John Stephenson has a video up of this Phelps-Roper woman spewing her disgusting “bible-based” rhetoric. Watching just a bare minute of it made tremble, not in fear of the Lord, as this woman might like, but in pure revulsion. I transcribed a little:
“‘Sempre Fi Fags’ means, ‘you are always faithful to the fags…’ not only that but you have sinned away your grace and America is doomed! Why don’t they file a lawsuit against the Lord their God, they are messing with the wrong God…you don’t get to call the Word of God hatred, missy…You’re messing with the wrong God, also…(American soldiers) are being cut off by the same (garbled) God who is cuttin’ off the children of America…God hates fags…You’re proud! You’re proud of your sins. You can’t do enough sinning. You think ‘gay’ pride, bimbo. You have sinned away your day of grace!”
She quotes Leviticus “Thou shalt not suffer this sin upon them but in anywise rebuke them…that means you warn ‘em that their sin is takin’ them to hell an’ if you don’t do that you (garbled) hate (garbled) in your heart.”
Hmmmmm……so this woman stands outside of military funerals and harrasses the mourners because she looooooooves everyone so much in the Lord. She calls down hell upon homosexuals because she looooooooooves them so much in the Lord.
Sometimes I wonder if there are people out there who embrace scripture simply so they can distort it and try to use it to excuse all of their twisted hate and bitterness.
I’m guessing “hate the sin and love the sinner” is not a big motto in this Phelps-Roper household. And I guess she doesn’t give credence to the idea that to “rebuke” or “admonish” does not mean “stand in judgement of…” but rather that we sinners, having tasted the Milk and Honey, are called to bring our fellow sinners to understanding of where we fall short and how we distance ourselves from God, that we may help them know Christ and his mercy and grace.
Nothing I read in scripture tells me that the job of a Christian is to pronounce doom on a nation, use words like “fag” (homosexual is a perfectly useful word for what you want to say, Mrs. Phelps, and I doubt Jesus would call a homosexual a “fag”) and decide in a matter of discourse with another person whether that person is going to heaven or hell. That judgement belongs to God, alone, and it seems to me a grave sin against humility for any human to point their finger and tell another the state of their soul.
What did Paul write in his letter to the Colossians 3:12-17
Because you are God’s chosen ones, holy and beloved, clothe yourself with compassion, kindness, lowliness, meekness and patience, forebearing one another and, if one has a complaint against another, forgiving each other; as the Lord has forgiven you, so you must forgive. And over all these put on love, which binds everything together in perfect harmony. And let the peace of Christ rule in your hearts, to which indeed you were called in the one body. And be thankful. Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly, as you teach and admonish one another in all wisdom, and as you sing psalms and hymns and spiritual songs with thankfulness in your hearts to God. And whatever you do, in word or deed, do everything in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God the Father through him.
I know there are some monastic houses where the infection of political correctness has seeped in and made a community decide that their commitment to “peace and justice” has inspired them to omit those sections of the psalms which are “dark” or “vengeful” or “desolate” from their recitations of the Divine Office. I think that’s a mistake. The psalms are a perfect reflection of the human experience and the human condition, and to omit any part of it because it makes you uncomfortable is to push away some truths about just how dark the world, and the humans in it, can be. Contrarily, there seem to be some Christians who cull the starkest, least merciful verses of scripture in order to embrace them to their withered souls in the interest of “justice.”
In both cases, the intentional omission/editing of scripture – or the rabid emphasis on one part of scripture over another – seems to me to smack of imbalance and pride – who is anyone to decide that one verse of scripture is more or less worthy of prayer, meditation and action, than any other verse? Even if their intention is a noble one, the fact remains that a mere human, or a mere community, really has no business deciding what part of God’s word should be left aside because it doesn’t fit the times or the mores. What was it Chesteron said, “the moment you choose anything, you reject everything else…”
Scripture is not meant to be picked over, with some morsels plucked for their sweetness (or their bitterness if your heart is bitter) and others left behind as unappetizing. It is meant to be taken as a whole, for it is as huge as your whole life and it takes that long to begin – just to begin – to digest it.
The woman from Fox News (I don’t watch, and I seem to see two names for her online, Julie Meyers and Julie Bandares) seemed as sickened by this diamond-hard-with-hate-eyed Phelps woman as I was, and she lost control of herself. Perhaps the best response to a woman like this is a soft, “I’ll pray for you,” but it wouldn’t shut her up.
I got a lot of emails from people telling me last week that to respond or react to Ann Coulter gives her the publicity she craves, and that if I could not comprehend the method in her madness, then I should just ignore her and “not criticize a fellow conservative.” (I’ll leave aside for now the issue of how these folks dishing out the advice were the same folk who do nothing but criticize those conservatives who don’t fall in line…that’s for another day.)
Perhaps they are right, that I should merely have ignored Coulter. The same could be said about this woman – to respond to her gives her publicity, makes her known, gives more exposure to her filthy rants. But in both cases (and I am not lumping Coulter in with these Phelps disasters – next to them she is an angel with a halo…) my own conscience will not let me simply “ignore” them and let them stand – unremarked upon – as examples of America, or of Christians, or of Conservatives or of Women. As a woman and a Christian, and an American, I cannot help but respond to the antics of both women and say, “please understand…these women are free to speak their minds, but I believe their pronouncements are abberations…this is uncommon…”
Maybe someday in the grand scheme of things, I will be proved wrong about all of the things I feel so passionately about. I’ll find out that the over-the-top Coulters and the warped Phelpses and the (I think patriotic but too extreme) “ship all those Mexicans back – every one of them” folk were right and I was wrong. Someday I’ll know all of what is right and wrong.
Or perhaps I’ll learn that being “right” was never all that important – that being kind trumped being “right.” Til then I can only go by my own lights and what small wisdom the Holy Spirit finds fit to lay upon me…and by that light, all I can see is that this language of spittle and hate, of mockery and malice…it is not fit for human consumption. It is pure poison.
Meanwhile these Phelps people seem intent on fighting for their right to wound the very souls they say they’re trying to save. In deference to Jeanette’s comment, yes, let’s call them cultists, shall we?
Michelle Malkin has the video and a link to the Patriot Guard Riders. Mudville Gazette links in the Dawn Patrol. Johnopedia links to a warning about making hasty generalizations and lumping all Christians – or all anybodies – together. Probably good for all of us to remember at one point or another. Sigh. Also, check out Newton’s take on all of this and her publican/tax collector musing on law and love.
Fox News Host Tells Westboro Baptist Church Hatemonger: ‘You’re going to hell!’
Heh! Found this at WND Fox News host Julie Bandera got pretty fired up with one of the nutcases from the Westoboro Baptist cult of hate.
“What would you do if you had a son in the military?” an outraged Banderas asked. “Would yo…
Excellent article.
I watched the video before I read your comments, and I agree that the Fox host let herself get sucked into a lose-lose shoutfest with Phelps-Roper.
I also think you are right about the need to not pick and choose scripture as it pleases us, and when you suggest prayerful meditation, I think you have it right on the money.
Lastly you say: “Maybe someday in the grand scheme of things, I will be proved wrong and the Coulters and Phelps and “ship all those Mexicans back – every one of them” folk will be proved right.”
I think you can be confident in the fact that none of those parties will ever be proven “right”.
What we need to do is to examine what folks like Coulter and Phelps are saying in light of Christ’s great commisions to love God and your neighbor, and see what Christ did to demonstrate that love. I think you’ll see that despite what Phelps and Company say, that calling folks fags and damning them to hell isn’t what Christ had in mind….
I’d Say That About Sums It Up
I seldom find anything to look at over at World Net Daily, but this is an exception:
A discussion about protests by an anti-homosexual church at the funerals of fallen American soldiers turned into an astounding shoutfest on national televisi…
Anchoress, the thing that wounds my heart is these people call themselves “Baptists”. I have been a Baptist all my life and have never seen the hate they spew coming from anyone in my church. I’m sure there are bigoted people but I haven’t encountered it.
This is a cult of about 75 people all related and thinking they will be the only ones in heaven. I think they may be surprised where they end up, but if they do end up in heaven they will have a lot to answer for. Please refer to them as a cult. You didn’t call them Baptists, but please, anyone else, this is not what Baptists stand for and we denounce this group.
TrackBack by NewsBusters Fox News Host Tells Westboro Baptist Church Cultist: ‘You’re Going to Hell!’:
“The Anchoress delivers Phelps a well deserved sermon.”
Anchoress,
I definitely concurr with what Jeanette has said.
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We had discussed the Merry Band of Hatemongers a little while ago on our blog. I had found an article that goes into the whole band…
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They adhere to an extreme form of Calvinism – predestination with plenty of puffery, in other words. They think they are going to have Heaven all to themselves: they’re just letting the rest of us know that “Nya, nya, nya-nya-nya, we’re going there and you’re not!” Their attitude strikes me as childish, for starters.
Jeannette, all Christians of goodwill understand that these people aren’t Baptist. They’re like the Santeria cultists who call themselves Catholics but sacrifice chickens to false gods. I feel a weird pity for that Phelps woman. She acts so like one of the Manson family that I wondered if she had been brainwashed.
[...] Also: Don’t miss The Anchoress. She has a darned good spanking in reserve for them. Filed in: Faith, The Bible by newton at 14:50 on Jun 12th, 2006 | | No Comments » [...]
[...] The Anchoress takes the sick and twisted who call themselves ‘Christian’ to task in this excellent take down. Sometimes I wonder if there are people out there who embrace scripture simply so they can distort it and try to use it to excuse all of their twisted hate and bitterness. [...]
[...] Leftists are fascists. The Anchoress also takes Ms. Phelps-Roper to task. Hmmmmm……so this woman stands outside of military funerals and harrasses the mourners because she looooooooves everyone so much in the Lord. She calls down hell upon homosexuals because she looooooooooves them so much in the Lord. [...]
You say,
“and I am not lumping Coulter in with these Phelps disasters – next to them she is an angel with a halo…”
but you seem to with,
“Maybe someday in the grand scheme of things, I will be proved wrong and the Coulters and Phelps and the “ship all those Mexicans back – every one of them” folk will be proved right.”
By putting Coulter in the middle of this post you have used a broad brush which also includes those who honestly believe the country has a right and obligation to protect its borders. So from your point of view, those obscene people who stand and protest outside of soldiers funerals are the same as those who want “illegal” people who are taking construction and other jobs to be punished. And not sure how Ann Coulter falls into this bucket with Phelps-Roper. I think you need to rethink this post and seperate out people otherwise one might think you are guilty of what you accuse.
And by the way, I would not miss a day without reading your fabulous work. On this one thing we disagree.
Hi Joe! Thanks for your kind words.
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I don’t think I’m so much “lumping them together” in that last graph as much as simply wrapping up a thought. I was severely castigated by many on the right for daring to criticize Coulter, but my feeling was that she undercut her own points by being over the top, and that her behavior reflected badly on all of us. Just as Phelps reflects badly on Christians. Perhaps I will try to clarify (when I have a little time – I have to take Buster to the doc’s) why I mentioned the immigration folk in that particular sentence. I was simply musing on the fact that “- hey – maybe someday I’ll find out I was wrong, wrong, wrong about all of these things I feel so passionately about.” And in that instance, in that context – wondering about “all” the things I am so loud about – it fits.
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But your point is not a bad one. I’ll think about an edit tonight!
Anchoress,
The Phelps tribe is indeed nasty. they’ve been at it for years- just used to be they saved their vitriol for the funerals of gay men and women who had died. Wasn’t considered as newsworthy of the mainstream press back then, but oh they were there.
Religion can make good people better (which is the case with the overwhelming majority); it can also make bad people worse. If these Phelps people had been born in the Middle East rather than America, they would be cheering on the Zarqawis of the world, or strapping on the bomb belts themselves,…,
What always irritates me is that the Left seizes on nutjobs like this as proof that all “fundies” are bigoted and mean.
I would like to know what sort of Christian believes that one can “sin away grace”; what a strange belief, given that the grace was never – indeed could never – be earned to begin with?
I wonder if this is a person with any personal knowledge of the God she claims to champion. Even the devil can quote scripture.
Hey, Ms. Phelps-Roper! KA-SMACK!
Wow, this was a beautiful couple of minutes. And it happened on Fox News, which, we are told, is chocked-full of troglodytic hatemongers.
Shirley Phelps-Roper is reprehensible, and the antithesis of every Biblical principle. I’m surprised that …
“Religion can make good people better (which is the case with the overwhelming majority); it can also make bad people worse.”
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Donna, C.S. Lewis said something very similar to your point.
Anchoress, as expected your response to my post was class. I have to admit concern since my ability to get a point across will never compare to yours and as stated, you are one of my must reads.
Joe, you are too kind. I’m glad you wrote back, though, because it reminded me to edit my post, which I have done now…please let me know if it is clearer and makes more sense, now?
Hello A,
Let me start by saying I have lots of respect for your opinions, and your values. But once again, I take issue with your attitude towards Ann C. And the critisism of her being “over the top”
I DONT BELIVE GOD WANTS US TO BE WIMPS
Was David over the top? He had already slain Goliath, but then David made a pretty good show of cutting off the giants head!
Was God over the top? He told Joshua to “kill em all” and take no prisoners. Joshua initially spared the King, only to give him a good old fashioned hanging after the battle.
Was Jesus over the top? Well, He could have peacefully chastised the money changers in the Temple. Instead, He chose to make one heck of a mess by turning over the tables, and showing no pacifism, gave the louts the “bums rush” out into the street.
I could go on. There is plenty more. Coulters book is more than the Jersey Girls, so stop taking the liberal bait over that chapter. (true as it is)
You wrote that the Bible needs to be taken as the whole work, not just selecting a verse to suit your needs. I agree totally. So why do take this one chapter, like the libs are doing, and selecting that to evaluate her entire work?
Hi Bob – Finally getting around to answering you. Maybe God does not want us to be wimps…but I do not believe he wants us to be vicious, either. You use an example of David and of Joshua…but those were both men who were in the middle of war – and their actions were not inappropriate to war. While we may be in a “culture war” I suggest that over-the-top behavior will not have the same effect as it might in war…I suggest it will merely make people with a sense of proportion turn away in disgust.
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As to the money changers…Angry Christians love to talk about Jesus sweeping clean the temple, but let’s face it, that behavior was remarkable – not an everyday thing for him to do.
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And yes, scripture is meant to be taken as a whole. Coulter’s book is not scripture. We might be focusing on “one” chapter right now, but her whole manner, demeanor and career shape how we receive that “one” chapter.
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Again, you and I will have to agree to disagree on Ms. Coulter.
[...] So Called Christians Who Make Me Ill Hmmmmm……so this woman stands outside of military funerals and harrasses the mourners because she looooooooves everyone so much in the Lord. She calls down hell upon homosexuals because she looooooooooves them so much in the Lord. [...]
[...] So Called Christians Who Make Me Ill Hmmmmm……so this woman stands outside of military funerals and harrasses the mourners because she looooooooves everyone so much in the Lord. She calls down hell upon homosexuals because she looooooooooves them so much in the Lord. [...]
[...] The Anchoress, in her usual profound way, said this in her discussion of this Phelps-Roper woman, the media’s latest hate-spewing darling, in So-called Christians who make me ill (Read the whole thing): Scripture is not meant to be picked over, with some morsels plucked for their sweetness (or their bitterness if your heart is bitter) and others left behind as unappetizing. It is meant to be taken as a whole, for it is as huge as your whole life and it takes that long to begin – just to begin – to digest it. [...]
[...] Are these the most disgusting people in the world?. Maybe. Just maybe they are. Ugly, ugly, ugly. These repugnant people aside, neo-neocon has thoughts thoughts about the Lancaster tragedy and pacifism. [...]