Israel is a secular western European State like any other

…and because of that, don’t be surprised by headlines like this:

Israel’s health ministry is investigating claims that Ethiopian immigrants have unwittingly had Depo-Provera jabs for years

This is how secular western European states deal with culling the herd.  Don’t kid yourself that this secular state is any different.

I particularly enjoy that the Minister of Health is investigating himself to find out if he was lying when he denied this was happening.  That too is entirely modern, secular and altogether without connection to the state of Israel as some kind of divinely instituted country.

And before anybody starts, saying Israel is a secular country and not divinely instituted is no more a “denial of Israel’s right to exist” than the same observation about the US, France or Australia is.  Yes,  people (in fact, National Review writers) have seriously attempted to make that accusation against me in the past when I criticized some blasphemous soft porn ad for Israeli tourism.  For some people, absolutely everything Israel does is utterly sacrosanct.

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  • HornOrSilk

    Absolutely correct. Israel is a secular state and like all secular states, it’s past is questionable, it’s present is filled with vices, and its future is not a necessity. Yet all of these things do not remove its right to existence; in the present world-system, it exists and so has rights, no matter how it got them, they exist now like any other state which emerged with questionable authority to do so became real states with real authority. But, as with every state, it does good (which can and should be mentioned) and evil (which must be criticized). If it wants to continue, it should seek to remove any evil it does and promote more good; justifying the bad because it exists is never right, and justifying it because there is some sort of “divine right” is even worse.

    • IRVCath

      The problem is, the position of the Israeli state and a substantial minority at least of its voters seems to be that anything is justified to preserve its existence, because without Israel, there will be a second Shoah. Even objectively immoral acts.

      • HornOrSilk

        We have similar people in the US which believe some form of Manifest Destiny.

        • Catholic pilgrim

          Yes there are quite a few people in the USA who believe God divinely & specifically appointed the USA to be the model nation over all the other nations. The USA is the best nation in the world (& ever in human history- past, present, future) because God appointed us, they say.

      • Andrew

        Iran has said it wants to “wipe Israel off the map” and has helped Hamas and Hezbollah send thousands of rockets into Israel. There is a real danger that a country like Iran could kill many Israelis if Israel isn’t careful about foiling the plans of its enemies. On the other hand, Israel is careful to limit civilian casualties during war. The reason why there were 64 Israeli soldiers that died this past month is because Israel put its soldiers lives at risk to send troops on the ground, rather than only bombing rocket launch areas, which would have increased civilian casualties. Israel did this despite the loss of dozens of soldiers and hundreds of soldiers that were wounded.

        • Guest

          Why don’t you mention the 1800 plus with 70% civilian kill rate of Palestinians Israel has killed? Or are they not people?

          • Andrew

            Civilian casualties happen during war, especially when there is a terrorist group (Hamas) firing from civilian areas. I never said there weren’t civilian casualties. What I said was that Israel is doing as much as it can to prevent civilian casualties while still protecting its citizens. If Israel had not cared about civilian casualties, Israel could have bombed areas that had rockets without sending in troops to verify, and the number of soldiers killed would have been much less.

        • Petey

          we’ve heard it all before.

          • Andrew

            Good. Then it’s really quite simple. A Hamas member shoots rocket to kill Israelis, the Hamas member dies in an airstrike (in the same way the Hamas member tried to murder others).

            • Joseph

              Remember the old cop shows when the criminal was surrounded by cops with weapons drawn but instead of surrendering, the criminal grabbed the nearest innocent bystander and pulled them to his chest? Remember how it totally disrupted the potential arrest and the cops always let the criminal go to avoid hurting the innocent hostage. This was always temporary. They would either come up with a plan to detain the criminal without harming the hostage or the criminal would leave the hostage when he felt it was safe to make his escape. The moral was to *never kill the innocent* hostage even if it meant no capturing the criminal.
              I remember those days too. The policy of countries like the US and Israel is to simply sacrifice the hostage to kill the criminal… and it’s wrong no matter how you attempt to justify it.

  • Dan F.

    I found it depressingly ironic that the advertisement that appears at the top of the column (on my mobile at least) says “Supported by the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation”

  • bob

    Mark seems to be pointing out that this version of Israel is acting like the one in the Bible. And that frequently ain’t good. Pretty old news but once in a while somebody has to remind people.

  • Guest

    The state of Israel has indeed done horrible things. Their actions towards Palestinians are ethnic cleansing like the US treatment of Native Americans.

    • Andrew

      Muslims represent 15% of Israeli citizens and are in the Israeli Parliament, police and army. There is no valid comparison between Native Americans (who were discriminated against in America) and Palestinians.

    • Joseph

      Muslims have indeed done horrible things. Their actions toward Christians and other religious minorities are ethnic cleansing worse than the treatment of Native Americans… and it remains unchecked by the so-called *peaceful majority* of Muslims everywhere who tacitly agree with this inhumanity by their inaction and instead spend lots of time weeping about a much smaller and disproportionate amount of Muslims killed because the other Muslims that they fail to do anything about use them as meat shields against a force that is willing to kill them rather than tactically avoid killing the hostage.
      What Israel is doing is wrong… but no Muslim on the face of this Earth has a right to lecture them.


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