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	<title>Comments on: Another Child Suffers at the Hands of Christian Parents</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2010/07/28/another-child-suffers-at-the-hands-of-christian-parents/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2010/07/28/another-child-suffers-at-the-hands-of-christian-parents/</link>
	<description>by Hemant Mehta</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Mon, 28 May 2012 11:52:00 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Hankmoore94</title>
		<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2010/07/28/another-child-suffers-at-the-hands-of-christian-parents/#comment-786020</link>
		<dc:creator>Hankmoore94</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 31 Jul 2011 00:35:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/?p=27233#comment-786020</guid>
		<description>I know it&#039;s hard for you,but just because the doctor was an atheist or whatever doesn&#039;t mean atheist are like that.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I know it&#8217;s hard for you,but just because the doctor was an atheist or whatever doesn&#8217;t mean atheist are like that.</p>
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		<title>By: Verimius</title>
		<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2010/07/28/another-child-suffers-at-the-hands-of-christian-parents/#comment-685506</link>
		<dc:creator>Verimius</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Mar 2011 20:26:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/?p=27233#comment-685506</guid>
		<description>@Jason Hernandez

You&#039;re using the &lt;em&gt;no true Scotsman fallacy&lt;/em&gt; (look it up).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Jason Hernandez</p>
<p>You&#8217;re using the <em>no true Scotsman fallacy</em> (look it up).</p>
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		<title>By: Ruby Leigh</title>
		<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2010/07/28/another-child-suffers-at-the-hands-of-christian-parents/#comment-539674</link>
		<dc:creator>Ruby Leigh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Aug 2010 01:59:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/?p=27233#comment-539674</guid>
		<description>This is just neglect. 

I have religious parents and a hemangioma ... but I received proper care for it though.  

These people just use religion to make excuses.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is just neglect. </p>
<p>I have religious parents and a hemangioma &#8230; but I received proper care for it though.  </p>
<p>These people just use religion to make excuses.</p>
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		<title>By: Jason Hernandez</title>
		<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2010/07/28/another-child-suffers-at-the-hands-of-christian-parents/#comment-530010</link>
		<dc:creator>Jason Hernandez</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 09 Aug 2010 00:32:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/?p=27233#comment-530010</guid>
		<description>its really sad that atheists like this take the extreme example and then apply it to the whole.  These are not Christians because not Christian would allow that to happen to their child.  Just because people say they are Chrisian does not mean that they are.  I just wonder where this anger against religion comes from.  You can point out the same examples for atrocities commited by atheists but I wouldn&#039;t say that all atheists are evil.  You should come up with some actually defensable arguements against religion instead of strawmen.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>its really sad that atheists like this take the extreme example and then apply it to the whole.  These are not Christians because not Christian would allow that to happen to their child.  Just because people say they are Chrisian does not mean that they are.  I just wonder where this anger against religion comes from.  You can point out the same examples for atrocities commited by atheists but I wouldn&#8217;t say that all atheists are evil.  You should come up with some actually defensable arguements against religion instead of strawmen.</p>
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		<title>By: R. L. Helm</title>
		<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2010/07/28/another-child-suffers-at-the-hands-of-christian-parents/#comment-528140</link>
		<dc:creator>R. L. Helm</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 05 Aug 2010 21:22:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/?p=27233#comment-528140</guid>
		<description>Okay I may be the odd man out here.
The assumption seems to be here (by the title of the article and most comments) that faith is somehow the problem. I don&#039;t know of any christian who would allow a child to be neglected in this manner.  The truth is anyone can follow ignorant and dangerous advice fueled by fear.  
Are we to assume that there are no stupid parents who are athiests? It seems to me that this is more a cult than a legitimate faith.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Okay I may be the odd man out here.<br />
The assumption seems to be here (by the title of the article and most comments) that faith is somehow the problem. I don&#8217;t know of any christian who would allow a child to be neglected in this manner.  The truth is anyone can follow ignorant and dangerous advice fueled by fear.<br />
Are we to assume that there are no stupid parents who are athiests? It seems to me that this is more a cult than a legitimate faith.</p>
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		<title>By: AnonyMouse</title>
		<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2010/07/28/another-child-suffers-at-the-hands-of-christian-parents/#comment-527539</link>
		<dc:creator>AnonyMouse</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 05 Aug 2010 01:09:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/?p=27233#comment-527539</guid>
		<description>Lynn wrote,

&quot;I am absolutely certain that many people in this kind of community pray that their child may develop a medical condition so that they, too, can gain status in the community by not having it treated. People are shit.&quot;

I am an ex-Follower who despises nearly everything about their death-cult, and this made me sick.  You know nothing about these people.  Yes, they are brainwashed.  Yes, they neglect their children (among other things) in the name of God.  But they do love their children, and when things like this happen it causes them tremendous pain.  You have to understand their situation.  They have been told from the time they were tiny children that if they took themselves or their loved ones to a doctor, they risked going to a lake of fire to be tortured for eternity.  FOR. FUCKING. ETERNITY.  Even if they don&#039;t completely believe it, even if it kills them to watch their children and siblings and spouses suffer, they are not willing to risk that consequence.

Even if you take that away - even if you go with the ones who might be willing to risk it - there&#039;s the social stigma.  Taking the child to a doctor renders you a sinner - dirty, not worth being associated with.  People avoid you, give you looks in church, warn their children about you.

That is wrong and selfish, and I would never say otherwise.  But it is an extremely difficult choice and they would NEVER ask to be forced to make it.

All of the states where these people live - Oregon is NOT the only one that lets them get away with this neglect - need to illegalize religion-fueled child abuse.  Their Bible tells them that they are relieved from guilt if the law requires them to seek medical attention.  They&#039;ll go down kicking and screaming, but they&#039;ll be over it in a couple of generations.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Lynn wrote,</p>
<p>&#8220;I am absolutely certain that many people in this kind of community pray that their child may develop a medical condition so that they, too, can gain status in the community by not having it treated. People are shit.&#8221;</p>
<p>I am an ex-Follower who despises nearly everything about their death-cult, and this made me sick.  You know nothing about these people.  Yes, they are brainwashed.  Yes, they neglect their children (among other things) in the name of God.  But they do love their children, and when things like this happen it causes them tremendous pain.  You have to understand their situation.  They have been told from the time they were tiny children that if they took themselves or their loved ones to a doctor, they risked going to a lake of fire to be tortured for eternity.  FOR. FUCKING. ETERNITY.  Even if they don&#8217;t completely believe it, even if it kills them to watch their children and siblings and spouses suffer, they are not willing to risk that consequence.</p>
<p>Even if you take that away &#8211; even if you go with the ones who might be willing to risk it &#8211; there&#8217;s the social stigma.  Taking the child to a doctor renders you a sinner &#8211; dirty, not worth being associated with.  People avoid you, give you looks in church, warn their children about you.</p>
<p>That is wrong and selfish, and I would never say otherwise.  But it is an extremely difficult choice and they would NEVER ask to be forced to make it.</p>
<p>All of the states where these people live &#8211; Oregon is NOT the only one that lets them get away with this neglect &#8211; need to illegalize religion-fueled child abuse.  Their Bible tells them that they are relieved from guilt if the law requires them to seek medical attention.  They&#8217;ll go down kicking and screaming, but they&#8217;ll be over it in a couple of generations.</p>
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		<title>By: Elena Villarreal</title>
		<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2010/07/28/another-child-suffers-at-the-hands-of-christian-parents/#comment-524140</link>
		<dc:creator>Elena Villarreal</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Jul 2010 22:11:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/?p=27233#comment-524140</guid>
		<description>@ hippiefemme

People say things like “It was God’s will that we caught this problem in time,” or “Thank God for modern medicine so that our little girl won’t be permanently impaired,” all the time. They&#039;re just less noteworthy.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ hippiefemme</p>
<p>People say things like “It was God’s will that we caught this problem in time,” or “Thank God for modern medicine so that our little girl won’t be permanently impaired,” all the time. They&#8217;re just less noteworthy.</p>
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		<title>By: mechanoid</title>
		<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2010/07/28/another-child-suffers-at-the-hands-of-christian-parents/#comment-524129</link>
		<dc:creator>mechanoid</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Jul 2010 21:31:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/?p=27233#comment-524129</guid>
		<description>@Bertram Cabot, Jr.
&lt;blockquote&gt;I BLAME YOU for the ATHEIST DOCTOR who killed my dad with his arrogant medical malpractice.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

The real problem here is that the Follower&#039;s of Christ withhold necessary medical care &lt;strong&gt;in the Name of God&lt;/strong&gt;.

Unless your doctor &lt;strong&gt;&quot;killed in the name of ATHEISM&quot;&lt;/strong&gt;, your rage and grief are misplaced.

I suggest some grief counseling, and/or anger management classes. Good luck to you.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Bertram Cabot, Jr.</p>
<blockquote><p>I BLAME YOU for the ATHEIST DOCTOR who killed my dad with his arrogant medical malpractice.</p></blockquote>
<p>The real problem here is that the Follower&#8217;s of Christ withhold necessary medical care <strong>in the Name of God</strong>.</p>
<p>Unless your doctor <strong>&#8220;killed in the name of ATHEISM&#8221;</strong>, your rage and grief are misplaced.</p>
<p>I suggest some grief counseling, and/or anger management classes. Good luck to you.</p>
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		<title>By: Bertram Cabot, Jr.</title>
		<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2010/07/28/another-child-suffers-at-the-hands-of-christian-parents/#comment-523824</link>
		<dc:creator>Bertram Cabot, Jr.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Jul 2010 09:57:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/?p=27233#comment-523824</guid>
		<description>And just as you blame all Christians for this, I BLAME YOU for the ATHEIST DOCTOR who killed my dad with his arrogant medical malpractice.

I BLAME ALL OF YOU.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And just as you blame all Christians for this, I BLAME YOU for the ATHEIST DOCTOR who killed my dad with his arrogant medical malpractice.</p>
<p>I BLAME ALL OF YOU.</p>
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		<title>By: kumquatwriter</title>
		<link>http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2010/07/28/another-child-suffers-at-the-hands-of-christian-parents/#comment-523714</link>
		<dc:creator>kumquatwriter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Jul 2010 04:25:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/?p=27233#comment-523714</guid>
		<description>@Manksteve: As long as MANA (Midwives Alliance of North America) refuses to release it&#039;s own safety data to the public, and with regards to the recently published Wax homebirth study demonstrating that homebirth has triple the neonatal fatality rate as hospital birth, I am not comfortable with homebirth.  Many of my dearest friends have had them, and all have had wonderful outcomes, and I chose to support them in their choices.  I am not against women who have homebirths, I am against midwives and advocates who push faulty and often deliberately misleading safety data.  One source that can serve as a handy starting point (though she&#039;s pretty brash) is the Skeptical OB (http://skepticalob.blogspot.com).  I don&#039;t agree with her on everything, but she does regularly provide links to peer-reviewed journals and the actual studies most blogs just quote out of context.

Honestly, I get much more hostility by being against homebirth than I do for being Atheist.  Again I must say, I am NOT sitting in judgment of other women who choose to birth at home.  I wish they had more and better data available to them, but I respect their choices.  I wish more people (particularly advocates) were willing to discuss this topic--but I get just as much (if not more) anger and refusal to hear my input as I do on the occasions I&#039;ve tried to discuss evolution vs. &quot;Intelligent Design.&quot;  

Also, and I don&#039;t know if this matters, I am 7 months pregnant.   

Freebirthing (by choice) on the other hand I am wholly against on the same page as the &quot;god will heal our baby.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Manksteve: As long as MANA (Midwives Alliance of North America) refuses to release it&#8217;s own safety data to the public, and with regards to the recently published Wax homebirth study demonstrating that homebirth has triple the neonatal fatality rate as hospital birth, I am not comfortable with homebirth.  Many of my dearest friends have had them, and all have had wonderful outcomes, and I chose to support them in their choices.  I am not against women who have homebirths, I am against midwives and advocates who push faulty and often deliberately misleading safety data.  One source that can serve as a handy starting point (though she&#8217;s pretty brash) is the Skeptical OB (<a href="http://skepticalob.blogspot.com" rel="nofollow">http://skepticalob.blogspot.com</a>).  I don&#8217;t agree with her on everything, but she does regularly provide links to peer-reviewed journals and the actual studies most blogs just quote out of context.</p>
<p>Honestly, I get much more hostility by being against homebirth than I do for being Atheist.  Again I must say, I am NOT sitting in judgment of other women who choose to birth at home.  I wish they had more and better data available to them, but I respect their choices.  I wish more people (particularly advocates) were willing to discuss this topic&#8211;but I get just as much (if not more) anger and refusal to hear my input as I do on the occasions I&#8217;ve tried to discuss evolution vs. &#8220;Intelligent Design.&#8221;  </p>
<p>Also, and I don&#8217;t know if this matters, I am 7 months pregnant.   </p>
<p>Freebirthing (by choice) on the other hand I am wholly against on the same page as the &#8220;god will heal our baby.&#8221;</p>
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