I’d have no problem with a science class teaching about obsolete explanations that have been disproved by science. That’s called “history”. The problem is that they want science classes to teach kids that, yes, God did indeed create the world in 6 days and the universe is about 6000 years old. As fact.

If anyone can come up with a fancy and demand that it is thought alongside mainstream scientific facts due to “fairness”, then I demand that the Flying Spaghetti Monster is taught as a third, equally valid theory, and with equal time and attention dedicated to it. It’s not more absurd than creationism, and it’s certainly less harmful…”

I want to ask, how much you actually know about evolution? I’ll tell you what I know. Evolution, in the sense of dinosaurs becoming birds, cannot SCIENTIFICLY happen. the only thing that can EVER happen in the real world is deevolution and natural selection. No natural organism can gain genetic information. It is not possible. There can only ever be loss of information or rearanging of present information. In that case, the THEORY of evolution is a hypothesis that is wrong. Creationism does not teach this kind of evolution. I do not have the time to go into all the finer points about the so many holes the theory of evolution ACTUALLY has but it is definitly more then the genesis account if you look at what the bible has to say along side the science.

I think they’re creepy. Really well done, but creepy. If he had them printed up, I guarantee they’d sell. If that wasn’t the case, they’d be hysterically funny. That one of Jesus and the little girl would be framed and hung on more than a few public school walls in parts of the Bible Belt.

Just so I know. Are these joke posters that are ironic or genuine posters that are scary? I’m torn between the two and I can’t decide. Either way I’m tempted to change the slogans on several for comedic effect.

And no I was talking more about the working class person of the 19th and early 20th century who sent their kids to the mines (or mills or whatever) at a very young age to learn a living and that kid would work there (or some place like there) for the rest of their lifes in haderous conditions where many would die. They were frequently given just enough to survive, certainly not enough to risk changing jobs knowing there might not be another one to come to (a form of slavery in and of itself). You can say this is not as bad as slavery and I might agree with you; but if you really think that it is not that bad you must be crazy. Take aside the issue of rape and abuse (which not all slave owners did to begin with and factory workers could generally get away with abuse) and you still have the insanely long hours in hazardous conditions, no hope of changing your situation (without risking your life and limb; not to mention those of your family)… it really doesn’t sound that much better or worse then slavery to me, certainly not a system I would ever want to live in.

And yes I can’t just say that God did everything, but you can not dismiss the possibility altogether. At some point in time life came from a state of no life; matter came from a state of no matter. What is wrong with saying that this could have come from a higher being? The perfection of the universe and this world seems to suggest that something helped to do it. I do not wish for anyones theory to be taught, just explain the problems with evolution as soon as you explain the theory.

There are just as many sites on there going against Christians (like this one for example). God only knows that I can not walk around school without seeing all sorts of signs premoting atheistic organizations. God only knows that I have been critized for wearing my cruxcifix or my Christian special needs summer camp shirt in the past. Both sides are hatefilled so please get off your high horse .

Okay here is why I call this propaganda. It is associating the ideals of a small subset with the whole population.

Sorry, but that’s just not true. There is no attempt here whatsoever to say that all or even most christians share these views, only that subset known as the christian right. We are well aware that many christians do not share those views. The original site and the post title here makes it pretty clear that it’s only the christian right that these are about. Those are the people who are trying to turn this country into a theocracy, and these posters are damn near to understating their views.

we are never told that the working class in the northern states in many cases had it just as bad as the slaves in the southern states

Leaving aside the politcal correctness issue, this just plain isn’t true. Are you possibly confusing being working class with being an indentured servant? You might make some sort of case for indentured servitude being like temporary slavery, but the operative word here is ‘temporary’, and that makes a really huge difference.

when you take away the issue of slavery (which was never the main issue for the war).

That’s just plain bullpuckey. Do you really mean to say that if the north had said “fine, keep your slaves, it’s ok”, or if that south had said “ok, we’ll give up the slaves”, that the civil war would still have started? No, slavery was and is the only reason that war ever happened.

States do not have the right to secede from the government when they get peeved because the North won the Civil War and for no other reason. The citizens were for succession as evidenced by their seceeding and by the fact that not a single state in the south voted for Lincoln, it would sortof like the United States and Canada agreeing to be one but giving Canada enough power that they can get anyone elected just by all voting the same way. As for the whole agreeing to something so therefore your part of it for all time thing no matter what way it goes that seems a bit shakey on its base to me, especcially seeing how the north single handly changed that new compact in midgame. What I suppose the arguments boil down to there is does all that justify the huge loss of life when you take away the issue of slavery (which was never the main issue for the war). I imagine you probably think George Bush is a war criminal (based on your other viewpoints, I think that certainly makes Lincoln one too.

The website you gave never mentions how life first spawned in reflection the my problems with it just how it relates to the farther evolution of that life. The problem is that I have no problem with the theories on the farther evolution of life, I want to know where life first came from and where matter first came from. In other words how hydrogen came from a state where there was no hydrogen and how life came from a state where there was no life. Also you never mentioned the propaganda aspects of this post, mainly that it attributes ideals to a very large % of the population ideals that they may not have.

To your other points, to compare Lincoln to a war criminal is utterly ridiculous. States do NOT have the right to secede when they get peeved at the government, its not fair to their citizens, and every state signed a compact, and became part of the union. You don’t get to go back on that a couple of years later because you don’t like the new laws. And if you have questions on evolution http://www.talkorigins.org is the best place to go. Thank you.

Another comparible example is the now classic (at least in some areas) pictures showing an autistic brain reacting to those they recognize and having no change. This is really an autistic brain, and probably the brain of many autistics. The problem I find with this is being aspie this compares all autistics to severe and profound autistics. This might not be a big deal with you, but try having people tell you that you don’t care about anybody or anything… it is not easy.

Also that site is largely false with my beliefs on the second law of thermodynamics. I find the problem to be with life coming from a state of no life, not from things growing. No matter what in evolution you start a state with no life, I just find it odd that life came from a state of no life when entropy increases in spontanous reactions. I am probably wrong but don’t you think that is odd.

Also with the big bang there is still the problem that at some point in time there was no universe, nothing existed, remember one day quadrillions (or more) years from now there will be no more hydrogen in the universe. This seems suggest that at one point in time hydrogen (from which every other substance comes from through stars burning up) didn’t exist. I suppose I never was taught how the big band explains that.

Also as for the whole slave thing, Marx himself would say that without slavery and the explotation of the prolatriot class (which had it just as bad in many cases) society like we enjoy it now would not be possible. Not defending slavery or what slave owners did but in a certain light (that we never learn) it was neccessary to create what we have today. And then we are never told that the working class in the northern states in many cases had it just as bad as the slaves in the southern states. And from a certain perspective Lincoln was a war criminal (he blantantly invaded for no particular reason, a soveign democracy (at least compared to just about any other country at the time and certainly compared to a country like lets just say…. Iraq… now). There are certainly more then one side then is taught to the Civil War (at least in elementry school, we learn more about this in high school).

Also remember that Bohrs model of the atom was at one time considered “reality”, not anymore.