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	<title>Comments on: Anti-Preaching: Should Atheists Proselytize?</title>
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	<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2008/12/26/anti-preaching-should-atheists-proselytize/</link>
	<description>by Hemant Mehta</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Tue, 14 Feb 2012 14:11:00 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: op</title>
		<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2008/12/26/anti-preaching-should-atheists-proselytize/#comment-277813</link>
		<dc:creator>op</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Mar 2009 08:57:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/?p=7174#comment-277813</guid>
		<description>I like this idea as a one off novelty. I don&#039;t think it would work if it was widely replicated as it could legitimize religious criticism of atheism as just another religion in the minds of casual bystanders and passers by.

Best way to deal with street preachers. Ask them to look up Matthew 6:5

&lt;blockquote&gt;And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by men. I tell you the truth, they have received their reward in full.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

-Jesus Christ</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I like this idea as a one off novelty. I don&#8217;t think it would work if it was widely replicated as it could legitimize religious criticism of atheism as just another religion in the minds of casual bystanders and passers by.</p>
<p>Best way to deal with street preachers. Ask them to look up Matthew 6:5</p>
<blockquote><p>And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by men. I tell you the truth, they have received their reward in full.</p></blockquote>
<p>-Jesus Christ</p>
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		<title>By: Kit Kittappa</title>
		<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2008/12/26/anti-preaching-should-atheists-proselytize/#comment-258895</link>
		<dc:creator>Kit Kittappa</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Jan 2009 02:16:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/?p=7174#comment-258895</guid>
		<description>This reminds me of the days when I used to go to Madras Christian College in Madras, India by commuter train. In the train, one day, an old man started a sermon by calling out, &quot;Oh all you sinners. Listen to me.&quot; The first day I ignored him. The second day, I could not take it. I got up and addressed him loudly, &quot;How dare you call me a sinner, you son of a bitch. You do not even know me. By calling me a sinner you have committed a sin. I want you to apologize.&quot; He just stood there dumbfounded. A few others in the train intervened. &quot;He is an old man. Leave him alone. He will not say things like that again.&quot;
        To day, when some one talks to me about Christian or Hindu scriptures, I just tell them, &quot;I know enough Science to know there are no supernatural beings or phenomena.&quot; If they still continue with the topic, I do not hesitate to engage them in a conversation bringing in logical and scientific ideas.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This reminds me of the days when I used to go to Madras Christian College in Madras, India by commuter train. In the train, one day, an old man started a sermon by calling out, &#8220;Oh all you sinners. Listen to me.&#8221; The first day I ignored him. The second day, I could not take it. I got up and addressed him loudly, &#8220;How dare you call me a sinner, you son of a bitch. You do not even know me. By calling me a sinner you have committed a sin. I want you to apologize.&#8221; He just stood there dumbfounded. A few others in the train intervened. &#8220;He is an old man. Leave him alone. He will not say things like that again.&#8221;<br />
        To day, when some one talks to me about Christian or Hindu scriptures, I just tell them, &#8220;I know enough Science to know there are no supernatural beings or phenomena.&#8221; If they still continue with the topic, I do not hesitate to engage them in a conversation bringing in logical and scientific ideas.</p>
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		<title>By: Neal Camp</title>
		<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2008/12/26/anti-preaching-should-atheists-proselytize/#comment-258578</link>
		<dc:creator>Neal Camp</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Jan 2009 03:50:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/?p=7174#comment-258578</guid>
		<description>Glad to know of such activities. More power to you!
Too many atheists are intellectuals who believe that you can&#039;t be rational and be emotional. However, unless reason is combined with emotion, most people are unreachable.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Glad to know of such activities. More power to you!<br />
Too many atheists are intellectuals who believe that you can&#8217;t be rational and be emotional. However, unless reason is combined with emotion, most people are unreachable.</p>
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		<title>By: Omar Call</title>
		<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2008/12/26/anti-preaching-should-atheists-proselytize/#comment-257776</link>
		<dc:creator>Omar Call</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 Jan 2009 21:47:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/?p=7174#comment-257776</guid>
		<description>So I was googling myself to see some of the responses to the article.  So far I have refrained from commenting on any, but I feel compelled to say something here, seeing how this is ostensibly a &quot;friendly atheist&quot; site and I would like to think of myself as a &quot;friendly atheist&quot;.

I realized that once I agreed to be interviewed for the New Times that they would do whatever they chose with the material, but I agreed because it seemed like a potentially good way to spread the message that &quot;you can be good (probably better, I would say) without God&quot;.  Niki &lt;em&gt;did&lt;/em&gt; sort of squeeze it in at the end.  Naturally these alternative news weeklies do sensationalize these pieces (the photos are a case in point), and to this end, the article contains a fair number of (what I perceive to be) exaggerations, oversimplifications, and outright factual errors.

At first I was upset about the misrepresentations, but ultimately I think that the overarching idea that it can be okay to openly scrutinize, question -- and yes, perhaps even ridicule -- dogma is more important than the perhaps false details about how it all goes and has gone down.

In truth, I perceive that the atmosphere of Mill Avenue, this microcosm of the world, &lt;em&gt;has indeed&lt;/em&gt; changed as a result of our actions.  It used to be you couldn&#039;t walk down here on a Friday or Saturday night without getting sermonized at on any number of street corners.  Now at least the fundamentalists know, if they do choose to set up their soapbox, they can expect some exuberant opposition.  And, in fact, more recently it seems they don&#039;t come at all, or if they see us coming, they pick up and leave.

The signs have been designed to evoke a response.  We have a fair number of them.  I try to make them pithy and thought-provoking.  My goal is to open a dialogue, which I would much prefer to do than trade insults via bullhorn.  And with the Evangelicals quieting down now, it is much easier to do.  Incidentally, the latest one reads &quot;Godless 4 goodness&quot;.  Not surprisingly, the responses to that one &lt;em&gt;are&lt;/em&gt; more reserved.

This article mentioned only the &quot;Damn God America&quot; sign, which was certainly the most provocative.  It was intended to be a spoof on the &quot;God Bless America&quot; bumper stickers, but a fair number did unfortunately associate it with Reverend Wright&#039;s remarks.  Some people see someone with a sign on a street corner and won&#039;t talk to you regardless of what it says.  But the ones who are likely to stop and ask a question or make a comment or suggestion are sometimes more likely if the sign is more reactionary.  And sometimes not.  And the ones who are likely to tell say &quot;You don&#039;t believe in God?  Fuck you!&quot; (that&#039;s an actual quote) will do so anyway.

So another aspect of the story the piece only incidentally mentions is the way this little movement has evolved.  In the beginning it was enough to be confrontationally distracting, but that by and large (at least locally) seems to have achieved its immediate objectives, and now a more approachable, interactive, &lt;em&gt;friendlier&lt;/em&gt; approach seems to be in order.  So we are trying to do that.

I would never have used the phrase &quot;preaching atheism&quot; and I have never claimed that I am trying to convert anyone to anything.  I do consider myself a devangelist, and I am prepared to talk about the failings and fallaciousness of Biblical literalism and religious belief.  I care about truth and universal human values that are independent of superstition and dogma, and I would like it if others did too.   I like to have conversations about it, and in truth, I get a lot out of the interactions that I do have.  I would say that the responses and feedback are pretty evenly divided between positive and negative.  Anyone who is willing to talk to me usually concludes that I have a respectful, if different view.  The ones who don&#039;t want to talk to me are perhaps not interested or prepared to have their viewpoints questioned, and that is OK too.

We can&#039;t be advocates of reason without being reasonable ourselves.  I&#039;ve discovered that astonishingly many people today mistakenly assume that without a god, you must not care about anything; what I care very much about is illustrating that this simply isn&#039;t true.  I believe in Love, Life, Truth, Beauty, Science, Justice, Goodness, and zero gods.  This is my message.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So I was googling myself to see some of the responses to the article.  So far I have refrained from commenting on any, but I feel compelled to say something here, seeing how this is ostensibly a &#8220;friendly atheist&#8221; site and I would like to think of myself as a &#8220;friendly atheist&#8221;.</p>
<p>I realized that once I agreed to be interviewed for the New Times that they would do whatever they chose with the material, but I agreed because it seemed like a potentially good way to spread the message that &#8220;you can be good (probably better, I would say) without God&#8221;.  Niki <em>did</em> sort of squeeze it in at the end.  Naturally these alternative news weeklies do sensationalize these pieces (the photos are a case in point), and to this end, the article contains a fair number of (what I perceive to be) exaggerations, oversimplifications, and outright factual errors.</p>
<p>At first I was upset about the misrepresentations, but ultimately I think that the overarching idea that it can be okay to openly scrutinize, question &#8212; and yes, perhaps even ridicule &#8212; dogma is more important than the perhaps false details about how it all goes and has gone down.</p>
<p>In truth, I perceive that the atmosphere of Mill Avenue, this microcosm of the world, <em>has indeed</em> changed as a result of our actions.  It used to be you couldn&#8217;t walk down here on a Friday or Saturday night without getting sermonized at on any number of street corners.  Now at least the fundamentalists know, if they do choose to set up their soapbox, they can expect some exuberant opposition.  And, in fact, more recently it seems they don&#8217;t come at all, or if they see us coming, they pick up and leave.</p>
<p>The signs have been designed to evoke a response.  We have a fair number of them.  I try to make them pithy and thought-provoking.  My goal is to open a dialogue, which I would much prefer to do than trade insults via bullhorn.  And with the Evangelicals quieting down now, it is much easier to do.  Incidentally, the latest one reads &#8220;Godless 4 goodness&#8221;.  Not surprisingly, the responses to that one <em>are</em> more reserved.</p>
<p>This article mentioned only the &#8220;Damn God America&#8221; sign, which was certainly the most provocative.  It was intended to be a spoof on the &#8220;God Bless America&#8221; bumper stickers, but a fair number did unfortunately associate it with Reverend Wright&#8217;s remarks.  Some people see someone with a sign on a street corner and won&#8217;t talk to you regardless of what it says.  But the ones who are likely to stop and ask a question or make a comment or suggestion are sometimes more likely if the sign is more reactionary.  And sometimes not.  And the ones who are likely to tell say &#8220;You don&#8217;t believe in God?  Fuck you!&#8221; (that&#8217;s an actual quote) will do so anyway.</p>
<p>So another aspect of the story the piece only incidentally mentions is the way this little movement has evolved.  In the beginning it was enough to be confrontationally distracting, but that by and large (at least locally) seems to have achieved its immediate objectives, and now a more approachable, interactive, <em>friendlier</em> approach seems to be in order.  So we are trying to do that.</p>
<p>I would never have used the phrase &#8220;preaching atheism&#8221; and I have never claimed that I am trying to convert anyone to anything.  I do consider myself a devangelist, and I am prepared to talk about the failings and fallaciousness of Biblical literalism and religious belief.  I care about truth and universal human values that are independent of superstition and dogma, and I would like it if others did too.   I like to have conversations about it, and in truth, I get a lot out of the interactions that I do have.  I would say that the responses and feedback are pretty evenly divided between positive and negative.  Anyone who is willing to talk to me usually concludes that I have a respectful, if different view.  The ones who don&#8217;t want to talk to me are perhaps not interested or prepared to have their viewpoints questioned, and that is OK too.</p>
<p>We can&#8217;t be advocates of reason without being reasonable ourselves.  I&#8217;ve discovered that astonishingly many people today mistakenly assume that without a god, you must not care about anything; what I care very much about is illustrating that this simply isn&#8217;t true.  I believe in Love, Life, Truth, Beauty, Science, Justice, Goodness, and zero gods.  This is my message.</p>
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		<title>By: Matt Stone</title>
		<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2008/12/26/anti-preaching-should-atheists-proselytize/#comment-255950</link>
		<dc:creator>Matt Stone</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Dec 2008 15:53:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/?p=7174#comment-255950</guid>
		<description>All I can say is, when Atheists start behaving like fundamentalists the claims to higher rationality start unravelling real quick. The truth is fundamentalism can emerge anywhere and is path independant.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>All I can say is, when Atheists start behaving like fundamentalists the claims to higher rationality start unravelling real quick. The truth is fundamentalism can emerge anywhere and is path independant.</p>
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		<title>By: Brian E</title>
		<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2008/12/26/anti-preaching-should-atheists-proselytize/#comment-255837</link>
		<dc:creator>Brian E</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Dec 2008 22:36:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/?p=7174#comment-255837</guid>
		<description>I for one am in full support of this guy, and think more atheists should do it.  I DO believe he&#039;s making an impact, though you will never see that impact immediately on the street.  People will go home and think about what he had to say, and perhaps visit an atheist site or two.  Thus he has started a person&#039;s journey toward rationality.  

And I think his pictures are appropriately hilarious.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I for one am in full support of this guy, and think more atheists should do it.  I DO believe he&#8217;s making an impact, though you will never see that impact immediately on the street.  People will go home and think about what he had to say, and perhaps visit an atheist site or two.  Thus he has started a person&#8217;s journey toward rationality.  </p>
<p>And I think his pictures are appropriately hilarious.</p>
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		<title>By: bernarda</title>
		<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2008/12/26/anti-preaching-should-atheists-proselytize/#comment-255820</link>
		<dc:creator>bernarda</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Dec 2008 19:36:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/?p=7174#comment-255820</guid>
		<description>Oh, I never start talking about atheism. For me it is the default position. If some god groupie brings up a religious defense, I will lay into him then. It is difficult for them because I know their bible better than they do.

Probably most people are not particularly religious, they just accept the surrounding social standard, or what they think it is, to avoid having problems.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh, I never start talking about atheism. For me it is the default position. If some god groupie brings up a religious defense, I will lay into him then. It is difficult for them because I know their bible better than they do.</p>
<p>Probably most people are not particularly religious, they just accept the surrounding social standard, or what they think it is, to avoid having problems.</p>
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		<title>By: Zar</title>
		<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2008/12/26/anti-preaching-should-atheists-proselytize/#comment-255616</link>
		<dc:creator>Zar</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 27 Dec 2008 21:37:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/?p=7174#comment-255616</guid>
		<description>I like it, in kind of a silly way.  No, it&#039;s not a perfect way to reach people, but I think we heathens nit-pick each other too much.  I like the idea of an atheist street preacher among all the fundies, just as I like the idea of a pair of atheist missionaries going door to door to try to convert mormons and Jehovas Witnesses.  It&#039;s funny.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I like it, in kind of a silly way.  No, it&#8217;s not a perfect way to reach people, but I think we heathens nit-pick each other too much.  I like the idea of an atheist street preacher among all the fundies, just as I like the idea of a pair of atheist missionaries going door to door to try to convert mormons and Jehovas Witnesses.  It&#8217;s funny.</p>
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		<title>By: Darwin's Dagger</title>
		<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2008/12/26/anti-preaching-should-atheists-proselytize/#comment-255597</link>
		<dc:creator>Darwin's Dagger</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 27 Dec 2008 20:35:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/?p=7174#comment-255597</guid>
		<description>This is very useful for pointing out to people that all kinds of individuals are atheists, even morons.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is very useful for pointing out to people that all kinds of individuals are atheists, even morons.</p>
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		<title>By: vjack</title>
		<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2008/12/26/anti-preaching-should-atheists-proselytize/#comment-255579</link>
		<dc:creator>vjack</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 27 Dec 2008 18:56:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/?p=7174#comment-255579</guid>
		<description>I think we are so early into any sort of atheist movement that just getting people to talk about it is enough of a struggle. Tactics like these, while not my preference either, probably do accomplish that goal.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think we are so early into any sort of atheist movement that just getting people to talk about it is enough of a struggle. Tactics like these, while not my preference either, probably do accomplish that goal.</p>
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