The latest in under-aged drinking

That would be alcoholic energy drinks, such as Four Loco, Joose, Max, Liquid Charge, and lots of others.  They have that sickly-sweet taste that fits the kiddy palate.  And since they look like regular energy drinks, they are easy to pass by cashiers and parents.

But these are actually malt liquors that contain between 9% and 12% alcohol!  That’s way more alcohol than beer, which has 5%, or, in some states 3%.  (Maybe that’s why they call the one brand “Four.”  It has four times more alcohol than beer.  Drinking one can is like drinking four beers.  And caffeine–the equivalent of three or so cups of coffee in each can– adds to the intoxicating effect, even as the stimulant makes kids think they are not being affected.  (This is in addition to other dangers from the combination of depressants and stimulants.)

But these, rather than the more honest beer, are what children and adolescents are sneaking around drinking these days.

(Do all of you parents already know this?  Or am I the late-learner?)

See How are these different? Three have alcohol, one doesn’t | HamptonRoads.com | PilotOnline.com.

About Gene Veith

Professor of Literature at Patrick Henry College, the Director of the Cranach Institute at Concordia Theological Seminary, a columnist for World Magazine and TableTalk, and the author of 18 books on different facets of Christianity & Culture.

  • http://debsueknit.blogspot.com DebbieQ

    I am a parent of three (23,22,19) and I have never heard of these!

  • http://debsueknit.blogspot.com DebbieQ

    I am a parent of three (23,22,19) and I have never heard of these!

  • WebMonk

    Depends on who you compare yourself to as to whether you are a “late-learner” or not. Compared to anyone under 25 – definitely a late-learner. Compared to anyone over that – you can consider yourself one of the few, the proud, the aware.

    (and I think you meant “affected” rather than “effected”)

  • WebMonk

    Depends on who you compare yourself to as to whether you are a “late-learner” or not. Compared to anyone under 25 – definitely a late-learner. Compared to anyone over that – you can consider yourself one of the few, the proud, the aware.

    (and I think you meant “affected” rather than “effected”)

  • Winston Smith

    Kids will find a way to get their hands on these concoctions and do dumb things, and laugh about it later (if they survive). It was Bartles and Jaymes wine coolers when I was just shy of legal age. They tasted like spoiled fruit punch.

    It should be noted that in countries without the puritanical compulsion to strictly set drinking ages, there is less of the binge drinking that marks the rite of passage to adulthood. (Perhaps that thought relates to the above thread on religion and politics.)

  • Winston Smith

    Kids will find a way to get their hands on these concoctions and do dumb things, and laugh about it later (if they survive). It was Bartles and Jaymes wine coolers when I was just shy of legal age. They tasted like spoiled fruit punch.

    It should be noted that in countries without the puritanical compulsion to strictly set drinking ages, there is less of the binge drinking that marks the rite of passage to adulthood. (Perhaps that thought relates to the above thread on religion and politics.)

  • Caleb

    One: I’m a college student (22) and I have never heard of these.
    Two: The beers I drink have 9 – 12% ;-)

  • Caleb

    One: I’m a college student (22) and I have never heard of these.
    Two: The beers I drink have 9 – 12% ;-)

  • http://lutherama.blogspot.com Dr. Luther in the 21st Century

    I have heard of these because there was a fight over 7-eleven’s debate to stock them because they do look like the popular energy drinks. Alcoholic energy drinks have been a hit in the club seen for some time now. A popular one is vodka and red bull.

    I am all for dropping the ridiculous drinking age restrictions.

  • http://lutherama.blogspot.com Dr. Luther in the 21st Century

    I have heard of these because there was a fight over 7-eleven’s debate to stock them because they do look like the popular energy drinks. Alcoholic energy drinks have been a hit in the club seen for some time now. A popular one is vodka and red bull.

    I am all for dropping the ridiculous drinking age restrictions.

  • Kirk

    I’m a young un’ and I only heard about these drinks for the first time this past weekend. They sound (taste wise) like pretty much the worst thing in history.

  • Kirk

    I’m a young un’ and I only heard about these drinks for the first time this past weekend. They sound (taste wise) like pretty much the worst thing in history.

  • http://www.utah-lutheran.blogspot.com Bror Erickson

    I’m not sure that these are being intentionally marketed to teenagers. Precisely because, I often like to have a Vodka/Redbull myself on the few occasions that I am out at a club/bar or whatever with friends.
    But yes nothing contributes more to the delinquency of young adults than these stupid underage drinking laws.

  • http://www.utah-lutheran.blogspot.com Bror Erickson

    I’m not sure that these are being intentionally marketed to teenagers. Precisely because, I often like to have a Vodka/Redbull myself on the few occasions that I am out at a club/bar or whatever with friends.
    But yes nothing contributes more to the delinquency of young adults than these stupid underage drinking laws.

  • Joe

    I agree. Eliminate the drinking age and let parents be parents and young adults be young adults. At 18 I was in the Army, trained to kill other men and willing to die myself for my country, but I was not old enough to buy a beer. I have never been able to square that.

  • Joe

    I agree. Eliminate the drinking age and let parents be parents and young adults be young adults. At 18 I was in the Army, trained to kill other men and willing to die myself for my country, but I was not old enough to buy a beer. I have never been able to square that.

  • Louis

    Joe agreed-. For instance, Italy has no minimum drinking age, and there is no marked increase in alcoholism etc. But then, the cultural norms around drinking are very strong. One of the side-effects of prohibitionism was to destroy any such culture on this continent. So maybe it will be great, but maybe because of the loss of tradition and food culture, it will not happen (tying in with the previous food post).

  • Louis

    Joe agreed-. For instance, Italy has no minimum drinking age, and there is no marked increase in alcoholism etc. But then, the cultural norms around drinking are very strong. One of the side-effects of prohibitionism was to destroy any such culture on this continent. So maybe it will be great, but maybe because of the loss of tradition and food culture, it will not happen (tying in with the previous food post).

  • http://www.utah-lutheran.blogspot.com Bror Erickson

    Louis,
    “For instance, Italy has no minimum drinking age, and there is no marked increase in alcoholism etc.”
    Having spent a couple years in Italy, I would have to say you are correct, but emphasize that this does not mean there wasn’t any alcohol abuse, or alcoholism. On the whole the culture and people had a much healthier attitude towards alcohol. But I can’t say that I didn’t see it abused by Europeans, that I didn’t see kids binge drink, etc. I saw that. I also saw parents deal with their kids in parental ways, and kids wake up with hangovers, but not a criminal record.

  • http://www.utah-lutheran.blogspot.com Bror Erickson

    Louis,
    “For instance, Italy has no minimum drinking age, and there is no marked increase in alcoholism etc.”
    Having spent a couple years in Italy, I would have to say you are correct, but emphasize that this does not mean there wasn’t any alcohol abuse, or alcoholism. On the whole the culture and people had a much healthier attitude towards alcohol. But I can’t say that I didn’t see it abused by Europeans, that I didn’t see kids binge drink, etc. I saw that. I also saw parents deal with their kids in parental ways, and kids wake up with hangovers, but not a criminal record.

  • DonS

    Count me in as one of the late learners, as I never heard of these drinks either.

    As for the minimum drinking age, there should not be a federal one, at the least. Let the states decide, and be influenced by their own constituents. I do think it is odd that the drinking age should be higher than the voting age, or the age of many of our military personnel, as Joe points out.

  • DonS

    Count me in as one of the late learners, as I never heard of these drinks either.

    As for the minimum drinking age, there should not be a federal one, at the least. Let the states decide, and be influenced by their own constituents. I do think it is odd that the drinking age should be higher than the voting age, or the age of many of our military personnel, as Joe points out.

  • http://www.redeemedrambling.blogspot.com/ John

    Louis has a great, great point. Actually using dangerous things allows a culture to emerge that passes on wisdom and restraint in the use of those dangerous things. When there is no exposure to a risky practice, this kind of culture dies. I would like to see people post some other risky-business cultures that they have experienced.

  • http://www.redeemedrambling.blogspot.com/ John

    Louis has a great, great point. Actually using dangerous things allows a culture to emerge that passes on wisdom and restraint in the use of those dangerous things. When there is no exposure to a risky practice, this kind of culture dies. I would like to see people post some other risky-business cultures that they have experienced.

  • http://www.toddstadler.com/ tODD

    The only thing that’s new here is the energy-drink aspect of it, which is only so because energy drinks are (relatively) new. I see kids drinking them (energy drinks in general) all the time, thinking they’re tough, though it makes me laugh because it’s probably because they can’t handle coffee. Kids have a pretty simple palate and really go for the sugary stuff, whether it’s their coffee or their beer equivalents (or in this case, both!).

    As Winston notes (@3), this is no different than the “wine cooler” trend (which was also high-alcohol beer, not wine). Heck, the first illegal drink I ever had (albeit in college) was a horrible concoction that came in a 2-liter plastic bottle and tasted like alcoholic Welch’s Grape soda. That was back in the mid-90s. I’m sure they were marketing to kids well before that.

    And yeah, my palate has matured, and I now enjoy rather bitter and/or strong beers, which can not infrequently go well beyond 5% ABV.

    But Winston, really, “It should be noted that in countries without the puritanical compulsion to strictly set drinking ages, there is less of the binge drinking that marks the rite of passage to adulthood.” Have you ever been to Britain? Plenty of teenagers and young adults getting totally smashed there. Britain in many ways has the same binge problems we do here.

  • http://www.toddstadler.com/ tODD

    The only thing that’s new here is the energy-drink aspect of it, which is only so because energy drinks are (relatively) new. I see kids drinking them (energy drinks in general) all the time, thinking they’re tough, though it makes me laugh because it’s probably because they can’t handle coffee. Kids have a pretty simple palate and really go for the sugary stuff, whether it’s their coffee or their beer equivalents (or in this case, both!).

    As Winston notes (@3), this is no different than the “wine cooler” trend (which was also high-alcohol beer, not wine). Heck, the first illegal drink I ever had (albeit in college) was a horrible concoction that came in a 2-liter plastic bottle and tasted like alcoholic Welch’s Grape soda. That was back in the mid-90s. I’m sure they were marketing to kids well before that.

    And yeah, my palate has matured, and I now enjoy rather bitter and/or strong beers, which can not infrequently go well beyond 5% ABV.

    But Winston, really, “It should be noted that in countries without the puritanical compulsion to strictly set drinking ages, there is less of the binge drinking that marks the rite of passage to adulthood.” Have you ever been to Britain? Plenty of teenagers and young adults getting totally smashed there. Britain in many ways has the same binge problems we do here.

  • Larry Wright

    I have learned about these recently(children 21, 20, 17). Last year my son was an exchange student to Germany. The drinking age is 16, and these kinds of drinks are consumed without much thought at all. In fact, they were regularly offered to players at the half-time in soccer games. While there was abuse noted of the drinking privilege, most observed did not abuse what we would call underage drinking.

    An addition note, the German parental component is much different than that of America, meaning the children are given much more latitude to be anywhere and move about on there own at an early age than here in America. Of course it would be interesting to hear of other experiences in foreign countries.

    I do believe that indeed the sugar hyped drink would make a tasty choice for underage drinking abuse.

    And as to earlier comments…

    [But yes nothing contributes more to the delinquency of young adults than these stupid underage drinking laws.] Bror#7

    Bror, I believe you must be trying to convey a point that is absent from this statement and would like to hear a further expansion of your reasoning. Certainly you don’t believe the law is the cause of the delinquency, wouldn’t many other factors be more compelling, e.g., nature, nurture, etc.? If the law were 16, here in the US, as in Germany, would that compel less 16 year-olds to be delinquent and more 15 year-olds to become delinquent?

  • Larry Wright

    I have learned about these recently(children 21, 20, 17). Last year my son was an exchange student to Germany. The drinking age is 16, and these kinds of drinks are consumed without much thought at all. In fact, they were regularly offered to players at the half-time in soccer games. While there was abuse noted of the drinking privilege, most observed did not abuse what we would call underage drinking.

    An addition note, the German parental component is much different than that of America, meaning the children are given much more latitude to be anywhere and move about on there own at an early age than here in America. Of course it would be interesting to hear of other experiences in foreign countries.

    I do believe that indeed the sugar hyped drink would make a tasty choice for underage drinking abuse.

    And as to earlier comments…

    [But yes nothing contributes more to the delinquency of young adults than these stupid underage drinking laws.] Bror#7

    Bror, I believe you must be trying to convey a point that is absent from this statement and would like to hear a further expansion of your reasoning. Certainly you don’t believe the law is the cause of the delinquency, wouldn’t many other factors be more compelling, e.g., nature, nurture, etc.? If the law were 16, here in the US, as in Germany, would that compel less 16 year-olds to be delinquent and more 15 year-olds to become delinquent?

  • Joe

    tODD – the drinking age in Great Briton is 18, unless you order it with food and are with an adult.

    Wisconsin – just changed its law. Until earlier this year, you could drink with your parents or of age spouse in bars and restaurants. It was left up to the owner if he wanted to serve you. That was just changed – now you have to be 14 (or maybe 16 – can’t remember right now) to have a beer with your old man.

  • Joe

    tODD – the drinking age in Great Briton is 18, unless you order it with food and are with an adult.

    Wisconsin – just changed its law. Until earlier this year, you could drink with your parents or of age spouse in bars and restaurants. It was left up to the owner if he wanted to serve you. That was just changed – now you have to be 14 (or maybe 16 – can’t remember right now) to have a beer with your old man.

  • http://www.toddstadler.com/ tODD

    Joe (@15), the drinking age in the UK is 18 if you’re in a pub or in public. Children can drink alcohol legally in private as long as they’re older than 5.

  • http://www.toddstadler.com/ tODD

    Joe (@15), the drinking age in the UK is 18 if you’re in a pub or in public. Children can drink alcohol legally in private as long as they’re older than 5.

  • http://lutherama.blogspot.com Dr. Luther in 21st Century

    The biggest contributing factor to binge drinking is the lack of exposure to responsible drinking. I have been drinking for sometime and yet have never been drunk. I grew up in a family that drank responsibly, I knew what it looked like. I started having wine spritzers at home when I was about 10 with the amount of filler decreasing as I got older. I would have to say in the U.S. at least my experience is rare. Most people’s experience with drinking is from watching MTV and Animal House style movies that glorify binge drinking and the only reason it is hilarious consequences is because it is not us results. They become inundated by that and when coupled with people tend to live by what they are exposed to and you end up with binge drinking as a right of passage.

  • http://lutherama.blogspot.com Dr. Luther in 21st Century

    The biggest contributing factor to binge drinking is the lack of exposure to responsible drinking. I have been drinking for sometime and yet have never been drunk. I grew up in a family that drank responsibly, I knew what it looked like. I started having wine spritzers at home when I was about 10 with the amount of filler decreasing as I got older. I would have to say in the U.S. at least my experience is rare. Most people’s experience with drinking is from watching MTV and Animal House style movies that glorify binge drinking and the only reason it is hilarious consequences is because it is not us results. They become inundated by that and when coupled with people tend to live by what they are exposed to and you end up with binge drinking as a right of passage.

  • Winston Smith

    tODD, despite my Orwellian name, I have never visited that sceptred isle. I am, however, familiar (from reading the Sun and the Daily Mail online) with the yob and yobette culture of binge drinking in that country.

    I wonder to what extent the American Animal House culture has spread across the Atlantic through popular culture.

    I was thinking more of France and Italy.

  • Winston Smith

    tODD, despite my Orwellian name, I have never visited that sceptred isle. I am, however, familiar (from reading the Sun and the Daily Mail online) with the yob and yobette culture of binge drinking in that country.

    I wonder to what extent the American Animal House culture has spread across the Atlantic through popular culture.

    I was thinking more of France and Italy.

  • Dan Kempin

    tODD, #13

    “I see kids drinking them (energy drinks in general) all the time, thinking they’re tough, though it makes me laugh because it’s probably because they can’t handle coffee. ”

    . . . which is what WE drank to think we were tough back in the day. I wonder who was laughing at us? Probably the old timers who chewed “snus” and swallowed the “juice.”

    I haven’t even tried an energy drink, but I won’t judge since I drink my coffee with a “red eye” whenever possible.

  • Dan Kempin

    tODD, #13

    “I see kids drinking them (energy drinks in general) all the time, thinking they’re tough, though it makes me laugh because it’s probably because they can’t handle coffee. ”

    . . . which is what WE drank to think we were tough back in the day. I wonder who was laughing at us? Probably the old timers who chewed “snus” and swallowed the “juice.”

    I haven’t even tried an energy drink, but I won’t judge since I drink my coffee with a “red eye” whenever possible.

  • http://www.geneveith.com Gene Veith

    The view that Europe is so much more enlightened about alcohol than we are is sort of countered if you go over there. The mobs of drunk teenagers can be seen nearly every night, even in the smaller towns, and alcoholism among adolescents has become a big problem. And have you ever been to a soccer game in Germany, England, or Italy? There is often more action in the stands, between drunken fans, than on the field. Then after the game there are the rampages from the fans of both the winning and the losing teams. In Russia, if you go out to dinner in a nice restaurant, you will routinely see people literally fall out of their chairs onto the floor, drunk. I witnessed that myself.

  • http://www.geneveith.com Gene Veith

    The view that Europe is so much more enlightened about alcohol than we are is sort of countered if you go over there. The mobs of drunk teenagers can be seen nearly every night, even in the smaller towns, and alcoholism among adolescents has become a big problem. And have you ever been to a soccer game in Germany, England, or Italy? There is often more action in the stands, between drunken fans, than on the field. Then after the game there are the rampages from the fans of both the winning and the losing teams. In Russia, if you go out to dinner in a nice restaurant, you will routinely see people literally fall out of their chairs onto the floor, drunk. I witnessed that myself.

  • http://www.geneveith.com Gene Veith

    As for the argument that, well, we did basically the same thing when we were young, we need to also factor in the orders of magnitude. Yes, parents hated our music too, but ours contained mild innuendos, whereas today’s often contains explicit imagery of sex, rape, murder, and necrophilia. Yes, we had our sugary wine coolers, but today’s equivalent has the chemistry of four beers and three cups of coffee. These are not the same.

  • http://www.geneveith.com Gene Veith

    As for the argument that, well, we did basically the same thing when we were young, we need to also factor in the orders of magnitude. Yes, parents hated our music too, but ours contained mild innuendos, whereas today’s often contains explicit imagery of sex, rape, murder, and necrophilia. Yes, we had our sugary wine coolers, but today’s equivalent has the chemistry of four beers and three cups of coffee. These are not the same.

  • http://www.toddstadler.com/ tODD

    Dan (@19), I’m sorry, but we appear to be a generation apart — the old timers I knew drank coffee while I drank soda, which I did until I was out of college (though it was the more caffeinated Mountain Dew that got me through those latter years). When I laugh today at the kids having an energy drink on the bus into school, it is because I know where they’re coming from.

    As for drinking your coffee with a “red eye”, I’m afraid you’ll have to clarify. “Red eye” as in an extra shot of espresso? Or “red eye” as in tomato juice and beer? If the latter, I can’t help you. If the former, you’re probably making your coffee too weak. Have you tried a French press? (Look who thinks he’s the tough coffee guy now, eh?)

    I’ve tried several brands of energy drinks, and they all taste like (what I imagine) horse urine (might taste like). Which is what I once thought beer tasted like, but I was wrong then. But I’m sure I’m right about energy drinks.

  • http://www.toddstadler.com/ tODD

    Dan (@19), I’m sorry, but we appear to be a generation apart — the old timers I knew drank coffee while I drank soda, which I did until I was out of college (though it was the more caffeinated Mountain Dew that got me through those latter years). When I laugh today at the kids having an energy drink on the bus into school, it is because I know where they’re coming from.

    As for drinking your coffee with a “red eye”, I’m afraid you’ll have to clarify. “Red eye” as in an extra shot of espresso? Or “red eye” as in tomato juice and beer? If the latter, I can’t help you. If the former, you’re probably making your coffee too weak. Have you tried a French press? (Look who thinks he’s the tough coffee guy now, eh?)

    I’ve tried several brands of energy drinks, and they all taste like (what I imagine) horse urine (might taste like). Which is what I once thought beer tasted like, but I was wrong then. But I’m sure I’m right about energy drinks.

  • Dan Kempin

    tODD #22,

    Mountain Dew, eh? I could always sense something of the rebel about you.

    I learned to drink coffee in the church fellowship hall–literally. (That was the era before offering “something else” was off anyone’s radar and we daring youths would sneak some to drink down in the youth room. I learned there to ward off any reference to decaf with the sign of the evil eye.)

    And . . . tomato juice and . . . [involuntary shudder] . . . BEER? That’s an innocence I can never get back, tODD. I think you’d get a day in the stocks for even mentioning it in Sturbridge.

  • Dan Kempin

    tODD #22,

    Mountain Dew, eh? I could always sense something of the rebel about you.

    I learned to drink coffee in the church fellowship hall–literally. (That was the era before offering “something else” was off anyone’s radar and we daring youths would sneak some to drink down in the youth room. I learned there to ward off any reference to decaf with the sign of the evil eye.)

    And . . . tomato juice and . . . [involuntary shudder] . . . BEER? That’s an innocence I can never get back, tODD. I think you’d get a day in the stocks for even mentioning it in Sturbridge.

  • http://www.toddstadler.com/ tODD

    Dr. Veith (@21), it’s your right to believe such things, but anyone who tells me that it’s kids today that are vastly different from when they were kids … well, it typically says more about that person than it does about the kids.

    Your comparison of the wine coolers of yore to these high-alcohol energy drinks strikes me as a bit unfair. In my memory, wine coolers were popular with the “we’re drinking illegally, but not binge drinking” set. These energy drinks seem a bit more designed for the “we just want to get drunk quick” set. If so, then a more apt comparison from the past might be to low-end fortified wines such as MD 20/20 (13-18% ABV), Night Train, or Thunderbird. All of those have been around since the 1950s.

    Heck, Buckfast Tonic Wine (15% ABV, plus up to 55mg of caffeine) has been made since the 1890s — by Benedictine monks, no less — and at some point (couldn’t tell you when) became popular with the anti-social behavior set in Scotland. Can’t tell me that’s a new drink!

    As for music lyrics today, in one sense, I think things should be viewed relatively. Young Generation B may shock old Generation A with lyrics that even hint at sex outside of marriage. But such songs won’t shock Generation B when they’re older — no, they’ll look back on such songs fondly, not as shocking. When Gen. B is older, they’ll, in turn, be shocked by Generation C’s songs that more overtly condone extramarital sex. And so on.

    But more importantly, necrophilia? Really? Until I did research on it, I couldn’t name a single song that mentioned necrophilia, much less a popular one. I mean, sure, I expected some Swedish black metal band to have several songs on the topic, but still.

    Then I started researching. Both GG Allin and Slayer wrote songs on the topic in the mid-80s, now a generation ago. But then Comus (whom I’d not heard of) wrote such a tune in 1971. Shortly after, Alice Cooper recorded a few songs on the topic, I believe. Before I was born! So blaming “today’s” music seems a generation late. To say nothing of William Faulkner’s “A Rose for Emily” or Algernon Swinburne’s “The Leper”. Oof! Both several generations ago.

  • http://www.toddstadler.com/ tODD

    Dr. Veith (@21), it’s your right to believe such things, but anyone who tells me that it’s kids today that are vastly different from when they were kids … well, it typically says more about that person than it does about the kids.

    Your comparison of the wine coolers of yore to these high-alcohol energy drinks strikes me as a bit unfair. In my memory, wine coolers were popular with the “we’re drinking illegally, but not binge drinking” set. These energy drinks seem a bit more designed for the “we just want to get drunk quick” set. If so, then a more apt comparison from the past might be to low-end fortified wines such as MD 20/20 (13-18% ABV), Night Train, or Thunderbird. All of those have been around since the 1950s.

    Heck, Buckfast Tonic Wine (15% ABV, plus up to 55mg of caffeine) has been made since the 1890s — by Benedictine monks, no less — and at some point (couldn’t tell you when) became popular with the anti-social behavior set in Scotland. Can’t tell me that’s a new drink!

    As for music lyrics today, in one sense, I think things should be viewed relatively. Young Generation B may shock old Generation A with lyrics that even hint at sex outside of marriage. But such songs won’t shock Generation B when they’re older — no, they’ll look back on such songs fondly, not as shocking. When Gen. B is older, they’ll, in turn, be shocked by Generation C’s songs that more overtly condone extramarital sex. And so on.

    But more importantly, necrophilia? Really? Until I did research on it, I couldn’t name a single song that mentioned necrophilia, much less a popular one. I mean, sure, I expected some Swedish black metal band to have several songs on the topic, but still.

    Then I started researching. Both GG Allin and Slayer wrote songs on the topic in the mid-80s, now a generation ago. But then Comus (whom I’d not heard of) wrote such a tune in 1971. Shortly after, Alice Cooper recorded a few songs on the topic, I believe. Before I was born! So blaming “today’s” music seems a generation late. To say nothing of William Faulkner’s “A Rose for Emily” or Algernon Swinburne’s “The Leper”. Oof! Both several generations ago.

  • http://www.toddstadler.com/ tODD

    Dan (@23), oh come, now. Is tomato juice and beer really any more disgusting than, say, tomato juice and vodka (aka a Bloody Mary, aka the alcoholic beverage that drinks like a salad)?

    Of course, I’m told that “red eyes” of the beer variety are more typical of Canada. Where I’m from (Texas), they make micheladas, which typically involve beer, lime, Tabasco, and, not infrequently, Worcestershire sauce (or Maggi) and, yes, tomato juice (or, dare I even mention it, Clamato).
    In summary, there’s a veritable United Nations of beer-tomato drinks out there for you to explore, Dan.

  • http://www.toddstadler.com/ tODD

    Dan (@23), oh come, now. Is tomato juice and beer really any more disgusting than, say, tomato juice and vodka (aka a Bloody Mary, aka the alcoholic beverage that drinks like a salad)?

    Of course, I’m told that “red eyes” of the beer variety are more typical of Canada. Where I’m from (Texas), they make micheladas, which typically involve beer, lime, Tabasco, and, not infrequently, Worcestershire sauce (or Maggi) and, yes, tomato juice (or, dare I even mention it, Clamato).
    In summary, there’s a veritable United Nations of beer-tomato drinks out there for you to explore, Dan.


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