Getcher Blessed Voigin Mary! Now Appearing for a Limited Time!

Who could possibly be dubious about a banner ad like that?  The long-running hit show, now in its 31st Church-defying year!

It seems one of the Medjugorje frauds was making a limited time offer visit to Alabama and so the Blessed Virgin was booked to appear while she was there. Of course, there’s some question as to whether the place she was slated to be the opening act for the “visionary” is legit or not, with at least one fraud patronizing the venue with her boffo act while other devotees of the fraud call it a cult.

But they pay well and the show must go on! Plus, the leader of Caritas will whip that uppity woman of your’n into shape with his approved Billy Bob Bible Banger methods.

Sad to say, the show closed four days ago. No word on whether the Blessed Virgin will touring with Rick Astley.

  • http://stevenadunn.wordpress.com Steven Dunn

    Funny how common sense and adherence to the catechism easily keep one away from cultists and frauds. You’d almost think the Church was looking out for its members or something. But that’s impossible, since the institutional Church refuses to accept the Medjugorjean visions. How confusing. /sarc

  • Jared

    Darn, I missed it! Guess I’ll have to settle for the Mass or something…..

  • Carbon Monoxide

    It is strange how people will fly half way around the world to see someone who (supposedly) sees the virgin Mary when they can touch God everyday at their local parish.

  • http://te-deum.blogspot.com Diane K

    Marco Corvaglia has an extensive write-up on the Caritas of Birmingham, and Marija’s visits. He’s actually got two posts. Get part 2 at the bottom of this post.

    http://www.marcocorvaglia.com/medjugorje-en/the-american-apparition-and-the-judicial-chronicles.html

  • Johnb

    I live in Birmingham and my wife and I were laughing because she allegedly appeared after 10 pm on the fourth of July. My reasoning for the late apparitions was because Mary didn’t want to dodge fireworks on the way down :)

    I’m disappointed in the local media, they did a poor job of covering it – they shouldn’t cover it at all – and have not warned people of what a fraud this is. I’m hoping the local Bishop will soon be more vocal about it. I know he is against it.

    • Jared

      Good for Bishop Baker. I hope he does speak out against it

      • Tominellay

        Caritas of Birmingham and the Catholic Diocese of Birmingham have no connection…The bishop doesn’t allow Masses to be said at Caritas, but otherwise can’t control what happens on somebody else’s property…

        It’s similar to Medjugorje, where the “visions” are not allowed in the church, but where no one can stop folks from following Ivan or Vicka or Mirjana wherever else they might go pretending to see Mary…

  • thomas tucker

    It’s like she can go…..anywhere!

  • Brian Q

    I have attended two of Ivan’s travelling vision shows. The first time it was one of my early exposures to the Medjugorje – for lack of a better work- phenomenon. I admit it seemed a very peaceful and spiritual event during the actual rosary and alleged visitation. And although Ivan was being fawned over by many he seemed a very quiet and humble sort when I briefly met him in the limited attendance gathering afterwards. The second time he came to the same church it seemed a very different experience. As he arrived word spread that Mary had already appeared to him that day – in the car on the way to the church- but had told him she would come again for the advertised apparition in the church. A special guest appearance I guess. I didn’t not have any interaction that time with Ivan that time although he did not seem to be enthused to be there as I recall but the whole thing seemed much more of a circus sideshow atmosphere. My doubts about the whole thing were deepened after that event….the alleged gold rosarys etc, I have a tough time buying it. I don’t tend to believe God or his mother lower themselves to doing guest appearances on demand or doing parlor tricks..

  • http://findmeinfloridaagain.blogspot.com Jeanne in Tampa

    Why do you do this? You don’t agree?

    Ask yourself if you really hear the Holy Spirit?

    I knew and know this question will tick you off. So what if she hears Our Lady? She didn’t hurt you or bother you. You should ask to hear God. You could if you asked God inside. If God showed up for some of you, it would stay on the “I must pray every word from a prayer book” AND
    “I must do it like a magic thing to say.” I seriously wonder about why many of you all get embarrassed when people are free to hear God and worship outside your comfort zone.

    Well, yes we have Jesus in the Eucharist, but do you let God talk to you when you receive Him or is it all mechanical in a prayerbook? Is it all about external practice and nothing about the Holy Spirit taking over. And it is all about worry and control and not having peace because of it.

    It is about surrender to God HIS WAY. It is not about our way.

    • Chris

      The problem with “listening” to “God’s” voice, is that you and I are not necessarily equipped to discern “God’s” voice from, say, Satan’s voice. So far as not using books and rote prayers, fine. We have a rich history of contemplatives who communed with God in silence. But even the greatest contemplative, St. John of the Cross, explicitly warned AGAINST seeking locutions and visions and “words of knowledge”, because the demons will be HAPPY to oblige.

      • http://findmeinfloridaagain.blogspot.com Jeanne in Tampa

        Ok…. O Holy Spirit fall on us with all the TRiune love and help us know that we are good enough to hear the heart of the Triune God and know love instantly.

        Then stop for 5 minutes. Shut up inside. What do you admit to hearing? Otherwise, if you don’t hear and know God loves . you YOU GIVE IT UP

        Otherwise come to common sense Catholic Florida and we will teach stubborn obstinate YOU IN PERSON. O wait , the Gospel was about you all today July 8th. Got that? And you say we here are all wrong so you can be right.

        Quote all you want but if you don’t know —- shut up and listen. Just close your eyes and listen and ask God to let you know He loves you. Then read James. You have not b/c you ask not.

        What gets me the most in the last few years is all the people who shoot their mouths off and quote this and that, yet don’t know God loves them and have never heard the still small loving voice of God in their hearts. You will more than likely ignore this and quote more stuff.

        The demons don’t want you to know God loves you. They will oblige that and so will ppl in Va. who say that word over and over. Oblige is one word used in the Waltons. Do you live there? The devil hates you and does not want you to know that God loves you. Got that? So what a hurt to ask God to say something? It is how we listen. But given the population here, some would shoot Jesus down if he showed up and told them He loved them.

        • Klaus

          You sound like a Mormon missionary. “Listen to your heart” does not trump decisions reached by lawful authority in the Church – or, for that matter, the proper use of human reason.

          Medjugorje is a fraud, and a vulgar one at that.

        • Ted Seeber

          Sounds a lot like the CCD classes I got in the 1970s in a very Charismatic parish- forget all those smells and bells, all you need to know is that Jesus Loves You. I think this is just an extension of this phenomena lampooned by a rock star a long time ago:
          http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lLNZjQ28tPE

          A certain amount of what’s going on is this kind of Christianity infecting Catholicism.

      • http://creativefidelity.wordpress.com Dan F.

        Jeanne in Tampa is getting it all wrong but what Chris writes is not exactly true either. Perhaps you would both be interested in: http://creativefidelity.wordpress.com/category/listening-to-god/

      • sammy

        It’s funny but medjugorje comes to mind

    • http://te-deum.blogspot.com Diane K

      From the Dark Night of the Soul by St. John of the Cross:

      “…the devil causes many to believe in vain visionsand false prophecies; and strives to make them presumethat God and the saints are speaking with them; and they often trust their own fancy. And the devil is also accustomed, in this state, to fill them with presumption and pride, so that they become attracted by vanity and arrogance, and allow themselves to be seen engaging in outward acts which appear holy, such as raptures and other manifestations. Thus they become bold with God, and lose holy fear, which is the key and the custodian of all the virtues; and in some of these souls so many are the falsehoods and deceits which tend to multiply, and so inveterate do they grow, that it is very doubtful if such souls will return to the pure road of virtue and true spirituality.”

  • Chris

    I hear StubHub got stuck with a boatload of tickets when people figured out it wasn’t Alabama appearing.

  • richard

    I’ve read that one receives special graces when visiting the apparition sites.

  • Elaine S.

    “The leader of Caritas will whip that uppity woman of your’n into shape”

    I must say I had no idea, before reading that link, that adding male as well as female names to the hurricane naming list was part of a Satanic plot to undermine the family(!). Some of that guy’s ideas have what C.S. Lewis called “the sure mark of evil” about them: they would be hilariously funny if they weren’t so harmful.

  • carol

    Chris you are so funny! I’m anxious to see what happens when the Vatican finally declares the visions at Medjugorje as not supernatural. Hoping all the Medjheads will stay on the ship and not go into schism. But maybe God is separating the sheep from the goats in more ways than one!

  • kevin

    Everyone Mej fanatic I’ve spoken to doesn’t want to hear a word about Fatima or Lourdes. It’s spooky. That tells me something is wrong with it right there.

    • Ted Seeber

      I’ve got one in my council, who DOES often refer to Fatima, Lourdes and other miracles. I hate to say it, but since he credits such Marian Apparitions with bringing him back to the church, it makes me wonder about his faith. He also tends a bit towards fiscal libertinism.

      • http://www.rosariesforlife.com Dave

        Is there something wrong with being initially convinced by miracles?! If so, I guess we’ll have to view St. Paul with suspicion, among others!

        • Ted Seeber

          Initially convinced, no. Having your entire faith for many years be ONLY about miracles and NOT about how you treat other people, yes.

          • susie

            Amen. I was excoritated and told I was worse than Stalin, just because I voiced my skepticism about Medjugorje. Not very “Marian” way to treat another sister in Christ. I think it’s dangerous and totally outrageous at how much money they’re raking in globe trotting and ‘advertsing’ visions! What bunk!

  • http://findmeinfloridaagain.blogspot.com Jeanne in Tampa

    I have been there. Here’s my take on it . I went to Mass there in 88. I prayed. Whether it was real or not didn’t deter MY PRAYER, MY CONFESSION AND MY HOLY STUFF.

    I got out of the country and learned something in a place that something COULD OR NOT BE HAPPENING.

    Klaus: I am not going to sit there and worry about whether or not you recited something correctly or saw my relationship with God was DONE CORRECTLY. I am done with people like that.

    Christianity is about our relationship with God. It is NOT JUST ABOUT EXTERNAL DONE CORRECTLY PRACTICE OF EXTERNAL FAITH. Got that? It is also not about whatever you all “I know more than you and can recite the Catechism verbatum or homeschool to the correct letter so that God loves me more and won’t beat me so I will stand up straight and narrow.”

    Sorry But Father God does not have a Virginia woodshed where He abuses his children.

  • http://findmeinfloridaagain.blogspot.com Jeanne in Tampa

    My point: whether it is or isn’t should not impact your relationship with God and your own practice of the faith. Gossiping about it all is worse.

    • ivan_the_mad

      That’s nice. The local ordinary, who has the authority, says there isn’t anything supernatural happening. That’s really the end of it right there. How many times must this be repeated? Repetita iuvant, I suppose.

      • http://www.rosariesforlife.com Dave

        Except he doesn’t have the authority to judge. That authority belonged to the bishops of Yugoslavia, and now belongs to the Vatican. The local bishop is entitled to his opinion, of course.

        • ivan_the_mad

          Except that he does. See Normae Congregationis, http://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/congregations/cfaith/documents/rc_con_cfaith_doc_19780225_norme-apparizioni_en.html

          III. AUTHORITIES COMPETENT TO INTERVENE

          1. Above all, the duty of vigilance and intervention falls to the Ordinary of the place.

          • http://www.rosariesforlife.com Dave

            In general, yes. In the case of Medjugorje, no.

          • http://www.rosariesforlife.com Dave

            See this letter from Cdl. Bertone:

            http://www.ewtn.com/library/CURIA/CDFAUBRY.HTM

            • ivan_the_mad

              a) Typo on my part, should have read “The local ordinary, who ha[d] the authority”. I see now there was some confusion. It looked like you were saying the local ordinary never had the position to judge, just the bishops’ conference and the CDF (to which I replied with the quote from NC).

              b) Yes, I’ve read that before. Peric still retains pastoral authority. He is still part of the process, both with the bishops conference and now with the CDF. I’d be careful saying it’s just his personal opinion, Bertone was referencing the fact that Peric won’t be making the final judgement on the matter, not that what Peric says can be discarded out of hand.

              • http://www.rosariesforlife.com Dave

                Certainly he still has input into the final result, but he cannot make an authoritative judgment on the matter of the apparitions. I agree that he retains pastoral authority over the parish of Medjugorje. We will just have to wait and see what happens.

                • ivan_the_mad

                  That’s fair enough, Dave.

  • Escalonn

    Well, some of it is silly, but a fair part of the sexual teachings linked seemed in accord with Catholic belief to me, even if the Church has gotten a lot quieter on it in the last 50 years – submission of wives to husbands and all that. Am I wrong or is that not one of the facts of marriage? Or we can speak of a two-way submission, but the husband submits as a governor does to a citizen, and the wife the opposite. Yes?

  • Fran

    The kind of post I would expect of a bitter atheist, not a fellow Catholic. Fine if you don’t believe. But don’t mock.

    • Mark Shea

      I do believe. I just don’t believe in the fraud that is Medjugorje. And I frankly resent the damage it is going to do to the faith of innocent people when that fraud is finally seen for the fraud it is.

      • Fran

        I meant fine if you don’t believe in Medjugorje. I respect that. But don’t involve the Blessed Virgin in your mockery of it.

        • Mark Shea

          It is the Medj frauds who involve her in mockery by lying about her “apparitions”. I defend her by mocking, not her, but these lying frauds who huckster in her name.

          • Fran

            That’s not what it looks like to me. But at least you admit to mocking those who say they see Our Lady. Thats being honest at least. But sad too. I lean towards belief in Medjugorje but if the Vatican should rule against that, I accept that. Totally. But if the Vatican made a ruling which went against your entrenched belief that it is a fraud, I suspect you still wouldn’t accept it. And I only come to this conclusion by your posts on it.

            • hpoitiers

              For the same reason we do not condemn the heresies of Protestantism, that is, by reason of the grace that complements one’s best, even if mistaken, efforts, we would not thus condemn the commitment of a mistaken contingent of Catholic pilgrims. So much the less by means of mockery, sarcasm, and contempt, which bespeak neither humility nor charity, hallmarks of a Catholic mind.

              • Mark Shea

                I have nothing but sympathy and pity for the pilgrims. It’s the frauds I resent.

            • Mark Shea

              I am under no obligation to accept a claim of private revelation, whatever Rome finds in this case. But Rome is going to ratify the findings of the two bishops who have been treated so abominably by these frauds. My great fear is that those who have been fooled by these frauds will have their faith shaken. The frauds have tied a great millstone around their own necks if they don’t repent.

              • Fran

                Just keep away from the mockery Mark.

              • susie

                Amen, Mark. I quite agree with you on this *fraud* for sure. God bless.

  • http://findmeinfloridaagain.blogspot.com Jeanne in Tampa

    REad the Gospel for this past Sunday….

    • Ted Seeber

      My new priest is now pastor of the school and parish he went to in the mid 1960s. I find it downright funny that this was his first Homily in a parish he thinks of as home.

  • http://findmeinfloridaagain.blogspot.com Jeanne in Tampa

    Lack of faith…

    I agree Mark! If this is really happening then it will be up for consideration for faith.

    I was wondering where is everyone on things when and if you do hear God? No one will answer. I mean for your own personal life. Don’t have to get into details, but everytime I get online here I encounter more and more stick to the book kind of folks who never really have what we call in Florida or the south “a personal faith relationship with God” to give meaning to the outside of the rote of what you are doing.

    I was appalled when 10 years ago I started to read blogs and find out what folks were writing when it came to faith. Even thought about writing a “historical context” on this observation. I hypothesize there is something to it. I don’t know. I know it is not all rote prayer from a book like many believe.

    In Medj, whether it is real or not, it is not about rote practice of the sacraments and rote answers. There needs to be a balance between rote and flying off the handle.

    • ivan_the_mad

      “In Medj, whether it is real or not”. It’s not real. The local bishops, who are the authority on the matter, have said nothing supernatural is happening. How many times must this be repeated? That’s it. Finished. The End.

  • ivan_the_mad

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gianna_Talone

    I was living in the area at the time this lady was “receiving visions”. The Archdiocese, as the Wikipedia article states, has come down *very* emphatically several times to say that this woman and that her messages are harmful to the Church. As the article also notes, she started “receiving visions” soon after visiting … Medjugorje.

    • http://www.rosariesforlife.com Dave

      Yeah, there were lots of copycat visionaries following in the footsteps of Lourdes and Fatima too. This is a non-sequitur. I am on the fence, just praying for the truth to come out in the case of Medjugorje, but the appallingly bad logic on the anti-Medjugorje side is not helping. Of course, the pro side is not always logical either.

      • ivan_the_mad

        Definitely your prerogative. I’m not shy to say that I think the visions are not genuine, based on the local ordinaries saying that they did/do not think they are genuine – and that’s enough for me. You see a non sequitur, but I think it’s every bit as pertinent as waving golden rosaries around as proof of authenticity. To each his own, I suppose, based on how they think of the situation. And since, as has been pointed out, there’s no official position – well, then I guess until then, we’re all free to have our own opinions on the matter.

  • http://findmeinfloridaagain.blogspot.com Jeanne in Tampa

    So what about Gianna. That shouldn’t bug you.

    That shouldn’t keep you from seeking God.

    • ivan_the_mad

      I never said that it did.

  • http://findmeinfloridaagain.blogspot.com Jeanne in Tampa

    But they burned Joan of Arc at the stake/// the end FINISHED? SHE WAS MADE A SAINT….

    THE END??? I don’t think so.

    • ivan_the_mad

      Yup. Joan of Arc was burned at the stake, and she was canonized. And this has what to do with anything?

  • http://twitter.com/CatholicDan Dan Sealana

    “A Still Small Voice: A Practical Guide on Reported Revelations” by Fr. Benedict J. Groeschel should be mandatory reading for any Catholic even remotely interested in private revelations.

    • susie

      Thanks, Dan. I’ll be checking that one out at our library and maybe buy a copy to hand out to a few who could use a dose of ‘reality.’ God bless.

  • http://findmeinfloridaagain.blogspot.com Jeanne in Tampa

    Good. Tell him he gets the Florida award for being NY/ Fla cool. Tell him I said so.

  • Jean

    I think there are a lot of sadly mistaken people posting comments about these apparitions. I went to Alabama about 7 years ago when this Medjugorje visionary came for 5 days. I was open to the possibility that my Mother from heaven was truly appearing to this woman, although I also was cautious about the fact that it could be a false claim. It is not the supernatural experience I had during one of the apparitions that convinces me of the authenticity of these apparitions because now that is just a distant memory that has faded with time. Instead, it is the fact that within 6 months of that visit to Alabama, I was already able to look back over that 6 months and see that I had become a completely different person than I was prior to that trip (without even understanding how the change occurred). The change was so profound that people in my life commented on it and the dynamics of volitile relationships completely changed so that peace overtook confrontational situations in profound ways in my life. My belief is that God healed something inside of me that was so far beyond repair that I couldn’t even function normally in social situations. I was damaged goods to say the least from a lifetime of abusive situations. I would have to write a book to explain all that happened on that trip. But, suffice it to say that Satan may masquarade as a heavenly being, but he is certainly not going to sow peace in place of conflict as the fruit of his visit. Someday, you will all hang your heads in shame for having mocked your Mother when She has come for you too.

    • Ted Seeber

      Satan might not- but God can turn even Satan’s work into good. Viva Christo Rey! Viva la Virgen De Guadalupe!

  • Jean

    Well, I think Satan is turning something good into something evil here. Shaking the dust from my feet.

  • Marc C.

    I have been studying Marian Apparitions for 25 years, the true (approved), the false (condemned), and the in-between (final judgment pending). I can tell you that “rosaries turning to gold” is a trademark ONLY FOUND IN “APPARITIONS” THAT HAVE BEEN CONDEMNED THE CHURCH, such as Necedah, Bayside, and San Damiano. This “phenomenon” never happens in connection with CHURCH APPROVED apparitions. Rosaries turning to “gold” (or any other color) at Medjugorje is a MAJOR RED FLAG that this apparent “miracle” doesn’t come from God or Our Lady. Think about it: Alchemy is an OCCULT science, it is the turning of base metal into gold using MAGIC, and thus is a practice CONDEMNED by the Church. So when the chain links of a regular rosary (made out of a base metal) turn to GOLD (or a golden color), it is nothing more than ALCHEMY being applied to a religious object; in either case, SATAN IS THE SOURCE OF THE MAGIC. Certainly the Church-appointed experts of the Commission studying the Medjugorje mess are going to recognize this. And that is just ONE example of the non-Divine origin of Medjugorje, even though despite this, God is supplying the true miracles of grace and conversion through the regular channels of THE MASS, CONFESSIONS, PRAYERS, AND PENANCES of the pilgrims, not through the “apparitions.”

    • Mark Shea

      Personally, I’d just like to see one documented before and after gold rosary. Just one. It’s an urban legend I’ve heard for years. Where’s the beef?

      And alchemy was not an occult science, because it wasn’t a science. No alchemist ever transmuted lead into gold. Relax.

  • Marc C.

    I never said the alchemists were successful. But they certainly tried. Alchemy was the precursor for modern-day chemistry, but occultists still practice it (I used to be involved in the New Age Movement and this was part of the “magical arts” department, so to speak). I have seen rosaries that allegedly turned to “gold”, though in most cases, when the links were broken open, it was only the outside of the chain that was gold in color, wheareas the interior was still the regular-looking base metal (these had come from Bayside). One rosary came from Medjugorje, and the lady who owned it made a big deal out of it, saying, “Look what happened to MY rosary!” There was nothing gold on it at all, but the chains were brightly tarnished, and the crucifix was a brilliant silver, almost platinum color, very shiny. I said to her, “What does this prove?” and she got very upset and said, “Well it didn’t look like this before I went there!” And I said to her, “This doesn’t tell me anything. Do you say your Rosary? That’s the main thing, no matter what color it is.” I do remember a book by Rooney and Faricy from the early Medjugorje days (I have all the Medj books, but they are boxed up and I can’t remember this particular title) and in it they reported the rosary belonging to one lady turning “half” to gold, meaning, half of the chains on her rosary turned to “gold”, but the other half remained normal, and the comment was made that hopefully the next time she returned to Medj the other half would change also. I found that very bizarre. Our Lady just doesn’t play games like this. Another time a lady who had been there said to a friend of mine, “I just had a vision of you climbing the mountain in Medjugorje.” And my friend said, “Well your vision was false, because I will never set one foot there!” Everything is miracles, signs, and spectacles with these people, and the devil seems more than happy to oblige them with all these tricks.

  • Marc C.

    Sorry, I meant also to add above that Satan can effect the change in the metal, because, as an angel with a much higher intelligence regarding natural laws and substances, he can manipulate the molecules at the subatomic level, but to the unsuspecting person the final, almost instantaneous result looks like “magic” or a “miracle,” depending on which perspective the person involved is viewing it from.

    • Mark Shea

      How do you know that?

  • Marc C

    How do I know what, that Satan can manipulate matter? First of all, he’s an angelic intelligence, far superior to human intelligence, and if we can manipulate matter in a laboratory (even make synthetic things that do not exist naturally), then Satan and the fallen angels can also take existing matter (which they know the components of and how they work with other components, energy, etc… far better than we do, and in ways we haven’t discovered yet) and alter it easily. Second, he demonstrates this ability (as has been well-documented by the Church) in exorcisms. There are plenty of testimonies from exorcists of how the possessed vomit strange objects such as glass, nails, or other materials, and often in quantities that far exceed what our human nature is capable of retaining, as well as objects materializing or dematerializing out of thin air (apportation). In the famous case of Magdalena of the Cross, the Spanish nun who lived several centuries ago who was an agent of Satan until her conversion and exorcism, she was able to fool her community, and clergy of various rank with her “visions”, “miracles”, and even a mysterious “pregnancy” that had everyone thinking she was somehow another Blessed Virgin because she was examined by doctors and her virginity was found to be intact. Look it up, its a completely true, (though utterly bizarre) story that the Church has validated (and for which Magdalena was punished severely for). Ask a good, traditional Catholic theologian specializing in mysticism and/or demonology. Satan isn’t God, he can’t bring into existence something from nothing, but he can certainly fool around with created substance and make it appear to do things that are outside natural laws. I’m surprised as a Catholic tackling a false apparition you don’t know this. How do you think he is fooling so many people at Medjugorje with “golden rosaries”, “spinning suns”, and “miraculous” photographs? He’s a fallible being, but far more intelligent and crafty than we can hope to be in our human nature while in this life.

    • Mark Shea

      I see a lot of assertion, urban legend and hearsay in your reply, but no actual documentation. I don’t even know that there has been any actual rosary turned to gold at Medj. It’s an urban legend that gets recycled, but where the actual proof that the thing has ever happened? I’m still not persuaded that the devil (who has no power to create ex nihilo) can change anything into gold. I’m open to persuasion with evidence. But you’ll have to do better than “everybody knows” or “it is widely said by experts”. Documentation please?

  • Marc C

    I don’t have any of these rosaries, so how am I supposed to give you one for evidence? Ask those who claim it happened to them to turn it over for evidence. As for the theological component of satan being able to manipulate created things, I told you, talk to a Catholic theologian (or more than one) who is well-versed in mysticism and/or demonology, or talk to an authentic Catholic exorcist (sorry, I’m not important enough to have any direct or instant connections for you). Start with your parish priest, maybe he can refer you to one, or your Bishop. I don’t mean to be rude, but your answers are showing yourself to be unwilling to do any research for yourself to find out the truth of the matter, you want everything handed to you, which certainly doesn’t say very much for your personal credibility or professional standards as you try to make your case. I can see why the Medjugorians don’t take you seriously. I don’t believe in Medjugorje myself, and I’m having a hard time taking you seriously now.

  • Marc C

    Here is what St. Thomas Aquinas in his Summa Theologica has to say about the angelic nature and their superior knowledge of created and material things. This page is just the title of the section on the Angels. click next to begin the question and answers. Its a lengthy treatise, but if you’re truly interested in making yourself believable you’ll take the time to study it. Its the best place to start, at least, in addition to the other (and most logical) recommendations I gave you above. If you’re not interestedin all this reading or are too lazy to do some work on your own then unfortunately you’re not going to come across as being very credible or professional. http://www.ccel.org/ccel/aquinas/summa.FP.vii.html

  • Joseph

    The seers are in a rush to cash in before they are exposed at the highest level.


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