Why Ann Coulter supports Romney

There are all kinds of questions about whether Romney, or Gingrich, or Perry, or whoever, is a true conservative.  Surely Ann Coulter is a true conservative, yea, a bona fide right winger to a fault.  She is supporting Romney.  She says, “of the available candidates, Romney is by far the most conservative, tied with Michele Bachmann.”   Most importantly, she says, he is the only one who can beat Barack Obama.   Here is her case for Romney:

There may be better ways to stop Obamacare than Romney, but, unfortunately, they’re not available right now. (And, by the way, where were you conservative purists when Republicans were nominating Waterboarding-Is-Torture-Jerry-Falwell-Is-an-Agent-of-Intolerance-My-Good-Friend-Teddy-Kennedy-Amnesty-for-Illegals John McCain-Feingold for president?)

Among Romney’s positives is the fact that he has a demonstrated ability to trick liberals into voting for him. He was elected governor of Massachusetts — one of the most liberal states in the union — by appealing to Democrats, independents and suburban women.

He came close to stopping the greatest calamity to befall this nation since Pearl Harbor by nearly beating Teddy Kennedy in a Senate race. (That is when he said a lot of the things about which he’s since “changed his mind.”) If he had won, we’d be carving his image on Mount Rushmore.

He is not part of the Washington establishment, so he won’t be caught taking money from Freddie Mac or cutting commercials with Nancy Pelosi.

Also, Romney will be the first Republican presidential nominee since Ronald Reagan who can talk. Liberals are going to have to dust off their playbook from 30 years ago to figure out how to run against a Republican who isn’t a tongue-tied marble-mouth.

As we’ve known for years, his negatives are: Romneycare and Mormonism.

We look forward with cheery anticipation to an explosion of news stories on some of the stranger aspects of Mormonism. The articles have already been written, but they’re not scheduled for release until the day Romney wraps up the nomination. . . .

No one is worried Romney will double-cross us on repealing Obamacare. We worry that Romneycare will make it harder for him to get elected.

But, again, Romney is the articulate Republican. He’s already explained how mandating health insurance in one particular wealthy, liberal Northeastern state is different from inflicting it on the entire country. Our Constitution establishes a federalist system that allows experimentation with different ideas in the individual states. . . .

The Heritage Foundation, a leading conservative think tank, supported Romneycare at the time. The biggest warning sign should have been that Gingrich supported it, too.

Most important, Romney has said — forcefully and repeatedly — that his first day in office he will issue a 50-state waiver from Obamacare and will then seek a formal repeal.

Romney is not going to get to the White House and announce, “The first thing I’m going to do is implement that fantastic national health care plan signed by my pal, Barack!”. . . .

Obamacare is going to be repealed — provided only that a Republican wins the next presidential election.

If a Republican does not win, however, it will never be repealed. . . .

Instead of sitting on our thumbs, wishing Ronald Reagan were around, or chasing the latest mechanical rabbit flashed by the media, conservatives ought to start rallying around Romney as the only Republican who has a shot at beating Obama. We’ll attack him when he’s president.

via Ann Coulter – November 16, 2011 – IF NOT ROMNEY, WHO? IF NOT NOW, WHEN?.

What do you think of her analysis?

About Gene Veith

Professor of Literature at Patrick Henry College, the Director of the Cranach Institute at Concordia Theological Seminary, a columnist for World Magazine and TableTalk, and the author of 18 books on different facets of Christianity & Culture.

  • http://www.matthewcochran.net/blog Matt Cochran

    Well… to answer her first question, the purists were voting for Ron Paul when the establishment was nominating McCain–same as we are now.

    And then his first important skill? An ability to trick liberals into voting for him. Surely he would never turn that ability on conservatives!

    Other than that… he almost beat Ted Kennedy once, he’s (snicker) not a Washington insider, and he speaks well. Be still my beating heart.

    What can I say? The interests of the nation go deeper than simply beating liberals, so I need a candidate who can do more than that. Maybe someday Republicans will actually support such a person.

  • http://www.matthewcochran.net/blog Matt Cochran

    Well… to answer her first question, the purists were voting for Ron Paul when the establishment was nominating McCain–same as we are now.

    And then his first important skill? An ability to trick liberals into voting for him. Surely he would never turn that ability on conservatives!

    Other than that… he almost beat Ted Kennedy once, he’s (snicker) not a Washington insider, and he speaks well. Be still my beating heart.

    What can I say? The interests of the nation go deeper than simply beating liberals, so I need a candidate who can do more than that. Maybe someday Republicans will actually support such a person.

  • SKPeterson

    Methinks the lady doth protest too much.

  • SKPeterson

    Methinks the lady doth protest too much.

  • Rose

    Romney brings an admirable integrity and humility to his campaign. Despite their disagreeable theology, Mormons produce exemplary families and citizens.

  • Rose

    Romney brings an admirable integrity and humility to his campaign. Despite their disagreeable theology, Mormons produce exemplary families and citizens.

  • Tom Hering

    Romney’s answer (on Charlie Rose last night) to America’s multiple military adventures isn’t to reduce their number, or to stop getting into them altogether, but to increase active duty personnel by 100,000. Yeah, that should get the country on the right track, morally and financially.

  • Tom Hering

    Romney’s answer (on Charlie Rose last night) to America’s multiple military adventures isn’t to reduce their number, or to stop getting into them altogether, but to increase active duty personnel by 100,000. Yeah, that should get the country on the right track, morally and financially.

  • Cincinnatus

    Words cannot describe how little I care about the opinions of Ann Coulter.

    But “methinks” the “winnability” of Romney has been vastly exaggerated by his supporters, whether they be begrudging settlers or dogmatic pragmatists. Certainly he assumes the most presidential demeanor of the Republican candidates, but this in itself isn’t enough to unseat an incumbent, nor is the fact that he’s a waffler–pardon me, “willing to compromise.” The Republican field is piss-poor, Romney included. How long is the G.O.P. going to persist in providing its members with embarrassing options?

  • Cincinnatus

    Words cannot describe how little I care about the opinions of Ann Coulter.

    But “methinks” the “winnability” of Romney has been vastly exaggerated by his supporters, whether they be begrudging settlers or dogmatic pragmatists. Certainly he assumes the most presidential demeanor of the Republican candidates, but this in itself isn’t enough to unseat an incumbent, nor is the fact that he’s a waffler–pardon me, “willing to compromise.” The Republican field is piss-poor, Romney included. How long is the G.O.P. going to persist in providing its members with embarrassing options?

  • Tom Hering

    Romney also asserted his belief, last night, that America is a shining city on a hill, i.e., that the American way of life is not only the right way for Americans, but the right way for everyone else in the world (his words). This is the very attitude of exceptionalism that repeatedly gets us into trouble in the world (an attitude shared by Obama).

  • Tom Hering

    Romney also asserted his belief, last night, that America is a shining city on a hill, i.e., that the American way of life is not only the right way for Americans, but the right way for everyone else in the world (his words). This is the very attitude of exceptionalism that repeatedly gets us into trouble in the world (an attitude shared by Obama).

  • Dennis Peskey

    I have a difficult time supporting a candidate who Coulter touts as having the “demonstrated ability to trick liberals into voting for him”. How this can be construed as a virtue escapes my comprehension. For my part, I would rather vote for a candidate who expresses views which I oppose, so long as they embraced the same views once elected. Bait and switch has not now nor ever will be a good policy, either in theology or politics. The truth will come out eventually and have consequences. I will not vote for a chameleon.
    Pax,
    Dennis

  • Dennis Peskey

    I have a difficult time supporting a candidate who Coulter touts as having the “demonstrated ability to trick liberals into voting for him”. How this can be construed as a virtue escapes my comprehension. For my part, I would rather vote for a candidate who expresses views which I oppose, so long as they embraced the same views once elected. Bait and switch has not now nor ever will be a good policy, either in theology or politics. The truth will come out eventually and have consequences. I will not vote for a chameleon.
    Pax,
    Dennis

  • The Jones

    The thing that makes me the angriest about the argument in this piece is that I think I agree with it.

  • The Jones

    The thing that makes me the angriest about the argument in this piece is that I think I agree with it.

  • larry

    Whomever one supports: I would echoe many here about Coulter’s ‘blast of wind’. Secondly its her’s and many like her whose “do what mommy says nannism” that drives and continues to drive many away. Keep wagging your finger, this is a sure fire way to garner less for your cause.

    Again, regardless of who one personally supports, I do find it odd that the electorate has more or less been coaxed into Romney. Every high marking candidate to date without exception has “had something wrong with them”, except Romney. Take your pick, first Perry, then Cain, then Gingrich, always Paul. If Bachmann or Sanotorum were to miraculously break into the lead one can be assured they will join this infamous club, but oddly never Romney.

    And futhermore one cannot be “of the available candidates, Romney is by FAR the most conservative,” and “TIED with Michele Bachmann.” Which is a summary of her inane argument.

  • larry

    Whomever one supports: I would echoe many here about Coulter’s ‘blast of wind’. Secondly its her’s and many like her whose “do what mommy says nannism” that drives and continues to drive many away. Keep wagging your finger, this is a sure fire way to garner less for your cause.

    Again, regardless of who one personally supports, I do find it odd that the electorate has more or less been coaxed into Romney. Every high marking candidate to date without exception has “had something wrong with them”, except Romney. Take your pick, first Perry, then Cain, then Gingrich, always Paul. If Bachmann or Sanotorum were to miraculously break into the lead one can be assured they will join this infamous club, but oddly never Romney.

    And futhermore one cannot be “of the available candidates, Romney is by FAR the most conservative,” and “TIED with Michele Bachmann.” Which is a summary of her inane argument.

  • trotk

    The neo-con dismissal of, ignorance of, and fear of Ron Paul reveals the deficiency of their thought. I heard a radio host yesterday (I didn’t catch his name) repeatedly calling Ron Paul a nut, yet never even mentioning anything Paul believes. Neo-cons seem oblivious to the fact that Paul is closer to our founding fathers than any other candidate we have seen in ages. But he is dismissed by people who claim to honor the constitution.
    It simply highlights that Coulter is either dumb, deceived, or deceitful.

  • trotk

    The neo-con dismissal of, ignorance of, and fear of Ron Paul reveals the deficiency of their thought. I heard a radio host yesterday (I didn’t catch his name) repeatedly calling Ron Paul a nut, yet never even mentioning anything Paul believes. Neo-cons seem oblivious to the fact that Paul is closer to our founding fathers than any other candidate we have seen in ages. But he is dismissed by people who claim to honor the constitution.
    It simply highlights that Coulter is either dumb, deceived, or deceitful.

  • trotk

    I also love (sarcastically) the idea that Romney is not part of the Washington establishment. If a politician who is the son of a politician is not part of the Washington establishment, what does it take to get in?

  • trotk

    I also love (sarcastically) the idea that Romney is not part of the Washington establishment. If a politician who is the son of a politician is not part of the Washington establishment, what does it take to get in?

  • Jerry

    Ann Coulter has always been a one-sided monologue; entertaining, but without any innate substance. I can see why she likes Gov. Romney. If the Republicans would only stop the circular firing squad then we might get the Bachmann or Sanotorum we need.

  • Jerry

    Ann Coulter has always been a one-sided monologue; entertaining, but without any innate substance. I can see why she likes Gov. Romney. If the Republicans would only stop the circular firing squad then we might get the Bachmann or Sanotorum we need.

  • Steven

    What a tragic misery this woman is who derides Sen. John McCain for telling the truth about waterboarding being torture, which, I firmly believe, no clearly thinking human being will deny. That is the America she wants. That tells me all I need to know about Ms. Coulter.

  • Steven

    What a tragic misery this woman is who derides Sen. John McCain for telling the truth about waterboarding being torture, which, I firmly believe, no clearly thinking human being will deny. That is the America she wants. That tells me all I need to know about Ms. Coulter.

  • norman teigen

    After reading Ann Coulter I have resolved to send money to the Committee to Re-elect President Obama.

  • norman teigen

    After reading Ann Coulter I have resolved to send money to the Committee to Re-elect President Obama.

  • Lutheran

    Ann Coulter…yecch.

  • Lutheran

    Ann Coulter…yecch.

  • http://www.toddstadler.com/ tODD

    Rose said (@3):

    Mormons produce exemplary families and citizens.

    This will be useful information, should Romney someday be in the running for Father of the Year or 2012′s Exemplary Citizen.

    For the time being, however, he’s running for President. Against a man who is also part of an exemplary family, among other things.

  • http://www.toddstadler.com/ tODD

    Rose said (@3):

    Mormons produce exemplary families and citizens.

    This will be useful information, should Romney someday be in the running for Father of the Year or 2012′s Exemplary Citizen.

    For the time being, however, he’s running for President. Against a man who is also part of an exemplary family, among other things.

  • trotk

    But tODD, you know it is only a matter of time before a liberal, godless, demon-crat has multiple affairs while in office.

  • trotk

    But tODD, you know it is only a matter of time before a liberal, godless, demon-crat has multiple affairs while in office.

  • Craig

    So much for the candidate with the Lutheran background. I have a hunch that Mitt did not spend much time in the Shorter Catechism.

  • Craig

    So much for the candidate with the Lutheran background. I have a hunch that Mitt did not spend much time in the Shorter Catechism.

  • JunkerGeorg

    The novelty of Skeletor (Coulter) was entertaining at first…kind of like Bill O’Reilly. But as she blasts not only liberals, but anyone else who does not completely agree with her, then the luster wears off pretty quickly. But then again, “People who think they know everything are really annoying to those of us who do.”

  • JunkerGeorg

    The novelty of Skeletor (Coulter) was entertaining at first…kind of like Bill O’Reilly. But as she blasts not only liberals, but anyone else who does not completely agree with her, then the luster wears off pretty quickly. But then again, “People who think they know everything are really annoying to those of us who do.”

  • http://gslcnm.com Pastor Spomer

    “Ann Coulter…yecch.”

    You guys just don’t like the way she speaks truth to power. ;)

  • http://gslcnm.com Pastor Spomer

    “Ann Coulter…yecch.”

    You guys just don’t like the way she speaks truth to power. ;)

  • Jon

    @20…”truth to power.”

    “There is a growing body of evidence that radiation in excess of what the government says are the minimum amounts we should be exposed to are actually good for you and reduce cases of cancer.” -Ann Coulter, on fears over the fallout from Japan’s nuclear crisis, Bill O’Reilly interview, March 18, 2011.

  • Jon

    @20…”truth to power.”

    “There is a growing body of evidence that radiation in excess of what the government says are the minimum amounts we should be exposed to are actually good for you and reduce cases of cancer.” -Ann Coulter, on fears over the fallout from Japan’s nuclear crisis, Bill O’Reilly interview, March 18, 2011.

  • http://www.toddstadler.com/ tODD

    Ann Coulter is hilarious.

  • http://www.toddstadler.com/ tODD

    Ann Coulter is hilarious.

  • Dust

    whatever your feelings on her…she knows how to work it! several best sellers, a successful website and over 18,000 followers on her facebook page….can anybody here match her numbers :)

    cheers!

  • Dust

    whatever your feelings on her…she knows how to work it! several best sellers, a successful website and over 18,000 followers on her facebook page….can anybody here match her numbers :)

    cheers!

  • Grace

    Coulter? :lol: it’s difficult to listen to her screech! The fact she supports Romney, is no surprise.

  • Grace

    Coulter? :lol: it’s difficult to listen to her screech! The fact she supports Romney, is no surprise.

  • Rich Shipe

    @ Pastor Spomer, or how she speaks power to truth! :)

    If he were the eventual nominee I’ll hold my nose and vote for Romney. And she’s right that we don’t have a lot of choices here. I would assume that she’s doing this because she fears Gingrich more than she doesn’t trust Romney. Also, she’s said frequently in the past that Romney will be the nominee and that he is going to lose. Then in 2016 we’ll get Rubio/Ryan.

  • Rich Shipe

    @ Pastor Spomer, or how she speaks power to truth! :)

    If he were the eventual nominee I’ll hold my nose and vote for Romney. And she’s right that we don’t have a lot of choices here. I would assume that she’s doing this because she fears Gingrich more than she doesn’t trust Romney. Also, she’s said frequently in the past that Romney will be the nominee and that he is going to lose. Then in 2016 we’ll get Rubio/Ryan.

  • Grace

    Romney believes the Mormon doctrine, if he didn’t he wouldn’t stay within LDS. Doesn’t this make some of you wonder what else he might believe.

    “My Father worked out his kingdom with fear and trembling, and I must do the same; and when I get my kingdom, I shall present it to my Father, so that he may obtain kingdom upon kingdom, and it will exalt him in glory. He will then take a higher exaltation, and I will take his place, and thereby become exalted myself.”
    Founder Mormon Church, Joseph Smith Journal of Discourses, Vol. 6, p. 4, 1844,

    Joseph Smith takes the place of God? – the Mormons follow the teachings of the leader/founder.

    “God is in the still small voice. In all these affidavits, indictments, it is all of the devil–all corruption. Come on! ye prosecutors! ye false swearers! All hell, boil over! Ye burning mountains, roll down your lava! for I will come out on the top at last. I have more to boast of than ever any man had. I am the only man that has ever been able to keep a whole church together since the days of Adam. A large majority of the whole have stood by me. Neither Paul, John, Peter, nor Jesus ever did it. I boast that no man ever did such a work as I. The followers of Jesus ran away from Him; but the Latter-day Saints never ran away from me yet . . .
    Joseph Smith History of the Church, Vol. 6, p. 408-409

    Joseph Smith did a better work than Jesus.

    The followers of Jesus ran away from Him; but the Latter-day Saints never ran away from me yet . . .

    It appears many of the Mormons haven’t “ran away” yet, that includes Romney.

    Perhaps Coulter doesn’t have a single clue as to Romney’s core beliefs. Do they matter? You bet, .. what else does he believe?

  • Grace

    Romney believes the Mormon doctrine, if he didn’t he wouldn’t stay within LDS. Doesn’t this make some of you wonder what else he might believe.

    “My Father worked out his kingdom with fear and trembling, and I must do the same; and when I get my kingdom, I shall present it to my Father, so that he may obtain kingdom upon kingdom, and it will exalt him in glory. He will then take a higher exaltation, and I will take his place, and thereby become exalted myself.”
    Founder Mormon Church, Joseph Smith Journal of Discourses, Vol. 6, p. 4, 1844,

    Joseph Smith takes the place of God? – the Mormons follow the teachings of the leader/founder.

    “God is in the still small voice. In all these affidavits, indictments, it is all of the devil–all corruption. Come on! ye prosecutors! ye false swearers! All hell, boil over! Ye burning mountains, roll down your lava! for I will come out on the top at last. I have more to boast of than ever any man had. I am the only man that has ever been able to keep a whole church together since the days of Adam. A large majority of the whole have stood by me. Neither Paul, John, Peter, nor Jesus ever did it. I boast that no man ever did such a work as I. The followers of Jesus ran away from Him; but the Latter-day Saints never ran away from me yet . . .
    Joseph Smith History of the Church, Vol. 6, p. 408-409

    Joseph Smith did a better work than Jesus.

    The followers of Jesus ran away from Him; but the Latter-day Saints never ran away from me yet . . .

    It appears many of the Mormons haven’t “ran away” yet, that includes Romney.

    Perhaps Coulter doesn’t have a single clue as to Romney’s core beliefs. Do they matter? You bet, .. what else does he believe?

  • http://www.toddstadler.com/ tODD

    Grace asked (@26),

    Doesn’t this make some of you wonder what else he might believe.

    Well, no. Because you’ve posted those quotes on this blog repeatedly. [1][2][3][4][5][6][7][8]

    Even if you had anything insightful to say about Romney or Mormonism, surely your repetition demonstrates that you long ago said it already. You have imparted your knowledge.

    Do you have anything else to say at this point, or can we reasonably assume that this is the sum total of your contribution to this topic?

    [1]geneveith.com/2011/08/22/mormons-rule-on-the-web/#comment-125026
    [2]geneveith.com/2011/10/13/its-going-to-be-romney/#comment-129946
    [3]geneveith.com/2011/10/13/its-going-to-be-romney/#comment-129649
    [4]geneveith.com/2011/10/28/believing-that-mormons-are-christians/#comment-130977
    [5]geneveith.com/2011/10/28/believing-that-mormons-are-christians/#comment-130983
    [6]geneveith.com/2011/12/01/an-alternative-presidential-option/#comment-133463
    [7]geneveith.com/2011/09/14/perrys-vaccination-problem/#comment-127069
    [8]geneveith.com/2010/09/02/a-mormon-on-the-glenn-beck-rally/#comment-90160

  • http://www.toddstadler.com/ tODD

    Grace asked (@26),

    Doesn’t this make some of you wonder what else he might believe.

    Well, no. Because you’ve posted those quotes on this blog repeatedly. [1][2][3][4][5][6][7][8]

    Even if you had anything insightful to say about Romney or Mormonism, surely your repetition demonstrates that you long ago said it already. You have imparted your knowledge.

    Do you have anything else to say at this point, or can we reasonably assume that this is the sum total of your contribution to this topic?

    [1]geneveith.com/2011/08/22/mormons-rule-on-the-web/#comment-125026
    [2]geneveith.com/2011/10/13/its-going-to-be-romney/#comment-129946
    [3]geneveith.com/2011/10/13/its-going-to-be-romney/#comment-129649
    [4]geneveith.com/2011/10/28/believing-that-mormons-are-christians/#comment-130977
    [5]geneveith.com/2011/10/28/believing-that-mormons-are-christians/#comment-130983
    [6]geneveith.com/2011/12/01/an-alternative-presidential-option/#comment-133463
    [7]geneveith.com/2011/09/14/perrys-vaccination-problem/#comment-127069
    [8]geneveith.com/2010/09/02/a-mormon-on-the-glenn-beck-rally/#comment-90160

  • Dust

    Grace….with all due respect, similarly things were said about RCC candidates in this country, going at least as far back as the Civil War, and it didn’t turn out so bad did it?

    cheers!

  • Dust

    Grace….with all due respect, similarly things were said about RCC candidates in this country, going at least as far back as the Civil War, and it didn’t turn out so bad did it?

    cheers!

  • Grace

    There are dozens of quotes regarding Joseph Smith, Founder of the Mormon church – I prefer to use the ones which illustrate the most outrageous beliefs.

    Jospeh Smith stated:

    The greatest responsibility in this world that God has laid upon us is to seek after our dead
    Jospeh Smith Journal of Discourses, Vol. 6, page 7

  • Grace

    There are dozens of quotes regarding Joseph Smith, Founder of the Mormon church – I prefer to use the ones which illustrate the most outrageous beliefs.

    Jospeh Smith stated:

    The greatest responsibility in this world that God has laid upon us is to seek after our dead
    Jospeh Smith Journal of Discourses, Vol. 6, page 7

  • Grace

    Why do you think Mormons Baptize, for their dead relatives?

  • Grace

    Why do you think Mormons Baptize, for their dead relatives?

  • http://gslcnm.com Pastor Spomer

    If Romney were to affirm frankly that, as a Mormon, he is not a Christian I would be sanguine about his candidacy. I would easily consider voting for say a Jewish person or an atheist. But having a public figure portray an alien theology as the true Christian one, and to do this to a populous that is theological illiterate, that I find regrettable.

  • http://gslcnm.com Pastor Spomer

    If Romney were to affirm frankly that, as a Mormon, he is not a Christian I would be sanguine about his candidacy. I would easily consider voting for say a Jewish person or an atheist. But having a public figure portray an alien theology as the true Christian one, and to do this to a populous that is theological illiterate, that I find regrettable.

  • Cincinnatus

    Pastor Spomer: Correct me if I’m wrong, but don’t most Mormons actually believe that their theology is the correct, revised version of Christian revelation? Why, then, would you demand that Romney renounce his beliefs, such as they are? He’s not being duplicitous in this case.

    (This is like demanding that Rick Perry apologize for labeling Mormonism a cult, which, to himself, myself, and many other Christians, is an actual belief.)

  • Cincinnatus

    Pastor Spomer: Correct me if I’m wrong, but don’t most Mormons actually believe that their theology is the correct, revised version of Christian revelation? Why, then, would you demand that Romney renounce his beliefs, such as they are? He’s not being duplicitous in this case.

    (This is like demanding that Rick Perry apologize for labeling Mormonism a cult, which, to himself, myself, and many other Christians, is an actual belief.)

  • Grace

    Do some research on the LDS/Mormon church – take the time to KNOW what these people believe.

  • Grace

    Do some research on the LDS/Mormon church – take the time to KNOW what these people believe.

  • Cincinnatus

    Welp, I reckon we better consider this thread closed. Grace has arrived.

  • Cincinnatus

    Welp, I reckon we better consider this thread closed. Grace has arrived.

  • Grace

    No Cincinnatus, lets just stick our fingers in our ears, wear blinders, and consider putting our brains on vacation. Ignoring what the LDS church believes is just that!

  • Grace

    No Cincinnatus, lets just stick our fingers in our ears, wear blinders, and consider putting our brains on vacation. Ignoring what the LDS church believes is just that!

  • http://www.toddstadler.com/ tODD

    Grace (@29), the problem isn’t, as you appear to imagine, that you’re somehow the only person who knows anything about what Mormons believe. No, I’m quite certain you’re nowhere close to the most knowledgeable person among commenters here when it comes to that topic.

    The problem is that all you apparently have to offer is pointers to a few — a very few — quotes on Mormonism. And, as is so often the case when you attempt to understand a religion, you quote not from core documents, but from documents that actual believers might not even recognize as authoritative, much less informative.

    So when someone points out that Romney is a Mormon, you have nothing of value to offer about, say, the interplay between the personal and the private, the relationship between church and state, what history tells us about how a President’s church’s beliefs are demonstrated (or not) in his administration’s policies, and so on. No, none of that. Your analysis really is as simple as “Romney=Mormon, and Mormons believe this”. Period. End of story.

    As such, really, your work is done here. And has been done for months now, since you offered up all that you have to say on the topic. Thanks for playing.

    Meanwhile, you have yet to teach me anything about the LDS church I didn’t already know. So why you think you’re educating anybody is beyond me. Frankly, the fact that you assume we don’t know the things you tell us speaks more to what you know than it does to what we do.

  • http://www.toddstadler.com/ tODD

    Grace (@29), the problem isn’t, as you appear to imagine, that you’re somehow the only person who knows anything about what Mormons believe. No, I’m quite certain you’re nowhere close to the most knowledgeable person among commenters here when it comes to that topic.

    The problem is that all you apparently have to offer is pointers to a few — a very few — quotes on Mormonism. And, as is so often the case when you attempt to understand a religion, you quote not from core documents, but from documents that actual believers might not even recognize as authoritative, much less informative.

    So when someone points out that Romney is a Mormon, you have nothing of value to offer about, say, the interplay between the personal and the private, the relationship between church and state, what history tells us about how a President’s church’s beliefs are demonstrated (or not) in his administration’s policies, and so on. No, none of that. Your analysis really is as simple as “Romney=Mormon, and Mormons believe this”. Period. End of story.

    As such, really, your work is done here. And has been done for months now, since you offered up all that you have to say on the topic. Thanks for playing.

    Meanwhile, you have yet to teach me anything about the LDS church I didn’t already know. So why you think you’re educating anybody is beyond me. Frankly, the fact that you assume we don’t know the things you tell us speaks more to what you know than it does to what we do.

  • The Jones

    Grace,

    Personally, I don’t think that Romney REALLY believes LDS doctrine in the way most people on this blog would define belief. I mean, most people here REALLY believe Lutheran doctrine, and that looks a lot different from the way Mitt talks about Mormonism. Of course he won’t outright abandon it, because that would unnecessarily burn bridges when he can just amicably, quietly, and half-heartedly stay in the club. While it may be accurate to call this disingenuous, we should also recognize that it’s what most people do with Christianity.

    I mean, think of Barack Obama with the Black Liberation theology of Rev. Wright’s church in Chicago. Sure he may be somewhat sympathetic and not outright disagree with all of it, and that may have problems of its own. But as Barack Obama said in his speech during the campaign, he can’t “abandon” his pastor, either. I imagine the future connection between Mitt Romney and Mormonism will be like the connection between Barack Obama and Rev. Wright.

    But luckily for Christian voters, that connection might not make much of a difference in the realm of worldly things between what our own candidates would propose and what a Mormon would propose. I mean, as a test case, can we really say we’ve had serious problems with the Mormon ideology of Sen. Orrin Hatch? If not, what difference will Mitt Romney give us?

  • The Jones

    Grace,

    Personally, I don’t think that Romney REALLY believes LDS doctrine in the way most people on this blog would define belief. I mean, most people here REALLY believe Lutheran doctrine, and that looks a lot different from the way Mitt talks about Mormonism. Of course he won’t outright abandon it, because that would unnecessarily burn bridges when he can just amicably, quietly, and half-heartedly stay in the club. While it may be accurate to call this disingenuous, we should also recognize that it’s what most people do with Christianity.

    I mean, think of Barack Obama with the Black Liberation theology of Rev. Wright’s church in Chicago. Sure he may be somewhat sympathetic and not outright disagree with all of it, and that may have problems of its own. But as Barack Obama said in his speech during the campaign, he can’t “abandon” his pastor, either. I imagine the future connection between Mitt Romney and Mormonism will be like the connection between Barack Obama and Rev. Wright.

    But luckily for Christian voters, that connection might not make much of a difference in the realm of worldly things between what our own candidates would propose and what a Mormon would propose. I mean, as a test case, can we really say we’ve had serious problems with the Mormon ideology of Sen. Orrin Hatch? If not, what difference will Mitt Romney give us?

  • Dust

    The Jones…..wrong, Romney really believes it and that’s ok. It’s probably not as scary or dangerous on this side of heaven as some folks imagine! Fact is, most Mormons, at least my understanding, are very patriotic, to the point where they even believe (my understanding) that the founding documents of this country, amount to something akin to the inspired word of God himself. If true, that makes them perhaps even much more likely to honor our bill of rights and constitution and protect a culture and society that defends them?

    cheers!

  • Dust

    The Jones…..wrong, Romney really believes it and that’s ok. It’s probably not as scary or dangerous on this side of heaven as some folks imagine! Fact is, most Mormons, at least my understanding, are very patriotic, to the point where they even believe (my understanding) that the founding documents of this country, amount to something akin to the inspired word of God himself. If true, that makes them perhaps even much more likely to honor our bill of rights and constitution and protect a culture and society that defends them?

    cheers!

  • http://gslcnm.com Pastor Spomer

    Cincinnatus,
    Please forgive my lack of clarity. I didn’t mean to demand anything of Mr. Romney per se. I was just stating the conditions under which his candidacy would not do harm to the public’s understanding of Christian beliefs. I know that he does actually believe that LDS teaching is more faithful to Christ than is the Catholic, Baptist or Lutheran faith. This, not despite, but because Mormonism is polytheistic, Pelagian, and condemnatory of the Church as She has existed from ancient times to the time of Joseph Smith.
    Politically, I support anyone’s right to believe such things. I don’t think that Mr. Romney’s religion would be an impediment to his functioning as chief executive. But the public debate surrounding this issue (or lack of debate in our closed minded politically correct atmosphere), harms the spread of the true Faith.

  • http://gslcnm.com Pastor Spomer

    Cincinnatus,
    Please forgive my lack of clarity. I didn’t mean to demand anything of Mr. Romney per se. I was just stating the conditions under which his candidacy would not do harm to the public’s understanding of Christian beliefs. I know that he does actually believe that LDS teaching is more faithful to Christ than is the Catholic, Baptist or Lutheran faith. This, not despite, but because Mormonism is polytheistic, Pelagian, and condemnatory of the Church as She has existed from ancient times to the time of Joseph Smith.
    Politically, I support anyone’s right to believe such things. I don’t think that Mr. Romney’s religion would be an impediment to his functioning as chief executive. But the public debate surrounding this issue (or lack of debate in our closed minded politically correct atmosphere), harms the spread of the true Faith.

  • The Jones

    Dust,

    Haha, yes, true. As a Christian who is Republican, there is a strange dual loyalty: Mormonism is deceitful and dangerous to the gospel (see Galatians 1:6-8), but it is downright patriotic and almost totally Republican. My worry about Mitt Romney is not that he is Mormon (although that is a great annoyance), but that he is moderate and flip flops on many issues.

    While I am still officially undecided, and while I will vote for any of the Republicans behind those podiums instead of Barack Obama (I might even vote for one of the podiums instead of Barack Obama), deciding who is the best person to watch out for the country is not necessarily the same as deciding who will best represent Christianity. That means I could definitely vote for Romney. Who knows? This could be an excellent opportunity to demonstrate what true tolerance means. It doesn’t mean abandoning convictions and agreeing on everything (as liberals usually believe). It means to tolerate one another and live together, even when you vigorously disagree.

  • The Jones

    Dust,

    Haha, yes, true. As a Christian who is Republican, there is a strange dual loyalty: Mormonism is deceitful and dangerous to the gospel (see Galatians 1:6-8), but it is downright patriotic and almost totally Republican. My worry about Mitt Romney is not that he is Mormon (although that is a great annoyance), but that he is moderate and flip flops on many issues.

    While I am still officially undecided, and while I will vote for any of the Republicans behind those podiums instead of Barack Obama (I might even vote for one of the podiums instead of Barack Obama), deciding who is the best person to watch out for the country is not necessarily the same as deciding who will best represent Christianity. That means I could definitely vote for Romney. Who knows? This could be an excellent opportunity to demonstrate what true tolerance means. It doesn’t mean abandoning convictions and agreeing on everything (as liberals usually believe). It means to tolerate one another and live together, even when you vigorously disagree.

  • Dust

    The Jones….good and wise comments, thank you! let me know who you’re going to vote for…maybe will vote for them too :)

  • Dust

    The Jones….good and wise comments, thank you! let me know who you’re going to vote for…maybe will vote for them too :)

  • larry

    I don’t buy into the concept that IF Romney is the candidate he will be elected or even carry many of the conservative house just because when trotted out against Obama, portrayed rhetorically as the devil, “any one but” is preferred.

    I know pretty cross section of folks that tend to vote, both democrat and republican, in the genre of “conservative”. There are some basic facts whether anyone here, Lutheran or otherwise, myself or another hates or likes that simply will prevail come time to vote.

    It’s not that any one of these will do him in or that any one of these carries sufficient number in and of themselves, but rather the accumulative effect.

    First, there are many, maybe not a majority, but a fair number of folks that as conservatives will never vote for him. They’d rather teach a lesson, if necessary for four more years. And the more the Coulter’s push, the more they are steeled in mindset. Like it or not this is a fact on how some will vote or stay home.

    Second, there are many, maybe not a majority, but a fair number of folks that as evangelicals and/or other Christians that will never vote for him. It’s not that he is a Mormon that’s the problem, it’s because the debate has been framed Mormonism is “Christianish” and such a vote becomes de facto affirming this. If the debate remained just “he’s a Mormon” just like so and so is an agnostic or other, he’d likely garner more votes. Thus, it’s not “he’s a Mormon” but that it becomes due to the framing of the argument a de facto affirming that it is a form of (acceptable) Christianity at the end of the day not essentially different. Like it or not this is a fact on how some will vote or stay home.

    Thirdly, there are many, maybe not a majority, but a fair number of folks in the southern states that will never vote for him. It’s generally a combo of the two above. Like it or not this is a fact on how some will vote or stay home.

    So, only someone as blind to these facts or playing ‘mommy giving a verbal spanking” as Coulter would see him a “more electable” republican, there are many, how many remains to be seen, who don’t vote and will never vote “holding their nose”. And the more one holds to an ideal the more this is true, left or right.
    The only thing that could fair for a Romney candidacy is that many on the left think in similar principle as above concerning “their trotted out guy”…to wit, “this is it eh!” So the election could be once again be an expensive campaign race toward the bottom two most candidates possible from either perspective.

  • larry

    I don’t buy into the concept that IF Romney is the candidate he will be elected or even carry many of the conservative house just because when trotted out against Obama, portrayed rhetorically as the devil, “any one but” is preferred.

    I know pretty cross section of folks that tend to vote, both democrat and republican, in the genre of “conservative”. There are some basic facts whether anyone here, Lutheran or otherwise, myself or another hates or likes that simply will prevail come time to vote.

    It’s not that any one of these will do him in or that any one of these carries sufficient number in and of themselves, but rather the accumulative effect.

    First, there are many, maybe not a majority, but a fair number of folks that as conservatives will never vote for him. They’d rather teach a lesson, if necessary for four more years. And the more the Coulter’s push, the more they are steeled in mindset. Like it or not this is a fact on how some will vote or stay home.

    Second, there are many, maybe not a majority, but a fair number of folks that as evangelicals and/or other Christians that will never vote for him. It’s not that he is a Mormon that’s the problem, it’s because the debate has been framed Mormonism is “Christianish” and such a vote becomes de facto affirming this. If the debate remained just “he’s a Mormon” just like so and so is an agnostic or other, he’d likely garner more votes. Thus, it’s not “he’s a Mormon” but that it becomes due to the framing of the argument a de facto affirming that it is a form of (acceptable) Christianity at the end of the day not essentially different. Like it or not this is a fact on how some will vote or stay home.

    Thirdly, there are many, maybe not a majority, but a fair number of folks in the southern states that will never vote for him. It’s generally a combo of the two above. Like it or not this is a fact on how some will vote or stay home.

    So, only someone as blind to these facts or playing ‘mommy giving a verbal spanking” as Coulter would see him a “more electable” republican, there are many, how many remains to be seen, who don’t vote and will never vote “holding their nose”. And the more one holds to an ideal the more this is true, left or right.
    The only thing that could fair for a Romney candidacy is that many on the left think in similar principle as above concerning “their trotted out guy”…to wit, “this is it eh!” So the election could be once again be an expensive campaign race toward the bottom two most candidates possible from either perspective.

  • Bryan Lindemood

    I doubt that Romney really believes Mormon “doctrine”. The adult The admittedly small group of adult LDS members who have been willing to speak to me about such matters, usually depart from the “doctrine” in some way or another fairly quickly in their own beliefs. But they still teach their children the “doctrine”.

    Was talking to a Mormon disbelievers spawn the other day and boy was (s)he gung ho about doing h(is/er) baptizing duty for the dead. Fun!

  • Bryan Lindemood

    I doubt that Romney really believes Mormon “doctrine”. The adult The admittedly small group of adult LDS members who have been willing to speak to me about such matters, usually depart from the “doctrine” in some way or another fairly quickly in their own beliefs. But they still teach their children the “doctrine”.

    Was talking to a Mormon disbelievers spawn the other day and boy was (s)he gung ho about doing h(is/er) baptizing duty for the dead. Fun!

  • Lou G.

    Gotta love Ann Coulter. She’s edgy, but right, imho.

  • Lou G.

    Gotta love Ann Coulter. She’s edgy, but right, imho.


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