http://www.samharris.org/blog/item/drugs-and-the-meaning-of-life/
I usually love everything Sam Harris writes, but I felt at times like this was grabbing for something that wasn't quite there. To say that taking psychedelic drugs are "one of the most important rites of passage for a human being" seems overkill to me. Has anyone here taken any? Am I really missing out that much?
UrsaMinor
Member
Never tried anything psychedelic. I have had some interesting conversations with people on LSD, though. They seemed to be enjoying themselves on a whole different plane that they had trouble explaining to me.
I have to concede Harris's point about the arbitrariness of our drug laws. I think they do much more harm than they prevent (if, indeed, they prevent any harm at all). I say make everything legal, make it a crime to endanger others by driving under the influence or doing anything else where clear perception, reflexes and judgment are required, and leave it at that.
Jabster
Member
Not for many many years but of all the drugs I've taken I put them in a class of their own just because they're such brain fuckers. It's not just they distort your vision is the fact that they really do screw around with your thoughts ... so getting panicky because I couldn't remember the last time I went to an A levels Maths class - that's ok I left college almost two years ago; standing at the end of an alley waiting for someone called Steve - nope that was something we made up to tell the two other people with us and for some reason we then thought we really were meeting Steve; they started the film again and I didn't realise - nope they where showing the same scene again; and last but not least spending a good half-an-hour wondering why I'm here on the planet.
@Custy
Which drugs do you enjoy more?
Jabster those are hilarious stories. Were those positive experiences, or was it like experiencing brief psychosis and unenjoyable?
so getting panicky because I couldn't remember the last time I went to an A levels Maths class - that's ok I left college almost two years ago;
I have nightmares that I have forgotten an AP English credit in high school... I wonder how common stuff like this is.
Mark the Pilgrim
Member
I've never taken drugs and I have no plan to do so. I'm 'here and there' on the legality of them as a whole - I believe that some drugs should be decriminalised, whilst other stronger drugs like ecstasy or heroin should probably remain criminalised.
I certainly don't agree that they are a rite of passage.
Elemenope
Moderator
...Alrighty then, picture this if you will:
10 to 2 AM, X, Yogi DMT, and a box of Krispy Kremes, in my "need to know" pose, just outside of Area 51.
Contemplating the whole "chosen people" thingy when a flaming stealth banana split the sky like one would hope but never really expect to see in a place like this.
Cutting right angle donuts on a dime and stopping right at my Birkenstocks, and me yelping...
Holy fucking shit!
Then the X-Files being, looking like some kind of blue-green Jackie Chan with Isabella Rossellini lips and breath that reeked of vanilla Chig Champa,
did a slow-mo Matrix descent out of the butt end of the banana vessel and hovered above my bug-eyes, my gaping jaw, and my sweaty L. Ron Hubbard upper lip and all I could think was: "I hope Uncle Martin here doesn't notice that I pissed my fuckin' pants."
So light in his way,
Like an apparition,
He had me crying out,
"Fuck me,
It's gotta be,
Deadhead Chemistry,
The blotter got right on top of me,
Got me seein' E-motherfuckin'-T!"
And after calming me down with some orange slices and some fetal spooning, E.T. revealed to me his singular purpose.
He said, "You are the Chosen One, the One who will deliver the message. A message of hope for those who choose to hear it and a warning for those who do not."
Me. The Chosen One?
They chose me!!!
And I didn't even graduate from fuckin' high school.
You better.
You better.
You better.
You better listen.
When he looked right through me
With somniferous almond eyes.
Don't even know what that means
Must remember to write it down.
This is so real.
Like the time he floated away.
See my heart is pounding,
'Cause this shit never happens to me.
Can't breathe, right now!
It was so real.
Like I woke up in Wonderland.
All sort of terrifying.
And I don't wanna be all alone when I tell this story.
And can anyone tell me why
you all sound like Peanut's parents
Will I ever be coming down?
This is so real.
Finally it's my lucky day.
See my heart is racing,
'Cause this shit never happens to me.
Can't breathe, right now!
You believe me, don't you?
Please believe what I just said, see the Dead ain't touring.
And this wasn't all in my head.
See they took me by the hand and invited me right in,
Then they showed me something.
I don't even know where to begin...
Soooo... hallucinogens are like a bad dream?
I've tried x and a little mj and that's about it.
I liked x, but I was never touchy-feely on it like other people. I was just happy. And talkative. But still pretty much myself. Just a happy, talkative version of myself. :D
Mj put me to sleep and I just don't really like it.
Jabster
Member
@Euda
Overall they where enjoyable experience but I can see the possibility of hallucinogenics not being for everyone. First time I took acid we took one tab each and then after half an hour or so thought this doesn't seem to be working so took another half a tab each - shortly afterwards it did start to kick in and so did the realisation that the top-up half tab hadn't even began to have any affect yet. This is when it starts to get weird as you slowly get more and more powerful hallucinations and your brain's ability to cope with this deteriorates. It was a key point for me, where I really had to concentrate hard to remember what I was doing and that it's not dangerous, but with a realisation that this will last for some hours if I don't like it. We all decided it was best not to be around people and so went along to the sea front and it all became somewhat better. There's something awe inspiring, I can see why this class of drugs is used in religious rituals, about see playing cards on the side of a tower, smiling faces between pebbles and best of all the stars when they same to have real depth to the distances between them and the closest ones you feel you can reach out and touch.
So what's the conclusion ... not sure, but I do sort of think that unless someone has taken this class of drugs they are missing out.
I always enjoyed MDMA for pure mood alteration. It genuinely did make me the happiest man on Earth, made me love everybody and made me want to dance. Had some great times on the mud :-)
Um... Coke is good, but I only did it once. Severe self-limitation because when I did it I spent about an hour and a half thinking that I was God (seriously) and that everybody else present were my loving creations. When I came down, I figured that it could get really addictive really quick so decided not to do it again.
Favourite is still hash. Not weed, though. I was using when the transition took place between hash and skunk/bud, and towards the end it seemed like all you could buy was skunk. Friends tell me that's still true. I never thought much to skunk. It's too strong and too samey - You smoke some, you turn into a vegetable, you fall asleep. It's just... Shit. With the good hash I used to get, smoking was massively social. A group of us used to spend the night rolling and smoking; the high was very mellow, very chilled, very relaxed - but you had to hit it really hard to turn veggie with it. Much better than skunk.
Jabster
Member
@Custy
That's was pretty much my experience with dope as well - I'm really showing my age by calling it that and grass was what was grown in the garage, bathroom, airing cupboard etc. by some bloke you knew.
I had some great nights on it but it was always social and the whole idea of being like a vegetable and falling asleep seems all rather pointless. Other drugs I've tried are coke - only once as rather nice but ever so pricey back then; quite a bit of speed - fun if you like speaking bollocks all night; magic mushrooms - a bit like tabs but more intense and shorter duration with the added bonus they are free and legal. Sitting in a pub passing around the mushrooms was always fun!
Still remember a time when we sitting in a mates car on the sea front and seeing a police car approach. We all kept saying don't say what we are really doing (have been to the woods, taken loads of mushrooms and have just had a spliff to finish the evening off). In the the confusion we didn't actually thinks of a reason for what we where doing so in a state of confusion a mate just blurted out, looking at the lights on the end of the pier officer.
Sock
Member
The first drug I ever did was LSD. At first, the only thing I could compare it to was being awake -way- too long, when you start to become delusional. As the trip continued, all the colors started to bleed and warp. My thought process wasn't too badly effected, but I was a lot less cautious in general. The hallucinations were very strange, and I did try to touch some of them to make sure that they weren't real.
Truthfully, if you're at all curious about experiencing something that you can NEVER experience any other way... I'd suggest salvia. However, let me explain something about salvia.
I hated it, the one time I did it. I am a control freak, I need to be in control of myself at all times. With salvia, my mind was working, but I couldn't control my body. I knew what I wanted to say, but every time I tried... I just couldn't speak, I couldn't say what I needed to. It was terrifying. Before salvia, I had perceived reality as something flat. After smoking it, I felt like reality had folded around me, and trapped me in another dimension. The hallucinations were the strongest I've ever felt. Everything looked like peacock feathers and spirals.
The high only lasts around 10-15 minutes. It's entirely legal in the US. You DO need someone who's going to stay sober to watch you, however. It really does take you to another plane. It's scary, but there's no long term side effects (unless you already suffer from some serious mental disorders, like schizophrenia).
I really can't stress, or explain, how it changes your perception of reality. It's an experience unlike anything I've ever had. Until you've tried salvia, it's something that you cannot fully understand. I would suggest that everyone try it once, just for the experience.
Also, LMNOP: Maynard is the closest thing I have to a deity.
Sock
Member
From my experience... no. It's not just hype. I never expected something to hit me like that, and I've done a lot of drugs. When I tried it, I thought I could handle it.
Watch the videos of people using on youtube. It does reduce you to a blubbering shell while it lasts.
I've never done shrooms, so I can't say. All I know is that it was extremely intense, and I am thankful that it was so short.
UrsaMinor
Member
Speaking of drugs, it seems that the U.S. has just declared that marijuana has "no accepted medical use".
http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-marijuana-20110709,0,1346255.story
Wow. I love the establishment of truth by fiat, don't you?
You also have the opposite. Something is not true because authority Y says so.
"Well yes, but my point was that you live in a nation of people who equate "truth" to "because X authority said so". The fact that people fall for that shit is a result of being raised religious, imho."
The number of people who live their lives purely on the basis of their own personal experimental knowledge is vanishingly small. I'd even go so far as to say that in many cases ignoring 'X authority's say so' can be a dramatically bad idea.
So, like, believing someone who tells you that it's their birthday today would be a bad idea? Or when someone tells you "I'm a doctor, and what you really need to do is come in to see me some time this week so we can run some tests"-- would believing the alleged doctor be unjustified? Should we *scientifically test* your birthday (never mind the likely impossibility)? Maybe withhold birthday congratulations or small kindnesses or cake until we get a peek at your birth certificate?
A) Sometimes we believe other people without justification.
B) Sometimes those people deceive us.
C) We do not like to be deceived because having the 'Truth' is better than not.
That's all well and good, but
D) We should never believe other people (or anything else, for that matter) without justification.
doesn't actually follow.
UrsaMinor
Member
D) We should never believe other people (or anything else, for that matter) without justification.
doesn't actually follow.
Agreed. On the practical side, if you pay attention long enough, the untrustworthy authorities will usually reveal themselves by slipping up, and then you can stop believing in them with some justification.
I'll give a tentative pass to anyone who doesn't set off my bullshit detector immediately. My trust is always subject to change when I get new information.
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