We are Everywhere!

Diane of the Te Deum Laudamus blog sends this along to me and the other unindicted co-conspirators named below:

Gentlemen!

This was sent to me, unsolicited, and glancing at it I noticed that each of your names are mentioned. See full context here.

But across the “Pond” in the United States there is a different view of Medjugorje and the gate keepers of Catholic opinion seem to work almost in a conspiratorial manner to quell any interest or trust in Mejdugorje. The who’s who of Catholic opinion makers, journalist and bloggers are eerily similar in their skepticism and condemnation. Two things the opinion makers have in common – 1. They have never been to Medjugorje and 2. They are all men.

Patrick Madrid, Patrick Coffin, Mark Shea, Greg Kandra, Pat &Matthew Archbold, Jim Akin, Kevin Knight at New Advent, and the editors of Catholic Culture and the National Catholic Register.

I speak with some authority on this issue. Perhaps no other reporter of Catholic news in the United States has personally reached out individually via e-mail or phone calls to prominent opinion makers who write about Medjugorje than Ministryvalues.com

God bless
Diane

This goes out to all my peeps and homies in The Conspiracy!

Who knew that “having similar opinions and occasionally remarking on them” now rates as a Conspiracy?

Want to have a “Phantom Menace Sucked” conspiracy? Who’s with me?

Further commentary from the Secret Anti-Medjugorje Brotherhood of the Hermetic Golden Order is available here, here, here, here, here, and here.

Please note that only boys are allowed to read and comment, because girls are icky and gross and who cares what they think anyway (stupid girls!). Also, pay no attention to Diane’s numerous writings critical of Medjugorje. Ministry Values, which speaks with some authority on the matter, says that all critics of Medj are male. And, by their same mystic arts, MV knows all about the travels of the various people who are critical of Medj.

If you are a male and you wish to join the Conspiracy (or complain about The Phantom Menace), just say something critical about them in the comboxes. Women: Be Silent! This is man’s work!

UPDATE: It just gets better and better. Spirit Daily now has a link to the Ministry Values piece titled “Sexism and Medjugorje”. Delightful! Yes. “Diane” is a sexist. As are all people skeptical of Medjugorje. Everything is explained!

UPPERDATE: Diane now has her take on things. That is, if you care what a *girl* thinks.

  • victor

    I believe Chesterton said it best:

    “The true intent the prophets mean is:
    To get revelation, remove your penis.”

    • Mark Shea

      Um, I highly doubt Chesterton said that.

      • victor

        Sure he did! It was in, uhhh, “The Man Who Ate So Very Much”. Or something.

        • http://www.theleenmachine.blogspot.com KML

          I laughed so hard at this it’s embarrassing.

    • Noah D

      Wasn’t that Origen?

      • victor

        HA! I actually LOL’d at that one! :)

  • Ben

    I too….thought The Phantom Menace sucked.

    • Rosemarie

      +J.M.J+

      Yeah but it had nothing to do with any conspiracy. It was just a matter of too much Jar Jar, not enough Darth Maul.

  • http://www.communionantiphons.org Andy, Bad Person

    Best comment from the MV page:

    These are the same “professional” Catholics that were quick to pounce on Fr. Corapi and Fr. Pavone.

    My response:

    Um, and they were right.

  • Lauran

    “Who knew that “having similar opinions and occasionally remarking on them” now rates as a Conspiracy?”

    And why not, if you follow the logic: Voicing your opinions (to or near liberals) makes you “judgmental” and disagreeing with them makes you “racist.”

    • http://confederatepapist.blogspot.com/ Confederate Papist

      Sorry…you’re not a boy!

      ;-)

    • Noah D

      It’s like that old saw, ‘What’s the definition of the word ‘fascist’? A person winning an argument with a liberal.’

      Wait…do I have cooties now, or something?

  • David N

    Well, as a newbie (TST2012), I took a lot of interest in the apparitions during my RCIA. Fatima touched me especially strongly, and I have a statue to Our Lady at home. I intend to make my Total Consecration on Her Feast next month. I also have a love for our Lady of Walsingham, Lourdes and Pompei. But Medjugorje struck me as a little odd – and that was from only reading ‘pro’ Medj writers. I didn’t bother reading ‘anti’ writers. For me, a few things just didn’t “add up” to make Medj “worthy of belief” for me”.

    Oh, and I’m European.

    • Noah D

      Welcome, brother!

  • Tom

    I seen to remember someone actually going to Medjugorje when it was popular and taking a lot of hits for exposing it as an evil fraud.
    http://www.culturewars.com/1998/Hahn.htm

  • http://confederatepapist.blogspot.com/ Confederate Papist

    PM sucked.

    Moon landing was staged.

    Blue spaghetti is my favourite.

  • Paolo

    I strongly believe in the messages sent by the Queen of Peace, and practice fasting and prayer, not to mention all others catholic issues, and I’m European. I strong believe that Our Lady is helping the Catholic Church to get ready at the triumph of the Immaculate Heart of Mary. But if the Holy Father will say otherwise, I’ ll submit, wholeheartedly. Alleluia!

    • http://confederatepapist.blogspot.com/ Confederate Papist

      Where do you live Paolo?

  • ds

    Now that the conspiracy is exposed, he openly ridicules the idea that he could be a conspirator. What more evidence do you need that there is a conspiracy!?

    • Mark Shea

      Now I will have to kill you.

  • polycarped

    Thanks for this article, Mark – it’s taken me a while to get my act together to write this comment because I’ve been crying with laughter reading it (especially the full twaddle by MV), watching the great Simpsons vid and reading these great comments. It really made my day. Are we sure Diane is not actually a man?! I mean I think they really are onto something here…(not). Sheesh…

    Keep up the good work gentlemen (including ‘Diane’ ;) ) and God Bless.

    Mary, Queen of Peace and Mother of the Church, pray for us!

    • http://te-deum.blogspot.com Diane K

      Born a girl; always a girl cuz God made me like this!

  • Dan C

    The Phantom Menace as well as the next two movies sucked!

    I am with you!

    (I am not too pleased with Return of the Jedi, either.)

    I thought the Star Trek reboot may have been the best movie ever.

    But…Medugorje…something I once considered true (in 1987) has gone on too long to be real. It’s core message in the 1980′s sounded like Fatima, etc. But I think that this “event” has persisted too long to have been a Marian apparition.

    But I am a dude from America who disliked all Star Wars movies after The Empire Strikes Back.

  • kath

    You mean I can’t be a member of the cabal just because I’m a chick? But I’ve always wanted to be in a cabal!

    • Mark Shea

      That’s what “The View” is for. Sheesh!

      • Beccolina

        Oh, that’s low. surely women can come up with a better cabal than THAT!

        • Mark Shea

          Don’t you worry your pretty little head about it. We Men will do the heavy lifting in the Evil Cabal department.

  • EastSideHunky

    Um…what has gender got to do with it? These Medjugorje frauds have been exposed and denounced by their bishop on numerous occassions. So Diane has episcopal authority over Bshp Panic or whomever is now in charge? It is a cluster of disobedient Croatian Franciscans who got everyone all whooped up on this. Any discerning Catholic would know from reading all the APPROVED visions of Mary that Our Lady is a woman of few, few words, not an ongoing talkative lady who goes on for days and weeks over trivial stuff rather than the message of repentance and salvation for wayward souls.

    And I have been to the Balkans and have much family there. So I guess there is an ethnic superiority if that’s the game Diane is playing.

    • Mark Shea

      Diane is not the author. Ministry Values is. She’s just passing the note on.

    • Ted Seeber

      Actually, I did some research into this. The three biggest complaints I’ve heard about Medjagore are:
      1. Their Bishops have denounced them as frauds
      2. They preach that all religions are equal, which is against Church teaching
      3. They’re not allowed to preach at home

      To these I answer:
      1. The Bishops didn’t say “there’s nothing supernatural going on here” they said “there’s no evidence of something supernatural going on here”. The second is what I’d expect given the supposed “visitations”- unlike the miracles at Fatima and Lourdes, there ain’t nothing going on in Yugoslavia other than inside people’s own brains. That doesn’t mean the visitations aren’t miraculous, just that they aren’t MATERIAL.
      2. The actual problematic vision in question didn’t say that all religions were equal, they said all *believers* were equal- that is, no absolute assurance of salvation, no absolute assurance of damnation either. Which is exactly what the Catechism teaches.
      3. No prophet is welcome in his home town- Galilee turned away Christ. Given that, I still find it sad that people will flock to see these visionaries, but weekly or daily mass, where even bigger miracles happen NOT on Standard Apparition Time, are ignored.

      • http://www.rosariesforlife.com Dave

        I don’t think they even said “no evidence of anything supernatural, exactly” but a better translation of “Non constat de supernaturalitate.” would be “the supernatural has not been established”

  • http://www.youtube.com/mariomusicmadness Nick

    Diane isn’t a man, though. And she has the best blog on Medjugorje.

    Oh yeah, and for readers wondering what private revelation is: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Private_revelation

  • http://te-deum.blogspot.com Diane K

    That post at Ministry Values was not inclusive I tell you! Not inclusive at all. I feel very neglected after all the times Mr. Ryan objected to my postings on Medjugorje and combox discussions.

    • Mark Shea

      SILENCE, WOMAN!

      • http://te-deum.blogspot.com Diane K

        :P

        Just for that, I’m going to link to my old post (the one I didn’t make since I am a woman and we can’t have an objectively critical view of Medjugorje).

        What Mushrooms Teach about Medjugorje. Here is part of what I wrote back then and tell me that we don’t see it in the writing of Mr. Ryan:

        The discussions which dominate the web are of a more experiential nature: “I went to Medjugorje, had a conversion of heart and a great experience, therefore, it is authentic”. Imagine if people judged the safety of eating wild mushrooms based on subjective taste alone, rather than on the wisdom of the learned who can tell the difference between good tasting poisonous mushrooms, and good tasting mushrooms that are safe to eat. The taste has no bearing on whether the mushroom is safe to eat. Further, one cannot make the poisonous mushroom non-poisonous, simply by an act of the will because it tastes good. It must be given over to experts to properly test.

        I suspect Cardinal Ruini and the members of his international commission will not be judging the mushrooms based on taste, but based mainly on objective facts to protect those who desire to continue feeding on them. We have to trust the good, wise, and learned cardinal to put them to the test. Some mushrooms are downright deadly, while others can produce odd behaviors and undesireable side effects.

        Full post here: http://te-deum.blogspot.com/2010/02/medjugorje-what-mushrooms-teach-about.html

  • EastSideHunky

    *I meant Bishop Zanic

  • http://www.chesterton.org Sean P. Dailey

    Oyez! Oyez! Is the Secret Anti-Medjugorje Brotherhood of the Hermetic Golden Order an affiliate of Calvin & Hobbes’ GROSS (Get Rid Of Slimy girlS)?

    Also, Mark, in the forthcoming issue of Gilbert Magazine, Richard Aleman (a man) reviews that notorious anti-Medjugorje book, Medjugorje Revisited: 30 Years of Visions or Religious Fraud, by Donal Foley (also a man). Gilbert Mag is edited by me — a man — and published by Dale Ahlquist, also a man.

    Coincidence? I THINK NOT!

  • Kathleen

    There is definitely a need for insignificant women in the pew to unite (perhaps, Insignificant Women Without a Leadership Council). I know many women who back the Bishops in the Dioceses that actually have the say in whether it is legitimate. They say NO, I believe them, and direct people to their statements to the fact of their position.

  • Margaret

    If there’s a conspiracy, then there have to albino assassin monks involved somewhere… LOOK OUT BEHIND YOU!!!

    • Noah D

      Oh, come on, you’re just a woman, what could you know about albino assassin mo

  • Debra

    You mean I’m not the only person in the known Catholic universe that doubts Medjugorje? How about Ann the Lay Apostle?

  • Deacon Greg Kandra

    Oh great. Now they’re on to us. Does this mean we have to change the secret handshake? But I don’t care what anybody says. I’m keeping my decoder ring and Dan Brown lunchbox.

  • Tom Ryan

    Jones was way ahead of you “guys”

    http://culturewars.com/medj.htm

    • Mark Shea

      I wasn’t aware this was a competition. This is now the second time you’ve made this point. Desperate for your boy to get some press? Would you like to link my readers to the anti-semitic ravings of Jones and Sungenis? Or would you just like me to stick to this and whitewash his obsession with Jews?

      • Noah D

        Er…if we’re in a conspiracy, don’t we have to pay royalties or licensing fees to the International Jewish Conspiracy, or something? Is this a franchise?

  • Tom Ryan

    Oh sure. Why don’t you tell all of your reader what awful anti-Semites they are!
    Throw in Voris while you’re at it. For your convenience, here they are talking to each other.
    http://www.realcatholictv.com/share/watch.php?vidID=roma-2012-02-05

    Or would you rather slander them by saying that they are obsessed with “the cranial capacities of negro skulls”?

    • Mark Shea

      No need. Jones’ and Sungenis’ anti-semitic screeds to the job all by themselves.

      annnnnd you’re done here. Bye!

  • http://www.chesterton.org Sean P. Dailey

    Neither Chesterton not Tolkien nor Belloc ever published anti-Medjegorje writings. But that’s only because of the inconvenient fact that they were dead. Can they still be part of the conspiracy?

    • Debra

      Well, they are the right gender, unlike myself.

  • Ted Seeber

    It just occurred to me that Fatima is as “woman led” as Medjegorje…..

  • http://gplus.to/viragovincit Joseph Anthony

    As a bona fide Catholic male from America, I feel qualified to say that Medjugorje makes me intellectually bewildered and icky-feeling. So how do I join the secret, exclusive club???? P.S., sorry ladies.

  • Veronica

    Phantom Menace sucked. Not that my opinion counts, since I’m a member of the XX chromosome clan…

    • Mark Shea

      Also, your midichlorian count is abysmal.

      • Chris M

        I wonder what the midichlorian count is at Medjegorje..

  • Fr. Dwight Longenecker

    I can’t believe it. I watched The Phantom Menace last night and thought it was probably about the worst film ever. Can I join your club?

  • Dan C

    But the Empire Strikes Back has one of the greatest, unexpected plot twists and unexpected lines in all of movie history! Until that time at least. “No, I am your father.”

    George Lucas gets cred for that. As well as the whole first Star Wars movie. I was 11 and watched it like 11 times that summer in 25 cent matinees wherever I could find it.

  • Dan C

    Its the PMS club. Unusually, it seems male-dominated.

  • Linus

    Some great ” B ” movies on archive.org. I will watch one of those before I plop down $$$$$$ to zip off to Medjegorje. If our Lady wants to tell me something, she can afford to come here – and then I would probably wonder if Satan was playing a trick of some kind. I do believe she appeared at Fatima and Lourdes and Mexico and a few other places. But if she ever appeared at Medjegorje, someone ( the Franciscans ?) have turned it into a freek show.

  • Howard

    Well, not all of us have time to worry about Medjegorje. My committee has been busy propping up the BCS in college football and maintaining the designated hitter in the American League (but not the National League).

    • Tominellay

      …nice work, Howard…

  • Richard C.

    Hey, Mark; maybe Steve is trying to line up feminist support for Medjugorje, so that when the Vatican condemns it, LCWR can endorse it. If the visionaries start adding labyrinth gardens next to their hotels, you’ll know it’s a trend.

    • Mark Shea

      The more I think about the “sexism” charge, the more hilariously incoherent it gets. There is just no There there at all. And yet the paranoid conspiracy people in his comboxes treat it as a Revelation, an all explaining theory of everything that puts the puzzle pieces together with geometric logic. Hilarious!

  • http://www.ministryvalues.com steve ryan

    mark,

    the “paranoid conspiracy people” do think there is a bias in reporting on Medjugorje.. I have done the following ..I have called or e-mailed National Catholic Register and Reporter seeking editorial policies on Medjugorje. I don;t have the exact word but suffice it to say it a policy of “blackout” See for your self. You have some stature ..call them .. see if the editors are willing to comment on this issues.
    Perhaps ask them why they did not right an articcle about Cardinal Schonborn inviting “seers” into his Cathedral. Perhaps they will say “we dont; report on unapproved apparitions” but this misses the point altogether – and leads to my great frustration. Medjugorje is not just about Marian apparitions it is about hundreds of priests saying Medjugorje led them to their vocation. It is about millions of people finding spiritual renewal there. It is about Catholic returning to the confessional booth. It is about the unsolved mystery..It is about medjugorje being the third most popular Catholic “shrine” in the world.

    • Mark Shea

      I’m sorry. Aren’t you the guy who wantonly leveled a charge of sexism at a bunch of strangers and who has not yet had the common decency to retract that sin against the 8th commandment? When you do that–publicly–on you site, then I will engage you on the rest of your ridiculous paranoid conspiracy theorizing.

      Repent.

      And, by the way, let’s be clear. If your next entry here is not a link to your retraction, but an attempt to suck more oxygen out of the room with self-justifications, you are done here. I don’t have time for crazy.

    • Ted Seeber

      It is, apparently, about a bunch of people wanting a private revelation to be more important than Canon Law allows private revelations to be.

  • Dismas

    Is it pilgrimage season to medj. already? I can hear the cha-ching of the cash registers at the travel agents and airlines from here. Maybe Stephen Ryan should offer the LCWR leadership a free package tour as a good will effort to have them convert back to the Church? That would be fruit I could believe in!

  • http://www.ministryvalues.com steve ryan

    Mark,

    I am willing to do something..

    Steve: I have deleted the rest of your self-justifying rant. When you write your retraction and apology for your lies about a sexist conspiracy and publish it, send me the URL and I will link you. Then we can talk. Till then, no more excuses. Repent. – Mark

  • http://www.ministryvalues.com steve ryan

    Apology made on CMR and I have changed the headline and body of my article removing the word “sexism”

    My sincere apologies to those it offended (probably means everybody here)

    steve ryan

  • Ryan J Hilliard

    Hmmm…me thinks they are preparing people for a negative response from Rome this year. Great! More disobedience in the air.

  • Mouse

    I thought I read that Patrick Madrid had actually once been to Medjugorje. But I might be remembering wrong.

    The Church is reviewing the matter at present, as we all know. I think silence is preferable until the Church rules – what is disturbing is to find some websites where people are already concocting arguments to support their clear intent to disobey the Magisterium should the Church rule against Medjugorje being a true apparition. That is NEVER right.

  • http://www.canonlaw.info Ed Peters

    You’re a riot, Mark.

  • Richard C.

    Medj supporters should not engage in any wishful thinking about the opponents having to accept a favorable ruling.

    There is never a duty to believe in a private revelation, even if it is approved.

    In short, this is because post-apostolic events cannot be added to the deposit of revelation which is binding on all the faithful.

    The Church’s approval of a private revelation is only a permission to believe, and it is only backed by the strength of the human testimony for the event. It is not backed by apostolic authority. Even now you are free to disbelieve in Lourdes or Fatima if the human testimony does not convince you.

    So, Medjugorje fans, you can certainly gloat if you get a favorable ruling, but don’t expect that anyone will have a duty to change his opinion.

  • Linus

    Those flocking to Medjegorje are placing themselves in spiritual danger. Here’s why: http://www.catholicnews.com/data/stories/cns/0804522.htm. Two priests connected with the founding or publication of the ” appearances ” have been severely disciplined and important Vatican offices have stated that there is no evidence for the phenomena reported. The local bishop has refused to allow local clergy to have anything to do with these ” events.” Finally, ask yourself, do you really think the Blessed Virgin has appeared there 40,000 times!!! If you do, you are absolutely the most gullible people on the face of the earth. The whole thing is nothing but a money making farce, it makes Catholics look like idiots. By taking part you are encouraging the flim flam and possibly endangering your soul by allowing yourself to be taken in.

  • Margaret O

    I agree with you Linus! As if Our Lady would be instrumental in causing all this controversy and disobedience over so many years. We have been dished up with the ignorant, standard response from the adherents, that so much good has come from Medjugorje. What amuses me is the fact that the seers have the power to call Our Lady wherever they go!

  • Michael

    1) So apparently I can’t judge Medj because I haven’t been there. I guess I can’t judge Islam either, because I haven’t been to Mecca or Medina.

    2) I went to there, just to check it out, and I still don’t believe it. Maybe its because I’m a man…yep! that’s definitely the reason. That’s not sexist at all, its just a fact. Its like blaming my first automobile accident on person in the other car…WHO WAS A WOMAN. You see what I did there?! Yep! that’s not sexist either, its just science folks. ;)

  • EJCM

    Thanks to reading your post just prior to our family Rosary last night I almost said “I believe in the Holy Simpsons”. Fortunately I caught myself just in time to lower my voice to a nearly inaudible level and mumbled through it.

  • Paula

    Just discovered Mark’s blog a few days ago and have read a number of articles out loud to my family as we all laughed out loud. Why did it take me so long to find this blog? Well, I am a girl. Now for the big confessions- I too hate Phantom Menace and all the rehashes since the Empire Strikes Back, all of which are truly painful. Also, I once won a theology essay contest at Loyola University comparing the teachings of Saint Theresa of Avila with the Hindu meditation practices of Paramahansa Yogananda.Naysayers think I got the prize because they announced the winner as “Paul A. Kennedy” rather than my real name , Paula Kennedy. But I was the first girl to win at Loyola so they say.
    Now for the worst confession, no matter how much I love your blog and how much I would love to join the esoteric conspiracy under my alias Paul A.; I do think that the Blessed Mother is appearing at Medjugorje and all the other places the seers “drag” her too. I also think she appeared above the Coptic Church in Egypt, and even Rwanda where Mary revealed the coming holocaust that seemed completely impossible- well, at the time of the appearances anyway. Mary appeared to girls among both the Tutsi and Hutu tribes calling them all to forgiveness and peace before hell on earth erupted yet again. My view is that mankind is in such a state that God is sending her to us because we need it. Meanwhile, thanks for all the great articles and comments…Paula


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