by VorJack
The newest battle over creationism in the schools may take place in Louisiana. You may remember a small flap over Governor Bobby Jindal’s passage of the 2008 Louisiana Science Education Act, which allowed school boards to approve supplemental material to be added to the science curriculum. Several watchdog groups predicted that it might lead to lawsuits.
The Livingston Parish School Board looks like it may be first in line to test this hypothesis. According to The Advocate:
During the board’s meeting Thursday, several board members expressed an interest in the teaching of creationism, an alternative to the study of the theory of evolution, in Livingston Parish public school classrooms.
[...]
Benton said that under provisions of the Science Education Act enacted last year by the Louisiana Legislature, schools can present what she termed “critical thinking and creationism” in science classes.
Board Member David Tate quickly responded: “We let them teach evolution to our children, but I think all of us sitting up here on this School Board believe in creationism. Why can’t we get someone with religious beliefs to teach creationism?”
While there is some mention of the ACLU, there is no sign that the board is thinking about the legal ramifications of this. Some of the arguments that were made are just odd, for example:
Martin, noting that discipline of young people is constantly becoming more of a challenge for parents and teachers, agreed: “Maybe it’s time that we look at this.”
I’m guessing that this is the standard “We need to teach them Christianity so they’ll be moral” argument, though it may just be a poorly written section of the article.
“schools can present what she termed “critical thinking and creationism” in science classes.”
If they really presented critical thinking, then creationism would not survive more than one or two minutes in a science class debate.
I am sure Louisiana is not the only state where creationism is gathering force.
It seems to be taking off across America. Most public school at least mention creationism and/or intelligent design as alternatives to evolution. Personally my biology teacher did not – but I know many other teachers did mention it and even show a video that covered all three. While the instructors did not go on to teach about creationism, they still discredit themselves as a science teacher and lead there students to believe evolution really is just a theory – instead of gaining an understanding of what it means to be a scientific theory.
What it means to be a scientific theory… sounds like a blog topic
Board Member David Tate quickly responded: “We let them teach evolution to our children, but I think all of us sitting up here on this School Board believe in creationism. Why can’t we get someone with religious beliefs to teach creationism?”
I assume they didn’t get the discovery institute memo about how you suppose to pretend that this is just an argument about alternative scientific theories and has nothing to do with religion.
Yep. And clearly they slept through Civics class too.
Seriously, this quote alone tells us exactly what kind of a sense of entitlement we are dealing with here: To hell with the US Constitution or any real definition of science, I want things done MY way. And what else can we expect when we deal with people who just presume they are backed by an almighty deity?
My god is bigger than your god.
While I would say that this is an important fight even in Louisiana, I’d just like to throw in one brief thought to the contrary.
In the redneck corner of the somewhat progressive state where I received most of my public school education (that would be Benton City, Washington, population 1500 Glenn Beck fans), there was no legal backing for teaching creationism in public school and that was technically acknowledged on paper by the local school board (even that riled these idiots up). But that didn’t stop the all christian faculty from teaching the (presumably) all christian children about the literal truth of Genesis. My 6th grade science class was like a friggin answers-in-genesis seminar.
Not that I’m at all endorsing that sort of thing. Just saying it happens, has been happening for a very long time, and seems to be largely independent of school board policies.
I completely agree with you. Irregardless of school board decisions the bible still worms its way into the classroom. If only children under 12 had the courage and the idea to fight back instead of accepting everything their teachers spoon-feed them.
I remember being in a Catholic High School (this was from age 12 onwards, though, but we didn’t start discussing this sort of thing until high school age in my country anyway) where a couple of the students were brave enough to continually ask awkward questions of the staff. The teachers would kick them out of the classroom and then tell their fellow students they were wrong, wrong, wrong, and that was it. I really don’t think the students are the ones who need to change – the adults in charge are just selling them down the river for the sake of scoring points with their angry skydaddy.
I think instead of letting the teachers spoonfeed us they need to give us a topic and let us write. Write about that one topic (beginning of human life on earth) and let us decide what we believe. I have been brought up in a strong christian home. That doesn’t mean i believe everything that my parents or my parent’s friends tell me. We need to decide for ourselves. it is only then will we truly know who we are.
You’re free to do that in your own spare time. But education isn’t about everyone just deciding for themselves what they think is true, or would like to be true. Students are free to disregard what they’re taught (at the expense of their grades), but meanwhile the rest of them should have the opportunity of a proper education, involving actual knowledge.
You mean just making shit up won’t edumacate you?
Quick! Someone tell Deepak Chopra!
Shocking, I know.
Just landed on this site by accident. Interesting stuff here. Might as well post my thoughts.
I personally don’t think creationism should be taught in a classroom, especially not in a science class. In my Biology classes, as background to the theory of evolution, we obviously mentioned Creationism and Lamarckism. But that’s alright, because they are presented as a way to justify the actual theory we are interested in. They are quickly discarded as incomplete models and serve only as a prelude to present a more robust model.
I think creationism lacks the requisites to belong in a science class. It cannot be scientifically demonstrated and experiments cannot be replicated (well…we actually have no way of experimentally demonstrating it…unless someone suddenly turns on “godmode”). The evidence suggests it is not a correct model of the way the universe works.
They could teach Creationism. But definitely not in a Science class. Might as well create a class that is a complement to Biology, if they so wish. Although, in my opinion, that would be a waste of time, as the two are almost extreme opposites. Maybe that could spark some of the “critical thinking” they wanted? Or would it just cause massive confusion?
If creationism is being taught in science class then we should balance it with evolution being taught in religious class. I mean you can’t tell children about genesis in religious class without balancing it with evolution. right?
That is an interesting idea for an experiment. Type in “It is a good day to die,” and see if we get creation. You could also try ↑, ↑, ↓, ↓, ←, →, ←, →, B, A, but that probably wouldn’t work.
“[...] but that probably wouldn’t work.”
Of course not.
You didn’t press start. =P
They could teach Creationism. But definitely not in a Science class. Might as well create a class that is a complement to Biology, if they so wish. Although, in my opinion, that would be a waste of time, as the two are almost extreme opposites. Maybe that could spark some of the “critical thinking” they wanted? Or would it just cause massive confusion?
It would cause a massive lawsuit (again). Establishment Clause violation, etc… Creationism, in all of its forms (including ID), is religious, and therefore does not belong in a public school. It doesn’t matter if you teach a seperate class outside of the biology class, it’s still illegal.
It’s illegal to teach as fact, though a class on comparative religion would have no problems teaching it as one of many ideas religions have come up with for how the world came to be. Though, naturally, the school boards don’t seem interested in teaching children that some people think the world is on the back of a turtle and others think it’s the result of a deity’s sneeze.
Oops, should have done some fact checking. I was not aware of the laws (maybe because I am not American, although, now that you mention it, I think it might also be illegal in my country). Sorry.
In any event, it was just a suggestion to patch up the problem. I personally don’t think that having a class where they teach a system that is based on wild assumptions (the existence of God) as if it was “The Truth” is going to make anyone a better person.
I’d like to see them try to force me to teach Creationism in a science class (if I was teaching this year, that is). They wouldn’t like the way I’d present it! I sure would teach critical thinking, and I’d demonstrate how creationism and ID are nothing but bunk.
I forgot about this: I have a philosophy professor who thinks creationism should be brought up in biology courses. He thinks if the instructor has the proper education than creationism would be brought up as a counter argument, evaluated, and shown to be deeply flawed as a way to highlight the theory of evolution and to give students a more complete understanding of all the theory encompasses. Using counter arguments / opposing views always allows you to strengthen your own view. In doing this the instructors would teach how scientifically flawed and nonsensical creationism is, while fortifying the theory of evolution in student’s minds.
However the philosophy professor said he would personally have to be responsibly for training the biology teachers because they would most likely butcher everything. Somehow we doubt that he could train them all.
For good discipline in the classroom, you can’t tell children that they’re descended from animals, or they’ll act like animals. You have to tell them that God created them, so that they’ll behave like human beings. For a strong moral society, we must fight against evilution.
Are you Poe? Please tell me you’re Poe! Just in case you’re not, though:
Why don’t you tell me what evidence exists to support your preferred creation myth versus, say, the Norse one?
So Frederick, I assume you were born an adult, since otherwise you would behave like a baby.
I forgot that human’s are not animals.
…. what kingdom do we hail from?
Gawds Kingdom!
oh lawdy! (:
Gotta be a Poe.
Yeah, ever since I found out that I was descended from Victorians, I’ve only ever travelled by Penny-Farthing, and I’ve fainted from shock whenever I saw a lady’s ankles.
This story hit slashdot this morning, so it’s getting really wide publicity. I would hope that the school board reconsiders since tons of people are now aware of their silly idea.
On the plus side, the person DID mention critical thinking and creationism as two separate things.
I still don’t quite get this “US-American thing”. Why again are there ignorant laypeople in charge of school curricula?
Why don’t you select judges from a vote at the local sports bar? Why isn’t the guy who looks best in uniform given the police badge? Why can’t the girl who likes water be the fire chief?
You got some ‘splainin’ to do.
The guy who looks best in uniform is given a job at the bar ;-)
and the girl who likes water – she organizes the wet t-shirt contests.
We all know that God spoke directly to G.W. Bush, and Creationism was not made part of SOLs when No Child Left Behind was rolled out, so there’s your answer. If God had wanted Creationism to be taught in public schools, His prophet Bush would have made it so.
Wow, the US is one bat-shit crazy country.
I think teaching creationism in schools is a terrific idea. It will help us cement a steady supply of gullible, stupid and superstitious people who will be our future underclass work force. The more the merrier. less competition for the rest of us.
The rest of us will teach our kids real science and logic so they can have a better chance to succeed in the real world. Most of the future growth in the world, the BRIC countries, are not as religiously obsessed as we are, we must prepare our kids to compete in that world.
Oddly enough, an astonishing number of them go on to be lawyers and engineers.
It may just be confirmation bias, but it seems to me that those two professions have a disproportionate percentage of the creationists.
That might be true, but not surprising in a country that is anywhere 70% – 80% Christian. And we can add another 10% – 15% of the population that are of other minor religions, it will be a wonder that any slice of society does NOT have a significant number of that group who belong to some kind of religious organization.
One surprise is lawyers tho. The Christian lawyer. seems like an oxymoron.
You forget the possibility that if they get into power (or more accurately their masters get into power) they will go Khmer Rouge on the rest of us and kill anyone showing signs of intellectualism, such as wearing eyeglasses.