Batman sucks

I saw The Dark Knight Rises last week, and was disappointed to say the least. I’m not exactly sure what went wrong. Part of me thinks Nolan must have had some much better plans for the third movie in his trilogy that got ruined by Heath Ledger’s death. But this may have been a case of failing because you tried to do something that was impossible in the first place.

SPOILERS AHEAD!

I’m not exactly sure when the movie first lost me… honestly, it may have been in a very early scene, where we discover Bane’s minions are all perfect fanatics who Bane can order to their deaths on a whim. Where did Bane get such wonderfully fanatical minions? Well, in this version of the story he is head of what’s supposed to be the League of Shadows (the villains from Batman Begins). Though they look like ordinary mercenaries, not ninjas, and nothing we see on screen explains what makes them so wonderfully loyal to Bane.

Compare Heath Ledger’s joker: from literally the first scene of Dark Knight, we see him manipulating people by appealing to quite ordinary human impulses, mainly self interest. The stunts he pulls off may not be 100% plausible, but Ledger’s performance is charismatic enough that you can see people thinking, “Oh crap, we don’t have a choice but to go along with this nutcase!” Tom Hardy’s Bane comes off as more of a cheap Darth Vader knockoff.

Then there’s the part where Alfred reveals that Bane was excommunicated from the League of Shadows. How did Alfred know this? I exactly don’t remember, but it went by fast enough to make clear that Nolan didn’t care about having a coherent excuse to give us that bit of background. But apparently the super-secret organization of ninjas makes its excommunication records public or something.

Then there’s a fact that at the beginning of the movie, Bruce Wayne has become a recluse who needs a cane to walk. At one point, we even get to hear a doctor telling Bruce just how bad his injuries are. Great! Score one for the realistic portrayal of the toll crime fighting would take on a man’s body! Except… he apparently retired from being Batman the night Harvey Dent died. So he was fighting the Joker with the injuries that now make him barely able to walk?

All of these three points come up fairly early in the movie, and they ruined my suspension of disbelief through the rest of it. The treatment of Batman’s injuries just gets worse through the movie. As he’s getting ready to take up the Batman mantle again, there’s a brief scene of him putting on some kind of super-leg brace, which was an interesting idea: using technology to compensate for physical decline.

Then Bane breaks Batman’s back, and imprisons him in a giant hole in the ground in some vaguely Middle Eastern locale. Except apparently, unlike the comics, it was just a dislocated vertebra, because an old doctor who’s also been imprisoned in the giant hole manages to fix Bruce Wayne’s back in a  few seconds using his bare hands.

And then Bruce walks fine for the rest of the movie. He even makes a near-impossible escape from the giant hole. In spite of the fact that while in the giant hole he had clearly been stripped of his Batsuit, so he had no super-leg brace helping him there.

Right…

While it doesn’t even rank as one of the worst things about the movie, I feel like I should say something about the movie’s politics. It’s been called fascist, but if it is, is a very accidental fascism.

You see, while Bruce Wayne is in the giant hole, Bane takes over Gotham. The piece I just linked has an apt description of the rhetoric Bane uses during his takeover: “Bane’s agenda is that of the Occupy movement as seen by people who don’t know anything about the Occupy movement.” But secretly, Bane just wants to blow up Gotham with a fusion bomb after making Bruce Wayne watch the city suffer (on TV!) for awhile.

Not that the movie is totally down on poor people. Selina Kyle gets in some good lines, like “you’re all gonna wonder how you ever thought you could live so large and leave so little for the rest of us.” (She’s never referred to as Catwoman, though we get a brief glimpse of a newspaper heading referring to her as “The Cat,” her name in her first comic book appearance.)  We see that she feels she has no choice but to do what she does, and really just wants a magic computer program (what? hold on…) that will let her start her life over again.

Taking all this together, if you tried to read a coherent political message into the movie, it would go something like this, “it’s totally understandable if you want to overthrow the rich, but if you do your work will just end up being co-opted by a nutcase who wants to kill everyone, and you’ll need a rich guy to come along and save you.” Not that I think that political message was intended. I just think Nolan thought it would be hip to include some vaguely-political dialog, and did so without any thought as to what he was really saying.

Oh, did I mention a fusion bomb? And a magic computer program? Yup, the movie has those things, along with a bizarre flying contraption called “the Bat,” another magic computer program that steals all of Bruce Wayne’s money, and probably something else that I’ve forgotten. The technology of the previous movies was never 100% plausible, but Rises really shoves the implausibilities in your face.

Another thing: I love how the fusion bomb simultaneously doesn’t function in any way remotely like real fusion bombs, and is referred to in the movie as if hydrogen bombs hadn’t been a real thing for 60 years. Oh, and how did the International Atomic Energy Agency miss the fact that Wayne Enterprises had a weaponizable fusion reactor sitting underneath a city of 12 million people?

One final problem with this movie: there’s a difference between foreshadowing and telegraphic every major plot twist, a difference which Nolan clearly doesn’t understand. For example: when Selina decides to get the hell out of Gotham before Bane can blow it up, Batman tells her she’ll be back. Which is obvious, the rules of the story require it. But did you have to announce it in the fucking script?

Worse… SUPER SECRET DOUBLE SPOILER ALERT WARNING!

The movie beats us over the head with the possibility that Batman could die. Mainly through Alfred’s dialog, but there’s also a point near the climax where Batman solemnly tells Selina he hasn’t given everything for Gotham yet. So when Batman flies off in the Bat to get the fusion bomb away from Gotham before it explodes, I’m not wondering if he’s going to make it out alive somehow. I’m thinking, “Oh, Nolan decided that now the trilogy’s done, he can kill Batman off. Good for him.”

Contrast the climax of The Avengers where  Iron Man similarly needs to save New York from a nuke. Logically, you know that even though Joss Whedon loves killing off characters, the execs involved would never let him do it because they need Tony alive for Iron Man 3. Yet there’s still a lot of genuine dramatic tension there. Not so when Batman flies off in Dark Knight Rises.

Except! It turns out that Bruce fixed the Bat’s autopilot, and somehow bailed out so he could run away and start a new life with Selina. It may sound ridiculous, but it could have been a cool twist… if everything in the movie up til that point hand’t been conspiring to make me not care.

Now it may seem unfair for me to complain about all of the movie’s suspension-of-disbelief ruining moments. After all, while I don’t think they were perfect, I didn’t make that complaint against Thor or Avengers or Amazing Spider-Man. The difference, though is that those movies embrace the implausibilities as part of the premise. They take them home and pet them and call them George.

Christopher Nolan’s franchise, on the other hand, pretended it was showing us how Batman could exist in the real world. Not really. Batman Begins assumed that ninja training could make you into the ultimate badass, and checking Wikipedia’s summary, I remember there was something about a “Microwave Emitter” super-weapon. But it was close enough to make for a satisfying movie.

Rises goes way, way beyond that. And it had to Nolan had to finish his trilogy off with a bang, with a threat on the order of “super-villain plans to blow up Gotham with a fusion bomb.” But there’s no remotely realistic way to have a plot like that happen.

Ultimately, I think the Dark Knight saga may be best seen as the story of a man who put forth an incredible effort, came so very close to his goal, and in the end failed only because what he was trying to do was impossible. I’m talking about Nolan, of course, not Bruce Wayne. Nolan’s achievement here is to show that the idea of a real-world superhero just doesn’t work.

And why would it? Being blatantly unrealistic is the whole point of superhero stories. A really realistic “superhero” story won’t be a superhero story at all, it’ll be a dark parody of superhero stories, like Mark Millar’s Kick-Ass (the comic, not the movie). That’s what makes the blatantly unrealistic Marvel films we’ve been seeing enjoyable.

And speaking of Kick-Ass, I liked it enough to read all of Kick-Ass 2, but Mark Millar did a much better take-down of the “superhero without powers” concept with the Defenders side-plot in Ultimates 2. The idea is sufficiently silly that even devoting a miniseries like Kick-Ass to it is overkill. The idea of a superhero who’s just an ordinary human being is a contradiction in terms.

So, as much fun as it is to come up with reasons why an ordinary human could totally beat Superman, the concept doesn’t really work in the end. Yeah, I said it: the concept of Batman just doesn’t work. Here’s looking forward to lots more Marvel movies. And if we’re very lucky, who knows? Maybe Zack Synder’s Superman movie will actually be good.

  • Will

    I agree that the movie was terrible. Spending an hour before he even decides to be Batman again was a huge mistake. And the timeline after Bane defeats Batman and sends him to that stupid prison that only 10-year-old girls and 40-year-old men with bad knees and broken backs can escape from didn’t work at all.

    Nolan could have skipped that first hour, and then he might have time to actually make the end of the movie make sense. Or maybe you’re right and it was doomed from the start. Either way, clearly the worst of the 3 offerings, and that’s saying something. Is it just me, or has Batman Begins not aged well?

  • bspiken

    I agree almost completely, except on the realistic portrayal bit, and I bring up Nolan’s “Dark Knight” for this one, that was a thoroughly enjoyable exercise on the realistic world for a superhero, and while I believe Ledger’s performance really sold you on the whole “crazy dude is gonna blow up the city!” troupe of supervillain, I think that as a whole the writing was way better, on “Rises” I really think that they beat you with the plot point on and on, “this film is about redemption and guilt” over and over (with batman doing monologues on his deep voice, which is just…no). And then Wayne goes scott free with Selina, no consequences, and Robin taking over the mantle for a new series.

    It really felt like no one but the actors actually cared about the film Caine is amazing, I really enjoyed Hattaway performance, together with Gordon-Levitt, Cotillard and Oldman, they seemed sincerely involved in the movie, (well them and the special effects crew, they blew Gotham up good for this one).

  • http://motherwell.livejournal.com/ Raging Bee

    …if you tried to read a coherent political message into the movie, it would go something like this, “it’s totally understandable if you want to overthrow the rich, but if you do your work will just end up being co-opted by a nutcase who wants to kill everyone, and you’ll need a rich guy to come along and save you.”

    Yeah, that’s pretty standard fascism: evil people are practically superhuman and incomprehensible, you can’t ever reason or make deals with them, and the masses can’t do squat without a Man On A White Horse to lead them and do all the thinking and deciding. It kinda reminds me of Republitarian Ron Paul pretending he represents the interests of the 99%.

    Not that I think that political message was intended.

    And that’s the worst part of it: this message has just been drummed into our deepest subconcious to the point where it affects our thoughts 24/7 without our even noticing it, and becomes an integral part of every story we tell.

    I’ve hated the Batman movies ever since I first heard the ads for the first one. Other movie ads make me at least a little bit curious about the movie, even when I know I don’t want to see it. Batman movie ads have always been heavy-handed, self-conscious, pretentiously dark (and/or darkly pretentious), and never left me feeling anything other than “Puh-lease, who do you think you’re kidding?”

    Another part of the problem, IMHO, is that Batman, like Superman, is an antique superhero. And while later generations of superheros have been entertaining and adaptable to changes in the real world, Batman is still nothing more than a very simple little kids’ story, for little kids who don’t yet understand how the world really works; and all those desperate attempts to make him Dark and Brooding and Deep and Relevant and All Grown Up have just made him even more ridiculous. It’s a bit like mounting jet engines and Stinger missiles on a Fokker Triplane: kinda funny, mostly sad, and totally futile.

  • http://motherwell.livejournal.com/ Raging Bee

    Oops, wrong weapon-system. That last sentence should have read: “It’s a bit like mounting jet engines and BVRAAM missiles on a Fokker Triplane: kinda funny, mostly sad, and totally futile.

  • Mikey

    Yeahs, I can say that at no time was I engaged in Batman’s story. It felt like Nolan got bored and wanted to make movie about Gotham’s police dealing with Bane but then was like “OH WAIT, they won’t let me make this without Batman… damn… I’m sure I can fit him in here somewhere…”

  • Dianne

    Then there’s the part where Alfred reveals that Bane was excommunicated from the League of Shadows. How did Alfred know this?

    Secretly Alfred is head of the League of Shadows and has been manipulating Bruce Wayne into eliminating rivals. I think it could be worked as a plot twist. I never did trust Alfred.

    • Aliasalpha

      So you advocate a return to that most classic of twists: the butler did it

  • Richard

    Wow. The first objectively wrong thing I’ve read on the Freethought Blogs. Read the numerous comics where Batman creams Superman. Batman>Superman, always.

    • http://www.facebook.com/chris.hallquist Chris Hallquist

      Oh, I’m aware of them. I even thought The Dark Knight Returns was a fun read. But the idea of Batman beating Superman doesn’t actually make much sense, as explained in this Cracked article.

      Which is actually pretty good, even though it defends Batman. The flaw in their defense of Batman is that failure to take their last point to its logical conclusion: if the DCU made sense, Batman would be reduced to being the Justice League’s lab geek. But the article works great as an explanation of why most Marvel characters are better than Superman.

      • Richard

        I agree that Marvel>DC, but Batman>all of them.

        The reason why is so blindingly simple.

        Batman villains=best villains in comics.

        Spiderman comes in a very close second.

        End of discussion.

        • http://www.facebook.com/chris.hallquist Chris Hallquist

          The Joker is a cool villain.

          NOT sure about the rest of Batman’s rogue’s gallery.

          (Also: what does it say about a character that he gets overshadowed by his villains?)

    • http://www.facebook.com/chris.hallquist Chris Hallquist

      Though it occurs to me that you might try a HPMOR-style take on the DCU, where the main conflict is Batman vs. Lex Luthor. Then you could have DCU story that actually makes sense. Maybe. Not entirely sure about that.

  • cory

    ”Bane’s agenda is that of the Occupy movement as seen by people who don’t know anything about the Occupy movement.” … I just think Nolan thought it would be hip to include some vaguely-political dialog, and did so without any thought as to what he was really saying.

    The plot is based on A Tale of Two Cities (it’s really obvious, he even quotes it in the end), and the rhetoric seems to me as close to the Cultural Revolution as OWS. Replace “planning to take over” with “have taken over” and you’re pretty much there.

    At present, our objective is to struggle against and crush those persons in authority who are taking the capitalist road, to criticize and repudiate the reactionary bourgeois academic “authorities” and the ideology of the bourgeoisie and all other exploiting classes and to transform education, literature and art, and all other parts of the superstructure that do not correspond to the socialist economic base, so as to facilitate the consolidation and development of the socialist system.

    While none so far as I know have been started by a supervillian with an army of ninjas, it is a simple fact that many left-wing movements have been started by (see Cultural Revolution) or hijacked by (French revolution for a brief time, Bolshevik rev.) authoritarian elements. Including this as a plot point is not the same thing as saying that this is what always happens. The movie never even hints that this was a typical left wing protest movement. It is not fascist, accidentally or otherwise.

    Given that the movie had been filming for several months before OWS even started, including the football scene where Bane announces his plan, the overall plot could not have been inspired by the movement, and I find it much more likely that the rhetoric was largely based on ToTC and the Cultural Revolution, so any similarity to OWS is purely coincidental. While they might have thought “OMG political relevance” as soon as the movement started, rewrote yet to be filmed scenes, and rewrote Bane’s lines (which I think were dubbed in post), I find this fairly unlikely. The draft of the script that they had when they started filming would resolve it. Does anyone know if it has been leaked/published?

    P.S. None of the science in this movie is as bad as the magic microwaves in BB. Seriously, watch it again. It’s laughable. On the other hand, the bad science in this was spread out over several things, so some people might have a harder time ignoring it. That’s why I like TDK: 95% Bad Science Free (5% Bad Science).

    • http://www.facebook.com/chris.hallquist Chris Hallquist

      Hmmm… I knew the making of the movie was already underway when OWS started, but assumed what Nolan did was think, “oh, this is in the news, we should throw in some references to be hip.” Did NOT know the football scene had been filmed by then. You may be right about the association being totally accidental.

      And of course, showing one example of something does not mean claiming that’s how it always is. Still, the fact that you’ve got this entire mythos of built around a rich guy beating up poor people, and then have this be the example of the poor people objecting… rather unfortunate, don’t you think?

      And this wasn’t even a realistic story about a revolution being corrupted into authoritarianism. Bane was a typical cheesy movie villain who basically wanted to do things for the evulz (there was something in there about Gotham being corrupt, but it made even less sense than it did in the first movie.)

  • eric

    The fascism of the plot didn’t bother me nearly as much as the stupidity of the league of shadows. Objective: you want to take Gotham down. Problem: there’s a superhero defending it. But you’re a 2,000+ year old organization, so the solution is obvious: wait 60 years until he’s dead.

    • http://www.facebook.com/chris.hallquist Chris Hallquist

      Yeah. Well, part of the motive was revenge. If they hadn’t cared about making Bruce suffer as much as possible before killing him, the could have just shot him, Scott Evil style, and their plan would have worked.

      • eric

        Ok, so they want revenge. Solution: put the sniper shot through his spine, rather than his head. Let him watch what you do from the sidelines.

        There are layers upon layers of League stupidity. If a hundred-year plan was good enough for Rome, why not here? Why not infiltrate the US military – you know, put a pilot in the seat of one of those jets that carried nukes over Gotham? Just start dropping bombs against orders. Why not just publish a front page ad that says “Bruce Wayne is Batman?” Why not release the Joker? He may be an uncontrollable anarchist, but he certainly keeps Batman busy.

        You’ve got the fusion-bomb maker, why set the timer for 5 months? Why not 5 minutes? Or heck, with the owner of the plans (because she’s on your side) you can probably design a new fusion bomb in less than 5 months. Good lord, importing smallpox from the USSR has to be faster. Another idea – run with what Gotham’s already done. Evidently there’s some 8-year old rule increasing the penalties for crime. Keep going. Institute a 1-strike rule; get stronger and stronger on crime until the city collapses.

        I would’ve liked to have seen the following ending. As per what happened, but after Alfred leaves, Rhaz Al Ghul (the original; because he’s immortal) sits down at Bruce’s table. Says: “Bruce, you’ve earned Gotham a reprieve. We will stay away from the city for the next 40 years. Then, when you’re old and decrepit, we’re going to destroy it.”

        That ending would’ve been horrible revenge – imagine living the next 40 years knowing that everything you’ve fought for, someone is going to destroy after you can do nothing about it. AND, it would’ve set up a next movie, because the most natural response for Wayne in this case is to create a legacy superhero.

        • cuppatea@yahoo.co.jp

          That sounds like Batman Beyond Begins.

  • Soren

    I was very disappointed too.

    I think he tried to make it the ultimate threat to Gotham, but it just didn’t fly.

    I hated the fusion bomb. Why make the story so unbelievable. Just let them steal the bomb from Russia, Iran or the US.

    And only this one expert could make it into a bomb. Why did it then take only like 2 minutes to do it?

    and then bane removes the core, which makes it “unstable”. This means it will blow in 59 days (or whatever) 2 hours 3 minutes 2 seconds. That is not unstable, that is fucking stable. Most of my watches has been more unstable than the bomb, losing or gaining more time in that period.

    And one more thing about the movie. The hole prison was the worst place on earth? Well no, people seemed rather nice.
    That whole story line was absolutely useless. If they had just removed the Bat from his city, perhaps letting him fall in the sewer with a broken back, and then cut the prison story, the movie had been much tighter and more watchable.

    Then the bat cut have returned in the last act, with no hint of how he did it, or perhaps with a hint that Alfred had a hand in it, or perhaps we see him being pulled from the sea by a figure which might be the joker?

    I don’t know – I can’t write for shit, but I do know when the plot is shit, and the prison plait was just that

  • sailor1031

    You were expecting plausibility in a Batman movie?

  • Fentex

    I don’t think Nolan had a trilogy in mind when he started, but found it a nice idea for a subject he likes and was enjoying working with after the success of the second.

    But it felt forced to me with altogether too much crowbaring of exposition into a story.

    I think it needed a completely different first twenty minutes, a quick sweep through the years after The Dark Knight that would establish a feel of passing time and show Bruces increasing personal dispair while Batman professionally succeeded.

    Then it ought to have switched to Banes story, showing more time passing, so that when we return to Gotham the stage is properly set.

  • http://www.twitter.com/WCLPeter WCLPeter

    When a friend asked me how I liked this film I put it to him this way:

    I’ve seen the Avengers four times in theatres and I’d go again right now, I will *not* be doing the same for The Dark Knight Rises.

    It just seemed too long and had way too much filler. They could have easily cut an hour out of the film and I think it would have had a LOT more impact.

    My other big problem with the movie was continuity within the universe.

    Obviously a film about a character is going to be primarily about that character, you can’t have other characters in the universe jumping in to help out the main one just because they happen to exist in the same universe. But Gotham was under siege for 5 months – a nuclear bomb threatened millions of people for MONTHS and not one peep out of Superman, The Flash, Wonder Woman, Cyborg, Green Lantern, Green Arrow, no one? Really?

    Joker blowing up stuff and Batman taking care of it quickly, yeah don’t see much need for them to show up. But Gotham in a hostage situation for 5 months and no sign of the Batman, ain’t no way those heroes are going to stay out of it!

    • http://www.facebook.com/chris.hallquist Chris Hallquist

      I think it’s pretty clear that these characters don’t exist in Nolan’s version of the universe. They wouldn’t fit in at all with his approach.

      • http://www.twitter.com/WCLPeter WCLPeter

        Good point, should have thought of that myself. :-)

        Still can’t help but feel its just not rational. Then again what’s rationality in a movie where a guy’s body armour can take punches from a guy who can easily demolish marble columns with his fists but can’t stop a simple little pocket knife.

        Though I do have to admit, I totally didn’t see the Big Bad being who the Big Bad was. So I have to give Nolan credit for that one.

        But overall I just didn’t like the film – didn’t hate it and will probably buy it in the upcoming “Trilogy Blu-Ray Mega Awesome Ultra Pack”, please please please Warner Brothers – put a Kevin Conroy overdub on it as one of the special features, but it wouldn’t be my fist choice of films to watch.

        • cuppatea@yahoo.co.jp

          In TDK Batman redesigned his armor to make him more vulnerable to knives and dogs.

  • Brian

    Haven’t seen the movie, and will probably wait for it on tv. Regarding Wayne being all banged up, but not having done anything physical since tangling with the Joker. That seems quite plausible to me. Many sports players have degenerative conditions, such as knees with no cartilage, that mean they are effectively crippled by the end or in the years following the end of their careers. The seem fine on the field, possibly due to painkillers, but they are in for a world of pain and mobility problems as the years pass.

  • pipenta

    Yeah, I did not care for this movie at all. I think Raging Bee summed up many of the reasons I disliked the film quite nicely. I did not hate it as much as I hated (KILL IT WITH FIRE) Prometheus. That movie dumped me out on the sidewalk feeling very ill-used. The Dark Knight Rises just left me blinking and with my ears ringing. In Prometheus, there wasn’t a single character that I gave a good goddamn about. None of them did a single thing that make a lick of sense in the context of their own characters. In Batman there were a few engaging characters, even if the dark knight himself wasn’t one of them.

    There was stupid and lots of it. And at a certain point, I just started feeling abused. By the time the football stadium was blown up, my patience was gone. Had I been alone, I would have walked out.

    One particularly maddening problem was that the dialog became blurred about a third of the way through the film and it was very difficult to hear what was said. It is possible that there just happened to be a problem with the print we were watching. But as the film progressed, we began to wonder if the blurring was intentional. Was it possible that the director or someone had looked at the final cut and found it flawed enough that it was preferable for the audience to not hear the specifics? If the film works at all, it is in the action sequences (if that sort of thing is your idea of a good time zzzzzz) and you don’t really need to know much plot.

    Did anyone else have trouble making out the words?

    • Mark Erickson

      Yes, I had problems hearing dialogue too. Although, since I already had stopped caring, it didn’t bother me much. Bane was mostly unintelligible. I just assumed he was saying evil shit.

      More importantly, I’ve hated Batman’s voice since the first movie. Deep is one thing. Sounding like a fifth grader doing a deep voice in another.

      • Tom Robbins

        A solution to the voice problem that also makes sense thematically (becoming the mask, being swallowed by batman) is for batman to simply wear a full face visor like a motorcycle helmet. You could, with the magic of Morgan freeman and a few billion dollars, stick a voice modulator, a half dozen vision modes, rebreather rated for gas and water, and make it actually look like a bat, and not a pointy ski mask. Oh, and cranial Protection. I don’t think ninja skilz automatically mean you can ignore a concussion, or windburn from gliding, or whatever else he does. Just a dumb design, it is.

  • Ysanne

    Oh yes, lot of good points in this review.
    The only thing I thought was well done with Bane’s fusion bomb plot was how he blackmailed the whole city’s population into obedience by not identifying the person holding the bomb’s trigger.
    Otherwise… *sigh*
    Nolan even included the “villain explains their motive in painstaking detail, giving the heroes just enough time to foil the plan” spiel after the dramatic twist revealing the real villain’s identity, and this after more than half the movie’s plot was already hinged on the “shooting is too good for my enemies, I want to see them suffer” cliche… really, isn’t the Evil Overlord List commonly known by now?

  • Rabidtreeweasel

    I suspect that the movie he wanted to make would have had Joker continuing his rain of terror from within Markham while Talia used the chaos to her own advantage. Heck I would have accepted Killer Croc. I hated this portrayal of Bane. Why in the name of all that isn’t really sacred did the man sound like Sean Connery?
    Gregory Levitt I enjoyed. I thought he was an interesting blend of Terry McGuiness and Night Wing. I thought having his real name was a bit obvious. Yeah, um, we get it.
    And frankly it would have been a better ending if Batman died.
    Best part of the movie for me was Anne Hathaway as Cat Woman. Loved her.

  • QuandraX

    I didn’t hate TDKR. I just didn’t enjoy it. I, like many, think the film is held up almost exclusively by Anne Hatheway as Selina Kyle. She was worth the download.

  • Natalie

    Man, Chris, you SO don’t get Batman. Nolan Batman isn’t Batman, and Batman’s schtick EVEN IN NOLAN-VERSE, isn’t “ordinary human being a superhero”. His schtick is “world’s greatest detective”, “master of everything”, “ultimate badass”, etc. Even AS a human being he’s not at all ordinary: he inherited unimaginable, for-story-purposes-infinite wealth, was born with huge natural intellectual and athletic aptitudes, and HAS A FUCKING SUPER-BUTLER, who just HAPPENS to be trained in combat-medicine. Does ANY of that read as “ordinary human” to you? He’s an EXTRAordinary human, the upper limits of human achievement, intelligence, determination and preparedness at the stretch of disbelief to the breaking point. Comparing him to, like, Kick-Ass or whatever just doesn’t make sense.

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