{"id":651933,"date":"2014-02-05T21:42:21","date_gmt":"2014-02-05T21:42:21","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/andygill\/?p=651933"},"modified":"2017-04-05T16:43:51","modified_gmt":"2017-04-05T21:43:51","slug":"bill-nye-vs-ken-ham-witnessing-a-train-wreck","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/andygill\/bill-nye-vs-ken-ham-witnessing-a-train-wreck\/","title":{"rendered":"Bill Nye vs Ken Ham: Witnessing a Train Wreck"},"content":{"rendered":"\n<\/head>

I\u2019ve come to find that winning a debate isn\u2019t so much about who\u2019s more \u201cright\u201d but rather who has better rhetoric. Last night during the debate, I think it was pretty clear that, although Ham had a couple good points, he was neither more \u201cright\u201d nor did he have better rhetoric.<\/p>\n

Though he did make a valiant effort to win by creating some \u201calternate reality\u201d in which natural law, empirical scientific evidence, and reasonable logic don\u2019t exist\u2026<\/p>\n

I question when exactly Christians are going to learn that we cannot use logical reasoning to prove our faith; hence, the use of the word, \u201cfaith.\u201d<\/p>\n

I\u2019ll say it since it seems no one else will:<\/p>\n

What we believe is illogical<\/strong>. Call me blasphemous, but take a step back for a second and think about the sheer, utter, ridiculousness of our basic\/foundational ideology:<\/p>\n

    \n
  1. The virgin birth.<\/li>\n
  2. Jesus being both fully God and <\/i><\/strong>fully human.<\/li>\n
  3. Jesus living a perfect life.<\/li>\n
  4. Jesus rising from the dead, after being crucified.<\/li>\n
  5. Jesus floating\/ascending up to heaven after rising from the dead.<\/li>\n
  6. Jesus returning on a white horse, with a sword in his mouth, and\u00a0apparently a tattoo of his name on his leg (or\u00a0thigh?) #BadAssJesus<\/a><\/li>\n
  7. And finally, believing that one day, we\u2019re also going to rise from the dead in bodily form<\/i>\u00a0(many don\u2019t know this is what the Christian bible teaches, instead they\u2019ve bought into more of a Gnostic sounding view of the resurrection).<\/li>\n<\/ol>\n

    (Sidenote<\/strong>: research through the NSYR lead by Christian Smith and Melinda Denton present in their book\u00a0Soul Searching,\u00a0<\/em>that most young Christians are not able to articulate what they believe in. Insinuating they don\u2019t even know the basic message of the Gospel).<\/p>\n

    If your knee jerk reaction is to become defensive and pull out your apologetics, or learned system of defense, in which your youth pastor indoctrinated you with (which in this case might have been me, but uh, that\u2019s a post for another time), then you\u2019ve missed the point. Here\u2019s a fun<\/del> painful example, of what that looks like:<\/p>\n

    You\u2019re not going to argue someone into believing this stuff, all the while your refusal to admit that your set of beliefs as a Christian are illogical is not<\/strong> helping, its only frustrating. It\u2019s leaving nonChristians such as Mark Joseph Stern, of Slate.com<\/a> saying things like:<\/p>\n

    \u201cThe maddening aspect of creationism is not just that it\u2019s ridiculous, but that it insists it\u2019s a perfectly logical, empirically verifiable scientific explanation of the universe.\u201d<\/p><\/blockquote>\n

    There has to come a point of humility in which one must <\/i>admit that what they believe and buy into is\u00a0a little bit weird.<\/p>\n

    To argue against scientific empirical evidence with a rebuttal of \u201cBecause the bible tells me so,\u201d is insufficient <\/i>(which is why I wrote this<\/a>).\u00a0To make a bold <\/i>statement claiming that 4,000 years or so ago natural law just changed without any empirical evidence documenting this change, and you believe that simply \u201cbecause the bible tells you so,\u201d is also\u00a0insufficient<\/i>.\u00a0It\u2019s presenting a baseless fallacy, a conclusion with no reasoning, and a judgment with little facts\u2026<\/strong><\/p>\n

    Ignoring the empirical research and data provided in regards to evolution, that seemingly refute this idea of Creationism is annoying, and at worst it is deterring <\/i>many away from Jesus.<\/p>\n

    \u201cIf I were an outsider, I would correctly assume that following Jesus means I must check my brains at the door in regards to science, and that I would need to become politically conservative\u2026 in which case, signing onto the Jesus movement would become a \u201cthanks, but no thanks\u201d situation.\u201d \u2013 Benjamin Corey\u00a0<\/a><\/p><\/blockquote>\n

    I never see\u00a0Jesus saying, that in order for us to show others that God loves them you must do so through\u00a0argumentative rhetoric (i.e. apologetics). I see Jesus giving us a new commandment\u00a0exerting us to love one another and saying\u2026 \u201cBy this all people will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another<\/strong><\/span>.\u201d This is why I think and believe one of the most dangerous things we can do with our lives, in our context, is blindly buy into an ideology we know very little to\u00a0nothing\u00a0<\/em>about.<\/p>\n

    It\u2019s the question as to whether or not we want to be right or if we want to be loving.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n

    Right now the single cause of atheism is not because we\u2019re so \u201cillogical,\u201d but because we\u2019re so hypocritical. As Brennan Manning puts it so well, \u201cwe\u2019ve acknowledged Jesus with our lips but yet we\u2019ve denied Him by our lifestyle.\u201d<\/p>\n

    We\u2019ve done so much harm to others justifying it through our inane logic of, \u201cbecause the bible told me so,\u201d creating laws exasperating the inequality, and oppression of people based off of arbitrary factors.<\/p>\n

    What if instead of pouring $100 million into the re-creation of Noah\u2019s ark we focus on the malnutrition of the poor (not just making this up, Ken Ham is trying to make this an actuality<\/a>)? Unless there\u2019s a big ass flood coming again, this is a definite waste of time and money (in Christian\/evangelical terms, it \u201clacks good stewardship\u201d).<\/p>\n

    Sidenote: <\/b>Imagine what a $100 million could do for those impoverished, hungry, and malnourished\u2026 (Shoot maybe I\u2019ll make a kickstarter, but seriously\u2026 who\u2019s with me?)<\/p>\n

    In my opinion the best way to give sufficient evidence of Christianity is NOT<\/strong><\/span> through a \u201clogical rhetoric\u201d but rather through the power and love<\/i> of God lived out daily i.e. serving the poor, seeking justice, promoting equality, living out a gospel that is\u00a0inclusive\u00a0<\/em><\/strong>as opposed to exclusive, oppressive, and\/or uninformed.\u00a0<\/em><\/p>\n<\/body><\/html>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

    I\u2019ve come to find that winning a debate isn\u2019t so much about who\u2019s more \u201cright\u201d but rather who has better rhetoric. Last night during the debate, I think it was pretty clear that, although Ham had a couple good points, he was neither more \u201cright\u201d nor did he have better rhetoric. Though he did make […]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":2493,"featured_media":652446,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[9,19],"tags":[244,246,248,250],"class_list":["post-651933","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-christian","category-church","tag-bill-nye","tag-bill-nye-vs-ken-ham-witnessing-a-train-wreck","tag-creationism","tag-ken-ham"],"yoast_head":"\nBill Nye vs Ken Ham: Witnessing a Train Wreck<\/title>\n<meta name=\"description\" content=\"I\u2019ve come to find that winning a debate isn\u2019t so much about who\u2019s more \u201cright\u201d but rather who has better rhetoric. 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