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	<title>Comments on: Does Attending Sunday School Lead to You Leaving the Church?</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2009/06/19/does-attending-sunday-school-lead-to-you-leaving-the-church-2/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2009/06/19/does-attending-sunday-school-lead-to-you-leaving-the-church-2/</link>
	<description>by Hemant Mehta</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Tue, 14 Feb 2012 18:32:00 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Shae</title>
		<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2009/06/19/does-attending-sunday-school-lead-to-you-leaving-the-church-2/#comment-322091</link>
		<dc:creator>Shae</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Jun 2009 20:30:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/?p=12832#comment-322091</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s probably just a correlation where being more involved in church (attending more than a sunday night service) = getting more sick of it = leaving.

Incidentally, I&#039;ve been to the creation museum and it&#039;s good for a laugh. They say:
* Plants aren&#039;t alive (this is to justify how people ate before the Fall brought death)
* Vultures ate &quot;withered&quot; plants before the Fall (not dead ones of course)
* Weeds didn&#039;t exist before the fall because they are a nuisance and thus of the devil

... and so much more highly specific young-earth ad-hoc nonsense.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s probably just a correlation where being more involved in church (attending more than a sunday night service) = getting more sick of it = leaving.</p>
<p>Incidentally, I&#8217;ve been to the creation museum and it&#8217;s good for a laugh. They say:<br />
* Plants aren&#8217;t alive (this is to justify how people ate before the Fall brought death)<br />
* Vultures ate &#8220;withered&#8221; plants before the Fall (not dead ones of course)<br />
* Weeds didn&#8217;t exist before the fall because they are a nuisance and thus of the devil</p>
<p>&#8230; and so much more highly specific young-earth ad-hoc nonsense.</p>
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		<title>By: absent sway</title>
		<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2009/06/19/does-attending-sunday-school-lead-to-you-leaving-the-church-2/#comment-321809</link>
		<dc:creator>absent sway</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Jun 2009 00:37:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/?p=12832#comment-321809</guid>
		<description>*shrug*  
I was an obnoxious little Sunday School star!  With a practically photographic memory, my Sundays were full of snacks and prizes, and I adore crafts; that didn&#039;t hurt, either.  I maintain that I was simultaneously brainwashed and thinking.  I was raised on a whole lot of Sunday school and a whole lot of PBS and gifted classes.  Church was pretty much my only social outlet.  The things I was taught at church were reinforced at home and then of course wildly challenged at school.  I learned about Buddhism in the second grade and was fascinated and swiftly assured that you can&#039;t be a Christian and a Buddhist, and unfortunately those nice people are going to hell.  I should have some sort of degree in engineering for brain compartmentalization.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>*shrug*<br />
I was an obnoxious little Sunday School star!  With a practically photographic memory, my Sundays were full of snacks and prizes, and I adore crafts; that didn&#8217;t hurt, either.  I maintain that I was simultaneously brainwashed and thinking.  I was raised on a whole lot of Sunday school and a whole lot of PBS and gifted classes.  Church was pretty much my only social outlet.  The things I was taught at church were reinforced at home and then of course wildly challenged at school.  I learned about Buddhism in the second grade and was fascinated and swiftly assured that you can&#8217;t be a Christian and a Buddhist, and unfortunately those nice people are going to hell.  I should have some sort of degree in engineering for brain compartmentalization.</p>
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		<title>By: martymankins</title>
		<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2009/06/19/does-attending-sunday-school-lead-to-you-leaving-the-church-2/#comment-321451</link>
		<dc:creator>martymankins</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Jun 2009 21:38:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/?p=12832#comment-321451</guid>
		<description>As a church going Mormon back in the day, Sunday School was always my least favorite of the whole thing.  It may have very well added to why I left.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As a church going Mormon back in the day, Sunday School was always my least favorite of the whole thing.  It may have very well added to why I left.</p>
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		<title>By: J. Allen</title>
		<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2009/06/19/does-attending-sunday-school-lead-to-you-leaving-the-church-2/#comment-321359</link>
		<dc:creator>J. Allen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Jun 2009 14:18:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/?p=12832#comment-321359</guid>
		<description>In sunday school you are taught that your particular sect is the one true religion.  But as a child, you have not invested time and money into the church because your parents really own your time, so when you come up against the rest of the world and want to learn about it, you begin to see the cracks.

The main difference is that children today simply have better education materials than they did fifty years ago.  Once I realized there were other religions as serious as Christianity I couldn&#039;t stop reading about them until they all became ridiculous.

Many kids read up on the heathens in attempts to reinforce their beliefs, but they see too many similarities and the questions don&#039;t stop unless they use pure emotion to say &#039;it&#039;s just true&#039; and stop asking questions.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In sunday school you are taught that your particular sect is the one true religion.  But as a child, you have not invested time and money into the church because your parents really own your time, so when you come up against the rest of the world and want to learn about it, you begin to see the cracks.</p>
<p>The main difference is that children today simply have better education materials than they did fifty years ago.  Once I realized there were other religions as serious as Christianity I couldn&#8217;t stop reading about them until they all became ridiculous.</p>
<p>Many kids read up on the heathens in attempts to reinforce their beliefs, but they see too many similarities and the questions don&#8217;t stop unless they use pure emotion to say &#8216;it&#8217;s just true&#8217; and stop asking questions.</p>
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		<title>By: cathy</title>
		<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2009/06/19/does-attending-sunday-school-lead-to-you-leaving-the-church-2/#comment-321350</link>
		<dc:creator>cathy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Jun 2009 13:13:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/?p=12832#comment-321350</guid>
		<description>Approximatly 1 in three?  Don&#039;t you know math is a tool of the devil?  Damn, Mehta, look at how you turned out with all of that math...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Approximatly 1 in three?  Don&#8217;t you know math is a tool of the devil?  Damn, Mehta, look at how you turned out with all of that math&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Fastthumbs</title>
		<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2009/06/19/does-attending-sunday-school-lead-to-you-leaving-the-church-2/#comment-321004</link>
		<dc:creator>Fastthumbs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Jun 2009 02:27:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/?p=12832#comment-321004</guid>
		<description>I suspect the trend of becoming unchurched is invertly proportional to the ubiquity of the internet – Why go to Sunday School and church, temple or synagogue when any theological related question can be googled, looked up in Wikipedia or asked on numerous blogs/boards and get nearly instant answers and (sometimes expert) opinions?  

Like print media, TV viewership, strip clubs and music stores; Sunday schools and churches are going by the wayside.

Anyone know of any study that shows such a correlation?  (I suspose I should google this...)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I suspect the trend of becoming unchurched is invertly proportional to the ubiquity of the internet – Why go to Sunday School and church, temple or synagogue when any theological related question can be googled, looked up in Wikipedia or asked on numerous blogs/boards and get nearly instant answers and (sometimes expert) opinions?  </p>
<p>Like print media, TV viewership, strip clubs and music stores; Sunday schools and churches are going by the wayside.</p>
<p>Anyone know of any study that shows such a correlation?  (I suspose I should google this&#8230;)</p>
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		<title>By: georgie</title>
		<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2009/06/19/does-attending-sunday-school-lead-to-you-leaving-the-church-2/#comment-320915</link>
		<dc:creator>georgie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Jun 2009 15:55:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/?p=12832#comment-320915</guid>
		<description>In my case I think it&#039;s true. I never took the catholic teachings seriously and in sunday school (wednesday for me)  I had questions that the nuns had no clue as how to answer. I remember being told stupid things about dinosaurs and the age of the earth that made no sense, or just being told my questions were irrelevant. The nuns lack of intelligence and their willingness to call my thoughts on the matter irrelevant lead to me skipping most day&#039;s by the time I was 10, I really wanted no part in it.  I went through the motions because that was what was expected in my family. By the time I was confirmed at 11, I refused to go back to sunday school and by 14, I refused to go to church. I think sunday school was a big factor, that&#039;s where they told me the bible was true and I just didn&#039;t fall for it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In my case I think it&#8217;s true. I never took the catholic teachings seriously and in sunday school (wednesday for me)  I had questions that the nuns had no clue as how to answer. I remember being told stupid things about dinosaurs and the age of the earth that made no sense, or just being told my questions were irrelevant. The nuns lack of intelligence and their willingness to call my thoughts on the matter irrelevant lead to me skipping most day&#8217;s by the time I was 10, I really wanted no part in it.  I went through the motions because that was what was expected in my family. By the time I was confirmed at 11, I refused to go back to sunday school and by 14, I refused to go to church. I think sunday school was a big factor, that&#8217;s where they told me the bible was true and I just didn&#8217;t fall for it.</p>
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		<title>By: Another Atheist</title>
		<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2009/06/19/does-attending-sunday-school-lead-to-you-leaving-the-church-2/#comment-320911</link>
		<dc:creator>Another Atheist</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Jun 2009 15:29:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/?p=12832#comment-320911</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t think the dropoff in attendance has anything at all to do with WHAT is being taught.  After all, Sunday School has been a pretty standard thing for decades, and the dropoff in church attendance is a relatively new trend.

I attended a UU church and sent my children to their RE program for about a year and a half.  They thought it was the most boring thing ever, and so did I.  I only did it because I felt that it was my responsibility to ensure that my children had some knowledge about different religions.  

I think there is a massive failure of the entire church community to keep up with societal change.  There is just nothing relevant going on there anymore.  Walking into a church is like walking into a time machine that takes you back about 50 years or so.  Every week I attended, I would enter the sanctuary and 90% of the people sitting there were over 60 years old. 

On the other hand, there doesn&#039;t seem to be any replacement for church attendance in terms of community building, teaching children moral values, etc.  Yes, there are couple of &quot;free thinker&quot; churches, but I do not expect that those will become widespread, because they are based on the same model as other churches.  I only hope that within my lifetime, there will be some  new movement or model or something that replaces the void left by churches in the community.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t think the dropoff in attendance has anything at all to do with WHAT is being taught.  After all, Sunday School has been a pretty standard thing for decades, and the dropoff in church attendance is a relatively new trend.</p>
<p>I attended a UU church and sent my children to their RE program for about a year and a half.  They thought it was the most boring thing ever, and so did I.  I only did it because I felt that it was my responsibility to ensure that my children had some knowledge about different religions.  </p>
<p>I think there is a massive failure of the entire church community to keep up with societal change.  There is just nothing relevant going on there anymore.  Walking into a church is like walking into a time machine that takes you back about 50 years or so.  Every week I attended, I would enter the sanctuary and 90% of the people sitting there were over 60 years old. </p>
<p>On the other hand, there doesn&#8217;t seem to be any replacement for church attendance in terms of community building, teaching children moral values, etc.  Yes, there are couple of &#8220;free thinker&#8221; churches, but I do not expect that those will become widespread, because they are based on the same model as other churches.  I only hope that within my lifetime, there will be some  new movement or model or something that replaces the void left by churches in the community.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve Caldwell</title>
		<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2009/06/19/does-attending-sunday-school-lead-to-you-leaving-the-church-2/#comment-320894</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve Caldwell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Jun 2009 12:33:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/?p=12832#comment-320894</guid>
		<description>Hemant,

As a humanist and atheist who volunteers to teach in the Unitarian Universalist version of Sunday School (what we call &quot;religious education&quot; or &quot;RE&quot; for short), I&#039;m not surprised to see the huge dropoff in adult attendance being reported by Ken Ham for adult who attended conservative Sunday Schools as children and youth.

The same trend has been observed in Unitarian Universalist congregations for many years even though we:

** embrace uncertainty and doubt

** don&#039;t teach our kids that Unitarian Universalism is the &quot;one true religion&quot;

** affirm freedom of belief including the freedom to be an atheist or a humanist

** are sexuality-positive (many UU congregations teach comprehensive sexuality education that affirms sexuality, sexual orientation diversity, allowing youth and adults to make their own informed choices about premarital sex, masturbation as a positive thing, and more)

** are supportive of findings of science like evolution

Even though we are doing the opposite of what Ken Ham recommends (e.g. we are not indoctrinating children and youth with Biblical literalism), we still see the same dropoff in participation when our former children enter adulthood.

And the UU trend is also present in other religious traditions including the moderate and liberal Christian denominations who atheists may find common ground with on church-state separation issues and other social justice issues.

Generally, we are seeing children and youth who are raised in a religious community leaving and becoming &quot;unchurched&quot; as adults.

I would suggest that something is going on here that is more sociological than theological.

The US is moving from a society with a cultural expectation that people attend church to one that doesn&#039;t.  This trend started with the Baby Boomer generation and it&#039;s not changing yet.

Several months ago, Hemant mentioned the parents that were forming &quot;atheist sunday schools&quot;:

http://friendlyatheist.com/2007/11/25/go-to-sunday-school/

It will be interesting to see if these groups morph into sustained communities where the former children raised in them maintain their involvement or if the former children leave when they become adults.

Based on what we are seing with other religious groups, I&#039;m guessing that the &quot;atheist sunday schools&quot; will also lose most of their members when they become adults as well.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hemant,</p>
<p>As a humanist and atheist who volunteers to teach in the Unitarian Universalist version of Sunday School (what we call &#8220;religious education&#8221; or &#8220;RE&#8221; for short), I&#8217;m not surprised to see the huge dropoff in adult attendance being reported by Ken Ham for adult who attended conservative Sunday Schools as children and youth.</p>
<p>The same trend has been observed in Unitarian Universalist congregations for many years even though we:</p>
<p>** embrace uncertainty and doubt</p>
<p>** don&#8217;t teach our kids that Unitarian Universalism is the &#8220;one true religion&#8221;</p>
<p>** affirm freedom of belief including the freedom to be an atheist or a humanist</p>
<p>** are sexuality-positive (many UU congregations teach comprehensive sexuality education that affirms sexuality, sexual orientation diversity, allowing youth and adults to make their own informed choices about premarital sex, masturbation as a positive thing, and more)</p>
<p>** are supportive of findings of science like evolution</p>
<p>Even though we are doing the opposite of what Ken Ham recommends (e.g. we are not indoctrinating children and youth with Biblical literalism), we still see the same dropoff in participation when our former children enter adulthood.</p>
<p>And the UU trend is also present in other religious traditions including the moderate and liberal Christian denominations who atheists may find common ground with on church-state separation issues and other social justice issues.</p>
<p>Generally, we are seeing children and youth who are raised in a religious community leaving and becoming &#8220;unchurched&#8221; as adults.</p>
<p>I would suggest that something is going on here that is more sociological than theological.</p>
<p>The US is moving from a society with a cultural expectation that people attend church to one that doesn&#8217;t.  This trend started with the Baby Boomer generation and it&#8217;s not changing yet.</p>
<p>Several months ago, Hemant mentioned the parents that were forming &#8220;atheist sunday schools&#8221;:</p>
<p><a href="http://friendlyatheist.com/2007/11/25/go-to-sunday-school/" rel="nofollow">http://friendlyatheist.com/2007/11/25/go-to-sunday-school/</a></p>
<p>It will be interesting to see if these groups morph into sustained communities where the former children raised in them maintain their involvement or if the former children leave when they become adults.</p>
<p>Based on what we are seing with other religious groups, I&#8217;m guessing that the &#8220;atheist sunday schools&#8221; will also lose most of their members when they become adults as well.</p>
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		<title>By: T</title>
		<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2009/06/19/does-attending-sunday-school-lead-to-you-leaving-the-church-2/#comment-320889</link>
		<dc:creator>T</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Jun 2009 11:56:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/?p=12832#comment-320889</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;There’s a joke in there somewhere about how 1 in 3 is not actually 30% and how they should really say “Almost 1 in 3…” or “Approximately 1 in 3…”&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Intelligence is not a common trait among people involved with creation museums.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>There’s a joke in there somewhere about how 1 in 3 is not actually 30% and how they should really say “Almost 1 in 3…” or “Approximately 1 in 3…”</p></blockquote>
<p>Intelligence is not a common trait among people involved with creation museums.</p>
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