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Unreasonable Faith Forum » Introduction » Welcome / Introduce Yourself

My story so far.

(19 posts) (15 voices)
  • Started 1 year ago by Ephlan
  • Latest reply from swmr1

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  1. Ephlan
    Member

    My name is Josh Stewart
    I grew up in a very conservative Christian community in rural TN. My Father was the pastor of a local Plymouth brethren chapel. My mother was just a simple woman who felt called by God to home-school my sister and myself.

    We were the typical home-school kids, brilliant in some areas but inconceivably ignorant in others. And all the while plagued with a terrible case of social awkwardness. I think the home-school education was the worst part of my childhood. Because of it I was sheltered from people who held opposing ideas. I also lacked a proper understanding of science and philosophy. And worst of all I was accountable only to my parents (neither of who have a college degree) when it came to demonstrating that I understood what was being taught. I was home-schooled all through high school. And Most of that was self taught. Because I had almost no accountability, I was able to cheat my way to a diploma through the means of an umbrella school. I didn't really understand the potential consequences of those choices until long after the fact. Having never been given the understanding of the importance of education.

    I mention this first because I want to give you all some warning that my posts may not be the best written work. The only English I ever learned I did so by reading books on my own. I really do think that my education bordered on child neglect. Being out in the boondocks by myself with almost no accountability is not a good environment for a child to learn in.

    My faith growing up was based on the fear of one thing.

    Hell

    In short, it worked much like this:

    In the beginning God created everything. Man sinned against God. God atoned for man's sin with Jesus's death on the cross. I could only be saved if I believed this and accepted Jesus's sacrifice for me.
    (here comes the part that kept me going in circles)

    If I accepted this then I would be indwelt by the holy spirit and would do good works for God. But, because I didn't want to do good things for God and because I still wanted to "sin" I felt I wasn't truly "saved" and therefore I started all over again.
    For a good 15 YEARS i went to bed every night torturing myself over my eternal salvation. I constantly bugged my parents about it. I asked why I didn't FEEL "saved". I asked how I could really know. I would talk to other preachers and youth pastors about it as well. I just can't stress this enough. I was consumed by the idea that there was a small chance that I might end up in hell. I was driven by fear almost solely.

    The real clincher for me was how often Jesus would say "go and sin no more". I really felt like that was such a snapshot of what Jesus expected of me. Sure, salvation wasn't built on works. But like Paul said in Romans: Should we continue to sin so that grace might increase? God forbid! So, I decided around age 11 to eradicate sin from my life. This was actually easier than it sounds at first. After all, what kind of trouble can an 11 year old get into on a farm in the middle of nowhere? The impossible part of my task I soon discovered was my inability to deal with my "sexual immorality". Puberty was hitting me hard at this point and the conflicting desire to be pure versus what comes naturally was maddening. This inner struggle went on for years and really shaped my life choices in the future.

    I eventually came to the conclusion that if I wanted to stay in God's good graces and avoid hell. I would have to marry somebody ASAP. This was to be my sole goal in life for the next eight years. (oh it gets more twisted) Once again, I was following the teachings of the bible and I justified it with 1Cor 7:9.

    "But if they can't control themselves, they should go ahead and marry. It's better to marry than to burn with lust."

    When I was 15 my parents moved out of the country and to a small town. It was here that I met my wife to be. Her dad was a pastor as well in the Christian Church (CoC with music) We dated for 6 years and got married when were both 21. I was still a hardcore believer at this point as was my wife and our entire family. We lived a happy married life for a few years until about two years ago.

    (I'm going to try and speed this up now so please bear with me.)

    Two year ago my best friend came to me and told me he didn't believe in God anymore.
    I was stunned. I didn't know what to think. My friends dad was also a pastor (see a theme here?) and had been my youth group leader during my teenage years. I knew my friend to be a very smart individual but I just couldn't fathom how he could risk his eternal salvation so flippantly. Over the course of several months we had nightly conversations about scripture, science and philosophy. He got me started on reading materials I never would have considered picking up and it got me thinking... hard.

    Suddenly I had questions. I went to my dad for answers, my pastor and my wifes professors. I began to rip through books looking for answers like my salvation depended on it. (I still thought it did.) I read Sam Harris, Dawkins, William Lane Craig, Bart erhman, Bertrand Russel, David Hume, CS Lewis, Robert Wright and on and on.

    Everyone I talked to seemed to be either uninterested and unconcerned, or unable to fathom the gravity of the concerns trying to communicate.

    Bart Erhman was the one who sealed my fate for me. He shattered my reliance on the bible as the true word of a living God. After I finished Jesus Interrupted I think I went crazy. My world exploded. All I had worked for in life had been based on lies my parents believed. "The bible has no errors, it contains no contradictions"... Shit I could have disproved on google for crying out loud. My world turned upside down in a way that I can't describe.

    For one, I finally found peace. There was no boogeyman getting ready to send me to hell. I didn't have to worry about the salvation of my friends and family or others. A weight came off me like I had never felt in any church service. I have never felt so free. On the other hand... the rage that enveloped me was unquenchable. I lost a lot of friends that day. I wrecked my marriage that day too. Those first few weeks I saw nothing but red. I laid waste with my new found knowledge and freedom. I went back to every pastor who had counseled me and ripped them apart. Usually it ended with everyone in tears, myself included. My wife and I were talking of divorce at this time when she told me she was pregnant...

    I have never been the same. I am trying to heal but I feel very overwhelmed. My wife and I are divorced. (she said I wasn't the man she married) I left home with everything I could carry in my car. I sold all my books that I worked so hard for and read so much. I live in lexington KY now without much to my name and not many friends. My best friend lives with me though and he's really the best thing that ever happened to me. Sorry to be such a downer. I've never really been able to write this out before so you'll have to excuse me. I don't know how to end this so I guess I'll stop here. Thanks for reading.

    Posted 1 year ago #
  2. UrsaMinor
    Member

    The anger at the lost and wasted years is understandable. You were raised with a lie, and deliberately sheltered from other worldviews. A sense of betrayal is almost inevitable when you finally do manage to break out of the navel-gazing black hole that is fundamentalist Christianity, and take a look at what's really out there.

    I never had to go through that. I was never sold on the God or Jesus idea in the first place, and my family and community are less punishing than yours. Dutch Reformed Protestants are just as wrong in their theology, but they lack the passion and vindictiveness of the evangelicals. I just sort of drifted away from religious stuff as a teenager. Nobody at church noticed. My mother is vaguely disappointed, but then she's a pretty vague Christian. Dad never attended church the last thirty years of his life, but if you asked him he'd say he believed in Jesus.

    I never actually sat down to discuss theology with either of my parents. I'm pretty sure that it would not have been fruitful, because I think their own beliefs were entirely unexamined, and it's hard to talk about what you believe in and why you believe it if you have been raised with "Religion = True = Christianity, of course!" as an axiom. By observation, I deduced that their morality was based on the Golden Rule, and all the God mumbo-jumbo was a sort of cultural veneer shellacked over that. Nobody ever quoted Bible verses to justify or condemn actions in our house.

    It is heart-wrenching to hear stories from people like you who have lost family and friends after deconversion, or who have carefully kept their deconversion secret from their family for fear of reprisals. On the surface, you'd think, "Hey, this is America, where you are free to believe or not believe as you see fit. Nobody can force religion on you, and no one can take it away. We're all united in agreement on that." You would expect religious people to support the freedom of religion concept. In my experience they don't, by and large. It's really bizarre to me how the country that built itself around the concept has devolved into the current state of affairs.

    Well, I'm glad to hear that you got out of the religion biz, but sorry to hear that it had to come at such a high cost. If you have any degree of mobility, you might consider relocating to a more liberal part of the country. New England, the mid-Atlantic, the West Coast. Practically any place other than Kentucky.

    Posted 1 year ago #
  3. Francesco
    Member

    Well, I assume that was quite traumatic...anyway, you probably escaped for one fo the most miserable existances ever. For what I've understood you married someone just because you could not express your sexuality, and that, on the long run, would have been devastating.

    However there are bright side. You're in your early 20, you can build a new life.

    Posted 1 year ago #
  4. FO
    Member

    Welcome to UF Ephlan... and... Just wow!
    That sucks horribly.

    The rage is entirely understandable.
    (Disclaimer: I have never been a believer)

    You may want to see if where you live there are atheist meetups/circles, where you can find a lot of people with similar experience.
    If not, UF is filled with that.

    Since you have been long in a sheltered community, you may want to make experiences.
    Travel, possibly.
    See different things.
    Learn what you like.
    Leave the US for a while if you can.
    Then it will be a lot easier for you to make friends.

    Posted 1 year ago #
  5. Custador
    Moderator

    Welcome again Ephlan. That's a hell of a story; I think you summed up for me why home-schooling needs to be much more tightly controlled. Parents treat their kids like they're property, to do with and to mould into whatever they like.

    Oh, and your standard of written English is a good deal higher than that which I read from a lot of university graduates, so don't get paranoid over that :-p

    Posted 1 year ago #
  6. kholdom0790
    Member

    Ohhh the horror. I can't even begin to assess that in any kind of mental framework. Just...no words.

    I am so happy and thankful that you came out of it, even at the expense of your entire network of friends, family and community. I hope you can find peace.

    Posted 1 year ago #
  7. Noelle
    Member

    You the same Josh I made a little fun of over at JNNPR when you first started commenting?

    There's a good number of atheist PK's around these sites. You'll find them if you bring it up. I married a PK, already atheist by the time we met in college though, so different story. And my father-in-law (now retired) seems barely deist. I've never seen them pray at dinner. He'd be thrilled to marry all the gay and lesbian couples on the eastern seaboard, he had no scruples about enjoying movies and books with the darkest R ratings and themes with his children. And though my husband never told dad he's an atheist, the man has never asked why we don't go to church. I've been told I don't know the same man who raised my husband.

    You're a good addition around here. Don't be shy about chiming in whenever.

    I'll offer the same advice as the others. You are a young man. Travel. Go to college and get yourself a nice degree. Stretches the brain and if you're lucky it'll help you get a job that'll help fund the travel bit. Open-minded people of every background are everywhere. You'll meet them. You have a child? You can push through this and be a good happy and honest man and father too.

    Posted 1 year ago #
  8. Agathos
    Member

    Welcome Ephlan. I too am a PK, and was socialized by parents who taught me to be ignorant and lack any sort of intellectual complexity. Furthermore, as with you, I was sheltered and insulated from outside influences that might make me question some of the very limited categories for understanding experience I was given.

    Breaking out of this deductive shield will cause significant cognitive dissonance: there's just no way around it. I don't know if you have seen the movie the Matrix but I liken it to taking the red pill, and for some people that means waking up in a 'better' place, for others it means waking up in a very dark and disturbing place. I think it's harder if you have been convinced that you will have life after life, that the creator of the universe is especially interested in everything you do and has a wonderful plan for your life. It may seem ridiculous to those not brought up with such categories but when you are socialized and inculcated to one-hundred percent believe that, and it is stripped away, the rebuilding phase can be extremely emotionally hard.

    I am one of Ursa's persons who (not-so) carefully keeps the secret, but has managed to keep it this far nonetheless. I'm starting to wonder if there is any benefit to ever coming out to those inside the Christian bubble. So far I haven't heard a lot of good stories.

    Posted 1 year ago #
  9. LRA
    Member

    Josh!!! Welcome! *hugs!*

    Posted 1 year ago #
  10. Ephlan
    Member

    Thanks you guys. This all means a lot.
    Noelle, I think so. But I can't remember what you said? :p

    Posted 1 year ago #
  11. Francesco
    Member

    I have just now understood the meaning word "homeschooled"....what the hell....sorry but that's a bit surreal for me (here school is mandatory). Think I didn't understand your story very well 'till now.

    Posted 1 year ago #
  12. Noelle
    Member

    It was mild enough. You broke out through the gates a little strong on a post that hardly warranted it. I gave you a smart-ass reply. But that is the way of the boards. You got the swing of things quickly enough. I second Nzo's veto on your previous not gonna comment that often statement.

    When it comes to leaving religion, some people were never there, some walk away with barely any notice. Looks like you went with outright sedition.

    Posted 1 year ago #
  13. Justice Gustin
    Member

    It's always been amazing to me how the perceived "good" of religion can be so detrimental. Reading your story, and similar others, reiterates the reasons why I'm an atheist.

    Good luck and welcome to UF.

    Posted 1 year ago #
  14. SunshinEsBH
    Member

    Congratulations!

    Know what you mean by that weight of guilt falling away when you realsise its all a (bad) story :->

    Congratulations again!

    I was also ended up getting divorced when i started drifting from the faith - all i can say is it gets easier as time goes by. Try keep strong.

    Gotta agree with the advice to travel if you can. It will blow your mind to see how differently people perceive things across the world.

    Posted 1 year ago #
  15. zach
    Member

    Welcome to the forum, Ephlan! I really appreciate your post. Stories like yours are why I still haven't come out to my parents or most of my friends. Of course, I didn't react quite as strongly when I lost my faith LOL. I wish I could though, I admire your tenacity. I have to hold my tongue and leave the room sometimes. I'm invested in finishing my Bachelor of Arts at a Christian college though, and so have until the end of next spring to keep my shout.

    I was home-schooled up until high school, but it was a Christian private school so the only "exposure" I faced were the charismatics. They actually helped plant seeds of doubt since I realized, though brushed aside, that they were actually taking much more of scripture at face value than my fellow Presbyterians (and especially the Baptists).

    How old are you then? Mid-twenties? We both got plenty of time to rebuild. I doubt my atheism is going to burn every bridge when I come out, though I'll definitely lose touch with my hometown...but I'm not that connected anyway. I've come out to a few people I trust here, maybe just under a dozen, and they've all reacted about as well as I could hope for.

    Posted 1 year ago #
  16. Tony T
    Member

    Hi Ephlan,

    I'm a first time reader of this site and forum and first time writer. It's always a shame when people use there beliefs to a dgree that cause people, you. To suffer in anyway. You are no doubt suffering a lot of pain and may do for the rest of your life. But and it's a big but. You are now free to believe and live how you have chosen without guilt. Try to put to one side any hate (if any) for being brought up the way your parents thought best. They belive what they believe and only did what they thought was best. No matter how misguided.

    Be happy that they live a life that suits them. Now it's your turn to live how you want and make mistakes, just like your parents. When I finally came to terms that there is no such thing as God, Gods and any other made up 'we must believe in things'. I was left with a hole. Where once there was something, now there is not. What I've realised is that it was me creating the hole in the first place. Now I'm just plain old me and happy in my choice.

    Wishing everyone well for no other reason than 'why wouldn't I'

    Posted 1 year ago #
  17. Justice Gustin
    Member

    Where there are holes, there is now room for logic and reasoning.

    Good trade-off in my opinion.

    Welcome, Tony T.

    Posted 1 year ago #
  18. blotonthelandscape
    Member

    "What I've realised is that it was me creating the hole in the first place."

    This was a bit of a lightbulb moment for me as well. It wasn't just a self-created expectation, though. It was also a connection between like minds, the social aspect of being a member of a religion. But UF fills that part of the gap for me now ;-)

    Welcome Tony (and a belated welcome Josh, I just realised I missed this one).

    Posted 1 year ago #
  19. swmr1
    Member

    Everyone I talked to seemed to be either uninterested and unconcerned, or unable to fathom the gravity of the concerns trying to communicate.

    Bart Erhman was the one who sealed my fate for me. He shattered my reliance on the bible as the true word of a living God. After I finished Jesus Interrupted I think I went crazy. My world exploded. All I had worked for in life had been based on lies my parents believed. "The bible has no errors, it contains no contradictions"... Shit I could have disproved on google for crying out loud. My world turned upside down in a way that I can't describe.

    Hi - Ephian! I so relate to these two points. My background is different but my "escape" from evangelical christianity was similar in that none of my christian friends seemed to know or care about the answers to major questions concerning the truth of the faith when I was struggling. It was as if truth were irrelevant. Bart Erhman was the nail in the coffin that killed off my faith. If the bible wasn't inerrant then it wasn't the word of god. Why believe in any of it?

    Things will get better. Try to bask in your new freedom rather than wallowing in your past. You have lots of life left to live!

    Posted 1 year ago #

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