{"id":112766,"date":"2025-09-09T11:49:23","date_gmt":"2025-09-09T17:49:23","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/danpeterson\/?p=112766"},"modified":"2025-09-09T21:24:55","modified_gmt":"2025-09-10T03:24:55","slug":"for-his-101st-recalling-a-minor-incident-with-pres-nelson","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/danpeterson\/2025\/09\/for-his-101st-recalling-a-minor-incident-with-pres-nelson.html","title":{"rendered":"For his 101st, recalling a minor incident with Pres. Nelson"},"content":{"rendered":"<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC \"-\/\/W3C\/\/DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional\/\/EN\" \"http:\/\/www.w3.org\/TR\/REC-html40\/loose.dtd\">\n<html><head><meta http-equiv=\"content-type\" content=\"text\/html; charset=utf-8\"><meta http-equiv=\"content-type\" content=\"text\/html; charset=utf-8\"><\/head><body><p>\u00a0<\/p>\n<figure id=\"attachment_76763\" aria-describedby=\"caption-attachment-76763\" style=\"width: 200px\" class=\"wp-caption aligncenter\"><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-media.patheos.com\/blogs\/sites\/186\/2019\/08\/Russell_M._Nelson.png\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"size-full wp-image-76763\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-media.patheos.com\/blogs\/sites\/186\/2019\/08\/Russell_M._Nelson.png\" alt=\"President Nelson\" width=\"200\" height=\"300\"><\/a><figcaption id=\"caption-attachment-76763\" class=\"wp-caption-text\">President Russell M. Nelson<br>President of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints<br>(Wikimedia Commons public domain image)<\/figcaption><\/figure>\n<p>President Russell M. Nelson entered his 102nd year of mortality today. \u00a0Remarkable. \u00a0Here are a few links that seem appropriate to the occasion:<\/p>\n<ul>\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/newsroom.churchofjesuschrist.org\/article\/church-releases-photo-of-president-nelson-on-the-eve-of-his-101st-birthday\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"nofollow\">\u201cChurch Releases Photo of President Nelson on the Eve of His 101st Birthday\u201d<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/latterdaysaintmag.com\/president-nelsons-op-ed-in-time-magazine-hits-right-note\/\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"nofollow\">\u201cPresident Nelson\u2019s Op-Ed in Time Magazine Hits the Right Note\u201d<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/www.deseret.com\/faith\/2025\/09\/08\/status-of-temples-announced-by-president-russell-m-nelson\/\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"nofollow\">\u201cAs President Nelson turns 101, here\u2019s a look at how he\u2019s brought temples \u2018closer\u2019 to Latter-day Saints: \u2018Construction of these temples may not change your life, but your time in the temple surely will,\u2019 the church president has taught\u201d<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/latterdaysaintmag.com\/prophetic-promises-president-russell-m-nelson-101\/\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"nofollow\">\u201cHappy 101st Birthday President Nelson: His Prophetic Promises\u201d<\/a><\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<p>I thought that I myself might take the opportunity to share an experience that I once had with President Nelson. \u00a0I may have shared it before, but perhaps not. \u00a0It isn\u2019t inspiring; it\u2019s just a tiny bit funny. \u00a0At least now, in retrospect. \u00a0First, though, I\u2019ll offer a little background:<\/p>\n<figure id=\"attachment_38666\" aria-describedby=\"caption-attachment-38666\" style=\"width: 597px\" class=\"wp-caption aligncenter\"><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-media.patheos.com\/blogs\/sites\/186\/2016\/12\/%D9%83%D8%A7%D8%AA%D8%AF%D8%B1%D8%A7%D8%A6%D9%8A%D8%A9_%D8%A7%D9%84%D9%82%D8%AF%D9%8A%D8%B3_%D9%85%D8%B1%D9%82%D8%B3_%D8%A7%D9%84%D9%82%D8%A8%D8%B7%D9%8A%D8%A9_%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%A3%D8%B1%D8%AB%D9%88%D8%B0%D9%83%D8%B3%D9%8A%D8%A9.jpg\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\" wp-image-38666\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-media.patheos.com\/blogs\/sites\/186\/2016\/12\/%D9%83%D8%A7%D8%AA%D8%AF%D8%B1%D8%A7%D8%A6%D9%8A%D8%A9_%D8%A7%D9%84%D9%82%D8%AF%D9%8A%D8%B3_%D9%85%D8%B1%D9%82%D8%B3_%D8%A7%D9%84%D9%82%D8%A8%D8%B7%D9%8A%D8%A9_%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%A3%D8%B1%D8%AB%D9%88%D8%B0%D9%83%D8%B3%D9%8A%D8%A9.jpg\" alt=\"St. Mark's, Cairo\" width=\"597\" height=\"671\"><\/a><figcaption id=\"caption-attachment-38666\" class=\"wp-caption-text\">The Coptic Orthodox Cathedral of St. Mark, in Cairo, Egypt<br>(Wikimedia Commons public domain image)<\/figcaption><\/figure>\n<p>When my wife and I were living in Egypt, Pope Shenouda III (1923-2012) was serving as the head of Egypt\u2019s Coptic Orthodox Church, the 117th Pope of Alexandria and the Patriarch of the See of St. Mark. \u00a0Among other things, he was active in ecumenical meetings with Catholic and Orthodox leaders. \u00a0But he was evidently not so enthusiastic about Christian churches that were outside of what he viewed as the apostolic or episcopal succession. \u00a0Or, at least, that\u2019s what I gathered from a story told to me by our Cairo friend and neighbor <a href=\"https:\/\/www.thegroffs.com\/obituaries\/The-Reverend-Dr-David-Lowell-Johnson\/#!\/Obituary\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"nofollow\">Rev. David L. Johnson<\/a>, who was at the time the (Lutheran) pastor of the nondenominational expatriate Ma\u2018adi Community Church, south of Cairo.<\/p>\n<p>As a leader in Cairo\u2019s small Protestant expatriate community, David had once made an attempt to meet with Pope Shenouda. \u00a0He was kept waiting for a very long time in an outer reception area, and then was treated, as he saw it, rather disrespectfully when he was finally admitted into the papal presence. \u00a0As he told me soon afterwards, he had the distinct impression that, while Pope Shenouda recognized Catholic and Orthodox clergy as validly ordained fellow priests, he regarded Protestant clergy as mere schismatic laymen.<\/p>\n<p>I recall a time many years ago, after I had joined the faculty at Brigham Young University, visiting the Jesuit Saint Joseph University of Beirut. \u00a0One night,\u00a0<a href=\"https:\/\/en.wikipedia.org\/wiki\/Samir_Khalil_Samir\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"nofollow\">Father Samir Khalil Samir S.J.<\/a>, a prominent scholar of medieval Arabic Christian literature and a contributor to BYU\u2019s Middle Eastern Texts Initiative, came to visit me in my lodgings there at Saint Joseph. \u00a0We talked at some length about the state of Christianity in the Middle East, and the conversation turned to Pope Shenouda, of whom Father Samir was, to put it mildly, not a fan. \u00a0Shenouda, he said, had gone out of his way to block various Protestant groups, and even the Assyrian Church of the East, from joining the Middle East Council of Churches and was a major obstacle to Christian unity in the region at a time when Christian unity was urgently necessary in the face of rising Islamist fundamentalism.<\/p>\n<p>Father Samir was sitting on the corner of my bed. \u00a0Apropos of Shenouda, he reminded me that the medieval monks had a way of <em>dealing<\/em> with what he called \u201ctroublesome popes\u201d: \u00a0\u201cA little poison in a cup,\u201d he said with a twinkle in his eye, \u201c<em>et voil\u00e0<\/em>. \u00a0A new election!\u201d<\/p>\n<figure id=\"attachment_30690\" aria-describedby=\"caption-attachment-30690\" style=\"width: 597px\" class=\"wp-caption aligncenter\"><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-media.patheos.com\/blogs\/sites\/186\/2016\/02\/799px-Beirut.jpg\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\" wp-image-30690\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-media.patheos.com\/blogs\/sites\/186\/2016\/02\/799px-Beirut.jpg\" alt=\"Ein Blick \u00fcber Beirut\" width=\"597\" height=\"448\"><\/a><figcaption id=\"caption-attachment-30690\" class=\"wp-caption-text\">A view of Beirut, Lebanon \u00a0(Wikimedia Commons public domain image; Benutzer: Robysan)<\/figcaption><\/figure>\n<p>That was an absurdly long introduction to a very slight anecdote regarding President Nelson:<\/p>\n<p>For two or three years, I met twice annually with what was called the Middle East Advisory Committee of the Church. \u00a0I was never formally appointed to it, so far as I\u2019m aware, and was certainly never formally released from it. \u00a0I simply stopped being invited, and I\u2019m not sure that it still meets. \u00a0(If it does, it may consist <em>entirely<\/em> of General Authorities now.) \u00a0Conference time is a busy time, but it was the time when the General Authority area president who oversaw the Middle East, a member of the Seventy, was back in town. \u00a0For a while, the committee was chaired by Elder Jeffrey R. Holland of the Twelve. \u00a0I think that Elder Dieter F. Uchtdorf met with us at least once. \u00a0Mostly, the chairman was then-Elder Russell M. Nelson. \u00a0He was chairing the meeting when this incident occurred.<\/p>\n<p>One day, our conversation focused for a few minutes on the difficult time that the Church has had in gaining full legal recognition in Egypt. \u00a0We\u2019ve been working on such recognition for decades now, and, although we\u2019ve made friends and some progress, we\u2019re still (as I understand it) not fully there, not where we ideally want to be.<\/p>\n<p>Pope Shenouda came up. \u00a0(Maybe I brought him up. \u00a0I don\u2019t remember.) \u00a0Owing to a particular encounter with an overzealous and very undiplomatic past member of the Cairo Branch, an American who was living in Egypt in his private capacity as a businessman but who also saw himself as advancing the cause of the Church there, Shenouda had taken particular notice of the Latter-day Saints in Egypt and had developed a particular hostility to us. \u00a0And, given the religious tensions in Egypt, the Egyptian president was simply never, ever, going to grant legal recognition to the Church over the strenuous objections of the country\u2019s leading Christian figure, who was an informal member of the president\u2019s consultative council.<\/p>\n<p>I commented on the matter, telling something of the story, but then sagely remarked that Pope Shenouda was about eighty years old and, given his age, certainly wouldn\u2019t last much longer. \u00a0After which time and with a new leader, I said, perhaps our chances might improve. \u00a0Having made my valuable contribution, I sat back with satisfaction until I realized that Elder Nelson, too, was eighty years old. \u00a0Open mouth, insert foot.<\/p>\n<p>No umbrage was taken. \u00a0Nothing was said. \u00a0And he has been friendly since then. \u00a0(Not that we\u2019re close associates or social buddies. \u00a0I don\u2019t want to exaggerate matters.) \u00a0But I had embarrassed myself. \u00a0Of course, it wasn\u2019t for the first time and, sadly, it hasn\u2019t been the last.<\/p>\n<p style=\"text-align: right;\">Posted from Gleneden Beach, Oregon<\/p>\n<p>\u00a0<\/p>\n<p>\u00a0<\/p>\n<\/body><\/html>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>\u00a0 President Russell M. Nelson entered his 102nd year of mortality today. \u00a0Remarkable. \u00a0Here are a few links that seem appropriate to the occasion: \u201cChurch Releases Photo of President Nelson on the Eve of His 101st Birthday\u201d \u201cPresident Nelson\u2019s Op-Ed in Time Magazine Hits the Right Note\u201d \u201cAs President Nelson turns 101, here\u2019s a look [&hellip;]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":1019,"featured_media":21172,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"closed","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[1],"tags":[6915,3367,951,39158,1215,24470],"class_list":["post-112766","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-uncategorized","tag-birthday","tag-coptic","tag-egypt","tag-khalil-samir","tag-russell-m-nelson","tag-shenouda"],"yoast_head":"<!-- This site is optimized with the Yoast SEO plugin v21.1 - https:\/\/yoast.com\/wordpress\/plugins\/seo\/ -->\n<title>For his 101st, recalling a minor incident with Pres. 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Nelson entered his 102nd year of mortality today. \u00a0Remarkable. \u00a0Here are a few links that seem appropriate to the occasion:\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:url\" content=\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/danpeterson\/2025\/09\/for-his-101st-recalling-a-minor-incident-with-pres-nelson.html\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:site_name\" content=\"Sic et Non\" \/>\n<meta property=\"article:published_time\" content=\"2025-09-09T17:49:23+00:00\" \/>\n<meta property=\"article:modified_time\" content=\"2025-09-10T03:24:55+00:00\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:image\" content=\"https:\/\/wp-media.patheos.com\/blogs\/sites\/186\/2015\/06\/AlexMarkCathedralInside2.jpg\" \/>\n\t<meta property=\"og:image:width\" content=\"768\" \/>\n\t<meta property=\"og:image:height\" content=\"512\" \/>\n\t<meta property=\"og:image:type\" content=\"image\/jpeg\" \/>\n<meta name=\"author\" content=\"Dan Peterson\" \/>\n<meta name=\"twitter:card\" content=\"summary_large_image\" \/>\n<meta name=\"twitter:label1\" content=\"Written by\" \/>\n\t<meta name=\"twitter:data1\" content=\"Dan Peterson\" \/>\n\t<meta name=\"twitter:label2\" content=\"Est. reading time\" \/>\n\t<meta name=\"twitter:data2\" content=\"6 minutes\" \/>\n<script type=\"application\/ld+json\" class=\"yoast-schema-graph\">{\"@context\":\"https:\/\/schema.org\",\"@graph\":[{\"@type\":\"WebPage\",\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/danpeterson\/2025\/09\/for-his-101st-recalling-a-minor-incident-with-pres-nelson.html\",\"url\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/danpeterson\/2025\/09\/for-his-101st-recalling-a-minor-incident-with-pres-nelson.html\",\"name\":\"For his 101st, recalling a minor incident with Pres. 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