David Barton Says His Christian Critics Were Recruited By “Secular Guys”

Just when you think you’ve heard it all…

In a video posted November 9, David Barton told an audience at Ohio Christian University that “secular guys” recruited the Christians professors who critiqued The Jefferson Lies.

Watch:

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Barton claims his Christian critics were recruited by “secular guys.” Of course, this is flatly false, at least in my case and anyone I know. No one recruited Michael Coulter and me to critique Barton’s book. Furthermore, there are dozens of Christian professors who have critiqued Barton’s work simply because it is the right and honest thing to do.

Jay Richards is a Fellow at the Discovery Institute who recruited 10 scholars to read our book and The Jefferson Lies. None of these scholars were recruited by secular people to critique Barton.

Even the Family Research Council recognized flaws in Barton’s presentations and pulled his Capitol Tour video from view. Also, Focus on the Family edited Barton’s talks to remove two major historical errors. Perhaps Barton is going to include FRC and Focus on the Family among those recruited by the unnamed “secular guys.”

If it is true that Barton has an entire chapter devoted to Getting Jefferson Right, I can’t wait to see it.

In the mean time, I wrote to Dave Garrison at Ohio Christian University with a request to allow Michael Coulter and me to come to the school and present our work. If they really want to get at the truth, they will take us up on the offer.

 

 

  • http://brucegerencser.net/ Bruce Gerencser

    I always knew you were a secret secular plant. :) what else could it be? The actual history, the evidence? Barton continues to lie, distort, and embarrass himself. The Ohio Christian University administrators should be castigated for allowing Barton to spread his $&#%^. I know they are a conservative school, but I know one of their graduates who pastors a Methodist church where I live. Quite a history buff. I am sure he would be upset his alma mater allowed someone like Barton to lie in the name Jesus and Christian theocracy.

    • Warren Throckmorton

      Bruce – Be sure and recruit your friend, if you know what I mean.

  • http://jacobarminius.blogpost.com/ William Birch

    So few make more passionate, whiny, self-made martyrs than extremist right-wingers like Barton. Honestly . . .

  • Lijdare

    Sound like this Barton’s form of La Barbera’s “Switzerland.”

  • dan

    Well if David wasn’t a christian you would all love whatever he said .

    • http://brucegerencser.net/ Bruce Gerencser

      No, I suspect most of us don’t like ignorance wherever it is found.

      It is Barton’s fundamentalist, theocratic Christianity, coupled with a revisionist view of American history, that makes him dangerous. This is why it is important for people like Warren to speak out. As an atheist, I know my words will be rejected by Christians. However, when one of their own speaks out, they are more likely to pay attention.

      • dan

        I understand your words coming for a person who believes in a nothing power .The magical powers of evolution with it’s belief that Biology spontaneity created itself .Then Biology without knowledge ,without information ,without intelligences to know anything created all life as we know it .Wow! Now that a embarrassingly stupidity .

        • http://brucegerencser.net/ Bruce Gerencser

          Nice try, Dan but I will not be drawn into a meaningless discussion about evolution/creationism on a post about history and Barton. Nice try, though. Besides…were you there?

          Now, out the door, time for a date with my heathen wife. :)

          • dan

            Well I understand since your a atheist who faith is in a meaningless nothing

          • http://brucegerencser.net/ Bruce Gerencser

            Dan,

            I do not put my faith in a meaningless nothing. I actually put my faith in reason and human beings. Real tangible, flesh and blood human beings. I also am a humanist, so I put great stock in the humanist ideals and the humanist desire to make the world a better place to live.

            I hope you will someday attempt to thoughtfully understand atheists/atheism rather than continuing to believe what some preacher or Christian book has told you about atheists/atheism. If you really want to know, I have a blog. You know where to find me.

            I will refrain from putting up a graphic that would mock and make fun of your faith. Maybe someday you will see how much harm you actually do to the faith and the cause you profess to love.

            Bruce

          • Tom Van Dyke

            Bruce Gerencser writes: “I actually put my faith in reason and human beings.”

          • http://aebrain.blogspot.com Zoe_Brain

            Reason is the greatest enemy that faith has; it never comes to the aid of spiritual things, but — more frequently than not — struggles against the divine Word, treating with contempt all that emanates from God.

            – Martin Luther

            He was right – reason and facts can never be relied on to tell you what you want to hear – only what’s true.

          • dan

            The truth if offense to the perishing .The love of God is offer to you and you replace it with pride of self and your imaginary nothing .16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel, because it is the power of God that brings salvation to everyone who believes: first to the Jew, then to the Gentile. 17 For in the gospel the righteousness of God is revealed …

            18 The wrath of God is being revealed from heaven against all the godlessness and wickedness of people, who suppress the truth by their wickedness, 19 since what may be known about God is plain to them, because God has made it plain to them. 20 For since the creation of the world God’s invisible qualities—his eternal
            power and divine nature—have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that people are without excuse.
            21 Foralthough they knew God, they neither glorified him as God nor gave thanks to him, but their thinking became futile and their foolish hearts
            were darkened. 22 Although they claimed to be wise, they became fools .

          • http://aebrain.blogspot.com Zoe_Brain

            As for snow….

        • http://aebrain.blogspot.com Zoe_Brain

          The magical powers of evolution with it’s belief that Biology spontaneity created itself .

          Biogenesis is inevitable given the laws of physics, just as is the spontaneous creation of matter from vacuum energy (see the Kasimir effect etc).

          Evolution is another matter, nothing to do with that. Nothing magical about it either, and biological evolution is just a special case. It’s used all the time to find good solutions to problems we have no idea how to solve. We’re even doing work on making the process more efficient, by evolving better evolutionary algorithms.

  • Stogumber

    But if Barton’s answer isn’t the right one, how else can we explain why Christian professors bitch against other Christians?

    You may perhaps say that those professors only plead for better means to reach a common Christian aim. But is there such a common Christian aim, from which we can decide which means are appropriate? I don’t see it, and Professor Throckmorton never speaks about it.

    Should we accept that in fact it is a conflict between two different religions, one Christian and one non-Christian – and of course both maintaining that they represent the true Christian religion?

    Then, the criterion might be: Who of both would better resist to a pagan dictator who tries to break them by a mixture of seduction and suppression (like the Roman emperor)? The followers of Barton or the followers of Throckmorton?

    • http://aebrain.blogspot.com Zoe_Brain

      How about those who aren’t “followers” of either – but are genuinely trying (however imperfectly) to seek the truth, and reject comforting lies?

    • ken

      “But if Barton’s answer isn’t the right one, how else can we explain why Christian professors bitch against other Christians?”

      Because christian professers believe in giving out the facts, not distorting them to fit their religious views. Seems a pretty reasonable explanation.

      Further, correcting Barton’s falsehoods and mis-representations is hardly “bitching”.

      “Should we accept that in fact it is a conflict between two different
      religions, one Christian and one non-Christian – and of course both
      maintaining that they represent the true Christian religion?”

      And how do you determine that one side is “christian” and the other “non-christian”?

      Your post indicates you believe that all christians must think exactly alike. Further, you set up a false dicotomy between those who support Barton and those who don’t. Simply because someone doesn’t agree with Barton’s methods and claims, doesn’t mean they believe everything Warren does about christianity either. It just means that they, like Warren, don’t believe Barton represents them.

      • http://aebrain.blogspot.com Zoe_Brain

        ” They have been still more disfigured by the corruptions of
        schismatizing followers, who have found an interest in sophisticating and perverting the simple doctrines he taught, by engrafting on them the mysticisms of a Grecian Sophist (Plato), frittering them into subtilties and obscuring them with jargon, until they have caused good men to reject the whole in disgust, and to view Jesus himself as an impostor. Notwithstanding these disadvantages, a system of morals is presented to us which, if filled up in the true style and spirit of the rich fragments he left us, would be the most perfect and sublime that has ever been taught by man. The question of his being a member of the Godhead, or in direct communication with it, claimed for him by some of his followers, and denied by others, is foreign to the present view, which is merely an estimate of the intrinsic merits of his doctrines.”

        So wrote Jefferson ( http://www.sacred-texts.com/bib/jb/jb04.htm )
        . He viewed himself as a Christian – a follower of the moral code taught by the man Jesus. These days, he’d be classed by Right wing Christians as an atheist, a librul commie in revolt against God.

    • Tom Van Dyke

      Hm. Self-described “evangelicals” yet they don’t evangelize the Gospel, Stogumber? I have seen this often in the Culture Wars, where the David Bartons are the enemy and they make common cause with those hostile to religion, to Christianity–to the Bible itself. Interesting point.

      Why do you think that is?

    • David S.

      What an approach to learning! The system where we produce truth by one person arguing a case based on evidence and then someone who disagrees brings their own case based on evidence, wherein hopefully the discussion will bring enough evidence that there will be consensus among students of the field, that system is almost universally used for finding truth. Yet you would dismiss it; if one person argues a case and another disagrees, then one of them must be non-Christian and it’s merely a conflict between religions.


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