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	<title>Comments on: Frank Schaeffer Exposes Fundamentalist Christianity on The Rachel Maddow Show</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2009/09/17/frank-schaeffer-exposes-fundamentalist-christianity-on-the-rachel-maddow-show/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2009/09/17/frank-schaeffer-exposes-fundamentalist-christianity-on-the-rachel-maddow-show/</link>
	<description>by Hemant Mehta</description>
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		<title>By: Margie</title>
		<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2009/09/17/frank-schaeffer-exposes-fundamentalist-christianity-on-the-rachel-maddow-show/#comment-455992</link>
		<dc:creator>Margie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 19 Apr 2010 05:28:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/?p=16186#comment-455992</guid>
		<description>I was wondering if anyone has heard of people losing their jobs after being asked if they were Christian in predominantly fundamentalist Christian communities?  Of course the official reason they&#039;re let go is something made up, with the question asked behind closed doors with no proof. That happened to me. I used to be a fundamentalist Christian.  Repetition and mind control techniques are used to get them to believe in crazy sounding things, starting with something very close to truth and so slowly moving them to obviously outlandish concepts that they don&#039;t recognize them as such.  They would have known it was out there like everyone else if the outlandish concept was what they heard first.  I also like that a Christian is addressing the danger. That seems to be the best way to deal with it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I was wondering if anyone has heard of people losing their jobs after being asked if they were Christian in predominantly fundamentalist Christian communities?  Of course the official reason they&#8217;re let go is something made up, with the question asked behind closed doors with no proof. That happened to me. I used to be a fundamentalist Christian.  Repetition and mind control techniques are used to get them to believe in crazy sounding things, starting with something very close to truth and so slowly moving them to obviously outlandish concepts that they don&#8217;t recognize them as such.  They would have known it was out there like everyone else if the outlandish concept was what they heard first.  I also like that a Christian is addressing the danger. That seems to be the best way to deal with it.</p>
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		<title>By: Ed V.</title>
		<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2009/09/17/frank-schaeffer-exposes-fundamentalist-christianity-on-the-rachel-maddow-show/#comment-368476</link>
		<dc:creator>Ed V.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Sep 2009 20:56:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/?p=16186#comment-368476</guid>
		<description>Reading the posts here, I think one could conclude that most of the participants agree that religious fundamentalists are crazy. I don&#039;t agree--Chrisitian fundamentalists are, in the main, not crazy and all would be well advised not to brush off into a pile with a crazy label. Many fundamentalists are in fact quite intelligent and they have an agenda that they believe in and towards which they are willing to ignore much of what is truth. But that makes them ignorant, not crazy.

Most of them are dug in on abortion issues and same-sex marriages. Those are the stakes that hold the line in the sand. If any persons are not in line with their thinking on those two issues, then it doesn&#039;t matter what else they stand for, how intelligent they are, how strong their abilities to lead are and on and on. They too watch Fox News as &quot;the only broadcast news with the truth.&quot; Fundamentalists and even some some Christians who are not traditional fundamentalists, are willing to accept and repeat as truth most anything that want to use in discrediting the opposition.

I highly disagree with the post that stated that the United States was the only country with religious fundamentalist problems. If that is accepted by the poster, then how does one explain the ruthless brutality in the name of Allah in Iran, Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Yemen, parts of Indonesia and several other countries to some degree.

The last election and the months since that election, have given rise to ridiculous behavior on the part of conservatives of a radical nature, whether they are Christian or not. They are polarizing like the formation of a black hole. This is a dangerous time and all would be well advised to take the radical conservatives very seriously, and not limit the extreme to fundamental Christians.

But, I could be wrong!!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Reading the posts here, I think one could conclude that most of the participants agree that religious fundamentalists are crazy. I don&#8217;t agree&#8211;Chrisitian fundamentalists are, in the main, not crazy and all would be well advised not to brush off into a pile with a crazy label. Many fundamentalists are in fact quite intelligent and they have an agenda that they believe in and towards which they are willing to ignore much of what is truth. But that makes them ignorant, not crazy.</p>
<p>Most of them are dug in on abortion issues and same-sex marriages. Those are the stakes that hold the line in the sand. If any persons are not in line with their thinking on those two issues, then it doesn&#8217;t matter what else they stand for, how intelligent they are, how strong their abilities to lead are and on and on. They too watch Fox News as &#8220;the only broadcast news with the truth.&#8221; Fundamentalists and even some some Christians who are not traditional fundamentalists, are willing to accept and repeat as truth most anything that want to use in discrediting the opposition.</p>
<p>I highly disagree with the post that stated that the United States was the only country with religious fundamentalist problems. If that is accepted by the poster, then how does one explain the ruthless brutality in the name of Allah in Iran, Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Yemen, parts of Indonesia and several other countries to some degree.</p>
<p>The last election and the months since that election, have given rise to ridiculous behavior on the part of conservatives of a radical nature, whether they are Christian or not. They are polarizing like the formation of a black hole. This is a dangerous time and all would be well advised to take the radical conservatives very seriously, and not limit the extreme to fundamental Christians.</p>
<p>But, I could be wrong!!</p>
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		<title>By: Matt D</title>
		<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2009/09/17/frank-schaeffer-exposes-fundamentalist-christianity-on-the-rachel-maddow-show/#comment-366247</link>
		<dc:creator>Matt D</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Sep 2009 02:49:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/?p=16186#comment-366247</guid>
		<description>@ DSimon and Cathy

what adjectives would you use?  whats wrong with &quot;crazy&quot;?  It&#039;s a perfectly valid use of the word. I&#039;m no shrink, but i doubt &quot;crazy&quot; is in any of the pysch texts.

what other adjectives are off limits?  should we stop describing things as &quot;ancient&quot; or &quot;old&quot; because octegenarians may be offended?

that&#039;s just C-R-A-Z-Y</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ DSimon and Cathy</p>
<p>what adjectives would you use?  whats wrong with &#8220;crazy&#8221;?  It&#8217;s a perfectly valid use of the word. I&#8217;m no shrink, but i doubt &#8220;crazy&#8221; is in any of the pysch texts.</p>
<p>what other adjectives are off limits?  should we stop describing things as &#8220;ancient&#8221; or &#8220;old&#8221; because octegenarians may be offended?</p>
<p>that&#8217;s just C-R-A-Z-Y</p>
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		<title>By: Kristi in kc</title>
		<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2009/09/17/frank-schaeffer-exposes-fundamentalist-christianity-on-the-rachel-maddow-show/#comment-366050</link>
		<dc:creator>Kristi in kc</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 19 Sep 2009 13:33:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/?p=16186#comment-366050</guid>
		<description>Too many of these Fundies, who lead mundane repressed lives, have had The Left Behind series as their only source of entertainment. And since they are GUARANTEED to come out on the winning end of the &#039;end times battle game&#039;, they are hoping for nothing more that to get to be a part of it in this lifetime. What a shame that they are actually hoping . . .no, actively attempting to bring about a major global disaster. That way they get to participate!
- Ah, the village idiot.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Too many of these Fundies, who lead mundane repressed lives, have had The Left Behind series as their only source of entertainment. And since they are GUARANTEED to come out on the winning end of the &#8216;end times battle game&#8217;, they are hoping for nothing more that to get to be a part of it in this lifetime. What a shame that they are actually hoping . . .no, actively attempting to bring about a major global disaster. That way they get to participate!<br />
- Ah, the village idiot.</p>
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		<title>By: Alec</title>
		<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2009/09/17/frank-schaeffer-exposes-fundamentalist-christianity-on-the-rachel-maddow-show/#comment-365980</link>
		<dc:creator>Alec</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 19 Sep 2009 03:47:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/?p=16186#comment-365980</guid>
		<description>I hate to, but I will admit it. I used to part of this insane sub-culture. I was very conservative, and very Christian. I would say that I was a fundie, but actually, I had no idea what a fundie was. I really knew next to nothing about religion, but I &quot;knew&quot; that God existed. I really didn&#039;t even pay attention to other religions, or really any contradictory evidence for that matter. I was in a way a Creationist, but again, I didn&#039;t know what that was. I was raised a Republican, and a Christian, but I did eventually develop an interest in science. Once I realized that there were conflicting ideas, I thought about, and abandoned both views. But during the election, I fully supported Sarah Palin, I thought that Obama might be the anti-Christ, I &quot;knew&quot; that he was a Muslim, was a terrorist and was born Kenya. Oh yeah, I watched Fox News all the time.  I supported the 2012 doomsday hypothesis, believed that Jesus was coming again, and all that psuedoscientific bullshit. 

I guess something clicked, maybe my prefrontal cortex developed, because now I&#039;m a full-blown skeptic, a fiscally Centrist, culturally Liberal, Agnostic Atheist and proud of it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I hate to, but I will admit it. I used to part of this insane sub-culture. I was very conservative, and very Christian. I would say that I was a fundie, but actually, I had no idea what a fundie was. I really knew next to nothing about religion, but I &#8220;knew&#8221; that God existed. I really didn&#8217;t even pay attention to other religions, or really any contradictory evidence for that matter. I was in a way a Creationist, but again, I didn&#8217;t know what that was. I was raised a Republican, and a Christian, but I did eventually develop an interest in science. Once I realized that there were conflicting ideas, I thought about, and abandoned both views. But during the election, I fully supported Sarah Palin, I thought that Obama might be the anti-Christ, I &#8220;knew&#8221; that he was a Muslim, was a terrorist and was born Kenya. Oh yeah, I watched Fox News all the time.  I supported the 2012 doomsday hypothesis, believed that Jesus was coming again, and all that psuedoscientific bullshit. </p>
<p>I guess something clicked, maybe my prefrontal cortex developed, because now I&#8217;m a full-blown skeptic, a fiscally Centrist, culturally Liberal, Agnostic Atheist and proud of it.</p>
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		<title>By: Jeffrey</title>
		<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2009/09/17/frank-schaeffer-exposes-fundamentalist-christianity-on-the-rachel-maddow-show/#comment-365919</link>
		<dc:creator>Jeffrey</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Sep 2009 23:51:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/?p=16186#comment-365919</guid>
		<description>I just didn&#039;t get the impression that he cared about having clout.  He reiterated numerous times that &quot;You don’t work to move them off this position. You move past them.&quot;  He said that he felt that no one was in a position to be constructive or influential, I presume he was also including himself among those no-ones.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I just didn&#8217;t get the impression that he cared about having clout.  He reiterated numerous times that &#8220;You don’t work to move them off this position. You move past them.&#8221;  He said that he felt that no one was in a position to be constructive or influential, I presume he was also including himself among those no-ones.</p>
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		<title>By: Hector</title>
		<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2009/09/17/frank-schaeffer-exposes-fundamentalist-christianity-on-the-rachel-maddow-show/#comment-365910</link>
		<dc:creator>Hector</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Sep 2009 23:24:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/?p=16186#comment-365910</guid>
		<description>I think in a way, some people who are very critical of fundamentalists but remain Christians, do so almost nominally.  I believe it is so that they have some sort of &#039;credibility&#039; and get other Christians to read or listen to what they have to say.  


I think if he had said &quot;I am an atheist&quot; in that interview--- all the Christians would be like &quot;Ah shit, I knew it&quot; but because he said he is a Christian (and I&#039;d say on Dawkin&#039;s scale a 3) he had some sort of clout still.


Cathy and DSimon... &quot;crazy&quot; can be insulting indeed but I don&#039;t think most people say &quot;crazy&quot; to mean &quot;mentally ill&quot; anymore.


Even so... some would contend that &quot;Crazy for God&quot; in the context of fundamentalism would equate to a mental illness.


Interesting link below for a recently published document.

http://ebookstore.sony.com/ebook/andrew-newberg/how-god-changes-your-brain/_/R-400000000000000134594


&quot;Fundamentalism, in and of itself, is benign and can be personally beneficial, but the anger and prejudice generated by extreme beliefs can permanently damage your brain.
- Intense prayer and meditation permanently change numerous structures and functions in the brain-altering your values and the way you perceive reality.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think in a way, some people who are very critical of fundamentalists but remain Christians, do so almost nominally.  I believe it is so that they have some sort of &#8216;credibility&#8217; and get other Christians to read or listen to what they have to say.  </p>
<p>I think if he had said &#8220;I am an atheist&#8221; in that interview&#8212; all the Christians would be like &#8220;Ah shit, I knew it&#8221; but because he said he is a Christian (and I&#8217;d say on Dawkin&#8217;s scale a 3) he had some sort of clout still.</p>
<p>Cathy and DSimon&#8230; &#8220;crazy&#8221; can be insulting indeed but I don&#8217;t think most people say &#8220;crazy&#8221; to mean &#8220;mentally ill&#8221; anymore.</p>
<p>Even so&#8230; some would contend that &#8220;Crazy for God&#8221; in the context of fundamentalism would equate to a mental illness.</p>
<p>Interesting link below for a recently published document.</p>
<p><a href="http://ebookstore.sony.com/ebook/andrew-newberg/how-god-changes-your-brain/_/R-400000000000000134594" rel="nofollow">http://ebookstore.sony.com/ebook/andrew-newberg/how-god-changes-your-brain/_/R-400000000000000134594</a></p>
<p>&#8220;Fundamentalism, in and of itself, is benign and can be personally beneficial, but the anger and prejudice generated by extreme beliefs can permanently damage your brain.<br />
- Intense prayer and meditation permanently change numerous structures and functions in the brain-altering your values and the way you perceive reality.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: DSimon</title>
		<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2009/09/17/frank-schaeffer-exposes-fundamentalist-christianity-on-the-rachel-maddow-show/#comment-365907</link>
		<dc:creator>DSimon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Sep 2009 23:06:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/?p=16186#comment-365907</guid>
		<description>I tend to agree with Cathy on this. This use of the word &quot;crazy&quot; is insulting and stigmatising to people with mental illness, similarly to how derogatorily calling something &quot;gay&quot; even without any direct reference to homosexuality is still insulting and stigmatising towards gay people.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I tend to agree with Cathy on this. This use of the word &#8220;crazy&#8221; is insulting and stigmatising to people with mental illness, similarly to how derogatorily calling something &#8220;gay&#8221; even without any direct reference to homosexuality is still insulting and stigmatising towards gay people.</p>
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		<title>By: Jeffrey</title>
		<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2009/09/17/frank-schaeffer-exposes-fundamentalist-christianity-on-the-rachel-maddow-show/#comment-365892</link>
		<dc:creator>Jeffrey</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Sep 2009 22:12:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/?p=16186#comment-365892</guid>
		<description>Unfortunately, being a Christian, is NOT &quot;just&quot; the default status that connects their communities.  Being a Christian says certain truths about themselves.  If they&#039;re Christians, if that&#039;s what they&#039;re going to call themselves, then it says that they believe in the Christian beliefs.  That MUST include a belief that Christ WILL eventually return.  It means a belief in the rapture, Revelations, all that.  It will also mean a belief in an actual Anti-Christ.  You can&#039;t just say &quot;oh, well, the bible is true and everything, but the people who say Obama is the Anti-Christ, they&#039;re crazy!&quot;  Because SOMEBODY has to be the Anti-Christ, right?  Why not Obama?  What basis do you have to say that you BELIEVE in the rhetoric of the bible, you BELIEVE there will be an Anti-Christ, but anyone who believes it is our current president is nuts?

I loved 99% of what I heard in this video, but this one point has always buggged me about religion, and Christianity specifically.  Besides having no 2 religions that agree on any whole universal truth, you won&#039;t find any 2 DENOMINATIONS within the SAME religion agreeing on it.  You could lock 2 Christians from the same church in a room, and eventually they will be fighting over whose interpretation is right.

Schaeffer has the right idea about crazy religious believers, of course, but if he&#039;s going to call himself a Christian, then he&#039;s still in the same club as they are.  He just thinks he&#039;s sitting at the cool kid&#039;s table.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Unfortunately, being a Christian, is NOT &#8220;just&#8221; the default status that connects their communities.  Being a Christian says certain truths about themselves.  If they&#8217;re Christians, if that&#8217;s what they&#8217;re going to call themselves, then it says that they believe in the Christian beliefs.  That MUST include a belief that Christ WILL eventually return.  It means a belief in the rapture, Revelations, all that.  It will also mean a belief in an actual Anti-Christ.  You can&#8217;t just say &#8220;oh, well, the bible is true and everything, but the people who say Obama is the Anti-Christ, they&#8217;re crazy!&#8221;  Because SOMEBODY has to be the Anti-Christ, right?  Why not Obama?  What basis do you have to say that you BELIEVE in the rhetoric of the bible, you BELIEVE there will be an Anti-Christ, but anyone who believes it is our current president is nuts?</p>
<p>I loved 99% of what I heard in this video, but this one point has always buggged me about religion, and Christianity specifically.  Besides having no 2 religions that agree on any whole universal truth, you won&#8217;t find any 2 DENOMINATIONS within the SAME religion agreeing on it.  You could lock 2 Christians from the same church in a room, and eventually they will be fighting over whose interpretation is right.</p>
<p>Schaeffer has the right idea about crazy religious believers, of course, but if he&#8217;s going to call himself a Christian, then he&#8217;s still in the same club as they are.  He just thinks he&#8217;s sitting at the cool kid&#8217;s table.</p>
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		<title>By: MikeTheInfidel</title>
		<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2009/09/17/frank-schaeffer-exposes-fundamentalist-christianity-on-the-rachel-maddow-show/#comment-365866</link>
		<dc:creator>MikeTheInfidel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Sep 2009 21:08:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/?p=16186#comment-365866</guid>
		<description>Rose, I think we would be more convinced of the idea of aura reading if there were any consistency at all in the results.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Rose, I think we would be more convinced of the idea of aura reading if there were any consistency at all in the results.</p>
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