent Landau | Faith … http://ow.ly/1atrFH

Leave a Comment

*