And just as the Greek myths describe the gods engaging in terrible behaviour, so to the bible describes YHWH performing some pretty horrible deeds. If god inspired these stories about himself (even if they didn’t happen) then what exactly is the message that we are supposed to take from them?

Yes, if it’s understood that it is just a collection of random myths we could have a lovely discussion about the bible.

I don’t see what is “just” about a collection of myths. Myths can often carry power and significance, wisdom and truth.

Your beliefs in hell and the resurrection and such are not based on the bible as the literal “word of God”, but upon the the life of an historical Jesus.

Yes, I would agree with Karl Barth that Jesus is properly the word of God. The Bible simply bears witness to that word.

I also still believe in the divine inspiration of scripture. I just don’t see why that would require every bit of it to be read “literally”. Is God not capable of communicating with us through poetry, myth, story, conversation, etc. just as much as through “literal” history or whatever?

But I do think I’m starting to get it now. Your beliefs in hell and the resurrection and such are not based on the bible as the literal “word of God”, but upon the the life of an historical Jesus. The bible has no authority in itself except to the extent in which it reveals the gospel (which is open to one’s own personal interpretation).

Perhaps it’s just the ex-fundamentalist in me, but it still seems a little too convenient. I can’t buy into it myself and I still don’t see the point of basing your life on it, but I can at least understand your position a little better now. Thanks.

I love the Bhagavad Gita and the Ramayana. I love Greek and Roman Mythology and Norse Mythology. I know that these are not literally true tales of actual gods, but there is a lot of metaphorical truth to be gleaned from those wonderful stories. Yet it would be silly of me to base my life and belief system around one of these books and elevate it to a status of “Word of God”.

Belief in the bible is no different.

The truth is that the bible has some great parts and some truly horrible ones and neither the good nor the bad comes from god or reveals anything about who or what god really is. Rather it is a document that reveals instead what the people from that time and place believed about the world around them and its interaction with the supernatural.

Now don’t get me wrong, I share most of your values and would encourage you to keep doing what you are doing because its better than the hateful spite coming from most of the fundamentalist churches. However, I just don’t see the point of torturing an ancient document that really isn’t relevant in today’s society.

I guess it all comes down to a person just deciding to interpret the scriptures any way they want to support their previously existing values and beliefs. It’s what the fundies do too, although usually to justify hatred and discrimination. At least Mike is twisting the bible for good instead of evil.

Maybe I should do the same and become a biblical atheist.

I sympathize with what you are all saying, but I guess my question for you Mike would then be, how do you decide which parts of the bible to believe and which to ignore? Is it just a list of stuff you happen to like and don’t like or is there some other rational? I don’t mean to come across as condescending, I’d reallly like to know.

I don’t ignore any of it. But I also don’t view the Bible as a collection of absolute rules and pronouncements for all time. It’s an unfolding conversation among people who have encountered God and are trying to make sense of those encounters. It presents multiple and often differing perspectives, and thereby invites us to join in the conversation ourselves, preferably (IMHO) in community with others who are also doing the same thing.

Do you believe in Adam and Eve, the Fall in the Garden of Eden (original sin) and therefore the necessity of Christ’s atoning death? Do you believe in the miracles as well as the horrendous judgements and plagues? How about the virgin birth, the incarnation and the resurrection?

It all depends. What do you mean by “believe in”? Do you mean do I believe it historically happened? Some of it yes, some of it no. It depends on the historical, cultural, and literary context of the passage, since, after all, the Bible isn’t just one unified document with exactly the same kind of genre all the way through. It’s a complex book containing many different types of literature that require different approaches of interpretation. If we were to read all of it “literally” we would be doing immense violence and disservice to the text since it’s not all meant to be read in that way. Some of it is, some of it isn’t.

And before you ask “how do you know which is which?” the simple answer is you study, or you listen to those who have studied. It’s really not that hard.

Sorry if you’ve written on this topic before and I missed it would make an interesting post on it’s own. If you’ve already answered these questions then just direct me there.

I’ve addressed many of these questions you’re asking multiple times here and elsewhere. Check out these posts:

A Christian Pastor Responds (Part 3)
How to Read the Bible
What Good is the Bible?