Did Last Night’s Debate Decide It For You?

Okay, a quick question. (Yes, I’m still taking a break. This doesn’t count. Seriously. It doesn’t. Stop it.) Did last night’s presidential debate change your mind, or decide it for you? Reading in various forums and so on a ton of responses to the debate, I got the impression that everybody who watched it already knew going in for whom they intended to vote (and, naturally, their man slaughtered the other guy).

It got me wondering: Did the debate—or do any “debates” like it—ever change, or finally decide, anyone’s mind?

Did last night’s debate change yours? Had you suspected Obama of being too slick and vague—but instead found him judicious, sincere, and trenchantly intelligent? Did you used to think McCain so rabidly ambitious it was clear he’s say anything to anyone he was trying to impress—but now think him a humble and dignified Man of the People?

Did the debate change or decide your mind at all? If so, share!

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About John Shore

John Shore (who, fwiw, is straight) is the author of UNFAIR: Christians and the LGBT Question, and three other great books. He is founder of Unfundamentalist Christians (on Facebook here), and executive editor of the Unfundamentalist Christians group blog.  (In total John's two blogs receive some 250,000 views per month.) John is also co-founder of The NALT Christians Project, which was written about by TIME,  The Washington Post, and others. His website is JohnShore.com. John is a pastor ordained by The Progressive Christian Alliance. You're invited to like John's Facebook page. And don't forget to sign up for his mucho awesome monthly newsletter.

  • http://www.kellykirbyfisher.blogspot.com Kelly

    The debates this year were just more of the same…just worded differently – and maybe the questions were in a different order. It would be similiar to communicating that "I'm hungry" 3 different ways:

    1. Let's go get something to eat.

    2. Feel like stopping at Outback Steakhouse for dinner?

    3. What are you fixing for dinner tonight, dear?

    All 3 of these statements basically convey the same message. It's frustrating….round and round. If I wanted to get on a merry-go-round – I would go to the Texas Fair (at least I could get a deep fried corndog there).

    I am afraid we are screwed anyway we vote – unless we start to get involved on the local level and realize that we need to be more concerned with who we are putting in Congress. While Bush gets all the blame for how things are right now – remember that the Democrats are the ones controling congress right now.

    I have decided to change my party affiliation to NO PARTY.

    For those of you who love history and politics, there is a really cool website out there called The American Presidency Project. It's got some really interesting statistics and information dating all the way back to the first election – that gave us George Washington. The web address is http://www.presidency.ucsb.edu/index.php

  • http://www.kellykirbyfisher.blogspot.com Kelly

    The debates this year were just more of the same…just worded differently – and maybe the questions were in a different order. It would be similiar to communicating that "I'm hungry" 3 different ways:

    1. Let's go get something to eat.

    2. Feel like stopping at Outback Steakhouse for dinner?

    3. What are you fixing for dinner tonight, dear?

    All 3 of these statements basically convey the same message. It's frustrating….round and round. If I wanted to get on a merry-go-round – I would go to the Texas Fair (at least I could get a deep fried corndog there).

    I am afraid we are screwed anyway we vote – unless we start to get involved on the local level and realize that we need to be more concerned with who we are putting in Congress. While Bush gets all the blame for how things are right now – remember that the Democrats are the ones controling congress right now.

    I have decided to change my party affiliation to NO PARTY.

    For those of you who love history and politics, there is a really cool website out there called The American Presidency Project. It's got some really interesting statistics and information dating all the way back to the first election – that gave us George Washington. The web address is http://www.presidency.ucsb.edu/index.php

  • Candace

    Don't be frightened, Jessica. Or at least not any more than you normally would be by ANY politician. Truly. It's just another election between two people who were chosen by the politicos and not the people, who are ultimately interested in nothing so much as their own power and fortune, and who will have a term or two at most before they retire, to fat-and-happily live out their days taken care of by our tax money and whatever they managed to feather their nests with while in office, so the next person can offer the same empty promises and mean-spirited ads to get elected, for the same reasons, with the same result.

    There truly IS nothing new under the sun, and a good look at the book of Revelation will show you that the earth ain't headed for no storybook ending anyway.

    So cheer up!

    (Yes, this IS how I get about 3 weeks before ANY presidential election. It'll pass; it always does! ;-) )

    Oh, and John: I really like your style of taking a break! Had I known this was the case, I could have saved myself some sack cloth and ashes of my own. Next time I'll know not to panic :-)

  • Candace

    Don't be frightened, Jessica. Or at least not any more than you normally would be by ANY politician. Truly. It's just another election between two people who were chosen by the politicos and not the people, who are ultimately interested in nothing so much as their own power and fortune, and who will have a term or two at most before they retire, to fat-and-happily live out their days taken care of by our tax money and whatever they managed to feather their nests with while in office, so the next person can offer the same empty promises and mean-spirited ads to get elected, for the same reasons, with the same result.

    There truly IS nothing new under the sun, and a good look at the book of Revelation will show you that the earth ain't headed for no storybook ending anyway.

    So cheer up!

    (Yes, this IS how I get about 3 weeks before ANY presidential election. It'll pass; it always does! ;-) )

    Oh, and John: I really like your style of taking a break! Had I known this was the case, I could have saved myself some sack cloth and ashes of my own. Next time I'll know not to panic :-)

  • http://suddenlyatheist.wordpress.com/ morsec0de

    No, it didn’t.

    The faces that McCain kept making did get me to chuckle, however.

  • http://suddenlyatheist.wordpress.com/ morsec0de

    No, it didn’t.

    The faces that McCain kept making did get me to chuckle, however.

  • http://www.johnshore.wordpress.com John Shore

    Are you suggesting that McCain smiling is like a pit bull wearing a tu-tu: almost cute, but would still clearly chew your face off? Because that’s a totally rude and utterly unwarranted thing to say.

  • anita

    Yes it counts. It’s a post. It counts. Does too.

    I dare say that everyone who watched the debates had already made up their minds and what they say only confirmed what they believed. They might say they were an undecided before they watched but no one at this point could truly be an undecided unless their medication hasn’t kicked in.

    For me, who is decidedly for Obama, the debate changed nothing. While Obama remains an unknown to me,I’d rather take a risk that go with more of the same. Maverick my fat…

  • anita

    Yes it counts. It’s a post. It counts. Does too.

    I dare say that everyone who watched the debates had already made up their minds and what they say only confirmed what they believed. They might say they were an undecided before they watched but no one at this point could truly be an undecided unless their medication hasn’t kicked in.

    For me, who is decidedly for Obama, the debate changed nothing. While Obama remains an unknown to me,I’d rather take a risk that go with more of the same. Maverick my fat…

  • anita

    The above comment has typos galore but then it wasn’t really a comment and doesn’t count as a comment so there were really no typos.

  • anita

    The above comment has typos galore but then it wasn’t really a comment and doesn’t count as a comment so there were really no typos.

  • http://www.johnshore.wordpress.com John Shore

    It doesn’t count, because it’s not really a POST. It’s just a quick question prompted by a huge national event. Get back in your sack cloth, Itchy.

    Speaking of clothes one really shouldn’t be wearing, I’m STILL having to wear my Fat Clothes because of the cookies you sent me. (People: Anita was kind enough to send me about 45 pounds of wonderful cookies—they were in a big basket, and shaped in all these Most Excellent Ways—as a housewarmng gift right after we moved here. It was awesome. For those of you who wish YOU had sent me something to commemorate our Big Day, despair not: It’s not too late. Email me for details and/or suggested gifts.)

    Send me more cookies. Now.

  • http://www.johnshore.wordpress.com John Shore

    It doesn’t count, because it’s not really a POST. It’s just a quick question prompted by a huge national event. Get back in your sack cloth, Itchy.

    Speaking of clothes one really shouldn’t be wearing, I’m STILL having to wear my Fat Clothes because of the cookies you sent me. (People: Anita was kind enough to send me about 45 pounds of wonderful cookies—they were in a big basket, and shaped in all these Most Excellent Ways—as a housewarmng gift right after we moved here. It was awesome. For those of you who wish YOU had sent me something to commemorate our Big Day, despair not: It’s not too late. Email me for details and/or suggested gifts.)

    Send me more cookies. Now.

  • http://rightplaceandtime.blogspot.com/ Colleen

    Absolutely, we need more of Joe the plumber! The candidates looked like they were really elbowing each other when they felt trapped. McCain had a flushed expression but Obama was really overflowing. Or maybe it was the other way around, sorry my memory is unclear I felt a lttle drained when it was all over. Hope you don’t mind a little potty humor. Badda bing badda boom

  • tavdy

    I (obviously) can’t vote, but before the debate I already knew I’d be voting Obama if I were able to. For a long time early on in the election cycle McCain struck me as an “acceptable alternative”, but I always preferred Obama – my only concern was his relative lack of experience in Federal politics compared to McCain. Or rather it was until last night (yup, I stayed up till 3.30am my time to watch them slug it out). To be honest, McCain’s performance last night wasn’t ever going to change anything: the only question I had was whether or not Obama would impress me – and he did. I guess like many people I was seeking confirmation rather than decision.

    Oh, and Scratchy, get into your own sack-cloth: I’m voting with Anita so you’re outnumbered 2-to-1. This counts as a post.

    ____

    Also, sending you gifts all the way from the UK might be a little impractical however I do have an alternative which I hope you’ll enjoy just as much: the recipe for my chocolate and morello cherry pudding. The only problem is that the recipe is in metric, but hopefully that shouldn’t be an issue if you have scales that do metric as well as imperial. It’s ideal for when you have quite a lot of guests as it’s a big recipe – it can serve up to 12 quite easily – and pretty straight-forward to make. It’s also gluten free, however it does contain nuts.

    300g caster sugar

    250g butter

    200g ground almonds

    125g cocoa

    6 eggs

    1.5 teaspoons bicarbonate of soda

    500g morello cherries (frozen destoned ones are best – defrosted)

    25g granulated or caster sugar

    kirsch or brandy (optional)

    Creme Fraiche (to serve)

    Beat together the sugar and butter until creamy, then mix in the almonds, cocoa, eggs and bicarbonate of soda. Pour into a deep 10″ by 13″ baking tin (I use a turkey-roasting tin) and bake at 180′C / 350F / Gas mark 4 for 35-45 minutes or until the cake is just cooked.

    Meanwhile, put the morello cherries in a pan over a low heat with the sugar, and simmer gently for about 10 minutes – the fruit should be softened but not stewed. If you’re feeling extra generous, add some kirsch or brandy to the cherries. When the cake is finished, serve it hot from the oven in individual bowls with the stewed cherries and the creme fraiche on top.

  • tavdy

    I (obviously) can’t vote, but before the debate I already knew I’d be voting Obama if I were able to. For a long time early on in the election cycle McCain struck me as an “acceptable alternative”, but I always preferred Obama – my only concern was his relative lack of experience in Federal politics compared to McCain. Or rather it was until last night (yup, I stayed up till 3.30am my time to watch them slug it out). To be honest, McCain’s performance last night wasn’t ever going to change anything: the only question I had was whether or not Obama would impress me – and he did. I guess like many people I was seeking confirmation rather than decision.

    Oh, and Scratchy, get into your own sack-cloth: I’m voting with Anita so you’re outnumbered 2-to-1. This counts as a post.

    ____

    Also, sending you gifts all the way from the UK might be a little impractical however I do have an alternative which I hope you’ll enjoy just as much: the recipe for my chocolate and morello cherry pudding. The only problem is that the recipe is in metric, but hopefully that shouldn’t be an issue if you have scales that do metric as well as imperial. It’s ideal for when you have quite a lot of guests as it’s a big recipe – it can serve up to 12 quite easily – and pretty straight-forward to make. It’s also gluten free, however it does contain nuts.

    300g caster sugar

    250g butter

    200g ground almonds

    125g cocoa

    6 eggs

    1.5 teaspoons bicarbonate of soda

    500g morello cherries (frozen destoned ones are best – defrosted)

    25g granulated or caster sugar

    kirsch or brandy (optional)

    Creme Fraiche (to serve)

    Beat together the sugar and butter until creamy, then mix in the almonds, cocoa, eggs and bicarbonate of soda. Pour into a deep 10″ by 13″ baking tin (I use a turkey-roasting tin) and bake at 180′C / 350F / Gas mark 4 for 35-45 minutes or until the cake is just cooked.

    Meanwhile, put the morello cherries in a pan over a low heat with the sugar, and simmer gently for about 10 minutes – the fruit should be softened but not stewed. If you’re feeling extra generous, add some kirsch or brandy to the cherries. When the cake is finished, serve it hot from the oven in individual bowls with the stewed cherries and the creme fraiche on top.

  • Lucilia

    I only have faith in Jesus…. why isn’t he running??? I’d definitely vote for him! Ok…Earth calling Lucy…I had forgotten for a moment, that this isn’t a perfect world. A girl can dream can’t she? :-)

  • Lucilia

    I only have faith in Jesus…. why isn’t he running??? I’d definitely vote for him! Ok…Earth calling Lucy…I had forgotten for a moment, that this isn’t a perfect world. A girl can dream can’t she? :-)

  • http://ww.sheppardministries.com Greta

    Hey, John, go figure that recipe out… the Brits are great for weighing everything! Do you know what ‘creme fraiche’ is? When we lived there, our kids called it ‘white gravy’… English folk put it on every dessert, and eat their dessert with a spoon and a fork.

    Now that takes some dexterity….at first! Mm..mmm good!

  • http://ww.sheppardministries.com Greta

    Hey, John, go figure that recipe out… the Brits are great for weighing everything! Do you know what ‘creme fraiche’ is? When we lived there, our kids called it ‘white gravy’… English folk put it on every dessert, and eat their dessert with a spoon and a fork.

    Now that takes some dexterity….at first! Mm..mmm good!

  • http://fvthinker.blogspot.com Mike (FVThinker) Burns

    Both McCain and Obama are honorable men despite how they might try to paint each other (McCain doing the lion’s share of painting at this point). While I think I could tolerate a McCain presidency, I don’t know if this world would want a Palin presidency…and there is a 1 in 5 chance of that happening were McCain elected (source federal actuarial tables). She has put no distance between herself and her church which preaches end-times theology. Do we want someone with the nuclear codes that might think they are fulfilling biblical prophecy?!?! I think not.

  • http://samwrites2.wordpress.com Sam

    John,

    Actually the debate and peer group pressure did finally get me off the undecided-but-leaning toward McCain fence into what I hope are greener pastures at Obama’s farm.

    I could not believe McCain’s proposal to “improve” the health care system by axing Section 125 benefits (health care premiums taken out before taxes) and had not examined either candidate’s voting records or specific proposals carefully until the debate. McCain’s proposed $5,000 health care allowance is almost as pathetic as the $1-a-day my kids get (they get bonuses based on performance). This pathetic fix irked me when I saw and heard the health care plan spill from McCain’s own smirking lips.

    Believe me, as a veteran I like McCain and wanted to vote for him due to my bias toward the GOP. As a small-time investor, his capital loss proposal also attracted me.

    Yet his debate performance and my one friend’s begging prompted me to dig out both candidates’ proposed presidential actions – even the awful consideration of abortion (I liked Obama’s take on avoiding conception to begin with) – and came up with less cons on Obama’s side than McCain’s cons in a side-by-side pro/con analysis.

    Thanks for the opportunity to publicly repent.

    Still wish Joe the Plumber was a candidate, though.

    -Sam

  • http://samwrites2.wordpress.com Sam

    John,

    Actually the debate and peer group pressure did finally get me off the undecided-but-leaning toward McCain fence into what I hope are greener pastures at Obama’s farm.

    I could not believe McCain’s proposal to “improve” the health care system by axing Section 125 benefits (health care premiums taken out before taxes) and had not examined either candidate’s voting records or specific proposals carefully until the debate. McCain’s proposed $5,000 health care allowance is almost as pathetic as the $1-a-day my kids get (they get bonuses based on performance). This pathetic fix irked me when I saw and heard the health care plan spill from McCain’s own smirking lips.

    Believe me, as a veteran I like McCain and wanted to vote for him due to my bias toward the GOP. As a small-time investor, his capital loss proposal also attracted me.

    Yet his debate performance and my one friend’s begging prompted me to dig out both candidates’ proposed presidential actions – even the awful consideration of abortion (I liked Obama’s take on avoiding conception to begin with) – and came up with less cons on Obama’s side than McCain’s cons in a side-by-side pro/con analysis.

    Thanks for the opportunity to publicly repent.

    Still wish Joe the Plumber was a candidate, though.

    -Sam

  • http://www.johnshore.wordpress.com John Shore

    Wow. Interesting stuff. And with Sam, we DO have someone whose mind was decided via the debate. Thanks for sharing your thoughts with us on that, Sam.

    Totally valid points, Mike.

    Tavdy: Good thouhts on debate; you are wrong: this is NOT a post; and I am SO making that recipe. It just sounds so great. (And Greta: Luckily, CAT is British, and so knows a bit about all that measuring/English-food stuff. So we’ll work it out.)

    Lucilia: Too funny.

  • http://www.1truebeliever.wordpress.com wickle

    Yep. I made up my mind after the debate. I’d never heard of these two candidates until last night, and my eyes were opened … it was like scales falling from the apostles’ eyes. Truly, truly amazing. I feel like I learned a lot.

    Of course, since this is in writing, you can’t see that I couldn’t get through this with a straight face.

  • http://www.johnshore.wordpress.com John Shore

    There’s a wiseguy in every bunch….

    (Thank God. BUT THAT’S NO EXCUSE!)

  • http://www.johnshore.wordpress.com John Shore

    There’s a wiseguy in every bunch….

    (Thank God. BUT THAT’S NO EXCUSE!)

  • Jessica

    McCain scares me…a lot.

  • http://www.johnshore.wordpress.com John Shore

    Christine: I don't know, man. Do you think your statement might in any way just possibly maybe a little tiny bit in a way so slight it's hardly worth mentioning cynical?

    Free: I personally didn't so much get the impression you did. Obama smiled, to my mind, a LOT—it was very often his response to McCain's recitation of his alleged transgressions—and McCain was often angry, and his expression/grimace certainly revealed it. So, I don't know. I thought both candidates were maybe more expressive than you thought. But yeah, they always seem so … antisceptic (sp?). It WOULD be nice if they would just be more … humanish. But they have to remain so tight, of course. The risks of being truly spontaneous certainly aren't worth what they could cost. Look what happened when Hillary dared to get even slightly emotional. She was crucified for it.

  • http://www.johnshore.wordpress.com John Shore

    Christine: I don't know, man. Do you think your statement might in any way just possibly maybe a little tiny bit in a way so slight it's hardly worth mentioning cynical?

    Free: I personally didn't so much get the impression you did. Obama smiled, to my mind, a LOT—it was very often his response to McCain's recitation of his alleged transgressions—and McCain was often angry, and his expression/grimace certainly revealed it. So, I don't know. I thought both candidates were maybe more expressive than you thought. But yeah, they always seem so … antisceptic (sp?). It WOULD be nice if they would just be more … humanish. But they have to remain so tight, of course. The risks of being truly spontaneous certainly aren't worth what they could cost. Look what happened when Hillary dared to get even slightly emotional. She was crucified for it.

  • Lynn

    Perfectly said Candace. Wading through the dense fog of campaign politics can blur a person’s perspective on reality. Reality: our God is sovereign…He reigns and is in control of all things. He is the Creator of all life. May His will be done through our vote.

  • tavdy

    John – here are the rough quantities for the cake ingredients in imperial, which Cat will know better than metric. The reason I use metric is because the butter, almonds, cocoa and eggs are all sold in packs exactly those sizes in the UK – so there's no measuring and nothing left over.

    10.5 oz caster sugar

    9 oz butter

    7 oz ground almonds

    4.5 oz cocoa

    6 eggs

    1.5 teaspoons bicarbonate of soda

    Also (for clarity) crème fraiche is type of mild soured cream from France, with a consistency similar to whipped cream, fromage frais or Greek yoghurt. What Greta describes sounds like crème anglaise (i.e. custard) which is pretty ubiquitous here.

  • Lynn

    [Scripture verses to go with my previous comment:

    Colossians 1:16 (New International Version)

    16 For by him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things were created by him and for him.

    Revelation 4:11 (New International Version)

    11"You are worthy, our Lord and God,

    to receive glory and honor and power,

    for you created all things,

    and by your will they were created

    and have their being." ]

  • Lynn

    [Scripture verses to go with my previous comment:

    Colossians 1:16 (New International Version)

    16 For by him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things were created by him and for him.

    Revelation 4:11 (New International Version)

    11"You are worthy, our Lord and God,

    to receive glory and honor and power,

    for you created all things,

    and by your will they were created

    and have their being." ]

  • Strider33

    I had made up my mind, and the debate did not change my mind. I plan on voting for McCain. There are two or three issues on which I agree with his stand more than I agree with Obama’s. and I trust him more than I trust Obama.

    Having said that, this is not a contest between a good candidate and an evil candidate. Both have good points, and both have flaws. The United States will go through difficult and dangerous times in the next four years, regardless of whether the president is McCain or Obama or Biden or Palin. Neither one will live up to all the promises made. The desire to keep government small and the desire to have the government do what is right will always involve tradeoffs.

    Two other points:

    I disagree with Candace that the politicos chose McCain and Obama. The politicos have saddled us with the two party system, but the coice of candidates is very much a product of the primary system. In January of this year, both the politicos and the pundits would have dismissed McCain and Obama as not viable candidates. It was voters and caucus attenders that made the selection. Politicos gave us candidates like John Kennedy and Richard Nixon. Today, we pick them.

    Skill at debating is not necessarily a good indicator of a good president. There were plenty of good presidents who would probably have been lousy debaters. Dwight Eisenhower comes to mind. Debates can be useful, but they have to be blended in with lots of other sources of information, including websites, books, and campaign speeches.

  • Strider33

    I had made up my mind, and the debate did not change my mind. I plan on voting for McCain. There are two or three issues on which I agree with his stand more than I agree with Obama’s. and I trust him more than I trust Obama.

    Having said that, this is not a contest between a good candidate and an evil candidate. Both have good points, and both have flaws. The United States will go through difficult and dangerous times in the next four years, regardless of whether the president is McCain or Obama or Biden or Palin. Neither one will live up to all the promises made. The desire to keep government small and the desire to have the government do what is right will always involve tradeoffs.

    Two other points:

    I disagree with Candace that the politicos chose McCain and Obama. The politicos have saddled us with the two party system, but the coice of candidates is very much a product of the primary system. In January of this year, both the politicos and the pundits would have dismissed McCain and Obama as not viable candidates. It was voters and caucus attenders that made the selection. Politicos gave us candidates like John Kennedy and Richard Nixon. Today, we pick them.

    Skill at debating is not necessarily a good indicator of a good president. There were plenty of good presidents who would probably have been lousy debaters. Dwight Eisenhower comes to mind. Debates can be useful, but they have to be blended in with lots of other sources of information, including websites, books, and campaign speeches.

  • http://www.johnshore.wordpress.com John Shore

    Nice job, Strider. Very well said and thought through.

  • http://www.johnshore.wordpress.com John Shore

    Nice job, Strider. Very well said and thought through.

  • FreetoBe

    Yes, Joe the Plumber gets my vote…..although he indicated that he’s really only interested in his 15 minutes of fame, so…… back to the big boys. Seriously, besides McCain’s smirk, did anybody notice that neither candidate showed ANY facial expressions at all? No anger, no smile, no thoughtfulness…..as though they had each practiced NOT showing how they really felt about anything. I think we’ve had enough with Mr Reagan acting in the White House (and the gov’s mansion in CA before that), I want to see REAL concern, real thoughtfulness, real interest, real anger, real something.

    John–back to your break…..no cheating.

  • http://rightplaceandtime.blogspot.com/ Colleen

    Debate and cake recipes. My my my…what a combo. Kind of makes you want to jump out of a cake with a debate of sorts. In the immortal words of Jackie Gleason. "How sweet it is!"

    Meanwhile let's keep looking to the Lord to direct our country. There is a verse that says, "“Man looks at the outward appearance, but the Lord looks at the heart” (I Samuel 16:7).

    Let's pray we have a president after God's own heart. Amen?

  • http://rightplaceandtime.blogspot.com/ Colleen

    Debate and cake recipes. My my my…what a combo. Kind of makes you want to jump out of a cake with a debate of sorts. In the immortal words of Jackie Gleason. "How sweet it is!"

    Meanwhile let's keep looking to the Lord to direct our country. There is a verse that says, "“Man looks at the outward appearance, but the Lord looks at the heart” (I Samuel 16:7).

    Let's pray we have a president after God's own heart. Amen?

  • http://angelbearoh.wordpress.com angelbearoh

    Call me crazy, but I get this feeling that Joe the Plumber is headed for his own nationally syndicated daytime talk show. Which will last for all of one season.

  • Candace

    Hi, John —

    Assuming that, by “christine”, you actually meant “Candace” — Cynical? ME?? About politics?!?(Like I said: It’ll pass as we get past the election and into the holidays :-) )

    Oh, and to answer the original question (sorry!): I had already made up my mind. I do so based on stuff like actual voting records and observations of candidate behavior and positions before they were (admittedly) campaigning for president, and other substantive stuff that might actually tell me something useful. Only even watched any of the debates to see how much either one evaded, lied and kow-towed (yup, more cynicism), and so I could discuss them in an informed way with my friends.

  • http://www.johnshore.wordpress.com John Shore

    Yes, I’m sorry; I meant Candace.

    Man, you ARE cynical. Well. That’s natural enough. Still. I do believe that sometimes good people motivated by good desires become public servants because they really do want to do good things. I don’t find Obama, for instance, in any way I can see or have learned about, in any way motivated by anything I would have any trouble with at all. He seems like one of the good guys.

  • http://www.johnshore.wordpress.com John Shore

    Yes, I’m sorry; I meant Candace.

    Man, you ARE cynical. Well. That’s natural enough. Still. I do believe that sometimes good people motivated by good desires become public servants because they really do want to do good things. I don’t find Obama, for instance, in any way I can see or have learned about, in any way motivated by anything I would have any trouble with at all. He seems like one of the good guys.

  • Candace

    Yes, but I'm cynical with peace in my heart and a warm smile on my face, honest. Though I know those things don't come across well in writing.

    I hope you're right about Obama (in general, and especially if he's elected).

  • Candace

    Yes, but I'm cynical with peace in my heart and a warm smile on my face, honest. Though I know those things don't come across well in writing.

    I hope you're right about Obama (in general, and especially if he's elected).

  • http://skerrib.blogspot.com skerrib

    I managed to miss all the debates. Not on purpose; it just happened. I went online & watched both of the candidates’ speeches at the Alfred E Smith memorial dinner though. Way better than talking policies & promises and such.

    My own soapbox for a moment–I think the president is in a unique position of knowing a lot of things the rest of us don’t know. Things we don’t want to know. And I think some are things that, if we knew them, we’d go “Oh, THAT’S why they made that decision that seemed perfectly ridiculous at the time.” Not that I think they only make good decisions–I’m just saying if we knew what they know our views might change a bit.

    So I think that with any candidate and all their lofty promises, when they do get into office and start getting a more complete view of what they’re dealing with, they realize that they can’t possibly come thru on all their promises to the letter because their more complete perspective changes the options for them.

    So that leaves me over with the folks who aren’t too terribly worried either way. I’m voting for McCain because my views on the issues tend to match his more closely. That’s all; no big whoop.

    Nice break John! Good of you to inform your readers. I just sort of left for 2 weeks without saying anything…but then again I was actually visiting much of my readership (all 6 of them), so it wasn’t as necessary. See you on the flip side…

  • http://skerrib.blogspot.com skerrib

    I managed to miss all the debates. Not on purpose; it just happened. I went online & watched both of the candidates’ speeches at the Alfred E Smith memorial dinner though. Way better than talking policies & promises and such.

    My own soapbox for a moment–I think the president is in a unique position of knowing a lot of things the rest of us don’t know. Things we don’t want to know. And I think some are things that, if we knew them, we’d go “Oh, THAT’S why they made that decision that seemed perfectly ridiculous at the time.” Not that I think they only make good decisions–I’m just saying if we knew what they know our views might change a bit.

    So I think that with any candidate and all their lofty promises, when they do get into office and start getting a more complete view of what they’re dealing with, they realize that they can’t possibly come thru on all their promises to the letter because their more complete perspective changes the options for them.

    So that leaves me over with the folks who aren’t too terribly worried either way. I’m voting for McCain because my views on the issues tend to match his more closely. That’s all; no big whoop.

    Nice break John! Good of you to inform your readers. I just sort of left for 2 weeks without saying anything…but then again I was actually visiting much of my readership (all 6 of them), so it wasn’t as necessary. See you on the flip side…

  • Paul

    Did not change my mind, but I thought it was interesting to note on the "fact checker" channel (maybe NBC) they asked their panel of undecided voters who they thought won the debate, all six said Obama. But then later, they asked who these previously "undecided" folk were planning to vote for, only 1 said Obama, 3 said McCain and 2 were still undecided. It made me laugh the next day when the other channels were touting the 74% who thought Obama won the debate – seemed like a good place to stop asking (or at least reporting) considering the 100% on NBC and what they really felt.

    I do feel that the Colin Powell endorsement is the coup d' grace to the McCain campaign

  • http://www.johnshore.wordpress.com John Shore

    Yeah, I'm surprised how true that is. I love Powell; I just didn't know he (still) held so much sway with popular opinion. His endorsement of Obama does seem to be being understood as the death knell of McCain's hopes.

  • http://www.johnshore.wordpress.com John Shore

    Yeah, I'm surprised how true that is. I love Powell; I just didn't know he (still) held so much sway with popular opinion. His endorsement of Obama does seem to be being understood as the death knell of McCain's hopes.


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