Comments on: The Teenager Was Right; the Teacher Was Wrong

By: Teacher Meg

Teacher Meg — Mon, 14 Jun 2010 11:27:48 +0000

I’m a public high school teacher and I haaaaate the pledge. I hate it for the Under God part (atheist) and for the enforced patriotism, which I don’t consider true patriotism. However, I have come to terms with the court decision that says leading the pledge is part of my job requirement. The way I see it, it’s my prerogative to find a different job if it bothers me that much (not likely!). I am pleased that students have the option, though. I don’t think most of them know that, and at the beginning of the year I inform them of their court-given option to refuse to stand or say part or any of the pledge. Then I lead it with gusto… because I love my job.

By: Jeff Dale

Jeff Dale — Tue, 02 Mar 2010 20:17:13 +0000

And no one, least of all someone who has authority and influence over young people, has the right to impose their views on someone.

And of course, the point so often missed is that the person refusing to stand or recite the pledge isn't necessarily doing so because of any form of disrespect or disloyalty. Pledging to a flag is simply misplaced loyalty: we support the principles on which the country was founded, but it's those principles that makes the country worthy of support (as long as it holds to those principles). By this light, the person refusing to stand or recite the pledge is actually doing better at modeling those principles than the folks who see red at his/her refusal.

By: CW

CW — Tue, 02 Mar 2010 13:53:28 +0000

Since when does the United States use armed forces to force it’s citizens to “worship” the flag that represents it?! Yes, there are religious groups that have gone to court to win EVERYONE in this country the right to chose weather or not they wish to show their respect to their government by standing or not. Weather it’s because you want the word “God’ removed from the pledge or because you feel you can honor your country, live by it’s laws and respect it’s people without making a public declaration, we have the right to make that decision. And no one, least of all someone who has authority and influence over young people, has the right to impose their views on someone. That teacher has A LOT to answer for.

By: More Pledge Of Allegiance Insanity | Miscellanea Agnostica

More Pledge Of Allegiance Insanity | Miscellanea Agnostica — Tue, 02 Mar 2010 05:17:07 +0000

[...] tip: Friendly Atheist blog. Feel Free to [...]

By: muggle

muggle — Tue, 02 Mar 2010 01:43:38 +0000

Yes, Todd, I do. Enforced patriotism from minors who can’t even enter into a contract. Creepy and makes no sense. I’d like to see the whole thing done away with, not just the God stuff. But I’ll settle for the God stuff to begin with.

These kids are brave. It wouldn’t even have occurred to me not to stand. I took a page from Paul Simon and pledged alleigance to the wall. I was religious as all get out in high school but didn’t trust the gov’ment one bit.

By: Isabel Jones

Isabel Jones — Mon, 01 Mar 2010 19:03:39 +0000

I’ve always being a little jeoulous of the american patriotism. The place where I was born, isn’t a serious place and it keeps bugging me.
But, only now, I realised that all this patriotism has its roots on religion. Sorry, but it creeps me out. Brazil is a very large country and catholic church rule it here. But, this country is such a mess that now even religion is taking seriously here, so I feel a little free from that forced control that is imposed on american people. I feel like I could have more motives for being patriot, I just don’t have any. The good thing is, very few people will notice if you don’t go to church or if you realy know the name of the president on duty. So if you don’t put your hand over your heart during the hymn on the Patria week or if you don’t know the words of the hymn. I’s ok, you wouldn’t be the only one.
There’s another good thing. I asked Hemant about the obligation of swearing over a bible in an american court-of-law and he said that an atheist can refuse to swear. A small victory in a very big battle.

By: Spurs Fan

Spurs Fan — Mon, 01 Mar 2010 18:28:51 +0000

@ JJR — That is true. In Texas, our students do have both pledges. In my former school district, the rule was that the students had to stand as to “not cause a disturbance”, but they had the right to say the pledge or remain silent. Oddly enough, our state pledge has the phrase, “indivisible” in it, despite the fact that our state charter and constitution allow for us to divide into five autonomous states. Go figure (if this ever happens, I’ll be fleeing to the “state” that has Austin in it).

By: Guest Pest

Guest Pest — Mon, 01 Mar 2010 10:14:38 +0000

Sue the bastards!

By: Jack

Jack — Mon, 01 Mar 2010 09:34:10 +0000

She doesn’t have to say the pledge, the school can’t make her, the teacher can’t coerce her, the Constitution and Supreme Court protect her.

Why she decided not to stand is beside the point, no one is in a position to make her say it regardless of her reason.

By: Unrein

Unrein — Mon, 01 Mar 2010 08:20:03 +0000

“PATRIOT, n. One to whom the interests of a part seem superior to those of the whole. The dupe of statesmen and the tool of conquerors.

PATRIOTISM, n. Combustible rubbish read to the torch of any one ambitious to illuminate his name.

In Dr. Johnson’s famous dictionary patriotism is defined as the last resort of a scoundrel. With all due respect to an enlightened but inferior lexicographer I beg to submit that it is the first.”

- Ambrose Bierce, “The Devil’s Dictionary”