Greg Laden posts a home address and employer contacts for online rival

This is really vile. I don’t care what you think about your opponent in an argument.

You never ever do this:

Greg Laden asks mykeru if he still lives at a specific home address

That link contained what he hoped was Mykeru’s home address. Only it wasn’t his home, it was his ex-wife’s home, and that was years ago. Even then, she may not even live there anymore! Some other family may be targeted by whatever plot Laden may have hoped to inspire by dropping dox.

Also included in that link was this actual photograph of the building:

Greg Laden posted a link to the picture of the home

Seriously, WTF!? I don’t know much about ‘Mykeru’, and maybe he’s not a great guy. What could possibly excuse purposely leaking an actual home address of somebody you disagree with? Nothing. This is every kind of wrong.

Laden then went on to disclose Mykeru’s alleged employment information. Presumably, Greg Laden wants his twitter followers to contact Mykeru’s employers and co-workers. You know, right after some visit his (ex-wife’s old) house.

I’ve not linked directly to this information, but it’s too late to remove it from the internet. Coupled with his history of bullying, and his direct threats of violence towards me, we can safely label Laden as a serial-harasser. When he attempted to trigger my PTSD, I saw him for what he was. Initially, I had thought it was just a one-off, and perhaps he just ‘saw red’. This was the first time I did not immediately forward a threat to the FBI. He continued to harass me, encouraging my peers to join in. To their credit, most saw what was happening after a few days.

A week later, he got the word that I was about to publicly release his threats. He called me about an hour before I hit ‘publish’. It was way too late for that. The conversation was absurd and he was extremely self-centered.

I published. He was booted. He wrote something about how I was the bad guy and deserved his violent threats. Then he showed up in my comments section and accused me of lying about that phone call. I think my response convinced him to fuck off, at least temporarily.

Several months passed. I even entertained the notion that he could change, and that if I saw him in person we’d perhaps even pose for a photo to bury the hatchet. On November 26th, Greg Laden re-extended the same violent threat against me that got him kicked off of FtB in the first place.

Even when he’s not harassing people, he’s largely incoherent. He has presented theories about testosterone-damaged chromosomes that don’t even qualify as junk-science. His writing is the laughing stock of reddit.

Obviously, I don’t think he’d win any fair fight. He doesn’t exactly seem to play fair, though, does he? That’s the whole point of purposely ‘dropping dox’ like home addresses: violence and harassment by proxy. It’s inexcusable, just like the violent threats and harassment that come directly from him.

What possible explanation could people have to defend this person’s antics? Hard to say.

It’s a trap!

Greg made his own home address very easy to discover. He is the only one who could have put that address up where it is, and he clearly makes no effort to hide it. I’m not linking to it, or discussing how to find it. I strongly discourage people from doing anything that allows him to look like a victim. That’s his game.

I seriously doubt that’s his real or current address that he’s making very public. If it is, then he’s doing it on purpose.  [edit: I was way off with the way the way I typed this initially. Maria Maltseva most certainly did not release her own home address. It was dug up and posted by one of Greg Laden's commenters, I completely misread the situation - All apologies to bluharmony.]

By leaking his own home address is Laden now baiting drama? Hard to say.

“Famous for kicking ass”

His tactics are really creepy when you analyze them. He recently posted this:

… I do not regard physical threats as unimportant. It is just that I am a very large, muscular man with martial arts training who never goes anywhere without my pit bull, and I always carry a gun. I am also famous for kicking ass, generally.

He wants to be quote-mined. He craves having a gotcha moment. He waits for somebody to post that quote without acknowledging his post’s cryptic last sentence. Paraphrased: “Am I kidding? Hard to say.

FtB did the right thing by kicking Laden to the curb. How he’s still taken seriously anywhere else is beyond me.

About Justin Griffith
  • http://beliefblower.com Renee Hendricks

    Justin, thank you for this post. I know there is fighting within “the ranks” in the atheism crowd on-line. Arguing/disagreeing/etal is one thing. Purposely putting out information to encourage others to go beyond general petty crap on-line and move toward actual stalking and harassing is entirely a different matter.

  • jackiepaper

    How you get taken seriously by anyone is beyond me.

  • George

    Well said Jackiepaper, but one should always show kindness to the defeated.

  • http://www.bolingbrookbabbler.com cethis

    Some people in the atheist community do drive me crazy, but posting addresses and employment information is not acceptable. Just as it was wrong for Justin Vacula to post Surly Amy’s home address, it’s wrong to post this person’s address.

    Greg has some good qualities, but he’s got to stop doing things like this. It only hurts Greg’s image, and I hope nothing happens to the ex-wife or the person he is targeting.

  • N_J

    And just think, Justin. While your posting of his threat against you led to your relegation to the FtB basement, shunned and scorned by PZ and other FtB bloggers and commenters for your honesty, Greg Laden is still their buddy. He’s in like Flynn, you’re not really even welcome here. The only reason Laden was booted was politics – they had to strike the pose that they actually are against bullying, threats, doxing and similar atrocious behavior. However, the fact that Laden is still their buddy, along with their own routine libeling, bullying etc. are well-documented, proves that they have no problem at all with such behavior. Laden’s banishment was a transparently smirking and cynical political ploy, nothing else.

    Why you stay here in this septic tank is incomprehensible to me. You do good work with your military atheist activism. You, your public standing and your activist efforts are severely diminished by your continued association with this awful blog network. You’re better off without them, and they would dance with glee if you left. They don’t give a shit about you or the atheist activism you do, which should tell you something about the character of the people here. They don’t even care about atheism or skepticism anymore. Why should you give a shit about them?

    ———————–

    Justin Griffith response:

    This will be the only comment I let through like this.

    To the anti-FTB: people I vehemently disagree that ‘all of FtB’ supports Laden. Initially, I even gave off signals that they didn’t have to publicly ‘have my back’. The only reason they may have even entertained not dropping him was because nothing like that had ever happened before, and hindsight is 20/20. You’ll never know how great Ed Brayton was to me on the phone. You’ll never know how many of the people here privately wrote to me in support. It really meant a lot to me, and you don’t know what the fuck you’re talking about. Yeah, there are like two people here on cordial terms with him… that’s a pretty good percentage for a group of people connected only by atheism.

    Several of my co-bloggers who you describe as not giving a shit about military activism have agreed to speak at military bases, or even joined the lineup at RBB2. Your premise is just wrong. When you say they don’t even care about skepticism anymore, you’re also talking about me. You’re also talking about people who never claimed to care about skepticism. Some are biblical scholars, scientists, or philosophers. Some write about sexuality and gender issues, we even have a drunken chef who likes good music. It’s not a perfect harmonious family, but what the hell did you expect?

    I messed up a bit too. I pissed them off and I apologized. I also accidentally allowed people to freely shitting on my friends here. I am much better at moderating comments now. Though you didn’t say this, I want to address one last point. I don’t see why people think it’s for the $ or the hits. I donate every penny to charity / activism, and it isn’t that much.

    To the anti-Justin Griffith people:Conversely, the other side of the narrative is off too. You’ll never know how many top-tier atheists wrote to me in confidence, expressing their condolences at my treatment. You’ll never know how I detested being fit into the ‘slyme pit’ narrative, appearing on their ‘body count list’ etc. Few of you will ever know the stresses of dealing with multiple credible death threats, and how an activist with my level of visibility simply has to take all of them seriously and let the FBI make the call. You likely won’t realize the extreme restraint I used, and part of me still regrets not doing so. Like I said, I wouldn’t expect somebody like Laden to fight fair, it doesn’t take a genius to ambush somebody.

    If you give a shit about harassment, threats, and mental health issues like PTSD, what is your deal? Stop it.

    To everyone: Do not rehash the elevator gate, or talk about why you hate RW, or shit like that. Do not respond to it if it gets by me temporarily. I’m going to heavily moderate this discussion. It is what it is. Stay only on the topic of the content of this post. Or don’t comment if you can’t hold back.

  • jackiepaper

    Did you see the harassment Greg was responding to? Did you see what he actually tweeted? Go back an look over the long history that Justin’s chums have of harassing and stalking other bloggers, especially feminists. Justin is chummy with the real creeps and snarking at Greg and using every opportunity to portray him in a nasty light. He’s not bothered by having to mislead or lie to do so.

    Get real Justin. You can’t make him look bad enough to make your buddies or yourself look better, even when you cherry pick the best material you can find.

  • allison

    [JG Edit: Thanks for the support, but I hope you understand why I'm deleting this.]

  • Bob Dog

    Are #1 and #2 fanboys or sock puppets? They certainly are #1 and #2, in the funkiest possible meaning.

    It doesn’t matter what you think of Griffith, whether you think reporting this is whining or justified. If you don’t like it, don’t read it.

    But defending Laden’s Neal Horsley impersonation is disgusting. There’s only one reason to publicize private info, and it’s not to generate fan mail for the person.

  • abear

    Greg Laden is ” big, muscular guy with martial arts training” that takes his gun and pitbull with him everywhere? That was in November, apparently he doesn’t like guns anymore? Or was this him writing fiction? Maybe a giant beergut counts as a big muscle?

    As far as his kicking ass goes, how would he do that? He never takes his feet out of his mouth!

  • George

    dn ǝʌıb noʎ ǝɯıʇ sı ʇı sdɐɥɹǝd

    ˙noʎ uo punoɹɐ pǝuɹnʇ ı puɐ ǝpɐɯ noʎ ǝuo ǝɥʇ ˙ʇuǝɯnbɹɐ ǝɥʇ pǝʇndsıp ʇou ǝʌɐɥ ןןıʇs noʎ ǝsnɐɔǝq ʞuıן pǝʇıpǝ ɹnoʎ pɐǝɹ oʇ ǝuoʎuɐ ǝʇıʌuı ı puɐ ‘ǝsɐɔ ɹnoʎ ǝʞɐɯ oʇ pǝןıɐɟ ǝʌɐɥ ןןıʇs noʎ ǝsnɐɔǝq ǝsɐɔ sıɥʇ uı puıɯ ʇ,uop ı ʇnq

    ¡ʞɔıp ɐ ǝɹɐ noʎ ‘uıʇsnظ sʇsod ʎɯ ʇıpǝ ʇ,uop

  • tigzy

    What possible explanation could people have to defend this person’s antics? Hard to say.

    [JG Edit... late catch. Snipped. Don't attack people who aren't named in the article.]

    @Jackiepaper – I think Greg might actually be using some strange hacked version of twitter which leaves him unable to block or ignore people he dislikes.

  • Mike de Fleuriot

    And No, this IS different from what Anonymous did to Shirley Phelps.

  • Candyguitar

    #5:

    Did you see the harassment Greg was responding to? Did you see what he actually tweeted? Go back an look over the long history that Justin’s chums have of harassing and stalking other bloggers, especially feminists. Justin is chummy with the real creeps and snarking at Greg and using every opportunity to portray him in a nasty light. He’s not bothered by having to mislead or lie to do so.

    Get real Justin. You can’t make him look bad enough to make your buddies or yourself look better, even when you cherry pick the best material you can find.

    So instead of recognizing Greg Laden’s misconduct for what it is, you’re attacking Justin and accusing him of lying about it, in spite of the evidence he posted? I think that speaks for itself.

  • George

    Justin Griffith estas mutan, halti klopodante paroli al li, kvazaŭ li havas la kapablon por kialo. Li intelekte ĉesis disvolvi kiam li estis malgranda knabo.

    Vi woudn’t argumenti kun terpomo? Do ne engaĝiĝi lin plu. Everytime fingrojn batis klavaro ni ĉiuj fariĝis dumber kiel rezulto de la sperto.

  • George

    George is being censored!



    Oh here comes the censorship!

  • SQuiller

    To the anti-FTB: people I vehemently disagree that ‘all of FtB’ supports Laden. Initially, I even gave off signals that they didn’t have to publicly ‘have my back’. The only reason they may have even entertained not dropping him was because nothing like that had ever happened before, and hindsight is 20/20.

    Rubbish. They were fine with him trying to get Abbie Smith fired. [JG edit: snipped, sorry.] Are you really so naive as to think that his behaviour toward you was exceptional and that your blog fellows did not know what he was about? One suspects that if he hadn’t gone after you you would now be swallowing the apologetics and defending him against those evil ‘others’. [JG edit: snipped... stay on the topic of LADEN.]

    • http://www.patheos.com/blogs/rockbeyondbelief/ Justin Griffith

      They were fine with him trying to get Abbie Smith fired.

      “They” didn’t exist when that happened. And I’ve only heard a few say it was justified. Perhaps they didn’t detect the histrionic trend yet? I sure hadn’t. I spoke out against this even in my first post on the subject. A handful of people I respect still disagree with me, playing to your point. The vast majority have posited no position whatsoever.

      Guilt by association is a two way street. Do you want me paint every pitizen with the same brush? Are you saying that more than 5 or 6 of you actively identify as MRA’s?

      Are you really so naive as to think that his behaviour toward you was exceptional and that your blog fellows did not know what he was about?

      I was naive. I really didn’t see it. I can’t usually stomach any of his writing, and didn’t have a sense for it. I also started devoting nearly all of my time to activism and didn’t even have time to see what was going on. Look, we’re not all able to read every blog or every story’s beginning. Sometimes the game of telephone isn’t clear but has that appearance.

      One suspects that if he hadn’t gone after you you would now be swallowing the apologetics and defending him against those evil ‘others’.

      Yes. And I’m asking that you allow others the chance to open their eyes.

  • artemisia

    I’m delighted to see this post; I would not have expected to see it here. Laden is fast becoming famous for his doxxing and bullying and violent threats, and it’s just inexplicable to me why he has so much support from people who claim to believe these things are wrong. What’s with the double standard? Wrong is wrong, and it needs to be called out no matter who does it. Refute someone’s argument or position with facts. If you can’t, the next step is to withdraw or concede. Alternatively, they can be silenced with de-friending or blocking. Trying to silence them with real life attacks is never acceptable. At least it shouldn’t be, in the freethinking community.

  • George

    L̪͖͕̱ͪ͋͗̎ͭ̾̔̊̊͢o͊͐̅́ͮ҉̝͔̻l̵̬̱̻̗̹̯̤̙̆ͮ̂̂̽ͣ̽͛̚͢ͅ,̯̱͊̾̄̈̚͝ͅ ̋͆̆̈́̈͏̱͚͈͙͟͝w̳̝̏͋̒̍̾͂̐̒̃͡e͗̊͋ͨ̎҉͓̭̹̗̲̫̠͠ľ̡̺̣̇ļ̰̲̤ͨͫ͊ͮ̋̂͒͂͆̀͟ ̸̺̦̰̮̩̥̾ͧ͒p̓͗̍҉͎̣̝̦̭͙̳̘lͫ̿҉̶͕̫̰̭͓͚͝a̡̯̟̲͉̠͚̟̗ͯ̎̀̑͆͘͡y̵͖͓̤̱̞̹̗ͤ͆͒̅͗ͬ͜ͅe̶̢̦͇ͯ̎̀̓͐̾ͦͮ̎́d͒ͫ̚҉͉͈̬!̣̖̲̗̤̩̰̺̋̉̕ ̜̗ͥ̂̾͆ͧ̏͜͟T̗̖̠̩̘͚̣̮̽͊̽̊̀̈́ͭ͆ͅh̛̳͔͉͍̣̾ͥ͂̐ͩ͑̈̀e̩̲͔̺ͣ̌ ̔ͬ̐͏̙̳̣͈͕͚̲̣͝l̆ͨ̽̿͗ͫ̃̚͢҉̤̥͓͍o̵̯̖̻̟ͫ͛ͩ̃r̶̬͚ͨͅd̵̼̰̘̱͙̒̍̀̍̒ ̷̯̳̘̜͈͖̩̫̽̂̈́ͤ̈́ͮ̅i̛̱̩̖͕̻ͫ̃̎̀̚s̢̜̭̹̰̤̞̉̋̏͛̆ͬ́͞ ͗̂͆͒̚̚҉͏̣̠̙͕s̯͈͙̼̙̟͙͇̃̋̿̐̾͠͠p̙̞̪̫̟ͦ̈́̔͊̇̏̚̚͝ě̛̘͖̮̲͚a̬̞̹̥̖͔͉͙̯̒̃̌̊k̫̻͕̃̍ͫ̐ͯ̈́ͬ̔i̔̑́̐͠͏̫n̴̗̼͎ͮͮͧ͌͋ͅg̵̪̦̙͔̗̈̈̈ͤ͜͞ ͔͚̫̪̺̣͙ͯ̆̆ͥ̽́ͦ̀͝
    ͯ̂̂ͭ͏̞̹̩̻t̷̨̫͍̦͉̦ͥ̌̀̋̓̿ͪh̴̺̺̹̮̮͙̲̱̟̒ͦŗ͇̦͎̰̺̗͉̣̩̈́ͧ̎̓ͯ͒̏͊̽͝o̮̓̀ͯͨ̇̐̈́̆u̼̱̘͉̰̜̔̏̃̕͞g̷̦̥̹͐͑h͍͇̖̪̭̝͑̆̏͆ͧ̑͑ ̧͖̹͉͇͎̳̀͂̑ͬy͎̜̝͍̲̟̰̹͗̿ͧͨ͘͝o̭̝̺͈͊ͥ̎͝͝u̞̬̤̅̄̈́͢ ̶͐̇͏͍͉̫̺i̢͇̙̭̰̩̒͂̒̕n̼͎͉̠̭͓̾͌ ̈́ͮ҉̪̣͚͖̳͝t̛̝͖̠̘̯͓̘̤͛͑̈́ͯỏ̸̡̦̺͍̂̽͗͛͋̉ͨn͔̜̝̖̘͙̞͚͔͂͛̎̍͛ͭg̢͓̝̥̑ͫ͆̊̓ͧͯ͝ͅu̴̬̝͓̼̱̯̼ͫ̈́̅e̢̠͒ͨ͜s̨̰̝̗̪͙̩̭̻ͨͫ̊͗͌̿̿͡!̭͚͍̩̏̓̐
    ̴̫͔͈͕̣̀̽͊͛̏̈̕͝Ḽ̸̛̻̩̹̗̪ͪ̑o̶̧̞̘̩̻̖͕̱͛̅́l͎̥̘̋ͣ,̙̤ͥ̑̏̉ ̢͓͙̜̻ͨ̾̔̍̚w̱̳̖̮̣͖̦͍̃̂̂͌e̍́҉̵҉̭͙̰̮͕̲͉ͅlͬ҉̪͘l͉̱̮̉ͨͮͨͤ́ ͔̼͖̤͔̓̅ͤͯ͌ͨͭ̎p͈̘̭̮̙̖͙͉ͧͣ͛͊̿̄̕l͉̭̖̈́̏̽ͭ͆̇̐̓a͓̠̠̻ͫ́͒̍̑ͣͦy̼͉͕ͨ̄̂̋̏͌̈́͌̕e̵̹͈͉̩͍̓̐͌ͯ͗͒͞͠d͕͙ͥ͒͛͟ͅ!̙̋͑́̀ ̡̥͓̹̙̤̭̬͇͒̾ͯ̌͛ͧ̈ͥ͛̕T̸̜͖̟͈̩̘̠̼̔͑ͦh̨̢̤̗̮̤̰͙̤̐̃͑̋ͪ̉͢e̸̜̮̞ͤ͒̓̄́̌̃̌͜ ̧̧͇̮̙̹̈͑͠l̉̂͏̞̠̠͙͚̘̣̀̕ͅo͈͙̫͐̍̚͡ͅȓ̳͈̞̯̈́͑́ͩ̑͘d̵̡̢͍̖̦͈̥ͣ̓͗ͅ ̸̺ͬ̿̔ͨ͒͒i̸̩̳̣̯̥͚̾́s̠̫̜̟̅ͩ͊̀̐ͧ͢͝ ͈̣͋͗̌ͫ̕s̲̥͗̾̏ͥͭ͘͠ṗ̖̞̖̜̦̓ͪ́́͑͋̔́͘e̦̗̩̟͈̱̙͌̍̀̃̍ͭ̒a̍̐̈́ͯ̊ͯ̃̓͏̝͉̫̤̳͚͙k̴̳ͧͭͣ́͂̚͟͠ĭ̝̺͙͔̰ͧ́͘ͅņ̛̜̝̞̯ͩ̈͋̅g̺͉̫̘ͨ̆ ̡̼̳̰͎̬͖̺̎̓̎̚̕̕
    ̧̹̪̥̻͓͔̮͂ͫ́ͅt̴̪̤͔̞̟̞̲̞̏ͬ̓͛̓̎ͤ͘ḩ͂̔́͛͗͏͇̬͉͓͇͡r̬͙͎͙̳̮͗͛̅̎ͦͣ͌ͬo̶̡̩̠̞̳̰͈̞̓̀̔u̹͎͓̹̣ͭ̌̉̈́̃̀g̣͍̠̥͎͔̘̘̃ͨ̓͛ͬ͆̂̃h̭̺̟͙͔̫̞̊̿ ̺͖̑͛̚ŷ̠̪͍̘̂̿ͤ̓̚o̺̩̫̙̜͂̈̉̈́͐u͉̠̖̬͇̠̯ͨ̈ͩ̈͒͘ ̵̞̼̞̟͆ͩ͜į̴̵̞͈̟̪̮͈̩͐ͧ̓͊ͪṅ̳̫̟̱̜̘͙͆̆͢ ̡̳̤͉̘̰̱̑̎̔̅̏͟t͍̘̲̠̘̫̟̋̍͐͛̀͝ȍ̥͍̻͙̻̎ͥ̀͟ņ̜͔̗̬̹̙̅̀́ͣͬͪͩ͊͗g̶̣͚̬̘ͨ͗́͑u̸̪̝̥ͬ̾ͭ́ͣ̀͐é̡͔̱̦̼̬͚̰̼̍ͬ̎̄́s͈̠͇̲ͨ̈́!̴̷̘͇͚͇͚͖̠̂ͧͥͤ̎̽̀̎͒͡

  • Mike LaFontaine

    Justin, you said you wouldn’t post anymore such comments, and that is fine. This is a message to you, from a complete stranger. If you are trying to dispel the notion that Laden’s expulsion from FTB was a political move you aren’t helping your cause when you write:

    You’ll never know how many of the people here privately wrote to me in support.

    Or when you write:

    You’ll never know how many top-tier atheists wrote to me in confidence, expressing their condolences at my treatment.

    Did any of those top tier atheists support you publicly? How about the second tier? Third? Did *anyone* publicly support you, other than the Slymepit?

    Here is my opinion. You can accept or reject it. All I ask is that you consider it. When you went public with Laden’s threats, you unknowingly had the fate of FTB in your hands. You could have exposed the whole (I am assuming) rotten underbelly of the network. They only supported you privately and not publicly because they don’t really support you. Not fully anyways. Only to the extent you are useful to them. They were just pacifying you in order to save their own asses in the secular community. With your discipline and sense of honor, you controlled their fate in a way that Thunderf00t never could. He was too undisciplined and too unethical.

    You are doing good work. Keep it up, but don’t count on them to always be there for you.

  • Stacy

    I think the way Laden behaved toward you, Justin, was shameful.

    They were fine with him trying to get Abbie Smith fired.

    “They” didn’t exist when that happened. And I’ve only heard a few say it was justified.

    Did he really try to get her fired, or just try to get her to take the ‘pit down?

    In any case, haters, he was kicked off FtB. Not sure what more you want–PZ to open a vein and write “Bad Greg!” in blood for you?

  • left0ver1under

    For the uneducated like George (#15):

    Justin Griffith only works for the US government, he’s not acting on its behalf. It’s only censorship when the government silences your words, not when individuals or businesses do it.

    Does a phone company “violate your rights” by cutting off your service after you make harassing phone calls? No. And neither can a person cannot “censor” a privately run blog to prevent unwanted comments.

    Yes, I am equating certain people to harassing and obscene phone callers. It’s an apt comparison.

  • George

    ̅̾͋ͤ̅̓̃̊́͏̸̢̫̝̮D̵̢̛̜͙̘͒̉ͦͭo̭̰̹̦̣͙̒̀ͯͤ̏ͯ̓ ̸͖̹̎ͧ̕͞y͓̙̻̠̱̰͋ͣͨ̿̔͋͡o͕̯̳͉͔̱ͩ̂͆̓ͭ͐ͣͧu͚͙̬͕̅̅̆̅͠ ̢͈͇̱̒͜n̗̤̿̽͞o̫̲͙̱͙ͬ̀̏͟t̴̶̩̞͉͔̮̣̝͋͛̒ͬ͐ͪ͂̆ͅ ̸̴̹ͣͦ̍ͮͤͪͮ̽́t̢̢͚͔͎̂ͫ̔͠ḩ̷̞̭̘͕̪̝̘ͣ̈́̌̌͌i̵̶̗̩͚͕͚̱̝̻̭̋͛͒ͩͨ̓ͯ̂ń͍̃ͧ͑ͪ̑̽̌̚͝k̴̿͌ͯ͛͝͏̫͖͕̝͓ ̟͑ͧ͊͗͢͟͝ͅť̴̠͕h͙͚̤͍̰ͯā̟͓̭̻͈̂̃ͧ͐̇̎̓̀t̯̫̳͇͔͗̉͠͠ ̛̺̻͔ͥ̂̓ͭa̹͖͈̯͎̦͎͓ͣ̀̔̏̋͘͞l̨͍̘ͫ͊́̍ͫͯl̺̙̩̼̈́̍̀ͥͨ̇ ̶̧̳͙͆̈̄̑͌̆̌̎ͅo̐̈̀ͭ̑̑҉̶̥̱̖͎̱͙͕̀ͅf̭̭͇̮̬̟̬̯͓̌̿ ̷̧̺̩̥̼́̑͒̋͝y̡ͫͮ̃͟҉͔̦͔ŏ̫̪̀̌̐̿͌͠͠u̩̤̜͓ͣ͛ͅr̵̛͖̰̬̬͖̪̗̬͌͊͆̿̿̋͌͞ͅ ̩͎̙̦̗̹̔͒͑̾͐ͨ͋̀d̸͎͕͕̦͓͇̍͌̈́̊̆͌̚͡ȩ̶͙̋͐͢ṭ̫̲̭̲ͮ͜͟r͈̱̳̪̖̟ͬ͒̾͑ͫ̓͒͗́͠a̸̪͓͈̿͒ͮ̚͜c̜̗͉͍ͪ̑͂͂̌͢ẗ̼̩͕͇̲̹̩̫̀ó̶̶͎̮ͪ̐̎̈͊ͨ̍ŕ͇́͜s̖͙̱̟ͯ̇ ̷̱̗͇ͯͣ̍̀͜å̪͕͚̼͈̲͍̃̍̌̄̚r̜͎͍̪͔̱̯͐͒̓ͮͪͧe̴̛̟̮̊̎̅ͨͅ ̺̮̳͔̻̜ͣ̅́̚l̘̱̟̤̹̆͑̍͗͒̑ͤͯ͝a̤̫̘̣͕ͭ͌̔̏͟u̎ͧͭ̆̀͏̘̼̭̤̻͘ģ̵̰͎̦͕̣̥͈̦ͭ͌ͥͤ̀h̝̹̣̥̊̃̇̉̑͡͝i̟̩͚̼͙̖̪̫͌ͥ̿n̢̠̯͑̏͂̐ͤ̈́̍̓ͭ͜g̡̮̫͊̎́̄̕ͅ ̩̯̭͓̹̘̰̗̗ͪͥ́̓̊̚̕̕a̞ͦͤ̆́̀̌̑̚̕͟͟t̢̢͎̖̤̖͔̹̗͐̌ͅ ̶͓̻͈̹̯̉̐ͬ̐ͪ̀y̴ͨ͂ͦ̈́ͬ̆́͟͏͎̙̦ö̟́u͙̱͕͈̝͔̇̃̑̆̊̀ ̞̼͚̲̆̉ͬ́r̬̳͎͙̰͙̩̬ͨͨ͟͞ḭ̘̲̞͓̞̲̍̔͒͟͞ͅg̤̱̰̼͖̩̞̣̲̓͐̚h̷̢̬̦͚͍̣̔̔t̪̏ ͚̲̝̱̯͈̎͗̊̍n̗̖̫ͤ͋̽͒̈́͡o̧͍͚̤̔̈́̎ͭ̉̍̈́̃̕ͅw̃̆ͧͮ̍̃̎̾͊҉̞̱̼?̢̛̦͚̱̦̩̥̖͂ͪͨ͠ ͉̮̠̲ͤ͒͛̒̅ͫ̀Y̵̙͔̖̝̰̰͓͈̌͛̊ͦ̑͗̈ͭ͂ͅoͣ͛̋̂ͦ̊ͬ͠͏̟̦̬̪̩͔̙u̴̜̰̓͋̏̑͞ ̜̤̰̈́ͥ̆͒͌̕j̷͙̪̅̌ͪ̃ͨ̊ͯu̴̥̻̟̱̮ͤͯs̋͞҉̫̜̩t̵̨͍͎̤̦ͮ͐̾ͯͩ̑̉ͬ͜ ̸̛͍̪̳͇͊͗͢m̡̨̗̯̬͊̾͌̊ͬ̓a͉̰̤͈͎̪̥̬ͩ̽ͩ̌̅̽̽k̷͐̽̇̂̀̎҉͉̣̱̠͈̼͍̯͙͘e̽̎͛̅҉̲̬͟ ̶̢̌̊͏͈̥̩͉̤̣̮̥ͅt̩̱͎̦̫̭̗͌̃͑̌̏̒͞ĥ̬̻́͐̀ͬ͌e̞̣͇̯̍̾ͯ̀̈́͊̎͒ǐ͐͋̍ͪ͋ͤ̒̓҉̠͓̪͖͖͝ͅr̢̫̥͕͇̦̳̓ ̵͕̙̞̻̼̯̘̪̥̇͌̔̈̊̉c͍̪̦̥͈ͦ̂ͩͫͭͣa͎̟̪̲ͩ̈́̀s̵̻͈̪͈͙̥̼̠̀͋̐͌e̩͌̓ͨ̉ͬ ̵̜̼͓̤͙̯̜̾̌͑̏f̭͕̖̒̉̏̉͊͐ͬ͡o̰̱̱̻̟͒̌r̖̫͕̍̏̏̎̔̎̎̕ ̈̄̔́҉̳̺̣̱͖̜̺t̝͎̙̀̃ͧͮ̅͛͟͟͝ẖ̸̛̩̬̗͐̒̋́͝ͅe̵̘͔͓̦͙͈̪̱̎͠m̟̩̜͈̦̪̊̍̍ͫ͛̓̍͝ͅͅ.̣̳͈̟ͦ̽͛̓͜͝ ̶̪͙̝̼̪͙̪ͮ̊ͦ̓͂͑̿̔͢A̴̡͍̳͎̜ͪͧ͂̔ͣş̦̖̮̞̋͑̓̓̒͆͌́̚ ͯ͒ͧ͒̉̊̓̽͏̛̰̰̤̰̠͎̖̜c̶͚͊͆̄ͣ̓ͩ̈̿́͠ͅl̫͙͕̜̩ͫ̔̊ͨ͝e͌͆̃̅̏̃͒́̚͏̞v̙̖̤͖̍͑ͅe̴̯̬̿̓̍̄ͫ͑̿ͧ̀r̥̲̪̜̳͍̬͆̀ͭ̅̈̈ͭͫ ̯͖̰͇̌̒ͣ͂̓̊͒ͪ̒͟a̛̭̺̲̤ͫ̐͒̈̉̚s̺͚̥̅͑̒ͥͤ̊ͩ͑ ̡̠̺͚̘ͥ͟͞I̢̙͇̙̭̤͓̬ͨ̒ͫ̈́ͯ͑̃̎ ̙̬ͫt̷̴̲̠̓͌̄͐̎ͧͅh͓͔̯̰ͬͧ̂̾ͪ̇̆̊i̸̧͉̠̥̠͓ͬͤ͟ǹ̴̔̃̆̂͗͋ͯ̋͏̛̯͖̪̪k̙̖̻͓͈͇̎́ͪ͊̊̔ͅ ̞̣̳͖͈̻̱̌̐̆̍̈́̋̏͊͟y̛̦̪̝̤̫͕̗͔̘̾̄ͥͭõ̵̡ͥ͏͎̤̰͇̪͔û̙̟̻̞͕͎̳͉ͨ̇̔͆̂͋r̀̆̄͌͞͏͚̝ͅ ̵̡̟͖̖̟ͦ̄͆ͦ̾̇̆͗ͧ̕e͐͐̐̎ͨ͆̔͘͏̨̻̘d̴͖̰̭̥̲͊͗ͬ̔͑ͥ̎ͨ́͢ḭ̡̡̹̭̗͉̽͗̈͆̃͡t͔̖̞̖̲̮͙ͮ̿̂ͥ̉͒ͪͪͅs̶̮̜̯̐̂̎ͥ͊̍͐͂ͪ͜ ̵̱͊͑ͤ͋̆ậ͎͙̫̯͉̳̥̌r̶̡̪̟̩͙̠̯̙ͪ͐̃͌̈͂̚͞e̷̮̙̞̯̭̟̓͗ͫ̈́,̲͈͕͛ͨ̔͟ ̵̟̤̓͐̂͛͐́ţ̙͇͖̠̰̭̑̈́ͧ̂̓͂̀̀h̶̜̘̼̩̱̹̹̹̑̇͊͐͘͠eͭ̉҉͇͔̭͠y͙̳̟͓̯ͩ̔̽͌ͮͅ ̶̯͎͙̺̤̏̔́̓̒ͯ̈́͡a̯̹̼̜͎̙̪̖̪͒̾ͦ͟r͑ͧ̋̆ͤ̄̕҉̼̜͔̥̙ͅę̦̬͖͎̳ͬͤͣ͢ ̨̪͔̫̺͍̭̯ͧ́̽ͩ͂p͖̻̙̦̫͓̠ͬͪͪr̤͖ͥ̑̀o̶̡̺̳̮̫̹̥͎̾b̳̙̺̻͕̃̉̽̾̌̉̔͌a̼̱͉̰ͮ̈́̈̽͛ͨ̈bͫ̒ͬ̋̎̽̚҉̞͔̟̳̫ḷ̝̞̰̟̻̖̒̍ͧ̓͂ͨ̀̓̀y̢̧͈̹̭̞̞̟̾͑ͨ͒͡ ̈́́̒̋̓ͫ̕͝҉̺̝s̱̮ͥ͆͒̽͘͟c͙͇͚͔̥͔̿̈ͅr̘̮ͮ̇͝ä̗̞̺̖͈̱̬̦̱́͂̐̈́͢͝tͬ̊ͣͨͫ̓͋͜͞҉͚c̥͕̯̻̝̗̰̉̈ͣͥͅh̡̼̥̜̯̹̬͍̟͐̾̎͒ͥ̽͛͋į͓̟̥͙̺̦͉͈̫̓̒̋̃̄ͩ̐̔͟ṇ̲̐͒͐́g̭͙̼̓́̚ ̷͈͉̜̣̞͈̀ͥͣ̓ͮͪ͋ͭ̓͠͝ṭ̶͙͉͖͇̳̌͐͗͒ͣͪ̃͢h̤͆ͮ̀͢ę͙͓̟̤̮̹̒̌ͭͯ͗ͧ͑̿ͩ͟i̛̪͕̼̣̳̬̠̩̱͋͂ͩͧͣ͂̃͌͌͜r͛͛̋̀͏̥͍̥̥̫ ̡̞̃̉̄͌̓̾͟h̏̃ͫ̿̇ͯ́ͫ̚҉̩͍ḛ̛̯͕̰̥͚̼͈̊̅̆ͦ̀ǎ̯̗̼͍̜̓̀ͤͨ͒̌̀͜ͅd̫̥ͧ͒̂ͧͥ̓͜͞s̴̼͔̱͔͔͕̃͗͘ͅ ̡̩̯̦̅̃͊̔ͨ͆̉́a̛͖̘̱̗͚̩̞̠ͬ͟n̸̙̓͛ͥͩd̸̳̹̎ͯ ͥͤ͝͏͈͍̘̪͇̰̖w̸ͬͣͦ̅̓̉͏̢̮̺̳͓̪o̵͈͎͊̌̈́̾͛́͟n̡̦͔̮̹͓̻̭͕̻̔́ḓ͈̳̣̟͂͌͠ḛ̩͔͖ͩ̎ͧ͝r̶̸̢̞̹͍̞̹̻̤͇͖̽̾ͦͫ̄i̤̫̤̺̜͇̭̯͕̒́̓̑̽͌ͮ̋ͯń̵͌̂҉͈͓g̬͚͆̊̇̄̋͜ ̛̜̱̠̬̩̞̪͂ͩ̄̓w̷̵̝͚̙̤͕̞͎̼ͮ͌̀̓̂̃̚͢h͓̖͎͖̙̗ͦ̎̊ͅy̳͈̪͍̦̠͗̆̂̇͠ ̻̌͌̈̉̚ỷ͕͍̝̭̞̠̱̖͂͐͌͢ơ̡̫̳̥̲̪̼̻̩͛̆ͧ̑̃ŭ̪͍̬̓̇̆̇͛ ̦̬̭̔̓͆͌ͪ͌̒͟ȧͥ͏̝͙̩͍̥r̩̫ͫͣ̏̀e̴̴̙̘̪͖͈̱̰͊͊̂̊͠ ̶͍̞̝̺͇̝͎̳͒́̆̀b̴̍̂̽҉̢̫e̅͋ͪ͏̯̝̗͓̻̹i̸̘ͮ͐̆̒͗͑ͣ̊n̷ͣ̉̈́ͫͩͮ͝҉̤͔̘̫g̯̭̬̺̘̟̯͚̎ͭͯ͗̚ ͇͇̟̦͚̜͓̤͋ͭs̱̫̜̄͊̀̿̀ͫͫͮ̂í̡̳̥͓̦̙͇̭̾͛̉́͂ͤ̑̀ͅl̶͉̳̰̠̈́̎l͔̞͐ͤ͐̾ͨ̆̀y̻̪̺̫͍̺̙ͥ̇̒̐ͥ.̡ͦ̋҉̸̳̩ ͮ͌̇̑̎ͥ̔҉͍̗̩͍̰͇Ť͇̜̘̟͇͓̠̣̣̈́̉ͪ̀͌̇h̛̖̯̖͔̯̠̰̍̓́̔̆̊͌̌͞ͅë̹̭͉́͒ͮ̅̍͢y̵̨̫͕͔͕͍͒̈̎̆͊ ̛̥̣̜̰̎̽͆̂̋̂ņ͔̼̱̐͋ͮ̿͘ơ̹̱͇͐͐̃͊̚͘ ͉̼̞̭̺͓͐̈́̃̓͠d̢̙̗͛̑ͪ͂o̸̙͌͒̾͛̽̒͡u̢͖̙͍̖ͫ̚̚͜b̛̬̯̜̝̍̌̄͜ṱ̙͇̯́ͧ̌ͮ̈́ ̭̖̬̒̋ͦ̓̄̓ͫ̉͊͜͠ä̧̜̮̝͔͇́̾ͤ̀̇͋͟͝ͅr̓̒͏͎̬̹e̶̘͚͎̍ͥ ͫ͆̉̆̔͏̺͚͝l̜̗͈̟̯̉̉ͮ̈́̔ͧ̚͝e͎̫͉̮ͨ̓͆͡ḟ͌ͫ̂͏̳̼̯ẗ̝̪̬̞̳̰̿̇̆ͦͅ ̨͓̙̤̗̬̠̘̂̃̓̿ͣ̿͐̆w͈̹̥̪̰̟̘͆͒̇ͩ͞ͅĩ̞̰̩͓̺͆̀ţ̩̖̝̺͈̪̓̊ͦ̍͜h̴̸͈͂̈̃́ͣ̕ ̡̼̩̪̟͓̺̱́̎ͫ̾͆͑̔͐t̗̜͓͛ͬͥ͑ͤͣ̒͝ḧ͖͔̥͕̱͊͋̄ͯẽ̩̝̑͒̐͟͝ ̶̦̹̬̯̫ͧ͐̃͌ͬ̋̾̿iͪͥ͏͉̤̮ͅm̸̢͇̻ͦͮ̐́̌p̶̛̤̭̬̯͎̬͕̥͑̀̏͊̎ͩ͂̕r̫̦̠̙͖̗̆͋̎ͮ͆̈́̐͐e̹̱̲͎̹̠̊̈̃̃͜ş̭̼̙̦̠̀̃̇̃͑ͫͬ͛ș̶̢̠̦̯ͥ͐̀͋̅̏͗i͒̉͂̋ͧ̄ͧ̓ͣ͏̠͇̗͍̠̫́͜ͅō̸͗҉̞̖̟̟̬n̘̟͈̩̔̾̐͢ ̟̖̞̟͕̄ͧͬ͗̀̊̈́͊t̏ͫ͆̆́̓ͣ͠҉̥̥̗h̵͎̘͂̋ͤ̾͜ą̨̥̟̞̝̰̦̋̊̄ͭ͌́ͅt̤̝͇̒ͩͧ̀̈͒̚͟ ̷̢͙̥̗̮̰̠͖̑ͥ̈͗ͨy̡̧̖̯͓̜̟̞̦͆́ͩŏ̸̭͙̺̼͎̠̻̃͑̄̇ͨ̍̈ǘ̸̩͓̤̝̹̬̘̯̃ͥ̌̾͛ͅ ͐ͩͯ̆̐̌̉҉̢̩̬̮̥̩̗̙h̰̻̘̖͚̠̦̽̌̀ͅa̼̬͓̳͓̙̤̜͋̀͞͝v̝̹̗͍͕̞̏̽ͥ̄e̮̲̣͇̝͕ͬ̄̄ͦ͢͡ ̨̘̘͉̰̜͖̞͙̮̽t̵ͫ͛ͪ͊̎̊͊͏̷͓͚h͖̣̀ͯ̅̀͝e͙̯͉̝̗͔ͪ̈́̈́̂ͥ̈͌̊ͅͅ ̷̧̥̯̳͕̗̦̦͚͔ͧͬ̅ͭ̀͒ͥ͞i͈̬̪͒ͧ͛̓ͪ̂ͩ̿n̟̫͍̻̗̝͖͔͕ͮ̂ͭ̈́t̂̔̇́͛͝҉͓͍̙̟ẽ̡̺̹̤͉̜̗̳̯ͯ͢ļ̫̰̪̠̝̝͉̊̇͛̌̀̀͝l͔͕͕̼ͤ͢ë̴͇͖̪̺͙̖͚́́c̛̺̹͍̥͛ͫ̃̉͗͌͑t͈̝̲̮̝̟͇̠ͫ͐̊̽̈ͧ̔u̹͔͇̠͚͛a̤̳̩͇ͣ͞l͑̾̈́͏̢͙̲ͅ ̋͗͐҉͇̮̱̫́͢c̖͔̏ͤ͗̀͝a͂̓̂ͩ͏̻̥̼̪͉͙́͠p̡͉̺̬̽̽̑̍̌̕ä̡̯͍́͒ͥͮͅc̢̲̝̤͊͐ͬi̸̙̺̥̰̯͎͈̇̊̇̈̀͝t͒͒̑́͏̩̳̲̩̣y̷̨̟̺̹̟̮͙̹ͭ̄ͧ͆͂ͫͣ͞ͅ ͈͍̲̩͈̈͗ͮ̈̀̀ȯ̶̎̊̀͏͕̰̥̹̻̳͝f̷̤̩̬͓̼̈͒̄̑̓ ̷̺̟̞͈̎̍ͥ͘ȁ̟̭͙͎̩̮̳̰̪ͯ̀̿̐ ̪̪͈́ͯ͌́́c͐̈́̑̿̑ͫͭͮ͌͏̣̼̣͝ȟ̟̻͓̻͙̰̳̝̤ͬͨ̓ͦ͗͒͜͞ǐ̵̧̛͚̬͇̺̺̗͂́͑l̿̓̆͏̛̟̣̺͉͙ͅd̡̹̔̃̉̌̑͑ͬͣ͠!͔͖̯̬͖ͣ̐́͜1̢̦̙̆ͤͩ̎̃̃͗̚̕
    ̯̮̱͕ͫ̅ͩͨ͞ͅ2̉͗҉̛͙̞̜̻͍̥͔
    ̵͖ͭ̈̍͗4̻̞̭̗͕̱͍̜̀́͞ ͐̀͋̐̓ͨ̽͏̯͖̪̗͞3̽̔͏̴͚͘ ̴̶͔̞ͫ̊́͜ ̝̗̻̣̩̘̙̩͌͑̅̒͑͆ ̨̥͖̦̓̇̋̽̓ ͣ̿ͬ҉̷̲̱̱̱͉̠̗̦͝ ̶̵̦̄͗ͤ̆̓̀͠ ̴͙͚̑͐̓̓ͫ̇̈́̅ ̪͙̩̫̹̏ͬ ̧̺̩͓̟̳̟́̉̽͟ͅ ̛͖̼͉̮̲̮̳̌̄ͬ̃̂̌ ̙̩̺̾͆̄̄̉̂̍ͪ́ ̜͉͇̅̒ͭ̔̐͊͐̚ ̢̞͓̖̿̃ ̢̰͕͙̤̝̭̟̓̇̈́͞ͅ ̌ͧͧͭͣ̆҉͈̯̙̲͇͇̘͓̫ ̶̣̭͕͚̟̭̙̃͒ͪ̔͒̋̇̕͡ ̬͙̜͍̰̪̝̟͆͛̕͠6̺̻͈̣̞̠̉̾̏̄̒͢͠6̸̤͉̬̰̱̈͊͘6̬͍̘̗̺̭̱̑̉̾ͧͬͪͫ̈͗͟ ̳͎͓̤̥̯̩̩̃ͤͣͩ̉ ̧̢̑ͩ̏̈́̏͏͕͕ ̀̄̓҉̗̮͞ ̫̏͊̇ͭͭ̀͜ ̩̗̙͗̇͂͝ ̣̖̦̜̭̱͎̩̋̈ͪ̐͜͢͞ ͙̻̈́͊͘ ̩̝̼͙̰ͣ͡ ̧̈́ͩ͝͏̱̠͓͎̲̠̺̮ ̵̨͙̬͙̣̹ͪͬ̏͊̂ͪ ̯̈́̐ͤͫ̊͒͐ ̺͙ͩͦͮ̔ ͍̊ͮ͋̆͢ ̵̢̼͚̒̉ ͨ͆ͥ̽̃̓̃҉͡͏̺̖͔̳͉̻̫ ͈̻̗͚̟͓͌͝ ̷̦̘̖̺̤̺͑̅ ̧̛̛͍̟̜̖̤͓͎̲ͪ̌̉ͫ͋ͧͥͯ̍ ̧̠͉̮͚̮̱͂̑̀͌͆͢ ̴̞͍̠͋͑̎̈ͣ̓̀ ̶̫͊̊ͬ͗ͬ̊̅ͬ͐ ̺̳͗͒ ̭̪͕̪͇̼͓̰̈́͗̍ͅ ̷̮̮̪̹̘̈́̓̅ͩ́ͪ̀ͅ ̸̷͉͖̗͔̘̹̜̈́͋ͪ̍ͭͮ̾̏ ̧̬͚̞̹̺͕̺̳̭̋͛̾̊̎͘ ͮ̓ͮ҉̭̩ ͕͂ͪ̇ͯ͂̃ͮ̿ͩ́͜ ̹͖̝͇̱̩̣̋͆̊̽̃̽͡ ̣̹̠̲͉̺̺͇ͬͩͬ͜͝͡5̴̮̫̱͚̝̠̳̙̌̍̀͜
    ̢͙̈̒͊̉͡4̷̜͙̟̭̤̫̗̩ͥ̅ͨ̏̄ͨͧ͒͠ ̢͇͉͕̼̻̮͇̭̟̏ͧ̐͒͑̿̀̚͠4̨̤͉̰̗͈̜̹̄́͟ ̛͓͇͇̘̻̰͉̞̘̂͑̋ ̻͊̒ͬͪ͞ ̥̠͉̜̓̈́̾̆̆̈ ̰̙̫͈̈͋̀͟ ̬̥̩ͨ̿̓̾̂̒͐́̚͠͡ ̖̻͕͕͖͔ͧ͋̐ͥ̄ͧ ̼̲͈̰͇͓̰͓̿̊̏̑̓̈̚ ̧̜̙̥͇͍͍͖̖̉̂ͬͯ̓ͅ ̵̞̦̊ͣͣ͐ ͪ̆͗̋͏̭̮̩͎̰͓ ̅́̿͆ͭ̏̆͏̤͎͈̜̳͓̦ ̂̉͛ͣ̈́̽̄͏͔̻̤̫̼ ̦͕̩̩̤̻̲͂̉ ͖͉͕͇̠̬͇̥ͪͤͨ̏ͧ̓̋ͯ̏ ̴̲͖͇ͪ̇͋ͥ̿̾̈́͞6̶̛͚̺̑́̑͛̚6̴̵̦͍̎̈̽̍ͨͬ6̸̲̹͉̘̼͎̣̾̄̔ͨͯͭ͢͞ ̧̗̱̦̘̟̘ͥͬͯ̐̒̈͋̚̕͠ ̶̜̠̟͎͚̜̓ͤ̏̓ͩͨͩ̽͆ ͎̫̟͎̑̓ͤ̀̚͟ ̅̊͑ͦ̂͊҉̻̙͚͚̺̘ͅ ͑̾̔ͨͨ̀͡҉̘͚͖̩̮͓̗ ̋ͯ̉ͥ̒ͥͪ҉̻͈͈̭̻̬̮̬ ̛̣̩͕͙̱̟̤̩ͩͮ̃̇̏̐̑͊ͫ ̳̤̣̠̮͇̤̙ͤ͂͌̿͂̇͘͡ ̫̞̳͖̩̦̇̅͠ ̡̅͗ͯ̏͐̀҉͓͎̥̰̣̘̰͔ ̛̩̻̲̹̯̹̲̭̈́̾́̃ͩ͑̉͐̎́ ͔̣̙̮̯͙̳̉̂ͮ̓ͤ̒͟ ̢͕͓͕͇̼̞̠̲͛́ ͖͓͌̊ͭ͛̾ͭ͌ͦ͛ ̡͙̘̰̺̘̫̦ͮ͂ͤ̾ͦͪ̅̋͂̀͜ ̬̙̯̹͎̙͙͊̈́̄̄̐̈́ͥ ̵̷͚̇ͬ̆ͭͦ̅ͬ́̚ ̂́̊ͮͭ̉҉̬̦̞̘̮̳͎ ̟̞̓̅͜ ̢͖̘͍̦͓͍̦ͩ̊̑̏ͥ̉̾̒ͭ ͉̟̲͓̜͔̣ͣ̓ͦ͂ͫͣͅ ̹̈́͐̈ͤ̋́̀ ̱ͣͭ̈͐̅͋̐͊ ̴̘̝̺͉̮̣̬ͤ̿̈̿̾̍̄͆͞ͅͅ ͙͔͓͉͛̈́̑̂̉ͅ ̴̧̬̬͕̤̖͈͒̑͢ ̖̼͕͖̏̊͐̽̽͐̄ͥ͐ ̢̖͕̩̟̻̫͇̣͈̊ͥ̿ ̵̨̜͈̈͐̿̽̑̓͞ ̓ͨ̔̑̚҉͓ ̮̰̲̗͉͈̂͌͂͋̇̍͌́6̲͍̺̯̟̻̐͜͞ͅ
    ̵̰̬͔̝̱̞ͨ̿͆̚͠ ̸̼̱͓̭̆ͬ͋͆ͣͅ ̵ͥ̿͂҉̫͙̬͍͔5̻̫͕̬̠̋͊ͫ͑ͥ̀̔͛́ ̬̺̙̹͚̜̼̗̬̿͝ ̘̱̳̳͙̦̱͍̃̑̍ͭ̓͠ ͔̂ͮ ̧͇̦̙̫͓͉̞̂͒ ̼̗̟̫͓̯̰̦̇ͦ͟͞ ̶̦̬͎̲͂ͯ̾̊͢ ̯͉̰̭̱̼̜̐̑͑̍̽̚͘͠ ̵̧̖̟̝̗̰͔̤͎̖̇̏̆ͣ͛͘ ̣͖̱͍͕̖̠̥̅ͧ͆̓̌͡ ̶̡͎̱̙ͩ̐̋͋̾̀ ̦̥̌ͥͬͦ̔̎͡ ̧͎̗̯ͣͮͭ̏͒̌̓̀ ̴̨͖̦̥͖̤̻͕̘͇ͫ̊̂̈ͮ͠ ̧̥̦̜͇̱͑ͧ̂́ ͕͙̹̜͖͈̘̉͐̅̈́ͦ͗ͦ̚͡ ̭̹̮̲̜̹͙̍̿̏̑̊̀̇͜͢ ̢̜̰̭̗̠͍̞͓̅̈̎̓ ͮ̍͗̽̀ͨ̅ͨ̀҉̤̹̲͎̥͚̰̟͝6̴̛̟͎̬̙̻̤͂̂ͅ6̋̾͌̅ͨͧ̓ͯ͢҉̣̱̫̮̲͈͙̝6̸͖͙͕͙͉̓ͤ̓ ̸ͫͭ͛̊ͫ̐͌̃̂҉͓̝͎̹͓ ̸̭͖͕̳̞̑͛̂ ̛̗̺̮̟̤̼̦̞͑ͤ͘ ̵̣̙̋̃͊́ͮͪ̆ ̲̠̬̳̂̂̆̌ͧ ̢̟̥͚̤͉̯͙̥̹̓̌̓̀ ͓̞̝̹̫̯̊̽ͦ̏̆͡ͅ ̶̙͕̮̥̤͍̲̽̒̑ͅ ̴̡̠ͭͬͦ͢ ̨̱̤̣͈̖̰̮̙̪͆͒̓̓̿͆ͭͨ͒ ̶̢̗̤̟̻͔̖͓̗̔ͨͮͣ̀ͣͩͧ̍͘ ̫̉ͯ̄̔̇̚ ̢̩̚͞͞ͅ ͙̬̀̈͂̀ ͥͤ͒ͨ̒ͩ͂҉̶̺̘̙̲̳̲͘ ͭ̐͋ͫ̒̒͘҉͍̗̰͈̜͕̱ ̸̲̲̝̟̒̾̃͒̿ͧ̿ ̶̮̬͓̼̹̳͔͚͗̓̄ ̶̧̨͖͔̫̰̈́̔͑͛̅̋̀̿̒ ̡̩̥̦̦̫͚̞̠̐̏̒͆̽ͪ ̝̰̦̞̮̠ͯ̀ͨͧ͐ͮ͂͌ ̯̙̽ ̶͍͈͙̰͓̙̖͉͌̍̉ͅ ͖̺̬̂ͧ̋̇͆ͧ̊̊̀ͅ ̸̛̬̯̅̾̐͛͗ ̵̢̃͐̇ͨ͒ͅ ̶̘̜̳̣̻͈͎͗̇͑̽̏͝ ̶̰̲͇̣̞͙̟̂̉̉7̵̜̲̖̎̅ͮ͗ͬ̉́͝
    ̵͎̥̹̊ͯ͊̉̈́̆͛͋͞ ̢̨͖̱̲̪͉̜̑̔̚ͅ6̌ͪ̐̈̒̄͏̞̣̺͚̣̖͢ͅ
    ̖̗̪̜̑̌͗͒ͥ̕͜ ̨͔̠̹̤̩̂̓̇̚6̥̰̦̬͕̺͗̋̈́ͯ́ͧͮͤ̀͜
    ̼̗̓ͤ̚ ̤̐ͦͦ͑̎͂ͫ̆̀͢͝6̳̠͛̇̾́
    ͙̫̝̮̜̼̜̮͌̄̏̾̾̈́͂̕ ̶̯̰̜̬ͤͩ̎6̷͕̣̹̞̈́̂̃͠
    ̰̩ͬͦ͂ ̬̟̗̀̒ͭͯ̿̍ͥ̀6̸̷͔̟̪ͩ̇̎̽͐̒̓̒̀
    ͎̥̤̫͎̲̀͛ͮͫ̽ͦ̀͡͝ ̲̯̼͖̮̹͌͑ͯͩ͌̀̕͜6̦̞͕̮ͯ̒̏̌̀̚͜
    ̮̭̼̫͍͔ͫ̃̐̚͠ ̶̤̰̭͎̜͉͙͖ͦͦ̒͂͠6͚̰͈̗̰͉̳̜̫̿ͮ̾̒̊̀̂̆

  • SQuiller

    Justin. Apologies for the misattributed quote about glocks ‘n threats in my last comment. Skimmed over a comment on another blog and wrongly read it as coming from you. Should be more careful.

    • http://www.patheos.com/blogs/rockbeyondbelief/ Justin Griffith

      That had me really scratching my head… I’m trashing it, thanks for the explanation.

  • http://www.patheos.com/blogs/rockbeyondbelief/ Justin Griffith

    Anyone wondering what is going on with George, he’s a nagnostic who refuses to be answered. You can’t win with him. He’s had dozens and dozens of people explain things to him. He has no idea what is going on regarding FtB, slyme, laden, etc. He’s just a jilted troll. So I’ve resorted to converting his posts to esperanto, or other silliness until I run out of ideas.

    If I edit a serious poster (everyone but george, likely) it will be annotated and probably explained in a brief note.

  • George

    Here is one you might want to squiggle out. Hatch Act and your Facebook conduct less then 24 hours after kids were killed. You are a Federal employee right?

  • Theo Ffensivatheist

    He’s “taken seriously” where, by who? The guy’s not well, that should be obvious to anyone who takes even a passing interest in this shit. The only way these people get better is when they eventually hit bottom & ask for help. That does mean having a little humility, can anyone genuinely see this “man” being humble?

  • George

    Don’t worry about deleting. I have screenshots of it all. Remember I said don’t provide links to your Facebook! I’m just looking for the department to submit my complaint.

    Merry Christmas

  • George

    I have really enjoyed playing with you, but you are far too easy to mess with! I hope to come across you again when I need a good laugh.

    Anyhow, good luck to you in your career, people like you are invaluable. The free world needs you to defend our freedoms.

  • Pitchguest

    [JG: Sorry man - it's a 'blog house rule' no ancient history... even if I agree. Sorry to slice up your comment, I know it was heartfelt.]

    After having done all that, he was still happily blogging at FTB with no questions asked. Except for when he threatened you with physical violence, and I suppose the line — even on FTB — has to stop somewhere. They relegated it back to the backchannel, attempted to keep it private, as per Ed’s own admission. You forced their hand. They couldn’t NOT get rid of him. Or “resigned”, according to Laden.

    [JG edit/reply: There really is some grain of truth to the resign/fired. Greg did indeed flounce first. 'You can't fire me, I quit!' Seriously, it was within an hour of me bringing the threats to light. If Ed did want it kept private, it was not because he took Greg's side, but because he was sick of the drama. He also probably just wanted to protect the FtB name from Laden's fallout. Isn't that a natural urge? Strange bit of truth: In fact after that laughably pathetic phone call I received from Greg Laden, I actually called Ed Brayton and told him that I did not ask for Greg Laden to be censored, or punished. However, I also didn't think Tf00t's posts violated any rules, because we didn't have any at the time! Ed (rightly so) was dismissive of the idea. He had to put some feet down and not everyone was going to be happy. A new and much needed 'no animosity in the backchannel' initiative came a little too late, but at least it came.]

    I’m sorry, Justin, but I just don’t get it. You stuck up for Abbie and got blasted for it. Then you recanted and apologised. Greg Laden threatens you with violence and most of the blog network’s biggest names all but support Laden, shuns you, at which point you again recant and apologise. What’s the deal? You keep removing posts that are supportive of you and condemnant of the network, and all I can say is why? Why? Why do you constantly try to gain their approval when you know they’re not even trying to gain common ground? I say if you want to write topics supportive of Abbie Smith, do so.* If you want to write topics condemning Greg Laden, do so. Don’t beat around the bush.

    *Frankly the way you doubled down from that blog post was disheartening. Sad.

    [JG reply - I wrote to Abbie ahead of time, she saw what I wrote before it posted. If I have a strong disagreement with somebody, I'll typically write to them first. More than half the time, I end up not posting anything (especially in the context of military activism). Abbie was professional as hell during our brief exchange. I really thought I was condemning her strongly, while still saying she shouldn't be attacked at the work place. I now realize that so many people misunderstood my intent that it was really just a shitty blog post.

    I've removed a handful of posts, and I'm sure they were posted on the pit. A couple I held longer than others because I was having fun with George's comments for a bit, but 90% of posts and 100% of on-topic posts were let through.

    I don't necessarily want 'pro-abbie' or 'anti-greg' support, though support is most definitely wanted. I want 'pro-foxhole atheist' support, if that makes sense. My needs don't fit neatly into either tribe's (for lack of a better term) narrative. Though Greg Laden clearly needed to be exposed - even I had no idea - I frankly should have just kept my mouth quiet about the slime pit. I was stupid to think that peace could be had. I have no answers, as you may have read in my comment on Ron Lindsay's blog post about shunning.

    FYI I'm replying to some of the lengthy comments like this so as not to upset the comment numbering and further confuse this dialog.]

  • http://itsmyworldcanthasnotyours.blogspot.com WMDKitty (Always growing and learning)

    *SMFH* I think you need some therapy, man.

  • chasstewart

    All Mykeru could do was laugh at his bumbling antipathy. I agree that Laden has absolutely no credibility outside of a few bloggers and who really cares about those few? Once he’s been linked to, you can stop worrying about the argument, close the tab and find something worthwhile to read. Thanks for bringing this to people’s attention and I hope others heed your call.

  • http://www.flickr.com/photos/57026708@N00/132604716 Purple Buffalo on Auburn Avenue

    My typing is bad sorry if I read like spam. Greg & friends should stop what they started bfore it is something they cannot stop. that is all. merry christmas .

  • Eshto

    I’ve seen the “harassment” Greg gets on Twitter. It’s just mocking, and he’s as much to blame for it as anybody else. He makes intentionally provocative statements, mocks others and they mock him back. If Twitter upsets him that much he should stop engaging with the people mocking him.

    There is a culture of cyber-atheists who take to facebook and twitter with the purpose of creating controversy and division, feeding trolls, pushing people’s buttons and then acting like victims when people push back. Greg is part of that culture. This petty bickering and infighting is beyond absurd. It doesn’t address or solve any issue related to feminism or any other topic.

    There should be a very basic set of on-line ethical standards everyone abides by. Do not make threats. Do not needlessly insult people you disagree with. Do not violate people’s privacy by posting screen captures of their private facebook conversations out of context to start drama. Until this community grows up and learns how to use social media like adults, this b.s. will continue.

  • http://www.flickr.com/photos/57026708@N00/132604716 Purple Buffalo on Auburn Avenue

    I think I’m in spam.

    can my comment go through, I am suportive.

  • http://www.flickr.com/photos/57026708@N00/132604716 Purple Buffalo on Auburn Avenue

    I gave up twitter after seeing what ahppened to the atheism+ tag.

  • http://www.facebook.com/autumnsfantasy Jennifer Anker

    Large man, martial arts, pit bull, gun? o.O This man is most likely a small man with a complex, which explains the need to create this online tough bully persona with a desire for petty revenge and aggression. Not to mention that any well-trained martial arts includes understanding the importance of not being aggressive unless absolutely necessary.

  • http://iacb.blogspot.com/ Iamcuriousblue

    The stupidity of Laden’s actions just amazes me. One would think he would have learned something from earlier conflicts that involved doxing. That with all the high indignation about feminists getting doxed or almost-doxed, he would avoid such blatant hypocrisy by doing the exact same thing. What did he think there was to gain?

    Still, no skin off my nose, since I basically don’t like the guy and want him to be embarrassed.

  • emburii

    I have a Rock Beyond Belief dog tag wrapped around my rearview mirror. Your event was good for a lot of people, including a friend on-base who was easing into the entire atheist thing and found it to be a lot of fun.

    Death threats, harassment, all of it is shameful especially to someone who devotes so much time, resources, and reputation trying to look out for others. I haven’t thought much of Greg Laden before, and this really seals him as a hypocrite and a poisonous personality. It may not count for much, and it is a little tempered (why must you support evo-psych?), but this is at least one voice supporting you and thanking you for what you do.

  • http://www.oolon.co.uk/ oolon

    I don’t agree with posting Mykerus address or employment details… However I’d hazard a guess it is exactly what he wanted Greg to do. I should have warned him about Mykeru. What I said to Mykeru on my blog in response to his threats of hunting me down and ice picking me

    … I’ll re-iterate, I don’t think Mykeru is an axe wielding maniac. I referred to his blog and right-wing loon baiting early on in our exchange on the pit, he seems to think this tough-guy routine gets results for him and fancies trying it out on atheists. I saw your little tete-a-tete with Greg Laden, didn’t manage to goad him into much did you? Maybe you will eventually, good luck with that.

    So again, as you need to say everything at least twice for Slymepitters to get it, I don’t think it was a good idea and I think Greg got played by Mykeru. He will be milking this for Slyme-cookies for years to come…

  • http://www.patheos.com/blogs/rockbeyondbelief/ Justin Griffith

    @Oolon

    I don’t think it was a good idea and I think Greg got played by Mykeru.

    Greg definitely got played by Mykeru. However, I still think he’s laying a trap by posting his own address so publicly in a ‘plausible deniability’ way. He hoped Mykeru would be dumb enough to respond in kind.

    However, Mykeru is a LOT smarter than Laden… additionally, he doesn’t seem to really give a shit about being doxxed, though if that information had been more current about his ex-wife, I think Laden should have just started running (in any direction). Mykeru’s probably tough, but his ex-wife seems to be… powerful. He described her in a pretty touching way, actually.

    Will somebody take the bait and let Laden have his martyrdom? Hard to say.

    So again, as you need to say everything at least twice

    Well if you cut out the nonsense in the middle, perhaps you wouldn’t have that problem.

  • jackiepaper

    Justin, did you really just call that slimy cyber bully smart and then reiterate that you believe that Greg was “provoking” his bully into threatening him? Are you fucking high? Now Greg is playing the “martyr” because your “clever” friend has chosen him as his newest in a line of harassment targets and you have decided that it would be fun to join in? That is some seriously F’d up S, Justin.

    • http://www.patheos.com/blogs/rockbeyondbelief/ Justin Griffith

      @Jackiepaper

      Calling somebody a lot smarter than Greg Laden is not a compliment. It’s a given.

  • http://www.oolon.co.uk/ oolon

    Hmm not sure I’d rate Mykerus intelligence too highly… He got very animated on the pit at a conversation myself, Aratina and Ophelia had on twitter about the possibility he was a Hoggle sock. Said we were threatening and d0x’ing him… Was pretty quickly obvious to me that this was an act – especially with the over the top legal threats and threats of violence he comes out with. A cursory glance at his blog and it was confirmed to me that this is an act he effects to try and goad his targets into saying and doing things they might regret…

    This seems to be the only trick he has hence he moves around trolling different communities then moves on when everyone presumably blocks and ignores him. I really don’t see what he gets out of it, Justin gets some schadenfreude, but what does Mykeru get? Frankly I think you may be close to the mark when you say he is “smarter” than Greg… But moving away from the warm fuzzy feeling you got from seeing Greg pwned can you really say it is smart or intelligent to annoy someone until they react? I used to do it as a kid in the back of the car to my sister — when she inevitably hit me I’d complain to my Mum and she’d get told off. I mostly grew out of this sort of behaviour, Mykeru obviously never managed it.

    • http://www.patheos.com/blogs/rockbeyondbelief/ Justin Griffith

      @Oolon

      But moving away from the warm fuzzy feeling you got from seeing Greg pwned can you really say it is smart or intelligent to annoy someone until they react?

      If you’re talking about me, you’re off. I had every intention of continuing radio silence. When he re-extended his threats against me several months later, wtf am I supposed to do? As he cozies up next to people who know exactly what he did, and then start telling alternate universe versions?

  • Leni

    Internet asshole stalk other internet asshole and gets his ex-wife half-assedly doxxed so he could make the point that assholes will be assholes. Movie at 11!

    Jesus, this whole thing is like a Russian doll of stupid.

  • stakkalee

    You say that “given his [Laden's] history of bullying and his direct threats of violence [towards me]” we can “safely label [Laden] a serial harasser.” Given the evidence posted by Stephanie Zvan, of Mykeru making direct threats of violence and bullying towards Greg Laden, can we label Mykeru a serial harasser, both of Laden and of Stephanie Zvan? If you agree, how would you have recommended Laden deal with Mykeru’s serial harassment? In the past you say you’ve forwarded threats to the FBI – can you tell us what the response has been in the past to you reporting these threats to the authorities?

    • http://www.patheos.com/blogs/rockbeyondbelief/ Justin Griffith

      @Stakkalee

      Given the evidence posted by Stephanie Zvan, of Mykeru making direct threats of violence and bullying towards Greg Laden, can we label Mykeru a serial harasser, both of Laden and of Stephanie Zvan? If you agree, how would you have recommended Laden deal with Mykeru’s serial harassment? In the past you say you’ve forwarded threats to the FBI – can you tell us what the response has been in the past to you reporting these threats to the authorities?

      DUH.

      1) Always report threats. If it happened on twitter, report it there. They get directly in touch with law enforcement ASAP. If it was on your blog, getting the IP is a possibility (though not 100%). Then you know what city’s PD to contact. They can trace it back to a house.

      2) Do NOT publicly demand their home address… WTF?

      3) Do NOT publish their home address on the internet… first of all DUH. Then second of all, it makes you vulnerable to a lawsuit, and it weakens your legal case. Not to mention WTF!!!???

  • trinioler

    Hey Justin.

    Could you please stop defending and joking with serial harassers? This is not the first time you’ve done so. You joked with Mykeru on twitter. You encouraged one of Laden’s harassers.

    That is shitty. Please stop it. Be the bare minimum of a decent human being and just avoid anything and anyone to do with Laden. Don’t pile on. Don’t encourage his harassers. Don’t joke with them. Don’t talk to them.

    • http://www.patheos.com/blogs/rockbeyondbelief/ Justin Griffith

      Could you please stop defending and joking with serial harassers? This is not the first time you’ve done so. You joked with Mykeru on twitter. You encouraged one of Laden’s harassers.

      That is shitty. Please stop it. Be the bare minimum of a decent human being and just avoid anything and anyone to do with Laden. Don’t pile on. Don’t encourage his harassers. Don’t joke with them. Don’t talk to them.

      In other words, you’re saying you’ll never talk to Greg Laden again.

  • stakkalee

    Twitter’s only acts when an account has violated their Rules and Terms of Service. The only part of their ToS governing violence and threats says “You may not publish or post direct, specific threats of violence against others.” Unfortunately none of the tweets posted by Stephanie Zvan seem to rise to the level of violation. Beyond that, Twitter recommends you contact your local law enforcement, but Twitter will not give out a user’s personal information without a supoena or court order, which means that Laden’s local PD would have no recourse to track down Mykeru (as again, the tweets don’t seem rise to the level of legal harassment.) Given that information, do you think if Laden reported Mykeru he could expect any cessation of the harassment? Do you think it fair that Laden’s likely only recourse to stop the harassment would be to remove himself from Twitter, a public platform, thereby ceding the ground to a stalker and harasser?

    • http://www.patheos.com/blogs/rockbeyondbelief/ Justin Griffith

      which means that Laden’s local PD would have no recourse to track down Mykeru (as again, the tweets don’t seem rise to the level of legal harassment.)

      Right now, you’re opening yourself up to ‘making false accusations’. I haven’t even clicked through to see any of the stuff yet. I’m just saying that you’re not being a good client for whatever lawyer (civil) or DA (criminal) court you’d hope to press charges in. You are freely admitting that the tweets don’t seem to rise to the level of LEGAL harassment. Therefore you’re saying it’s not a crime. Yet you still want to report it, or take further action of some sort.

      You report crimes. You ignore non-crime “hurt my feelings” stuff, or blog about it, or argue back, or whatever. As long as you yourself don’t resort to crime, you’re ok! If you think you might have a case in the future, or are hoping to establish a pattern of contact for some court, giving out a home address (even an incorrect one) will make your case thrown out instantly, and may generate charges against you.

  • stakkalee

    Yes, I’d noticed that you’ve responded (several times) to Jason Thibeault’s post on the subject, but have yet to respond to Stephanie’s post. You should go read Stephanie’s post and then decide whether you want to characterize what Mykeru did as “‘hurt my feelings’ stuff.” Please understand, I’m not trying to justify what Laden did. But your post only tells half a story. You owe it to your readers, and yourself, to report the whole story. Regardless, have a Merry non-denominational solstice celebration.

    • http://www.patheos.com/blogs/rockbeyondbelief/ Justin Griffith

      Regardless, have a Merry non-denominational solstice celebration.

      I quit drinking a few months back. Not likely. ;)

  • http://www.youtube.com/user/noelplum99 noelplum99

    Interesting as all this is one of the plus points of this drama is that I end up getting introduced to new blogs i hadn’t read before, which is great!

    Your championing of irreligiosity in the US military seems an awesome thing to do and i firmly believe it will be an undertaking that will get easier as the years role on

    Sorry if that is a bit OT, happy new year and all that,

    jim

  • Shelly Leit

    Greg Laden is a total asshole. I hope some day he gets sued and finally stops harassing people. He did the same to me, and many others. He’s a sociopath and a misogynist. His hobby is attempting to destroy people on his various blogs. He’s a sick, twisted man and is probably dangerous and his online friends are the same.

  • Shelly Leit

    Stephanie is also a psychopath who also loathes fairness, truth and humanity. I wouldn’t believe a word that evil bitch says.

  • Shelly Leit

    That’s hilarious — Greg himself is a misogynist and hates women.


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