Pray4Trig now Pray4Healing

Not because it’s a crazy idea to think Down Syndrome can be fixed by praying… or that it’s something that needs to be “fixed” in the first place.

I think most reasonable people can agree that it’s preferable to not have Down Syndrome, and that an actual cure would be welcome.

Yeah, in what universe is Down Syndrome a good thing? Not that prayer would have worked. Still, it would have been an interesting experiment in the efficacy of prayer if we hadn’t scared them off with our Jesus hate.

A prevention maybe. Sure, not having it in the first place would be good but it’s NOT something that needs to be ‘fixed’. Down syndrome children are, for the most part, sweet, loving and a joy to be around…and if they want it in terms these so-called ‘christians’ can understand, they are god’s true innocents.

I’d say that Down Syndrome is something that should be fixed if possible and safe, but as with anything, prevention is really the easiest route by far.

Three letters: P-O-E.

Also from their FAQ:

In addition to the regular load of hate mail we got from those who hate the Lord, we received an anonymous emailed threat, promising a DDoS attack at a specific time. The emailer said he (or is it she?) was offended that we were “disparaging Trig Palin”.

Nothing could be further from the truth! But it’s not the first time we’ve heard this.

At the appointed time, our server crashed. God had told us to take this one seriously, so we’d backed up our database immediately before.

However, this made it clear to us that this site was not helping to demonstrate the majesty of God. It was sowing discontent and hatred among those who didn’t understand.

I guess I’m a bit shocked that someone would try to DDoS a site like that as well as send them a warning. I’m not sure how they think doing the same thing with a different name is going to prevent the same uproar.

As the aunt of a child with Down Syndrome (they’re not “Down Syndrome children”) I agree that it’s not something that needs to be “fixed”. People with Down Syndrome are still people first, and they feel the same as any of us. They’re not just the “perfect little angels” they are so often stereotyped as. My nephew can be as much as brat as any kid! The point I make with this is that they usually have all the same emotional depth as any of us. Their level of cognitive difficulty varies greatly from individual to individual. You can’t just lump them all together into one preconceived stereotype. And while yes, I could agree that prevention could be a good thing, if you’ve ever loved someone with Down Syndrome, then you love them for EXACTLY WHO THEY ARE. We wouldn’t change my nephew even if we could, and the idea that we should is just offensive.

Pretty sure this is a Poe. And I agree with some of the others who have posted on this thread (and the previous one)–it’s kind of low to make an example of a kid with Down’s Syndrome, even if the goal is to draw attention to the ridiculousness of religion.

Is it bad that I thought pray4trig was a site for lazy theists in pre-calculus?

I find it interesting how christians manage to prove themselves wrong repeatedly and repeatedly ignore the outcome, change their mind and go onto something else they feel is more likely to re-enforce the results they *want* to get.

The efficacy of prayer is one of the easiest things to test for yourself and yet when the evidence goes the other way, they have no compunction in breaking the 9th commandment, to themselves at the very least.

On their absurd poll I said that “The Rapture” was the one miracle that most Americans would support because the rest of us want their cars.

I found this very amusing. I honestly have no idea if this is a joke or not, though I’m sure some of the comments over there are. Like these:

“Blessed be all, except Democrats. They will shudder under the power of the Lord when Trig is healed”

“My wives, my kids and I are all pulling for you little guy. God will yank those retarded demons from your soul!”

And just to be a smart ass, I signed their petition.

I call poe. Christians just aren’t as amusing as that guy.

Look a cure is desirable — it’s not changing who they are for Pete’s sake, no more than curing a kid with lukemia would be. Do you really think they’d be anyone other than them if they were relieved of this handicap?

But exploiting a specific kid with it was beyond thoughtless and rude. Disgusting frankly. I hope it’s a Poe but, Poe or for real, they shouldn’t have poked fun of someone pretty damned defenseless.

Mike, I thought the same thing when I saw the title!

IMO, if it is a poe, it is in bad taste.

@Theophania: “while yes, I could agree that prevention could be a good thing, if you’ve ever loved someone with Down Syndrome, then you love them for EXACTLY WHO THEY ARE. We wouldn’t change my nephew even if we could, and the idea that we should is just offensive.”

If you wouldn’t put the down syndrome away from him even if you could, then why would prevention be a good thing?

I don’t think down syndrome has much to do with who they are. Down syndrome just pull them back. It would be great to have it erradicated.

@Hemant Mehta: “or that it’s something that needs to be “fixed” in the first place.”

So (*Warning, thought experiment ahead*) if tomorrow a magician put Down Syndrome in you, you wouldn’t mind? If he said “Ok now I’ll take it away from you so you can return to your sit, thanks for volunteer!”, you’d say “Nah, don’t worry about it, I’ll be just fine”?

In my opinion, this sort of mentality by which Down Syndrome isn’t something we should worry about because they are like any of us actually affects science. Like in, “We need funding to make some Down Syndrome research. We’re looking for ways to prevent it from happening — But why? That’s offensive, they’re like any of us. It’s just like trying to prevent black people from being born, isn’t it? My son has down Syndrome and I love him the way he is. Do your research on something else.”

Did you look at the poll they have on this website?
I don’t even know what to say about “The Obama Psalm 109:8 thing.”

I should have clarified my position better. In the last sentence of this post, I meant to say that parents of children with Down Syndrome usually say they wouldn’t want to change their child (if they had that power) because it would change who they are.

That’s what I meant by Down Syndrome not being something needing fixing.

I think it would be wonderful if a “cure” was found that would prevent it from occurring in the first place.

As the aunt of a child with Down Syndrome (they’re not “Down Syndrome children”) I agree that it’s not something that needs to be “fixed”. People with Down Syndrome are still people first, and they feel the same as any of us. They’re not just the “perfect little angels” they are so often stereotyped as. My nephew can be as much as brat as any kid! The point I make with this is that they usually have all the same emotional depth as any of us. Their level of cognitive difficulty varies greatly from individual to individual. You can’t just lump them all together into one preconceived stereotype. And while yes, I could agree that prevention could be a good thing, if you’ve ever loved someone with Down Syndrome, then you love them for EXACTLY WHO THEY ARE. We wouldn’t change my nephew even if we could, and the idea that we should is just offensive.

Fixing that cognitive difficulty wouldn’t change who they are. People with ADHD get treatment so they function better. I have spent most of my life with severe depression/anxiety. I’ve just recently found treatment that seems to be working, and I’ve heard people say things like, “It’s like you’re a completely different person!” (Meant as a compliment.)

But I’m not. I just function better. I’m “fixed.” Mental illness doesn’t define who you are any more than physical illness does. If we were talking about a person with diabetes or a broken leg no one would say that we shouldn’t “fix” them if given the power to do so, and I think it’s just as absurd to argue that way about mental illness.

I also think this is a Poe. I get the point they are trying to make, but I agree with whoever said it’s not nice to pick on a kid.

However, it did make me laugh that yet again, PZ Myers is in a poll. I wonder if he’ll win this one too?

“attempting to gather prayers for young Mr. Palin has accomplished little beyond gathering a collection of people who hate the Lord.”

I hope they have plans to free them. Of course an authentic such collection could not include atheists – by definition we recognize no “Lord” to hate.

I don’t know if I mentioned this last time, but my nephew has Down Syndrome. He’s not yet two, but it looks like he’ll be a very high-functioning person.
It’s hard (for me) to talk about “fixing” things like DS without running into Eugenics territory, imho. I used to be all about Eugenics, but then I got a clue.

FYI: scientists are working on ways to treat the cognitive effects of Down Syndrome:

http://www.technologyreview.com/biomedicine/23979/

The leap from treating an individual’s cognitive problems to selective breeding is a remarkable non sequitur.

Yeah, so, DS is a little bit more than “cognitive problems” and people DO decide to terminate pregnancies when they find out the kid may have DS sooooo………. ?

That site has GOT to be a Poe; this is an excerpt from one of the recent updates:

Trouble is, lying and saying he was converted would serve the purpose of making God look foolish. God does not like to be made to look foolish; that’s why many countries have blasphemy laws, to protect Him from such things.

I’m sorry but if that doesn’t scream sarcasm, nothing does.

I know there’s more to it than the cognitive side, and I know a lot of DS pregnancies are terminated.* There are also some people who give kids with DS plastic surgery to reduce the facial structures associated with it, but that’s just not what we’re talking about. On the other hand, if your nephew has some of the other physical problems associated with DS, like congenital heart disease, hearing deficits, thyroid disorders, or leukemia, I’m sure you’d have no hesitation fixing those.

*Still not eugenics, which is selective breeding in order to improve the species. The vast majority of these mothers, I would think, are not thinking of improving the species as a whole, but simply don’t want to care for a disabled child, which is understandable.

Down Syndrome covers a wide range of people with different abilities. My cousin has it, and badly. He has never (and will never) functioned well enough to live independently. He cannot speak. He gets frustrated and upset at his limitations and inability to communicate clearly; also paranoid, shy and scared around new people and situations. He is likely to die relatively young. Yeah, we’d rather have him than not, but if there was a ‘fix’, a cure? We’d take it like a shot…

Yeah, I have to agree with Ash. I love my sister, who has t-21, but she often dislikes having it and knows that it’s why she has trouble communicating and figuring things out. Finding ways to decrease the risk of t-21 especially in older mothers, and to mitigate its cognitive effects, is a good thing.

The praying thing reminds me of the chiropractor my Mum had when she first had my sister, who offered to cure her Downs Syndrome with chiropractic.

aLL THE PRAYING THAT sARAH pALIN HAS DONE HAS HAD NO EFFECT ALL ALL ON HER STUNTED BRAIN

I would prefer Down Syndrome be fixed, myself. It’s not categorized as a serious impairment of cognitive and motor function for nothing.

If someone repaired of Down Syndrome wishes to return to that state, perhaps then you’d let him (though the medical profession tends to frown somewhat on inflicting crippling illnesses.)

I understand a lot of people are attached to the personalities that form under the influence of Down Syndrome, but it’s got a host of medical problems that result from it as well. That sounds to me like saying that you shouldn’t “fix” a heart condition or “fix” a missing leg.

While I’m at it, eugenics isn’t the answer, genetic engineering is. Genetic engineering renders selective breeding pointless (and selective breeding immediately runs into the issue of who gets to issue the licenses and, if so, under what criteria. Just totally unworkable.)