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I'm new here

(69 posts) (16 voices)
  • Started 2 years ago by Veritas
  • Latest reply from Darwin

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  1. Veritas
    Member

    I’ve really enjoyed reading your forum, but haven’t participated until now (does that make me a lurker?) But I’d like to share my story. You can tell I’m new at participating in forums or blogs, so be gentle with me.

    For the first 15 years of my life I was brainwashed by a combination of Southern Baptist stupidity/bigotry and the really fundamental Church-of-God-brand of hellfire and brimstone. To say that they scared me to death is an understatement. Watching those people flailing around on the floor talking gibberish (sorry, “speaking in tongues”) was probably not the healthiest thing for a child (or adults for that matter). I felt like there was something wrong with me that “the spirit of god” wouldn’t enter my body and “speak” through me. The Baptists baptized me twice (I guess I was a really sinful 9 year old). I really wanted to believe and because my mom spent her life looking for a god that would save her, we went to every service, event, crusade, evangelical retreat, and revival we could get to. I was ideal fodder for the Baptist fear machine….dysfunctional family, lots of insecurity and fear.

    When I was 16 my mom discovered Herbert W. Armstrong and his Worldwide Church of God (very weird church/cult). I started having nightmares about my mom suddenly disappearing to the “place of safety” (Petra in Jordan). Somehow I found the courage to tell her that I wasn’t going to church any more. Since then (many years….I may be older than any of you!) I’ve tried hard to believe in god (lots of praying….to no avail) at different times in my life; it felt like trying to believe the earth is flat…..just wasn’t going to happen.

    Some of the questions I had even as a teenager were:

    1. That whole John 3:16 thing….it doesn’t seem like a huge sacrifice for a god to have his “son” killed and then get him back in 3 days. The Baptists likened it to watching my brother hanging on the cross….I would never get my brother back…..that would be a real sacrifice indeed.
    2. How can god “know every hair” on our heads, intervene and direct our lives and still allow us free will? Also, is it really free will if the choices are “my way or eternal torture”….that seems more like coercion and threats.
    3. If god made us with our logical and wonderfully curious minds, why are we not to use them?
    4. If there were a god as Christianity describes him, why does he get all the credit when things go right (i.e. a cancer healing after chemo) but none of the blame when things go wrong? Although I did see where some of the extreme fundamentalists said that god was punishing Haiti for homosexual behavior by sending them the earth quake. Have they never heard of tectonic plates?

    Anyway, you get the drift. Until I discovered some of the atheist blogs and websites, I thought that religion was not for me, but was mostly benign (well, except for the bloody crusades, Spanish inquisition, etc. throughout history). I can see how believing in something/someone to come save and comfotrt us would be nice if you didn’t think about it too much (and if it actually worked) It scares me that the religious right in this country is getting more and more fundamental and have so much power.

    Thanks for helping me along my path away from all that fear and superstition.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  2. Eudaimonist
    Member

    "How can god “know every hair” on our heads, intervene and direct our lives and still allow us free will? Also, is it really free will if the choices are “my way or eternal torture”….that seems more like coercion and threats."

    Even better than this, if God already knows the future (and therefore it is certain), how can free will still exist?

    Posted 2 years ago #
  3. Veritas
    Member

    Exactly!

    Posted 2 years ago #
  4. Veritas
    Member

    If god needs us (flawed, imperfect human beings) to worship and adore him, does that make him a narcissist? Maybe some psychiatric intervention is called for.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  5. Elemenope
    Moderator

    Welcome, Veritas!

    Posted 2 years ago #
  6. Veritas
    Member

    Thanks. Can someone tell me how to put my picture on my profile? I like seeing what people choose.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  7. UrsaMinor
    Member

    Hi, Veritas! Welcome to UF!

    I just grappled with the picture problem myself just a few days ago. You have to go to http://www.Gravatar.com and create a profile there (use the same email address that you used when you created your UF profile). Then you can upload a picture, and it will appear here instead of the little geometric icon.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  8. Custador
    Moderator

    Welcome Veritas :-)

    Posted 2 years ago #
  9. dutchhobbit
    Member

    Hey welcome, have some cookies

    Posted 2 years ago #
  10. fredjs
    Member

    Welcome, Veritas! Say, would you like a chocolate covered pretzel?

    Posted 2 years ago #
  11. LRA
    Member

    Welcome! :D

    Posted 2 years ago #
  12. Veritas
    Member

    I love all chocolate and cookies!

    I have a question for you guys. The word "god" is so much part of our venacular...you know, "thank god I found my keys". Do you find that weird, do you try not to say it or do you just accept is as a part of our language norms? My friends with whom I (good- naturedly, mostly) debate god think its a sign that I really do believe in god deep down inside.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  13. LRA
    Member

    Nah. It's just a bad habit. Like biting your nails.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  14. Kodie
    Member

    I say "goddammit" A LOT! I don't think it's weird, think of it how you pick up any slang. Also, I say "Oh my god!" a lot. How do you learn language, how are you fluent at it? Does the fluency with English come from god? I don't think learning a word and then using it comes from god, but if you think you shouldn't say it, you can train yourself to listen for it, listen for the situations you say it, and then say something else or nothing, like LRA said, bad habit. Like how you remember not to curse in front of your grandmother, for example, or at a job interview.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  15. fredjs
    Member

    @Veritas:

    There's nothing wrong with using 'god' in those ways. It's just part of our vernacular, like you said. I say "holy shit" a lot but even when I was a believer I never though that shit was particularly holy.

    The one thing I try not to do anymore is refer to something I like a lot as 'heavenly'. "This chocolate is heavenly", "Being in your arms is like heaven", "Wow, this dump I took makes me feel like I just got into heaven!". I don't look at the concept of heaven as a particularly welcoming or happy place to be. Then again, I know I'm probably going overboard when I try to cut myself off from using the word in passing.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  16. Veritas
    Member

    Thanks, it seems to be an individual thing. Interesting, christians try not to use that name as a curse because they believe and I don't want to use it because I don't believe. I'm not going to sweat it :)

    Posted 2 years ago #
  17. Paul
    Member

    Welcome to UF!

    It's funny how christians abide by the whole don-not-use-his-name-in-vain thing, when most of those uses are simply colloquial forms of a prayer and not actually defaming their god.

    I think about the use of "god" in secular speech a lot, and although I do find it a bit hypocritical, the vernacular is simply too pervasive. I've yet to find the proper want to stop using phrases like "holy shit" or the interjection "jesus!" At this point it's simply language. Should we stop using the term "goodbye?" which originally derived from something like "god be with you?" If anything, the widespread use of these terms is a perfect rebuttal to the persecution complex: it shows that the christians really are the majority and not a persecuted minority.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  18. fredjs
    Member

    One thing that I don't do anymore and have been good with since is saying "bless you" when someone sneezes. That one has absolutely no value at all.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  19. UrsaMinor
    Member

    Try "Gesundheit" or "A vos souhaits".

    Posted 2 years ago #
  20. Kodie
    Member

    Or "get any on ya?"

    Posted 2 years ago #
  21. joe agnost
    Member

    After someone sneezes I like to say: "You're sooooo good looking."

    Anybody get the reference??

    Posted 2 years ago #
  22. fredjs
    Member

    @Ursa: Yeahhhh, that's the ticket. :|

    @Kodie: Nice! I also like the classic "Hey! I want the news not the weather!"

    @joe agnost: Nope. Do tell.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  23. UrsaMinor
    Member

    @joe agnost: not a clue here either.

    @fredjs: if you want to be even more classy, try "Salve!". That's Latin for "Gesundheit". :)

    Posted 2 years ago #
  24. Kodie
    Member

    I guess you two never watched Seinfeld.

    I usually, and most people I know, say "bless you," but Fred's technically right, it's really just a courtesy to acknowledge something normal, a reflexive expression, even to wish someone "health," it's just like knocking on wood, or is it more like saying "thank you"? It's just expected in polite society (which is populated by aliens in my estimation).

    EDIT: And when I say "bless you," I mean it like Paul explains we say "goodbye." And when I sneeze and I'm alone, and it startles me, I sometimes acknowledge it... a lot less politely. I hate sneezing. Maybe that's another reason people address it aside from health superstitions or spirits escaping. We don't say "god bless you" when someone stubs their toe or gets something in their eye, but we usually say, "you ok?"

    Posted 2 years ago #
  25. joe agnost
    Member

    Thank you Kodie! I was beginning to wonder about y'all! ;)

    Further explanation - Jerry Seinfeld, in an episode of his sitcom "Seinfeld", decided that a compliment was more appropriate than a "god bless you" when someone sneezes... so he settled on "you're soooo good looking". Every time someone sneezed around Jerry for the rest of the episode he'd reply with..... you guesses it: "you're soooo good looking!".

    It still cracks my wife up when I do it... we're simple that way! ;)

    EDIT: I just realized that Kodie provided a link to youtube - ignore my explanation then!

    Kodie wrote: "I hate sneezing"

    Funny - I'm the opposite! I find it ~almost~ orgasmic! I think it's a similar feeling to that although (obviously) one that lasts a LOT less long and isn't nearly as intense as the real thing.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  26. fredjs
    Member

    @Kodie:

    You're some kind of freak encyclopedia. I love it! Thou art now known as 'Kodiepedia'.

    I used to watch Seinfeld but it's been ages. After Cloverfield came out I came *this close* to doing a YouTube spoof called Cloverfeld, which would've had this monster terrorizing New York by screaming "What's the deal with humans? They're humans but they taste like chicken!", etc. I was beaten to it.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  27. Kodie
    Member

    Kodiepedia. I love it! I saw some mash-ups recently, never watched them before - mostly paired with Ferris Bueller, but I think you could do a better mash-up than this one. Maybe not, I've never seen Cloverfield.

    Serenity NOW!!!

    Posted 2 years ago #
  28. fredjs
    Member

    It's OK in spots but overall fairly meh.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  29. Justice Gustin
    Member

    Goddamn, what a password!

    Hi to all- I have been following all of you for four days now while I've been snowed-in here in north Georgia. I feel like I know some of you now and am amazed at the wealth of info.

    I am by no means an expert on these subjects, but at times would like to put my two cents in.

    First off, I am 100% atheist- pretty much have been all my life. Details may ensue.

    Regarding using these words in everyday vernacular, I do say "goddamn it" occasionally but, it could be considered meaning to have god (intentional lower case) damn (v.) the object in question. I don't think that is the same as using his name in vain is it?

    How about "damn it to hell"? I say that all the time. Kinda the same meaning I guess.

    Oh, to hell with it- I just say what I want!

    Posted 2 years ago #
  30. Eudaimonist
    Member

    I'm only 95% atheist. :(

    Posted 2 years ago #

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