So which one should I vote for?

The Virginia primary is on February 12. Someone asked me who I was for and I didn’t know what to say. Some of the candidates have good qualities, but all of them–in my humble opinion–have flaws. The question now is how to balance all of this out. I’ve got two weeks to decide. I am totally open to persuasion. You readers always help me think through things, so I’m appealing to you now. Whom should I vote for and why?

About Gene Veith

Professor of Literature at Patrick Henry College, the Director of the Cranach Institute at Concordia Theological Seminary, a columnist for World Magazine and TableTalk, and the author of 18 books on different facets of Christianity & Culture.

  • http://scott.andstuff.org/ Scott Moonen

    Ron Paul — a Patrick Henry for our time. ;)

  • http://scott.andstuff.org/ Scott Moonen

    Ron Paul — a Patrick Henry for our time. ;)

  • Ken

    The Virginia (and Maryland, for me) primary falls one week after Super Tuesday. There’s a very good chance the Republican race will be down to two or maybe even one man by then. IOW, your choice may be simplified fairly soon. Not to say made more palatable, just simpler.

  • Ken

    The Virginia (and Maryland, for me) primary falls one week after Super Tuesday. There’s a very good chance the Republican race will be down to two or maybe even one man by then. IOW, your choice may be simplified fairly soon. Not to say made more palatable, just simpler.

  • Richard

    McCain–he has many flaws, but he is strong on Islamic fascism, and has been consistently pro-life.

  • Richard

    McCain–he has many flaws, but he is strong on Islamic fascism, and has been consistently pro-life.

  • Joe

    Ken, I think the race is already down to two men. The fact that Rudy and Huckabee have nto quit yet does not mean they have a chance. It is between McCain and Mitt.

  • Joe

    Ken, I think the race is already down to two men. The fact that Rudy and Huckabee have nto quit yet does not mean they have a chance. It is between McCain and Mitt.

  • http://www.pagantolutheran.blogspot.com Bruce

    Only one of the two has extensive experience as an executive. I think this point is often missing when discussing candidates. An awful lot of being the president is administrating an enormous, often contentious bureaucracy.

    As for McCain, yes he is strong on defense. That isn’t to say Romney wouldn’t be just as strong. I don’t like what McCain has done with Feingold and Kennedy. That is two solid strikes and I could probably find a third.

    Not that I’m trying to influence anyone’s vote, mind you.

  • http://www.pagantolutheran.blogspot.com Bruce

    Only one of the two has extensive experience as an executive. I think this point is often missing when discussing candidates. An awful lot of being the president is administrating an enormous, often contentious bureaucracy.

    As for McCain, yes he is strong on defense. That isn’t to say Romney wouldn’t be just as strong. I don’t like what McCain has done with Feingold and Kennedy. That is two solid strikes and I could probably find a third.

    Not that I’m trying to influence anyone’s vote, mind you.

  • Manxman

    Ron Paul – he is truly different from the other candidates – in a good way.

  • Manxman

    Ron Paul – he is truly different from the other candidates – in a good way.

  • phdsvp

    Yeah, Ron Paul’s different…if you consider being a racist crackpot different.

    Frankly, it doesn’t matter. If, by then, your choices are either McCain, Hillary, or Barak, they’re the same person.

  • phdsvp

    Yeah, Ron Paul’s different…if you consider being a racist crackpot different.

    Frankly, it doesn’t matter. If, by then, your choices are either McCain, Hillary, or Barak, they’re the same person.

  • organshoes

    You tell me, brother. I’m stumped.
    If consistently pro-life includes favoring embryonic stem cell experimentation–even in the face of new (and successful) techniques for non-embryonic cells–then I guess McCain is consistent.
    My, the nuance.
    Mitt’s an executive. A businessman. Same was said about George W. Bush, having been successful ‘in the private sector.’ A sector which he has let down as a budget-busting, government-program initiator.
    Don’t like that Mitt’s a Mormon? Well, what are any of the other candidates, and why does it matter? If they say they’re Christian, what sort of theology do they embrace? With what confession are they affiliated? What do their Bibles say? What does their Jesus say, and what does He do? Inspire more ‘giving’ as through increased taxation, or more peace as in not only Love your enemies, but bargain with them?
    It’s a real dilemma, and it’s the largely untold story of the Republican race. I know many Republicans would like us conservatives to just get in line and vote to win, but we resent the loss of our beliefs (forget that fuzzy ‘values’ word), and that loss for the sake of an uncertain victory.
    This is where the Chinese restaurant ballot would be so helpful: one from column A, one from B, etc.

  • organshoes

    You tell me, brother. I’m stumped.
    If consistently pro-life includes favoring embryonic stem cell experimentation–even in the face of new (and successful) techniques for non-embryonic cells–then I guess McCain is consistent.
    My, the nuance.
    Mitt’s an executive. A businessman. Same was said about George W. Bush, having been successful ‘in the private sector.’ A sector which he has let down as a budget-busting, government-program initiator.
    Don’t like that Mitt’s a Mormon? Well, what are any of the other candidates, and why does it matter? If they say they’re Christian, what sort of theology do they embrace? With what confession are they affiliated? What do their Bibles say? What does their Jesus say, and what does He do? Inspire more ‘giving’ as through increased taxation, or more peace as in not only Love your enemies, but bargain with them?
    It’s a real dilemma, and it’s the largely untold story of the Republican race. I know many Republicans would like us conservatives to just get in line and vote to win, but we resent the loss of our beliefs (forget that fuzzy ‘values’ word), and that loss for the sake of an uncertain victory.
    This is where the Chinese restaurant ballot would be so helpful: one from column A, one from B, etc.

  • http://puttingoutthefire.blogspot.com Frank

    Romney. Yes McCain is on the right side of what needs to be done with the Mohammedan problem. But, he authored the biggest attack on free speech ever, McCain-Feingold. He supported immigration reform that excused the breaking of our country’s laws. He supported allowing rules of the senate to trump the constitution on the matter of judicial nominations. The president promises to uphold the constitution, McCain has shown that he might not be able to be trusted.
    That’s not to say that I don’t have very serious issues with Romney. Some might say that his flip flopping on issues is indefensible. I say defending the indefensible is indefensible.

  • http://puttingoutthefire.blogspot.com Frank

    Romney. Yes McCain is on the right side of what needs to be done with the Mohammedan problem. But, he authored the biggest attack on free speech ever, McCain-Feingold. He supported immigration reform that excused the breaking of our country’s laws. He supported allowing rules of the senate to trump the constitution on the matter of judicial nominations. The president promises to uphold the constitution, McCain has shown that he might not be able to be trusted.
    That’s not to say that I don’t have very serious issues with Romney. Some might say that his flip flopping on issues is indefensible. I say defending the indefensible is indefensible.

  • The Jones

    J Mac, baby. One foot in the grave and still kicking electoral tail all across the US of A.

    Some people have some legitimate differences of opinion with John McCain regarding policy, but I love how he’s honest about what he belives, even when its very unpopular. I’ll take a bull-headed, stubborn, and honest politician over a looks good in the moment politician any day.

  • The Jones

    J Mac, baby. One foot in the grave and still kicking electoral tail all across the US of A.

    Some people have some legitimate differences of opinion with John McCain regarding policy, but I love how he’s honest about what he belives, even when its very unpopular. I’ll take a bull-headed, stubborn, and honest politician over a looks good in the moment politician any day.

  • Carl Vehse

    Those who favor McCain might wish to note who they would like to see as the VP candidate. Senator McCain’s grandfather died at age 61, and his father died at age 70. McCain is 71.

    In addition to McCain’s age and the stress being in the Oval Office, Thomas Sowell noted:

    “Senator McCain’s teaming up with Senator Ted Kennedy on immigration, and with equally left-wing Senator Russ Feingold to violate the First Amendment in the name of “campaign-finance reform,” are classic examples of a loose cannon.”

    An elderly loose cannon.

  • Carl Vehse

    Those who favor McCain might wish to note who they would like to see as the VP candidate. Senator McCain’s grandfather died at age 61, and his father died at age 70. McCain is 71.

    In addition to McCain’s age and the stress being in the Oval Office, Thomas Sowell noted:

    “Senator McCain’s teaming up with Senator Ted Kennedy on immigration, and with equally left-wing Senator Russ Feingold to violate the First Amendment in the name of “campaign-finance reform,” are classic examples of a loose cannon.”

    An elderly loose cannon.

  • Bror Erickson

    Mitt Romney said in his speech on religion that he knows his sphere and his church knows theirs. Unfortunately that just isn’t true. Anyone living in Utah knows that. I debate whether him being mormon really should play at all in my consideration of him for president. The results of my internal debate don’t really matter for two reasons. 1 I don’t like the guy, and could care less about his buisness experience. Government is not a fortune 500 company. His impersonal approach to government, the fact that he refused to pardon ANYONE while he was govenor, tell me he will not make a good president. Pardons are there for a reason one should consider them on a case by case, not a rubberstamp denial. 2. The fact that I have an internal debate about how much his religion should play a role in my consideration of him means that it is playing a role.
    Yesterday I received the local paper and found it very intereting in light of Romneys speech a month ago, that the church is weighing in in Utah on a bill effecting the sale of alcohol in the state. 4 Years ago Huntsman (govenor of Utah, Mormon, supporting McCain) wanted to repeal the state’s quirky laws concerning alcohol, or at least revamp them to be more in line with what you find in the rest of the western states. But as other states are seeing more and more the futility of Blue laws, and making it easier for micro brews, and resturaunt owners to conduct buisness, Utah has decided to go backwards and now will not allow the sale of wine coolers, and the like in Grocery stores. Now this does not effect me so much, except that I like to get my wife liquored up on them and now I will have to buy them at a more expensive (42% marked up price) in the state run Liquor stores. I will still be able to buy my 3.2 beer though in the grocery store. All because the “Church” (as they are wont to call it out here) has deemed the sale of a legal substance by law abiding grocers to adults (who evidently are not allowed to make choices for themselves) a moral issue. Thankfully my congregation has a liquor license entitling us to the right of serving wine for communion.

  • Bror Erickson

    Mitt Romney said in his speech on religion that he knows his sphere and his church knows theirs. Unfortunately that just isn’t true. Anyone living in Utah knows that. I debate whether him being mormon really should play at all in my consideration of him for president. The results of my internal debate don’t really matter for two reasons. 1 I don’t like the guy, and could care less about his buisness experience. Government is not a fortune 500 company. His impersonal approach to government, the fact that he refused to pardon ANYONE while he was govenor, tell me he will not make a good president. Pardons are there for a reason one should consider them on a case by case, not a rubberstamp denial. 2. The fact that I have an internal debate about how much his religion should play a role in my consideration of him means that it is playing a role.
    Yesterday I received the local paper and found it very intereting in light of Romneys speech a month ago, that the church is weighing in in Utah on a bill effecting the sale of alcohol in the state. 4 Years ago Huntsman (govenor of Utah, Mormon, supporting McCain) wanted to repeal the state’s quirky laws concerning alcohol, or at least revamp them to be more in line with what you find in the rest of the western states. But as other states are seeing more and more the futility of Blue laws, and making it easier for micro brews, and resturaunt owners to conduct buisness, Utah has decided to go backwards and now will not allow the sale of wine coolers, and the like in Grocery stores. Now this does not effect me so much, except that I like to get my wife liquored up on them and now I will have to buy them at a more expensive (42% marked up price) in the state run Liquor stores. I will still be able to buy my 3.2 beer though in the grocery store. All because the “Church” (as they are wont to call it out here) has deemed the sale of a legal substance by law abiding grocers to adults (who evidently are not allowed to make choices for themselves) a moral issue. Thankfully my congregation has a liquor license entitling us to the right of serving wine for communion.

  • http://amusedmomma.blogspot.com Paula

    With this country drowning in debt and borrowing so much from China, our national security at risk from illegal immigration and being the world’s big brother, our soverignty challenged by too close of an association with the UN, the only candidate talking about ALL those things AND proposing change rather than the status quo is Ron Paul.

    Visit ronpaul2008.com to check out the issues you’re concerned about.

  • http://amusedmomma.blogspot.com Paula

    With this country drowning in debt and borrowing so much from China, our national security at risk from illegal immigration and being the world’s big brother, our soverignty challenged by too close of an association with the UN, the only candidate talking about ALL those things AND proposing change rather than the status quo is Ron Paul.

    Visit ronpaul2008.com to check out the issues you’re concerned about.

  • JLarson

    Well, Edwards is out, so you can cross him off your list. ;)

  • JLarson

    Well, Edwards is out, so you can cross him off your list. ;)

  • David Thompson

    I will go with Ron Paul as long as I think he has the ability to hold Romney and McCain’s feet to the fire and force them – if in fact he can – to at least espouse a belief in limited government. When his effectiveness dies out (if it hasn’t already) I will then decide which of the remaining three holds more strongly to 1) limited government (because an expanding fed will inevitably trespass upon the family and the church), 2) moral absolutes (especially in the areas of life, marriage, and family), and 3) a strong national defense.

  • David Thompson

    I will go with Ron Paul as long as I think he has the ability to hold Romney and McCain’s feet to the fire and force them – if in fact he can – to at least espouse a belief in limited government. When his effectiveness dies out (if it hasn’t already) I will then decide which of the remaining three holds more strongly to 1) limited government (because an expanding fed will inevitably trespass upon the family and the church), 2) moral absolutes (especially in the areas of life, marriage, and family), and 3) a strong national defense.

  • Don S

    I, too, am struggling with the decision, and I have to vote next Tuesday. It appears that Giuliani is probably going to exit the race today, and it appears also that Huck has decided to run for Vice President on the McCain ticket.

    I’m unsettled about Romney, and dislike the way McCain has relished poking conservatives in the eye over the years on most every issue important to us, including our 1st Amendment right to political speech, immigration reform, judges, stem cell research, etc. I probably won’t decide until I step in the booth.

    Whoever wins, however (and at this point it would seem likely that it will be McCain), there will be no hesitation to vote for that candidate in November. The Supreme Court is at stake, and I don’t want Hillary or Barack appointing our next three justices.

  • Don S

    I, too, am struggling with the decision, and I have to vote next Tuesday. It appears that Giuliani is probably going to exit the race today, and it appears also that Huck has decided to run for Vice President on the McCain ticket.

    I’m unsettled about Romney, and dislike the way McCain has relished poking conservatives in the eye over the years on most every issue important to us, including our 1st Amendment right to political speech, immigration reform, judges, stem cell research, etc. I probably won’t decide until I step in the booth.

    Whoever wins, however (and at this point it would seem likely that it will be McCain), there will be no hesitation to vote for that candidate in November. The Supreme Court is at stake, and I don’t want Hillary or Barack appointing our next three justices.

  • Larry

    It’s not too late to give Ron Paul a FAIR hearing (for a change). I humbly submit that those who say “racist and crackpot” may do well to meditate on Prov. 18:13. The primaries are a struggle for the soul of the party. Even if Paul does not stand a chance of getting the nomination, he still represents principles the Republican Party needs to hear and heed. Maybe he’ll function like Goldwater did and give rise to a Reagan in the future.

  • Larry

    It’s not too late to give Ron Paul a FAIR hearing (for a change). I humbly submit that those who say “racist and crackpot” may do well to meditate on Prov. 18:13. The primaries are a struggle for the soul of the party. Even if Paul does not stand a chance of getting the nomination, he still represents principles the Republican Party needs to hear and heed. Maybe he’ll function like Goldwater did and give rise to a Reagan in the future.

  • Joe

    Don’t forget that McCain is bad on the 2nd amendment as well. He was a co-sponsor of the gun show loophole fix, bill s. 890, that would have effectively outlawed all private guns sales that occur at a guns show unless the seller had a federal license. As it is now, you need a license only if your in the business of selling guns (defined by the number guns you sell).

    He also did anti-gun ads that ran in movie theaters before the movie Pearl Harbor. Gun Owners of America gave him a C- in 2000 and 2002 and an F- in 2004 and 2006. The NRA gave him a C in 2004.

  • Joe

    Don’t forget that McCain is bad on the 2nd amendment as well. He was a co-sponsor of the gun show loophole fix, bill s. 890, that would have effectively outlawed all private guns sales that occur at a guns show unless the seller had a federal license. As it is now, you need a license only if your in the business of selling guns (defined by the number guns you sell).

    He also did anti-gun ads that ran in movie theaters before the movie Pearl Harbor. Gun Owners of America gave him a C- in 2000 and 2002 and an F- in 2004 and 2006. The NRA gave him a C in 2004.

  • Bror Erickson

    McCain; it is rather sad that the republican party was unable to find a better candidate, actually I think they did in a few people, but they have not survived the race. It seems one of them will be on the same ticket as McCain. I can only hope they tailor each other well. I do think McCain will do a better job then any of the other canidates running. I do however, have reservations about him. I guess just not as many as I do the alternative.

  • Bror Erickson

    McCain; it is rather sad that the republican party was unable to find a better candidate, actually I think they did in a few people, but they have not survived the race. It seems one of them will be on the same ticket as McCain. I can only hope they tailor each other well. I do think McCain will do a better job then any of the other canidates running. I do however, have reservations about him. I guess just not as many as I do the alternative.

  • Chilibean

    I’m at a point where I don’t even want to vote in November. I may be writing in ‘Beaver Cleaver’, or ‘George Bailey’ on my ballot.

  • Chilibean

    I’m at a point where I don’t even want to vote in November. I may be writing in ‘Beaver Cleaver’, or ‘George Bailey’ on my ballot.

  • organshoes

    What qualifies the Beaver or Bailey for your vote, over any of the present candidates?
    Do you even realize what George Bailey believes about angels, for heaven’s sake? Doesn’t that give you pause at least…?

  • organshoes

    What qualifies the Beaver or Bailey for your vote, over any of the present candidates?
    Do you even realize what George Bailey believes about angels, for heaven’s sake? Doesn’t that give you pause at least…?

  • http://www.cockahoop.com/ tODD

    Chilibean (@20), it is my understanding that one of the qualifications for presidential candidates is that they be (1) alive and (2) not fake. I believe Thompson dropped out due to the first qualification, and it remains to be seen if Romney will due to the second. :)

  • http://www.cockahoop.com/ tODD

    Chilibean (@20), it is my understanding that one of the qualifications for presidential candidates is that they be (1) alive and (2) not fake. I believe Thompson dropped out due to the first qualification, and it remains to be seen if Romney will due to the second. :)

  • organshoes

    If being ‘not fake’ is a qualification, we’re doomed.
    Maybe ‘not fictional’ is more accurate.
    Faking it–vamping thru the primaries to the nomination–being fake: that’s how they all do it.
    Who’s a cynic?

  • organshoes

    If being ‘not fake’ is a qualification, we’re doomed.
    Maybe ‘not fictional’ is more accurate.
    Faking it–vamping thru the primaries to the nomination–being fake: that’s how they all do it.
    Who’s a cynic?

  • Carl Vehse

    The GOP should consider Teddy Roosevelt; he has the experience and the ideal campaign motto… unless the Bull Moose Party decides to run him in 2008.

  • Carl Vehse

    The GOP should consider Teddy Roosevelt; he has the experience and the ideal campaign motto… unless the Bull Moose Party decides to run him in 2008.

  • http://www.bikebubba.blogspot.com Bike Bubba

    Kucinich!

    (did I have anyone fooled?)

    I wish I could vote for Ron Paul, but his stance on radical Islam is a bit weak. Huckabee, despite some liberal tendencies on his part. I can’t go easily with Romney or McCain because of their records.

  • http://www.bikebubba.blogspot.com Bike Bubba

    Kucinich!

    (did I have anyone fooled?)

    I wish I could vote for Ron Paul, but his stance on radical Islam is a bit weak. Huckabee, despite some liberal tendencies on his part. I can’t go easily with Romney or McCain because of their records.

  • Greg

    When I thought Guiliani was going to be the winner I was going to vote for Paul as a protest. Now that Guiliani is out of the picture its all about stoping Hilary(she will win the demos.) I think Mccain -Huckabee is the strongest ticket. I decided that if Romney won florida I would vote for Mccain since Mccain won I will vote for Huckabee. I want Mccain to win but I want Huckabee to be strong enough to get VP.

  • Greg

    When I thought Guiliani was going to be the winner I was going to vote for Paul as a protest. Now that Guiliani is out of the picture its all about stoping Hilary(she will win the demos.) I think Mccain -Huckabee is the strongest ticket. I decided that if Romney won florida I would vote for Mccain since Mccain won I will vote for Huckabee. I want Mccain to win but I want Huckabee to be strong enough to get VP.

  • Greg

    By the way PHdSVP there is no evidence I am aware of that Ron Paul is racist. If you have some please post it. If you don’t find your father confessor and confess your breaking of the eighth commandment.

  • Greg

    By the way PHdSVP there is no evidence I am aware of that Ron Paul is racist. If you have some please post it. If you don’t find your father confessor and confess your breaking of the eighth commandment.

  • kerner

    Organshoes @8:

    You ask what the theology of the other candidates is like.

    I have researched McCain. He has a video on “Faith” which you can find here:

    McCain is an Episcopalian. However, he and his family have been attending a large (5000 members, or something like that) Southern Baptist church in Phoenix. I think his wife and some of his children have been baptized (or re-baptized) by this church, but I believe McCain has not. While most of McCain’s children went to preppy type grade schools and High Schools (or elite Catholic High Schools), his two youngest children attended Christ Lutheran Elementary School in Phoenix.

    When I watch McCain’s “Faith” video, it seems to focus more on works to me (It’s only a minute video, but the McCain campaign presumably made it). On the other hand it also seems to be about being a part of God’s plan and his faith being kind of an individual thing. I read somewhere that McCain has reminisced about his father praying regularly from an old prayer book (the Book of Common Prayer?). Maybe it was from McCain’s book, “Faith of My Fathers”. I found an exerpt from that book here:

    http://www.bookbrowse.com/exerpts/index.cfm?book_number=200&page_number=1

    This exerpt is not about spiritual things as far as I can see, but it is rather about the exploits of a young Midshipman and/or Naval officer (including a description of shore leave in Rio; check it out, fw). McCain has a video and has given speeches about a guard in his Vietnamese prison loosening his bonds (while he was tightly and painfully tied up) and later this guard drawing a cross in the dirt. McCain seems to have concluded from this that God has never abandonned him, even in his most dire circumstances.

    It is my impression that McCain is not a thinker of deep theological thoughts. Indeed, he does not appear to me to be the contemplative type at all. Rather, he seems to me to be basicly what used to be called “a man of action”. This accounts for many of his strengths, as well as a lot of his more obvious wrong turns. If I had to guess about the status of McCain’s soul (always a really risky practice), I would guess that he is a Christian, but he is the kind of Christian who has really taken the Book of James to heart.

    So, does anybody know anything about Huckabee? I heard he was a televangelist in the early days, but I’m not even sure of that.

  • kerner

    Organshoes @8:

    You ask what the theology of the other candidates is like.

    I have researched McCain. He has a video on “Faith” which you can find here:

    McCain is an Episcopalian. However, he and his family have been attending a large (5000 members, or something like that) Southern Baptist church in Phoenix. I think his wife and some of his children have been baptized (or re-baptized) by this church, but I believe McCain has not. While most of McCain’s children went to preppy type grade schools and High Schools (or elite Catholic High Schools), his two youngest children attended Christ Lutheran Elementary School in Phoenix.

    When I watch McCain’s “Faith” video, it seems to focus more on works to me (It’s only a minute video, but the McCain campaign presumably made it). On the other hand it also seems to be about being a part of God’s plan and his faith being kind of an individual thing. I read somewhere that McCain has reminisced about his father praying regularly from an old prayer book (the Book of Common Prayer?). Maybe it was from McCain’s book, “Faith of My Fathers”. I found an exerpt from that book here:

    http://www.bookbrowse.com/exerpts/index.cfm?book_number=200&page_number=1

    This exerpt is not about spiritual things as far as I can see, but it is rather about the exploits of a young Midshipman and/or Naval officer (including a description of shore leave in Rio; check it out, fw). McCain has a video and has given speeches about a guard in his Vietnamese prison loosening his bonds (while he was tightly and painfully tied up) and later this guard drawing a cross in the dirt. McCain seems to have concluded from this that God has never abandonned him, even in his most dire circumstances.

    It is my impression that McCain is not a thinker of deep theological thoughts. Indeed, he does not appear to me to be the contemplative type at all. Rather, he seems to me to be basicly what used to be called “a man of action”. This accounts for many of his strengths, as well as a lot of his more obvious wrong turns. If I had to guess about the status of McCain’s soul (always a really risky practice), I would guess that he is a Christian, but he is the kind of Christian who has really taken the Book of James to heart.

    So, does anybody know anything about Huckabee? I heard he was a televangelist in the early days, but I’m not even sure of that.

  • kerner

    well, both of my links appear to be dead or wrong

    try this:

    http://bookbrowse.com/excerpts/index.cfm?book_number=200&page_number=1

    and this:

  • kerner

    well, both of my links appear to be dead or wrong

    try this:

    http://bookbrowse.com/excerpts/index.cfm?book_number=200&page_number=1

    and this:

  • Paul

    I’m tempted to vote in the Minnesota DFL (Democratic Farm Labor Party – MN doesn’t have a straight Dem party) caucus because I feel so strongly against Clinton. Then, if it’s between Obama and McCain in November, it’s a decision for one generation or another. Obama could usher in the next era of political leadership as JFK did. Trouble is, I have no idea the kind of people with whom Obama would surround himself. Or will it be a question of defense and statesmanship? In that case, it would be McCain. On the other hand, if the November decision is between Romney and Obama, I will probably make my first vote ever for a Democrat because Romney scares me only slightly less than Clinton. If Huckabee makes it to November, no doubt he’s got my vote. If Clinton is on the November ballot, I’d even vote for Romney.

    But what about Obama/Huckabee? Could such a thing happen?

    Bottom line, if I want an Old School President I’d probably vote for McCain. If I’m willing to take a risk for change, then I’d consider Obama….which bring me back to the possibility of participating in the Democrat caucus this Tuesday – because I’m more afraid of Clinton than Obama.

    On the lighter side, maybe another Clinton administration would give the nation another shot at a Clinton impeachment?

  • Paul

    I’m tempted to vote in the Minnesota DFL (Democratic Farm Labor Party – MN doesn’t have a straight Dem party) caucus because I feel so strongly against Clinton. Then, if it’s between Obama and McCain in November, it’s a decision for one generation or another. Obama could usher in the next era of political leadership as JFK did. Trouble is, I have no idea the kind of people with whom Obama would surround himself. Or will it be a question of defense and statesmanship? In that case, it would be McCain. On the other hand, if the November decision is between Romney and Obama, I will probably make my first vote ever for a Democrat because Romney scares me only slightly less than Clinton. If Huckabee makes it to November, no doubt he’s got my vote. If Clinton is on the November ballot, I’d even vote for Romney.

    But what about Obama/Huckabee? Could such a thing happen?

    Bottom line, if I want an Old School President I’d probably vote for McCain. If I’m willing to take a risk for change, then I’d consider Obama….which bring me back to the possibility of participating in the Democrat caucus this Tuesday – because I’m more afraid of Clinton than Obama.

    On the lighter side, maybe another Clinton administration would give the nation another shot at a Clinton impeachment?

  • Carl Vehse

    The NYT article, “An Ex-President, a Mining Deal and a Big Donor” (http://www.nytimes.com/2008/01/31/us/politics/31donor.html?_r=1&hp=&oref=slogin&pagewanted=print), gives an example of the type of dealings we can expect from another Clinton admimistration.

    On the other hand one can review the Saudi deals with the Bush I or II administrations.

    I don’t think Congress is capable of impeaching anyone any more, much less convicting them. It’s a “pot and kettle” thing.

  • Carl Vehse

    The NYT article, “An Ex-President, a Mining Deal and a Big Donor” (http://www.nytimes.com/2008/01/31/us/politics/31donor.html?_r=1&hp=&oref=slogin&pagewanted=print), gives an example of the type of dealings we can expect from another Clinton admimistration.

    On the other hand one can review the Saudi deals with the Bush I or II administrations.

    I don’t think Congress is capable of impeaching anyone any more, much less convicting them. It’s a “pot and kettle” thing.

  • organshoes

    kerner #28
    Thank you. I was sort of asking rhetorically about the other candidates’ religious views. And solely on account of those who refuse to vote for a Mormon.
    I don’t have any illusions about what Mormons believe, but I don’t have any reason to trust any of the other candidates on the basis of thier beliefs either.
    I know too many shades and shapes of Christianity, and what it inspires, to make religion a test of a candidate’s fitness.
    If a Christian see his faith as inspiration or guide for policies I don’t agree with (raising taxes to lift the poor out of poverty, for instance, or not confronting enemies), then I’m not voting for that Christian.
    In politics, unlike in faith, it’s pretty much about works. Belief is pretty much irrelevant.

  • organshoes

    kerner #28
    Thank you. I was sort of asking rhetorically about the other candidates’ religious views. And solely on account of those who refuse to vote for a Mormon.
    I don’t have any illusions about what Mormons believe, but I don’t have any reason to trust any of the other candidates on the basis of thier beliefs either.
    I know too many shades and shapes of Christianity, and what it inspires, to make religion a test of a candidate’s fitness.
    If a Christian see his faith as inspiration or guide for policies I don’t agree with (raising taxes to lift the poor out of poverty, for instance, or not confronting enemies), then I’m not voting for that Christian.
    In politics, unlike in faith, it’s pretty much about works. Belief is pretty much irrelevant.

  • B.Wink

    “Former Utah governor and current Cabinet secretary Mike Leavitt sought to infuse the lessons of his religion into his inaugural address and into state policy, conducting a series of “Early Morning Seminary” classes in which he and top advisers discussed how to incorporate “just and holy” Mormon principles into his governance, archival records show. ” — The Salt Lake Tribune, 12/30/2007

  • B.Wink

    “Former Utah governor and current Cabinet secretary Mike Leavitt sought to infuse the lessons of his religion into his inaugural address and into state policy, conducting a series of “Early Morning Seminary” classes in which he and top advisers discussed how to incorporate “just and holy” Mormon principles into his governance, archival records show. ” — The Salt Lake Tribune, 12/30/2007

  • B.Wink

    I also live outside of Salt Lake City. In December it came out that former Governor Leavitt held the above meetings in the Governor’s Mansion. Minutes were taken at these meetings and have now been made public. (Even though he fought to keep them private). I have the same struggle that Bror Erickson does. The mormon church has successfully infused & incorporated many policies into the government of Utah. The sphere of Romney’s church and government are one in the same here in Utah. So I have a hard time believing that Romney could easily keep them separate as he stated in his speech.

  • B.Wink

    I also live outside of Salt Lake City. In December it came out that former Governor Leavitt held the above meetings in the Governor’s Mansion. Minutes were taken at these meetings and have now been made public. (Even though he fought to keep them private). I have the same struggle that Bror Erickson does. The mormon church has successfully infused & incorporated many policies into the government of Utah. The sphere of Romney’s church and government are one in the same here in Utah. So I have a hard time believing that Romney could easily keep them separate as he stated in his speech.

  • Bror Erickson

    Thanks B.Wink, Sometimes I beging to wonder if I am just off in left field. We should get together sometime.
    Organshoes, I always believed I knew what mormons believed, then I moved to Utah.

  • Bror Erickson

    Thanks B.Wink, Sometimes I beging to wonder if I am just off in left field. We should get together sometime.
    Organshoes, I always believed I knew what mormons believed, then I moved to Utah.

  • Bror Erickson

    Organshoes,
    Belief can be irrelevent in politics, but it is not always so. Beliefs can be very relevent.

  • Bror Erickson

    Organshoes,
    Belief can be irrelevent in politics, but it is not always so. Beliefs can be very relevent.

  • http://www.cockahoop.com/ tODD

    Carl (@31), surely you don’t believe what the New York Times says?

  • http://www.cockahoop.com/ tODD

    Carl (@31), surely you don’t believe what the New York Times says?

  • Chilibean

    Chilibean only used the Beaver Cleaver / George Bailey scenario because that I find on the horizon are as qualified as these fictional characters. The fact of the matter is I may leave this ballot section blank as I do for all the Judgeship nominations that I can’t find info.

  • Chilibean

    Chilibean only used the Beaver Cleaver / George Bailey scenario because that I find on the horizon are as qualified as these fictional characters. The fact of the matter is I may leave this ballot section blank as I do for all the Judgeship nominations that I can’t find info.

  • Ben Turnbill

    Humbly I susggest that the last thing thing I want to do is get ina defensive position in the ballot box. The Romantic in me wants to vote -for- someone. that said…

    I’m leary of Mormonism and the government. Permit me a generality: History repeats itself. I ‘m also leary of someone in office without the critical-thinking/intel.-integrity to deny the horrid false religion he is, one would think, very familiar with. Such sloppy thinking on matters most important is a bit disturbing considering bioethics and life is much more than complex than just saying no to abortion.

    I’m still shy from yesteryear’s liberalism ill-winda in the office and the courts to let either democrat have court justice influence.

    While Huck makes my growing libertarian fibers cringe, it’s relaxing to think of him in matters like marriage life. I have my priorities. I’m also open to Ron, but like much of America I don’t know him as well yet.

    And also, I think Havel would say living in truth means voting on principle over practicality.

  • Ben Turnbill

    Humbly I susggest that the last thing thing I want to do is get ina defensive position in the ballot box. The Romantic in me wants to vote -for- someone. that said…

    I’m leary of Mormonism and the government. Permit me a generality: History repeats itself. I ‘m also leary of someone in office without the critical-thinking/intel.-integrity to deny the horrid false religion he is, one would think, very familiar with. Such sloppy thinking on matters most important is a bit disturbing considering bioethics and life is much more than complex than just saying no to abortion.

    I’m still shy from yesteryear’s liberalism ill-winda in the office and the courts to let either democrat have court justice influence.

    While Huck makes my growing libertarian fibers cringe, it’s relaxing to think of him in matters like marriage life. I have my priorities. I’m also open to Ron, but like much of America I don’t know him as well yet.

    And also, I think Havel would say living in truth means voting on principle over practicality.

  • Ben Turnbill

    Another thing, am I the only one who realizes that change in and of itself isn’t necessarily good? Do campaigns drop that language and actually get people to assume the candidates are refering to their own pet reforms? Actually, I think that happens.

    If I were to speak one way or the other about change in and of itself, my Proverbs readings about those “given to change” would not incline to to make it my banner.

    I don’t understand this trumpet call.

  • Ben Turnbill

    Another thing, am I the only one who realizes that change in and of itself isn’t necessarily good? Do campaigns drop that language and actually get people to assume the candidates are refering to their own pet reforms? Actually, I think that happens.

    If I were to speak one way or the other about change in and of itself, my Proverbs readings about those “given to change” would not incline to to make it my banner.

    I don’t understand this trumpet call.

  • http://www.LutheranLucciola.blogspot.com Lutheran Lucciola

    I’m voting for Paul also. The “racist” attempt is a smear tactic.

  • http://www.LutheranLucciola.blogspot.com Lutheran Lucciola

    I’m voting for Paul also. The “racist” attempt is a smear tactic.

  • http://www.roundunvarnishedtale.blogspot.com Cheryl

    It has been a long primary season, and I have been struggling throughout to pick a candidate. I finally settled on Fred Thompson, but then he dropped out. Then I settled on Rudy, but of course now he has dropped out. For me, Huckabee and Paul were not options. That left Romney and McCain, and I decided last night that I will cast my vote for McCain. Rather than rehash my reasoning here, I will invite you and your readers to visit my blog: http://roundunvarnishedtale.blogspot.com/2008/02/four-days-and-counting.html
    I’m kind of proud of this post because my husband (who has a brilliant political mind and is much smarter than me on these issues) says I have convinced him to vote for McCain as well!

  • http://www.roundunvarnishedtale.blogspot.com Cheryl

    It has been a long primary season, and I have been struggling throughout to pick a candidate. I finally settled on Fred Thompson, but then he dropped out. Then I settled on Rudy, but of course now he has dropped out. For me, Huckabee and Paul were not options. That left Romney and McCain, and I decided last night that I will cast my vote for McCain. Rather than rehash my reasoning here, I will invite you and your readers to visit my blog: http://roundunvarnishedtale.blogspot.com/2008/02/four-days-and-counting.html
    I’m kind of proud of this post because my husband (who has a brilliant political mind and is much smarter than me on these issues) says I have convinced him to vote for McCain as well!

  • Kyralessa

    That fact that McCain gets low marks from the NRA makes me _more_ likely to vote for him, not less. I never have understood how people can call themselves pro-life while advocating that everyone be able to easily own a device designed *solely* to kill.

    (I emphasize *solely* because I don’t want to hear the stupid line about having knives in my home. Do you use a gun to slice meat and spread butter on your bread? Guns are only designed to do one thing.)

  • Kyralessa

    That fact that McCain gets low marks from the NRA makes me _more_ likely to vote for him, not less. I never have understood how people can call themselves pro-life while advocating that everyone be able to easily own a device designed *solely* to kill.

    (I emphasize *solely* because I don’t want to hear the stupid line about having knives in my home. Do you use a gun to slice meat and spread butter on your bread? Guns are only designed to do one thing.)

  • Carl Vehse

    Mitt Romney: “Frankly, I like Ted Kennedy.”

    From Part 2 of Leno’s interview with Romney at
    http://hotair.com/archives/2008/01/19/video-mitt-on-leno/

    As Michelle Malkin noted (http://michellemalkin.com/2008/01/19/five-words-a-gop-presidential-candidate-shouldnt-say/):

    “Mary Jo Kopechne was unavailable for comment.”

  • Carl Vehse

    Mitt Romney: “Frankly, I like Ted Kennedy.”

    From Part 2 of Leno’s interview with Romney at
    http://hotair.com/archives/2008/01/19/video-mitt-on-leno/

    As Michelle Malkin noted (http://michellemalkin.com/2008/01/19/five-words-a-gop-presidential-candidate-shouldnt-say/):

    “Mary Jo Kopechne was unavailable for comment.”

  • Pingback: Yaz birth control.

  • Pingback: Yaz birth control.


CLOSE | X

HIDE | X