The FBI has arrested a man from Concord, North Carolina for conspiring to bomb an abortion clinic. From the Charlotte Observer:
Justin Carl Moose, 26, is a self-described “extremist, radical” and the “Christian counterpart of Osama bin Laden,” according to an affidavit filed by FBI agents. Agents arrested Moose, who lives in a northwest Concord neighborhood, on Tuesday.
His arrest followed an investigation that began after Planned Parenthood alerted the FBI to a Facebook page registered to Moose, which the group said was advocating extreme violence against abortion providers.
From the Salisbury Post:
Federal authorities identified Moose as the person who made the Facebook page. On it, he writes: “Whatever you may think about me, you’re probably right. Extremist, Radical, Fundamentalist…? Yep! Terrorist…? Well…. I prefer the term ‘freedom Fighter’. ‘End abortion by any means necessary and at any cost’. ‘Save a life, Shoot an abortionist’
The affadavit says that starting Jan. 19, Moose made numerous statements “advocating the use of violence in order to affect his ideological and political beliefs. The majority of these postings relate the issue of abortion and the murder of abortion providers.”
One posting on Aug. 22 was “List of death camps with address’ Do with it what you wish.” The affadavit says that post referred to a list of abortion clinics throughout the nation.
Another post, on Aug. 3, provided a link to a website that authorities say contained a recipe for making explosives. In a post the next day, the affadavit says, Moose warned advised readers how to use the explosives without harming themselves.
On Aug. 23, the affadavit says, Moose posted this:“To all the feds watching me:”You can’t stop what is in motion. Even if you bring me in, my men will continue their mission. Furthermore, I will not go peacefully. Do you really want another Waco?”
Moose also claimed to be a member of the Army of God, an extremist anti-abortion Christian organization that may include the Olympic Park Bomber Eric Rudolph. My hunch is that Moose’s membership could be a delusion – if you’re going to be an effective terrorist it’s best not to tip your hand on Facebook. But he did seem to have the necessary knowledge to create a bomb.
It’s nice to see that at least some of the crazies are too stupid to enact self-preservation . . .
I love how some people are so focused on the terrorists outside our borders, they fail to see the ones within. *sigh*
“Terrorist…? Well…. I prefer the term ‘freedom Fighter”
He learned his lines well, as we all know from the Glenn Becks of the world, terrorist is a protected term and can only legally used by Muslims.
I used to read about people like this and say to myself, “At least they’re in some little town I’ve never heard of, way down south somewhere.” Well, now I live in the south and thanks to finding Daniel’s blog I now read about the crazies that are practically neighbors. I’m pining away for my Detroit suburbs today.
Detroit is predominantly black, and blacks are extremely predominantly Christian. You can’t escape religion in America. If you really want to get away, move to Sweden, or another country with a high rate of atheism.
I’d rather fix America than move. I think religion is dying. I dream for the day when Christians are considered a minority, and put in the same category as muslims, jews, hindus and buddists. I dream for the day when homosexuals can get married. I dream for the day when someone can say they are an atheist, and not lose their job, or be shunned, or be excommunicated from their family.
I dream for the day when children are raised based on logic and science, and not on religion-born culture. I dream for the day that sexuality is not suppressed. I dream for all that and more.
Some say religion isn’t harmful. That sleeping dogs should be allowed to lay. Religion is a dog, but it is not sleeping. It is rabid. It seeks to gain back the power it had in the dark ages…ages dark because of religion. It will destroy whoever and whatever stands in it’s path to accomplish this goal. It must be fought, and fought hard.
As an evangelical Christian, I rarely talked about my faith. As an atheist, after subscribing to atheist blogs and youtube channels, after hearing the insights of people like Hermant Mehta, The Amazing Atheist, Pat Condell, Richard Dawkins, and lesser known but no lesser profound people too numerous to count, I realize how much of a poison religion is. I am sad for what it has done for our world. While there will always be evil in the world, but religion causes a lot of it. Either through doing evil in the name of their god, or through the degredation of morality that religious culture has caused.
I spread my lack of faith whenever I can. I’m still a closet atheist in person, but I kill religion as much as I can online. I have been successful in doing so. I can only hope that the people I deconvert will become as passionate about religion as I have, and will seek to fight it fervently, until we can live truly free from religion.
Detroit is predominantly black, and blacks are extremely predominantly Christian. You can’t escape religion in America. If you really want to get away, move to Sweden, or another country with a high rate of atheism.
What does Detroit and African Americans and their religiosity have to do with this moron terrorist for Jesus?
I meant to reply to another person’s comment, who said they were moving to Detroit to get away from religious nutjobs.
And yet, your specific point about Black folks in Detroit still doesn’t make any sense.
How doesn’t it? He’s saying he’s going to move to detroit to get away from religious people, I remind him that there are religious people in detroit. How does this not make sense?
I think he says he misses Detroit compared to where he lives now. You can’t read for comprehension and you make a lot of weird assertions.
It doesn’t make sense because you didn’t remind him that there are religious people in Detroit; you specifically singled out African Americans in Detroit, as though there are no other religious people of different racial or ethnic backgrounds who live in Detroit or its suburbs.
He also went into a diatribe about how successful he is at deconverting people on the internet with fierce intensity, hoping to spread this fire, and is a closet atheist in person. Forget about singling out a demographic in one major US city – he can’t even read that the person he’s responding to is familiar with the religiosity of Detroit already. There is a big difference between the religious make-up of a demographic or a location and how much people are in your face about it. Why still in the closet, Danny? I live somewhere I think is a lot of Catholics and more in my neighborhood, Jews, and how shall I fight this power around me, ignore it like I usually do, because it doesn’t bother me, or get on the internet because I’m safe and tell you, stop being Jewish or Catholic in Boston, I live in your neighborhood, so stop it. And they all say ok, so I am successfully deconverting my whole city. Right now.
According to wikipedia, 81.6% of Detroit is black, and I don’t know how to read this chart listing religious beliefs by racial identification, but it seems really insensible to target a location based on demographic information without having lived there to test whether it has a tolerable or intolerable amount of religiosity to a person who has lived there and moved somewhere else. I mean, which of these two can give the fair comparison and which one sounds a little off his nut?
And? High percentage of blacks live in detroit. An extremely high percentage of blacks are religious(with most being SOUTHERN BAPTIST). Therefore, there is a high percentage of religiofacists living in detroit, even when you assume non-blacks are all atheists. Of course, that isn’t the case. By doing some simple statistical math, you can safely put detroit at around 95% Christian.
Kodie, he said he was pining for his detroit suberbs. I could have(and probably) misinterpreted it, but it doesn’t say he lived in detroit. It could be like saying “I’m pining for my promotion” or “I’m pining for my college degree”.
As for my closet atheism, you’ve explained that you live in a place with jews and catholics. If I lived in a place like that, I wouldn’t be in the closet. For one, catholics and jews aren’t usually a big problem to atheists. They only torture their own kind. Its the fucking southern baptists and other evangelical groups that are the fucking ones who hound everybody day after goddamn day.
Catholics aren’t even fucking conservative. The pope fucking endorsed cucklefucking evolution. EVOLUTION. He’s also always preaching tolerance and peace and baaaaawww lets be nice. Not that catholics give a shit. They just want to dress up and drink spiked jesus blood. As long as you’re not a fag or have an abortion, they really don’t give a shit.
Try living around here, in deep south NC. Most of them will fucking exile you if you don’t completely adhere to their incredibly stringent societal standards. Come out as an atheist? They’ll fucking destroy you. The motherfucking sheriff will come to your fucking house and arrest you for some bullshit, and the judge won’t give a goddamn about shit. They’re all corrupt as shit, and they’ve all got their mouths on jesus’s sandy dick. All small towns need to be fucking annexed.
I wish I lived in the soviet union where religion was considered a mental illness…fucking america has to invade everybodies goddamn countries and fuck up their shit.
Around 90.7% of Detroit is religious. At least, that’s the percentage I got from the chart.
Try living around here, in deep south NC. Most of them will fucking exile you if you don’t completely adhere to their incredibly stringent societal standards. Come out as an atheist? They’ll fucking destroy you. The motherfucking sheriff will come to your fucking house and arrest you for some bullshit, and the judge won’t give a goddamn about shit. They’re all corrupt as shit, and they’ve all got their mouths on jesus’s sandy dick. All small towns need to be fucking annexed.(emphasis on the crazy mine)
Either you’re just given to ridiculous hyperbole or your so far off your rocker you don’t even know where it is anymore. And hey, since living in NC is so unbearable to you, why don’t you move to a larger city? I’m pretty sure Charlotte would be a bit more amenable to your particular brand of crazy.
Oh, and your comment about the Soviet Union is about 25 years out of date. First, there is no more Soviet Union. Second, the fall of communism has allowed for the flourishing of religious expression in Russia (of course, this has not been completely smooth).
10% of North Carolina identify as non-religious, and only 38% identify as Baptist, so I think you’re exaggerating slightly about being tarred and feathered for not being a Southern Baptist.
He was talking about small towns. looking at the overall state demographics tend to be skewed by the data from the larger cities which are more diverse.
Demographic knowledge fail. It’s actually so incorrect that it’s humorous.
If crime fighters fight crime, and firefighters fight fire, what do freedom fighters fight?
– George Carlin, thinker.
be ready for an invasion of Godbots defending this violent man and babbling about saving teh babbies. Dispatches from the Culture Wars’ thread on this topic was over 100 posts yesterday.
This fucktard lives roughly 2 miles from me. I’d love to say, “Only in the bible belt”, but we already know that isn’t true.
It always puzzles me that the almighty God, the God that created the universe from a puff of thin air, the God that created the earth and all its wonders in as little as 6 days, somehow needs to employ the crazies to do all the dirty work these days.
I’m sure God can level an abortion clinic with only on spit ball if he wanted to. I’m sure God can turn all the gays straight with a blink of his left eye if he wanted to.
I hear his time is taken up with mostly skee ball these days….
*snrk* +1
I really hope no Christians have the gall to put up a church within two blocks of the Olympic Park…
That’s sacred ground!
Great Scott! Google Maps reveal that there’s a music club right outside the park with the horrendously insensitive and inflammatory name “The Tabernacle”!
While I support the right of the muslims to build the mosque, its hardly the same thing as a christian building a church. 9/11 was the largest terrorist attack in history. Over 3,000 people died. It was a direct result of a group of people following their interpretation of the koran. If the koran was never written and spread, the world trade center would very likely still be standing today.
The muslims want to build a place dedicated to the preaching and worshipping of the principles and ideas in the Koran, the same book responsible for the massacre at ground zero, the worst terrorist attack in history.
I find this extremely offensive. Still, the first amendment is not there to protect popular speech, its there to protect offensive speech. That’s why I support the mosque.
Just sayin’. I’ve heard the abortion clinic/ground zero comparison before, and I think it’s flawed.
Uh, if the bible was never written, hundreds of thousands of Muslims and Jews would not have been massacred by Christians at various times throughout history, including several crusades.
Do you oppose the building of churches anywhere near a Jewish or Muslim massacre site? Because that takes a whole lot of ground away from the Christians. Heck, if we toss in native cultures wiped out by overzealous missionaries, a significant chunk of the earth should be off limits to Catholics.
The crusades were over 600 years ago. In a hundred years or so, it will be totally appropriate to put mosques around ground zero. Right now, its a massive, fresh tragedy.
You know there was a mosque in the world trade center that was used by the Muslims who worked there some of which were killed on 9/11.
The Crusades may have been over 600 years ago, but Native American children were being stolen by Christian churches as late as the 60s, and beaten and tortured and in some cases murdered. Is it ok yet to put up churches where Indians can see them?
If there was a memorial to those native american children or a place where many were killed or buried, then yes, it would be wrong, or where more than five were very brutally murdered. Of course, with the vast majority of Americans being Christian, you wouldn’t hear about that on the news, especially in the 60s. The catholic church wouldn’t give a shit either.
It would be wrong, but legal.
Not sure why you bring up catholics though. As you’ll soon find out when my comment passes moderation, I hate christians, jews, muslims and hindus equally.
I’d classify atomic bombing the hell out of Hiroshima and Nagasaki as terrorist attacks. Wonder if there are American-y centers there. An embassy, perhaps.
Bah, replied in the wrong thread-of-thought. Meh.
Personally I’d say the largest acts of terrorism in the last fifty years, in order of size, are probably the alied invasion of Iraq, the Israeli blockade and repeated invasion of Lebanon, Gaza and the West Bank, the American invasion of Vietnam, the Iraqi invasion of Kuwait, the American invasion of Panama, 9/11, and the repeated American UAV attacks in Pakistan.
Amen. Though I’d classify the UAV attacks as acts of war myself, but thank Brannigan the Pakistanis don’t…
The iraq war?
Not our business? Yeah. A dumbass started it? Yeah. A bunch of other shit why it shouldn’t have happened? Goddamn right.
Terrorist attack? Be serious. Saddam was a shitbag, and we the Iraqis a favor by hanging his worthless ass.
Vietnam? Same thing.
Iraq involved the wholesale destruction of a country for a political agenda. By any dictionary definition, it may indeed be the largest terrorist attack in history.
And while Saddam was indeed a vicious dictator, try telling the dozens of Iraqis killed daily in sectarian violence that the Coalition did them a favour by getting rid of him and replacing his tight control with anarchy.
Yeah, we were totally justified in invading Vietnam to prevent them from holding democratic elections. After all, they might have voted for a government that America didn’t like!
Since far more Iraqis have been killed under the occupation (ONE MILLION so far) than Saddam ever killed, why exactly do you think that we did them a favour? Because they get to be killed by nice shiny white people with expensive toys?
“While I support the right of the muslims to build the mosque,”
It’s not a mosque. I was honestly tempted to stop reading right here, but I persevered…
“its hardly the same thing as a christian building a church. 9/11 was the largest terrorist attack in history. Over 3,000 people died. It was a direct result of a group of people following their interpretation of the koran. If the koran was never written and spread, the world trade center would very likely still be standing today.”
Size matters not. A terrorist attack is a terrorist attack (unless it’s against Russia, then it’s just bin Laden following his CIA training to thwart those commies) and it doesn’t matter that 3000 people died in one and one person died in the other. That one person’s blood makes the ground as sacred as the blood of 3000, otherwise we’ll have to draw an arbitrary line in the sand to determine where the cut off is for the appropriate number of murders before we declare a site untouchable by people remotely related to the murderer.
“The muslims want to build a place dedicated to the preaching and worshipping of the principles and ideas in the Koran, the same book responsible for the massacre at ground zero, the worst terrorist attack in history.”
There’s a book responsible for many, many atrocities and crazy people doing crazy things. By your logic, as covered by other commentators, there’s not a lot of space left for churches, and really the guy who wrote Catcher in the Rye should probably stay away from Liverpool just to be on the safe side…
“I find this extremely offensive. Still, the first amendment is not there to protect popular speech, its there to protect offensive speech. That’s why I support the mosque.”
It’s not a mosque. If only free speech were also accurate speech…
“Just sayin’. I’ve heard the abortion clinic/ground zero comparison before, and I think it’s flawed.”
You haven’t remotely demonstrated how it is flawed.
Its a goddamn mosque. Just because a church doesn’t have a steeple and it has a basketball court and some tables, its still a goddamn church.
Size does matter. We can’t go around banning land that people died on, just like we can’t put it on the news every time an African child dies of aids or starvation.
You want a solid death number? I think it would be better to wait until a situation arose(which it probably will eventually, since Christianity is getting smaller and more cult-like). Its just like the people who want solid distances.
If you’re really looking for hard numbers, I’d say 300 people, 5 blocks away, for 100 years, and no, don’t demolish/close buildings already there. There’s a difference between it happening to be there and actively seeking out a particular site.
“Its a goddamn mosque.”
No it isn’t. I’m not even going to bother with the conversation until you look up this most fundamental fact and use a source other than Fox News. The rest of what you said is purely arbitrary anyway. You’ve simply decided that this situation is different because you want it to be.
“actively seeking out a particular site.”
This betrays your Islamophobia – you actually are implying they did this on purpose to hurt and upset the victims (many of which were Muslim, by the way). That particular site happens to be in a largely Muslim community, which would be why they are building a community centre. Those Muslims, I’m afraid, already happened to be there.
I don’t watch fox, or any television news program. I get my news from a variety of sources, almost all of which supported the mosque for reasons other than free speech(exceptions being theamazingatheist, who supported it on free speech grounds, and pat condell, who opposed it)
YOU need to look up this fundamental fact.
Mosque
–noun
a Muslim temple or place of public worship.
From dictionary.com
From wikipedia:
“The word “mosque” in English refers to all types of buildings dedicated for Islamic worship although there is a distinction in Arabic between the smaller, masjids dedicated for daily five prayers and the larger masajid where the daily five prayers and the Friday congregation sermons are held (مسجد جامع, masjid jāmi‘), which is attended by more people and play more roles such as teaching Qur’an.”
Gee, its sure sounding like a fucking mosque, or at the very least, a masjid, which serves the same purpose.
Don’t tell me they aren’t seeking a particular site. They got it as close as possible to ground zero. Maybe you need to watch commentary from someone with a spine like Pat Condell for more than 10 seconds.
Islamaphobia? What the fuck kind of word is that? Is it supposed to be like homophobia? Because homosexuals, who just want to fuck who they want, are totally like muslims, who, like christians and jews, run their lives based on a book so horrible that there isn’t a word sufficiently powerful to describe it.
Nobody says Christianaphobia. No, I’m allowed to hate christians. The second I hate muslims though, its totally a race issue. Moreover, my hatred somehow affects my logic? Your emotions must affect your logic if you would make such an implication.
I hate jews, muslims, christians and hindus, in no particular order. I do not discriminate. I despise them all equally. Those are the religions I’ve studied enough to hate, and I hate them with a passion. They are all extremely alike, with the exception of hinduism, which is still extremely fucked up.
Despite how much I hate them all, I am not biased. Whenever I meet a religious person, I show them the same courtesy I show anyone.
Your moniker and your commentary are strangely incongruous. Just sayin’.
Masajid is not a large mosque it’s just the plural form of masjid. Jamih is a synonym for masjid. If you can’t even get a dictionary entry correctly why should we take anything else you say seriously.
Given that the Christian and Jewish prayer rooms in the community centre are as large as the Muslim prayer room, I guess it’s also a church and a synagogue too, right?
Does the fact that there’s a chapel in my local airport mean that it’s actually a church that just happens to have runways?
Seriously, this exactly as much a mosque as your local YMCA is a church. And it’s as much a pro-terrorism, anti-American mosque as your local YMCA is a branch of Westboro Baptist Church.
“Your moniker and your commentary are strangely incongruous. Just sayin’.” I guess the “on toast” didn’t fit in the name field.
;-)
“Your moniker and your commentary are strangely incongruous. Just sayin’.”
““Your moniker and your commentary are strangely incongruous. Just sayin’.” I guess the “on toast” didn’t fit in the name field.”
Asshole factor does not reflect on love for a particular animal. Pic related.
I guess it all depends on how paranoid we are in regards to Imam Feisal Abdul Rauf’s “TRUE” motivations. I’m open to all eventual possibilities, but this is what his website says in the FAQ section:
“Why are you building “a mosque near Ground zero?”
Strictly speaking, it will not be a “mosque,” although it would have a prayer space on one of its 15 floors. At the beginning, no one considered the fact that Imam Feisal Abdul Rauf Abdul Rauf’s current mosque is 12 blocks from the Ground Zero site, while the Park51 Community Center location is only 2 and one-half blocks away. We never discussed wanting to be close to Ground Zero; our goal was to find a good real estate opportunity for a community center. 51 Park seemed to fit the bill.”
This is the source: http://www.cordobainitiative.org/?q=content/frequently-asked-questions
Then why did they decline Donald Trump’s offer?
Just to offend you.
I think that many people here are viewing this as atheists. Which is normal, because they are (as I am). They see the centre as being the same as a McDonalds, a Walmart, a gift shop, whatever. Nothing special, no special significance to the building or its location. Maybe it’s in bad taste because of what happened, but that’s it. But I think that’s not the way that the instigators of the building see it. They see it as a sign of victory over America. I think that is what most of us who question the centre feel.
I can also relate to Danny’s point about chrsitianaphobia – it’s OK to hate Christians (possibly because many of us used to be one), but as soon as you say anything that could be taken as islamaphobic, then you’re the bad guy. And as an automatic response against the Christian protests, atheists tend to support the centre.
I don’t particularly want a mosque anywhere. I don’t care why they want it. Mosques are useless to me. However, the issue isn’t just opposing Christians on principle of opposing what Christians want. It’s opposing why the Christians think they get the last word and nobody else’s rights matter – why should they over-ride the Constitution to call a certain parcel of land “sacred,” that is imposing too much Christianity in my secularism. If they didn’t want a mosque there, someone should have bought the space before a Muslim did, but now all of a sudden, expect Muslims or anyone to respect their right to designate land as “sacred,” arbitrarily, that we have to respect their right to grieve and commemorate an event several blocks away from its core and not in sight of it, because someone dead was flung over to or near that spot, but certainly that person was dead before they got there. I’m not in favor of a mosque there, I’m just not against it if that’s what they want and their rights are constitutionally backed, as opposed to sentimental opposition and fear of Islam. If people can build a church wherever they want and have the zoning rights and permits to start building, they don’t ever think, we’re not wanted, our building is symbolic of danger or hate to anyone. They take that right for granted, but they won’t share it, and that’s un-American. The Constitution doesn’t say we have to be nice, it just says we have to be fair.
Islamophobia is a word that describes a fear of being blown to smithereens and suspecting Muslims of all being up to no good. It’s being a racist. I think if they don’t like Muslims near that whole area in need of a cultural center or a mosque, they ought to buy up all the buildings and systematically evict them… oh, they can’t.
@Kodie: my definition of islamaphobia has nothing to do with being blown up (that could equally be christianaphobia, especially if you live close to an abortion clinic). It’s more to do with seeing how fundy Islam treats its people (especially the women), doesn’t respect other’s beliefs, demands complete adherence, and supports killing anyone who disagrees or leaves.
Am I afraid of what Islam could do? If it becomes big enough to be a real voice in any (formerly Christian or atheist) country, then yes. I see it as a very large step back in time and I worry what would be the consequences.
On the other hand, I have very similar concerns regarding fundy Christians.
“And as an automatic response against the Christian protests, atheists tend to support the centre.”
Atheists tend to support the centre because they tend to be rational and critically appraise a situation. Using our brains, and sources of news other than Fox, we learn that this isn’t anywhere near as scary or evil as it is being portrayed. Though actually you could use Fox just from last year, and find they thought it was a great idea then. The idea never changed, the presentation of it did, and it was done on purpose to stoke up racial and religious resentment.
“and sources of news other than Fox” – OK, now I wish I could actually get Fox where I live.
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A symbol of VICTORY OVER AMERICA?
ROFLOL!
I’m sorry, Len but blind, very loud, and irrational nationalism and toxic patriotism can be as unblinking, unthinking, and dangerous as any religious faith. How can a frigging real estate development be a THREAT TO AMERICA OMG THE BROWN HORDES ARE COMING!!!!!!!!!
The baying crowds of uber-nationalist loons are certainly more frightening to me than this Iman, even if the super secret agenda to train Islamists were really whate was happening here. Andc even if it were true, better to be here than in some storefront mosque in some downmarket suburb.
Exactly. For all the arguments that suggest they move this center somewhere else, I wonder what they think the difference is. Does an Islamic cultural center or community center or mosque exist somewhere? What is its purpose? In what way is building it on this site granting much more than that purpose? I don’t even care if that’s their motive, to build nearest to the site as some imaginary victory monument, or for opposers to view it that way, it’s psychological. Otherwise mundane religious worship cultural building for a community of Muslims who have the money and the right to build it there. It “feels” like they’re doing it to hurt you, or it “feels” like they’re doing it to “feel” triumphant, but they can’t actually do anything there they wouldn’t or couldn’t do somewhere else. Why does anyone worry about the significance of this particular location? It’s imaginary.
I didn’t say the centre would be a threat to America. You did. And do you have a problem with brown people? You appear to mistake me for a blind (I try not to be), loud (again, I try not to be – I don’t type in caps), American (if that’s what you mean by “irrational nationalism and toxic patriotism” in this context). Wrong on all counts.
And do you really think that terrorists would need to build a centre such as this to train more terrorists? That’s pretty limited thinking. And insulting to the poeple who would use the centre as planned.
As Danny says above, read / listen to some of the other commentaries on this (he mentions Pat Condell – I agree).
This is a question. I read the two articles (Charolette Observer and Salisbury Post). I did not see in either article the reason WHY he was arrested. Did I miss why he was arrested? What has he been charged with?
The first sentence of the original post:
“The FBI has arrested a man from Concord, North Carolina for conspiring to bomb an abortion clinic. ”
Conspiracy, apparently.
That picture is EPIC!! Love it!!! hahahaha