One of the arson suspects for the Texas church fires not only had guns in his house, he had — wait for it — an atheist book!
One of two East Texas church arson suspects kept books on demon possession and atheism as well as assault rifles and guns, and may have left graffiti offering inside information about one of the attacks in a local store bathroom, according to court records. [...]
A search of Bourque’s home after his arrest recovered books titled Demon Possession and The Atheist’s Way.
In fact the newspaper was so concerned that the headline is “Atheist books, guns found at home of arson suspect.”
First of all, Demon Possession does not sound like an atheist book. That sounds like a religious book. Second, what the hell does an atheist book in his house have to do with arson? Why didn’t they say, “Christian books, guns found at home of arson suspect”? Because it doesn’t matter if he had Christian books in his home. Nor would it matter if he had atheist books.
It seems they’re are trying to casually link atheism with arson… or maybe I am overreacting.
What do you think?
It’s very obvious why atheist books were mentioned. Churches were set on fire, not libraries or scientific institutes. If either of those had been set aflame, Christian books -might- have been mentioned, if found.
Oh? Did the atheist book in question (The Atheist’s Way: Living Well Without Gods by Eric Maisel) advise nonbelievers to set churches on fire? (Hint: The answer starts with “N”)
Is there a lengthy history of churches being set on fire by atheists? (Hint: The answer has just two letters)
Over the history of Christianity, do you think more churches have been set on fire by theists of one variety or another, or by atheists?
So then, is your choice of the word “obvious” justified?
Meanwhile, the religious books also found in the home – three copies of the Bible – are full of stories of violence and intolerance towards those not sharing one’s beliefs.
You misunderstand my tone. But yes, “obvious” is entirely justified.
We’re the minority. We’re also viewed by the majority as being immoral god-haters. That an atheist book would be found in the home of a guy who’s been burning down churches… that’s quite obviously going to be mentioned in the news. If the guy was Muslim, that would’ve been mentioned, too. Or if he was a gay rights activist.
It’s all about versus stories. Atheists versus Christians, Muslims vs anything, etc.
that’s quite obviously going to be mentioned in the news.
I guess I still don’t understand this word “obviously.” I think it ought to be linked somehow to cause, effect, and such. No one has yet bothered to fill in those links.
“Over the history of Christianity, do you think more churches have been set on fire by theists of one variety or another, or by atheists?”
Maybe that’s why they mentioned it – it’s so unusual to find that atheists burned down a church. I wonder how many of the readers understood that…
“Churches were set on fire, not libraries or scientific institutes.”
So? It’s not uncommon for church communities to call other Christian denominations “non-believers” because of a couple of minor differences in they way they act on their faith.
I’ve had protestants tell me point-blank back in college, when I was still a Catholic, that I was going to hell just because I followed a different theology.
Gee, would a Texas newspaper ever suggest that lack of god or demon worship/possession ( the books)causes someone to burn down a church? I would think it being Texas (or quite a number of southern states) of course they are attempting to link it, and suggest it’s part of the cause.
I think they’re more upset by the fact that he had non-religious books in his house at all.
You mean they’re upset that you are still legally allowed to own any book other then the buybull in Texas.
Texas has…book?
:( I’m Texan, and of course we have books. I HATE when people stereotype Texans. We are culturally rich, have world class universities, and have beautiful and varied topographies.
LRA – thanks for straightening us out re: Texas! Here in Canada, the media is not kind to Texas…(George Bush, right-wing extremism, guns n’ god, etc.) but I know most reputation is often very flawed. I live in Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada, and we are always the target of jokes (it’s cold, it’s a hic town in the middle of nowhere, we use dogs & sleds to get around, etc.). Winnipeg is actually a beautiful, sophisticated city that focuses on the arts – ballet, music festivals, world-class concerts, etc….so I get it!
He also had three bibles.
So what? The worst atheist book you can imagine pwns 3 bibles easily. Everybody knows that!
According to this article, he also had three Bibles. Not one, but three! *cue spooky music*
http://www.kltv.com/Global/story.asp?S=12039830
A man with a bible always knows the word of God
A man with 3 bibles is never quite sure…
I heard something like that about watches
At least they didn’t invade my house. I keep all of my over-sized books on one shelf, so the Bible sits (with other other mythical readings) cozily among such neighbors as Douglas Adams and all of the books from my Nazi history class.
Here’s a few headlines that could have worked just as well:
“Books and guns found at home of arson suspect.”
“Several brown shoes, GPS found at home of arson suspect.”
“Stuff was found inside the home of arson suspect.”
“Stuff was found outside the home of arson suspect.”
Based on the headline the columnist chose I’m assuming he wants his readers to conduct a psychological evaluation of the arson suspect. I had psych 101 in college but don’t remember much of it… I’m just going to assume the suspect was a sociopath… but I could be wrong, maybe he’s just an arsonist. Were matches found?
Oh, no! I have atheist books! I hadn’t planned on burning down any churches, but I guess I gotta. Dang.
Yeah, pretty much. I’m reminded of the movie “How to Get Ahead In Advertising,” in the train scene with the newspaper, about how casually very dangerous drugs get associated with milder ones to cast the milder ones as more horrible by association. And the paper doesn’t technically lie because it says those drugs like heroin “may have been found” with cannabis resin.
Not to mention any gamer could tell you about how much video games and, more so back in the 80s, Dungeons & Dragons were and are given this same guilt-by-association treatment. Or comic books. Or rock and roll. Or jazz… And on unto the beginning of humanity.
Kinda reminds me of certain UF atheists blaming crimes on one’s religious beliefs…
It does, right? Especially when those cases you refer to, the reason cited for the crime was Yahweh or the Bible.
And you remind of the way Faux news pundits likes to jump to conclusions on a suspect’s motivations BEFORE the police have even effected a proper investigation.
Most violence seems to be either directly or indirectly connected with religion. There’s the obvious – the inquisition, crusades, witch trials/murders, 9/11 and its ilk. There’s so-called “honor killings” in some countries – the slaughter of girls and women – because they dared to show an ankle, talk to a man, or disobey their husband. This fear of sex and oppression of women is DIRECTLY related to holy books. The three monotheistic religions are hierarchical and patriarchal. God is male, all-powerful, jealous, violent, angry, and unpredictable. But he LOVES us sooooo much. Men in religious societies tend to model themselves after this – after all, this is the ultimate male legitimacy. And what about mentally ill people who think that jesus told them to kill, or they were defending themselves from satan…many mentally ill people are highly religious (this may have an impact on why they became mentally ill in the first place, but that’s another comment, another day!) There are religious wars raging all over the world today. Millions of people continue to die – because “my god is better than your god”. Another example was the colonization of the American and Canadian Indians by the Europeans – in an attempt to christianize them. When they wouldn’t convert, many communities were given small-pox-infested blankets (just like god of the bible, right? Believe or DIE!!!!!!) You know, I could write a full-length book on how religion is connected with violence – especially the monotheistic ones. But really – need I say more?
Janet Greene
Your post up there sums up pretty well what I sometimes want to say straight to my Christian righteous friends who think they are morally superior than all the poor non-believers around them.
I hope you don’t mind if I later quote it in my blog.
Regards
Quote away! The more people who hear that message, the better, as far as I’m concerned. :)
If that book hasn’t already been written, it should be. People should be made more aware of the ills of religion.
I agree. I don’t think any of the atheist books specifically target that – I wish someone would. Another opening in the atheist book niche is the psychological damage of being raised in a religious home. Most serial killers grew up fundamentalist christian – I’ll look ffor the link if someone asks – and I know it screwed me up very badly. I read a book that touched on it – Religion that Harms, Religion that Heals, by Celia Dunn Murray, but this isn’t an atheist book. If someone knows of books on these subjects, I would be much obliged!
Yep. I’m with sock and … Donny (I can’t believe I just agreed with DP….) on this one. It’s perfectly valid to bring up possible indicators of motive in a crime against a politically or ideologically-aligned institution.
If the headline had been “Fundamentalist religious tracts found in the home of abortion-clinic shooting suspect”, this blog would have been all over it, from exactly the opposite side.
It’s not necessarily equivalent. Religious poeple tend to do things like bomb abortion clinics BECAUSE of their religious beliefs. Therefore, their religious belief and their actions are causally connected.
Atheists, on the other hand, usually do not act BECAUSE of their atheism. Atheism isn’t a belief system or dogma – it’s the LACK of dogma.
well, nice to see that news networks can understand elementary investigative reporting… o wait never-mind that was in my dream. I wrote the KLTV manager a letter about Layron Livingston’s insinuation. Who knows maybe it will impact KLTV, doubt it. :) But what a douche bag.
I would also like to note that 3 Bible were also found at his house.
Don’t you people read comments before posting?
But did you read that three bibles were also found at the house?
I heard 3 bibles were also found at the house :)
that was really funny! Make some more up!
“I am not an alien.” </MST3K>
Er, I mean, spammer.
Yeah, just like a friend who was busted for pot plants on his land. One of the comments in the article in the paper was that they “found a suitcase full of money” it was gymbag he threw his change in, they probably raked in a big $67.00
Plus he also was an organist for a local church…
Just more media truthiness
I’ve been keeping an eye on this story as I live with in 100 miles of most of the churches that were burnt.
For those of you who don’t know East Texas, where the arson suspects were from and where most of the churches that were burnt are located is pretty fundamentalist.In fact East Texas is made fun of by the rest of the state for being a little backwards. This is done mostly in jest and not just by people that live in urban areas but rednecks across the state as well. However there is more than a little bit of truth to it. It’s a bit hard to quantify. I’ve never lived there but after spending some time there visiting friends and working in a maximum security prison in East Texas for a year and a half I can say that there is a discernible social quality that is more than a little disturbing to a non-believer like me.
I really hope this doesn’t become something people here fixate on. The last thing I need is to have to debunk “church burning atheists” stories in the small town I live in now.
“… as I live with in 100 miles of most of the churches that were burnt.”
So, where were you on the night of …?
;-)
I suppose I was probably at home indirectly worshiping Satan by actively denying the existence of God.
OK, that sounds like a good alibi.
I think so too, but do you think the Texas authorities will buy it???
In fact East Texas is made fun of by the rest of the state for being a little backwards.
Nice try, but the article in question appeared in the Dallas Morning News.
Not sure what your are making reference to Peter. My comment about East Texas being made fun of wasn’t in reference to where the article originated.
♫ One of these things is not like the other things… ♫
lol
♪ One of these things just doesn’t belooong… ♫
You ready to guess? No? Okay, keep looking. I look too. This is hard, even for a monster.
Good point. It doesn’t take guns to start a fire but books burn real good.
You’re so smart.
I would never advocate the burning of churches. That would be wrong. But what they are built for and what goes on in them is ,to say the least , a waste of human energy. Why the arsonist did is increase publicity and sympathy for religious institutions. Violence is counter productive. Much better wait til the congregation decide to think for themselves and convert the building into something useful. Like a nursery school.
Don’t Christians know that supposed cases of demonic possession are described in the gospels. Luke 8:26-40 describes a case in which Jesus expelled demons from a possessed man. I doubt that anyone ever called Jesus an atheist.
Good observation, Daniel, for this posting. I know that the writers are, indeed, implying a causal connection. Having grown up in a religious home, until I was an adult, I truly believed atheists worshipped satan, used demons, etc. This is the connection that is taught – assumed. It never, ever occurred to me that atheists don’t believe in anything supernatural. I thought they hated god because they wanted to sin! And this is the thinking that led to this article. Here’s the argument:
1. The arsonists were atheists
2. Atheists hate and fear god because they want to sin
3. Atheists have no morals because they don’t believe in Jesus – there is no ethic that tells them arson is wrong – obviously, because they are not christians, they don’t know right from wrong
4. They are threatened by church, the holy place of god, because atheists hate anything good and pure (being satanists, & all)
5. Ergo – they burned down the church.
I’m not sure if anyone else on this blog was as thoroughly brainwashed as I was, but it’s pretty embarrassing to see it in writing because I can’t believe I was ever that dumb.
(sheepishly raising hand and going back into lurkdom)
LOL – to preserve your self-respect, I’ll pretend I didn’t see your hand up…however, being the only one in the audience who had the ‘nads to “out” himself, I applaud your ‘courage…
*proudly raises unbelieving hand*
“I once was lost but now am found,
Was blind, but now I see.”
(oh, the irony)
What he said.
I don’t think it’s been mentioned in this thread that he had 3 bibles.