{"id":18692,"date":"2018-04-29T16:38:12","date_gmt":"2018-04-29T20:38:12","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/admin.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/?p=18692"},"modified":"2018-04-29T16:38:12","modified_gmt":"2018-04-29T20:38:12","slug":"agree-be-loved-think-for-yourself-disagree-be-hated","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/2018\/04\/agree-be-loved-think-for-yourself-disagree-be-hated.html","title":{"rendered":"Agree &#038; Be Loved \/ Think for Yourself &#038; Disagree &#038; Be Hated"},"content":{"rendered":"<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC \"-\/\/W3C\/\/DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional\/\/EN\" \"http:\/\/www.w3.org\/TR\/REC-html40\/loose.dtd\">\n<html><head><meta http-equiv=\"content-type\" content=\"text\/html; charset=utf-8\"><meta http-equiv=\"content-type\" content=\"text\/html; charset=utf-8\"><\/head><body><p style=\"text-align: center;\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"alignnone wp-image-18695 size-full\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-media.patheos.com\/blogs\/sites\/572\/2018\/04\/FreeSpeechFranklin.jpg\" alt=\"\" width=\"640\" height=\"480\"><\/p>\n<p>In our <a href=\"https:\/\/en.wikipedia.org\/wiki\/Postmodernism\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"nofollow\">postmodern culture<\/a> today, the notions of \u201ctough love\u201d or a rebuke done in love for the good of another, are almost incomprehensible.\u00a0To disagree with someone now\u00a0<em><strong>is<\/strong><\/em> to \u201chate\u201d them. It can\u2019t possibly be <em>otherwise<\/em>, because now people <strong><em>are<\/em><\/strong> their opinions (<em>x<\/em> = <em>y<\/em>); not <strong><em>separate<\/em><\/strong> from them (<em>x<\/em> has opinion<em> y<\/em>).<\/p>\n<p>The people who commit these horrible acts of tough love must have hidden nefarious motives: so we are informed by the upholders of the secularization <em>zeitgeist<\/em>\u00a0and idol. There are no absolutes. We either agree with other people (in which case we \u201clove\u201d them), or we disagree, which is intolerance and hate. Those are the only two possible scenarios. We can\u2019t disagree<strong><em> and<\/em><\/strong> love them.<\/p>\n<p>So, for example, to follow this\u00a0 pseudo-thinking to its logical end, we can\u2019t tell an alcoholic he shouldn\u2019t drink, for his own good. That is disagreement and therefore hatred. If we love him, we have to let him drink himself to death and kill someone on the road, where he\u2019s out drunk driving.<\/p>\n<p>Therefore, tolerance is <em>literally impossible<\/em>, because tolerance, of course, is loving people and allowing them freedom <em>even though we disagree<\/em> with something they believe or do. Postmodernism renders this intrinsically impossible, since disagreeing (by definition) is hatred and touchy-feely \/ warm fuzzy agreement is love. Last night I dared to disagree with someone and so several people came and told me that I \u201chated\u201d him.<\/p>\n<p>We either love or hate, and so intolerance is a meaningless category in postmodernist groupthink. It never happens because it <em>can<\/em>\u00a0never happen. The new categories preclude it.\u00a0In order to be a good postmodernist I have to lie about myself and agree with whatever anyone else says in order to love them. And that makes mincemeat of both truth <em>and<\/em> love, and I can never do either thing.<\/p>\n<p>Therefore, I am <em>not<\/em> a postmodernist and so, must necessarily (so we\u2019re told) be a hater in the postmodernist\u2019s eyes, because (routinely, in the course of doing apologetics) I dare to disagree with someone, and beyond that, even outrageously dare to tell them sometimes that they are <em>wrong<\/em>, for their own good (and to accept the same criticism coming my way).<\/p>\n<p>Thus, the \u201cbad guys\u201d in this brave new thought-world are those who reject postmodernist subjective-mush-relativism. The \u201cgood guys\u201d are those who get with the program and accept all that nonsense: who learn as quickly as possible how to be clones and groupthinkers and doublethinkers and bootlickers.<\/p>\n<p>George Orwell predicted and rather <a href=\"https:\/\/en.wikipedia.org\/wiki\/Nineteen_Eighty-Four\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"nofollow\">prophetically described the whole thing<\/a> 69 years ago.<\/p>\n<p>As we inexorably drift further and further away from the biblical worldview, this madness will continue and become exponentially worse. Let\u2019s pray that reason and true tolerance will again one day actually return to their rightful place.<\/p>\n<p>Postmodernism is part of the \u201cworld-system\u201d (<em>kosmos<\/em>) that the Bible command us to oppose.\u00a0People follow things to different degrees, but certainly subjectivism and denial of absolutes and moral relativism are major trends in thinking and behavior today. No one (who believes this stuff) ever puts it bluntly in those terms, but how they <em>act<\/em> confirms that they <em>do<\/em> think it (whether consciously or not).<\/p>\n<p>I wish I had a dime for every time I\u2019ve been accused of \u201chating\u201d someone just because I had an <em>honest disagreement<\/em> concerning what they believe or do. But fuzzy, illogical thinking is also part and parcel of postmodernism. And it often infests even Christian environments, because the world always does that, and we are all sinners, prone to the overwhelming cultural influences around us.<\/p>\n<p>***<\/p>\n<p>(originally 10-3-17)<\/p>\n<p><strong>Photo credit:<\/strong> <span style=\"color: #0000ff;\">photograph by<\/span>\u00a0<a class=\"external text decorated-link\" href=\"https:\/\/www.flickr.com\/people\/10518954@N00\" rel=\"nofollow\" target=\"_blank\">k_donovan11<\/a>\u00a0<span style=\"color: #0000ff;\">(6-28-06)<\/span> [<a href=\"https:\/\/commons.wikimedia.org\/wiki\/File:Freedom_of_Thought_Ben_Franklin.jpg\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"nofollow\">Wikimedia Commons<\/a> \/\u00a0\u00a0<a class=\"extiw decorated-link\" title=\"w:en:Creative Commons\" href=\"https:\/\/en.wikipedia.org\/wiki\/en:Creative_Commons\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"nofollow\">Creative Commons<\/a>\u00a0<a class=\"external text decorated-link\" href=\"https:\/\/creativecommons.org\/licenses\/by\/2.0\/deed.en\" rel=\"nofollow\" target=\"_blank\">Attribution 2.0 Generic<\/a>\u00a0license]<\/p>\n<p>***<\/p>\n<\/body><\/html>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>In our postmodern culture today, the notions of \u201ctough love\u201d or a rebuke done in love for the good of another, are almost incomprehensible.\u00a0To disagree with someone now\u00a0is to \u201chate\u201d them. It can\u2019t possibly be otherwise, because now people are their opinions (x = y); not separate from them (x has opinion y). The people [&hellip;]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":2331,"featured_media":18695,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[112],"tags":[267,258,1575,3856,3853,5483,631,185,119,1566,5480,5477,547,763,98],"class_list":["post-18692","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-philosophy-science","tag-agnosticism","tag-atheism","tag-bigotry","tag-clones","tag-groupthink","tag-hatred","tag-intolerance","tag-irrationality","tag-philosophy-of-religion","tag-postmodernism","tag-provincialism","tag-reason","tag-relativism","tag-skepticism","tag-tolerance"],"yoast_head":"<!-- This site is optimized with the Yoast SEO plugin v21.1 - https:\/\/yoast.com\/wordpress\/plugins\/seo\/ -->\n<title>Agree &amp; Be Loved \/ Think for Yourself &amp; Disagree &amp; Be Hated<\/title>\n<meta name=\"description\" content=\"Tolerance is literally impossible in postmodernism, because it&#039;s loving people &amp; allowing them freedom even though we disagree with something they believe or do.\" \/>\n<meta name=\"robots\" content=\"index, follow, max-snippet:-1, max-image-preview:large, max-video-preview:-1\" \/>\n<link rel=\"canonical\" href=\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/2018\/04\/agree-be-loved-think-for-yourself-disagree-be-hated.html\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:locale\" content=\"en_US\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:type\" content=\"article\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:title\" content=\"Agree &amp; Be Loved \/ Think for Yourself &amp; Disagree &amp; Be Hated\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:description\" content=\"Tolerance is literally impossible in postmodernism, because it&#039;s loving people &amp; allowing them freedom even though we disagree with something they believe or do.\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:url\" content=\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/2018\/04\/agree-be-loved-think-for-yourself-disagree-be-hated.html\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:site_name\" content=\"Biblical Evidence for Catholicism\" \/>\n<meta property=\"article:author\" content=\"https:\/\/www.facebook.com\/dave.armstrong.798\" \/>\n<meta property=\"article:published_time\" content=\"2018-04-29T20:38:12+00:00\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:image\" content=\"https:\/\/wp-media.patheos.com\/blogs\/sites\/572\/2018\/04\/FreeSpeechFranklin.jpg\" \/>\n\t<meta property=\"og:image:width\" content=\"640\" \/>\n\t<meta property=\"og:image:height\" content=\"480\" \/>\n\t<meta property=\"og:image:type\" content=\"image\/jpeg\" \/>\n<meta name=\"author\" content=\"Dave Armstrong\" \/>\n<meta name=\"twitter:card\" content=\"summary_large_image\" \/>\n<meta name=\"twitter:label1\" content=\"Written by\" \/>\n\t<meta name=\"twitter:data1\" content=\"Dave Armstrong\" \/>\n\t<meta name=\"twitter:label2\" content=\"Est. reading time\" \/>\n\t<meta name=\"twitter:data2\" content=\"3 minutes\" \/>\n<script type=\"application\/ld+json\" class=\"yoast-schema-graph\">{\"@context\":\"https:\/\/schema.org\",\"@graph\":[{\"@type\":\"WebPage\",\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/2018\/04\/agree-be-loved-think-for-yourself-disagree-be-hated.html\",\"url\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/2018\/04\/agree-be-loved-think-for-yourself-disagree-be-hated.html\",\"name\":\"Agree & Be Loved \/ Think for Yourself & Disagree & Be Hated\",\"isPartOf\":{\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/#website\"},\"datePublished\":\"2018-04-29T20:38:12+00:00\",\"dateModified\":\"2018-04-29T20:38:12+00:00\",\"author\":{\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/#\/schema\/person\/471eaa20e441eca4bb1ea50393cf632e\"},\"description\":\"Tolerance is literally impossible in postmodernism, because it's loving people & allowing them freedom even though we disagree with something they believe or do.\",\"breadcrumb\":{\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/2018\/04\/agree-be-loved-think-for-yourself-disagree-be-hated.html#breadcrumb\"},\"inLanguage\":\"en-US\",\"potentialAction\":[{\"@type\":\"ReadAction\",\"target\":[\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/2018\/04\/agree-be-loved-think-for-yourself-disagree-be-hated.html\"]}]},{\"@type\":\"BreadcrumbList\",\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/2018\/04\/agree-be-loved-think-for-yourself-disagree-be-hated.html#breadcrumb\",\"itemListElement\":[{\"@type\":\"ListItem\",\"position\":1,\"name\":\"Home\",\"item\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\"},{\"@type\":\"ListItem\",\"position\":2,\"name\":\"Agree &#038; 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Formerly a campus missionary, as a Protestant, Dave was received into the Catholic Church in February 1991, by the late, well-known catechist and theologian, Fr. John A. Hardon, S. J. Dave\u2019s articles have appeared in many influential Catholic periodicals, including \\\"This Rock\\\" (now called \\\"Catholic Answers Magazine\\\"), \\\"Envoy Magazine\\\" (Patrick Madrid), \\\"The Catholic Answer,\\\" \\\"The Coming Home Journal,\\\" \\\"Gilbert Magazine\\\" (American Chesterton Society), and \\\"The Latin Mass.\\\" He also writes a featured column for every issue of \\\"The Michigan Catholic\\\": published by the archdiocese of Detroit, and was editor for most of the apologetics tracts published by the St. Paul Street Evangelization apostolate. 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Unsolicited correspondence has indicated many hundreds of conversions (or returns) to the Catholic faith as a result, by God's grace, of these writings. Dave's conversion story was published in the bestselling book \\\"Surprised by Truth\\\" (edited by Patrick Madrid; San Diego: Basilica Press, 1994). Sophia Institute Press has published six of his books: \\\"A Biblical Defense of Catholicism\\\" (Foreword by Fr. John A. Hardon, S. J., 1996 \/ 2003), \\\"The Catholic Verses\\\" (2004), \\\"The One-Minute Apologist\\\" (2007), \\\"Bible Proofs for Catholic Truths\\\" (2009), \\\"The Quotable Newman\\\" (editor: 2012), and \\\"Proving the Catholic Faith is Biblical\\\" (2015). He is co-author (with Dr. Paul Thigpen) of the inserts for \\\"The New Catholic Answer Bible\\\" (Our Sunday Visitor: 2005), and editor for \\\"The Wisdom of Mr. Chesterton: The Very Best Quotes, Quips, and Cracks from the Pen of G. K. Chesterton\\\" (Saint Benedict Press \/ TAN Books: 2009). \\\"100 Biblical Arguments Against Sola Scriptura\\\" was published by Catholic Answers in May 2012. His \\\"Quotable Wesley\\\" compilation was published by (Protestant \/ Wesleyan publisher) Beacon Hill Press in April 2014. Several of his 49 books are bestsellers in their field. Dave maintains a popular personal Facebook page, a Facebook author page, and has a Twitter account as well. He offers almost all of his books in e-book form on his own Biblical Catholicism site (http:\/\/biblicalcatholicism.com\/), at a permanent deep discount: only $2.99 for ePub, mobi, and AZW, and $1.99 for PDF. His writing has been enthusiastically endorsed or recommended by many leading Catholic apologists, authors, and priests, including Dr. Scott Hahn, Fr. Peter M. J. Stravinskas, Marcus Grodi, Patrick Madrid, Steve Ray, Tim Staples, Devin Rose, Mike Aquilina, Al Kresta, Karl Keating, Fr. Dwight Longenecker, Brandon Vogt, Marcellino D'Ambrosio, and Fr. John A. Hardon, S. J. Dave has been happily married to his wife Judy since October 1984. 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Formerly a campus missionary, as a Protestant, Dave was received into the Catholic Church in February 1991, by the late, well-known catechist and theologian, Fr. John A. Hardon, S. J. Dave\u2019s articles have appeared in many influential Catholic periodicals, including \"This Rock\" (now called \"Catholic Answers Magazine\"), \"Envoy Magazine\" (Patrick Madrid), \"The Catholic Answer,\" \"The Coming Home Journal,\" \"Gilbert Magazine\" (American Chesterton Society), and \"The Latin Mass.\" He also writes a featured column for every issue of \"The Michigan Catholic\": published by the archdiocese of Detroit, and was editor for most of the apologetics tracts published by the St. Paul Street Evangelization apostolate. Dave\u2019s apologetics and writing apostolate was the subject of a feature article in the May 2002 issue of \"Envoy Magazine.\" He served as the staff moderator at the Internet discussion forum for The Coming Home Network, from 2007-2010. Dave has been interviewed on many nationally syndicated Catholic radio shows, including \"Catholic Answers Live\" (twice), \"Faith and Family Live\" (Steve Wood), \"Kresta in the Afternoon,\" \"Son Rise Morning Show,\" \"Catholic Connection\" (Teresa Tomeo), and \"The Catholics Next Door.\" His large and popular website, \"Biblical Evidence for Catholicism,\" was online from March 1997 to March 2007, and received the 1998 Catholic Website of the Year award from \"Envoy Magazine.\" His blog of the same name (now transferred to Patheos), begun in February 2004, contains more than 1,500 papers, at least 500 debates or dialogues, and over 50 distinct \"index\" web pages. Unsolicited correspondence has indicated many hundreds of conversions (or returns) to the Catholic faith as a result, by God's grace, of these writings. Dave's conversion story was published in the bestselling book \"Surprised by Truth\" (edited by Patrick Madrid; San Diego: Basilica Press, 1994). Sophia Institute Press has published six of his books: \"A Biblical Defense of Catholicism\" (Foreword by Fr. John A. Hardon, S. J., 1996 \/ 2003), \"The Catholic Verses\" (2004), \"The One-Minute Apologist\" (2007), \"Bible Proofs for Catholic Truths\" (2009), \"The Quotable Newman\" (editor: 2012), and \"Proving the Catholic Faith is Biblical\" (2015). He is co-author (with Dr. Paul Thigpen) of the inserts for \"The New Catholic Answer Bible\" (Our Sunday Visitor: 2005), and editor for \"The Wisdom of Mr. Chesterton: The Very Best Quotes, Quips, and Cracks from the Pen of G. K. Chesterton\" (Saint Benedict Press \/ TAN Books: 2009). \"100 Biblical Arguments Against Sola Scriptura\" was published by Catholic Answers in May 2012. His \"Quotable Wesley\" compilation was published by (Protestant \/ Wesleyan publisher) Beacon Hill Press in April 2014. Several of his 49 books are bestsellers in their field. Dave maintains a popular personal Facebook page, a Facebook author page, and has a Twitter account as well. He offers almost all of his books in e-book form on his own Biblical Catholicism site (http:\/\/biblicalcatholicism.com\/), at a permanent deep discount: only $2.99 for ePub, mobi, and AZW, and $1.99 for PDF. His writing has been enthusiastically endorsed or recommended by many leading Catholic apologists, authors, and priests, including Dr. Scott Hahn, Fr. Peter M. J. Stravinskas, Marcus Grodi, Patrick Madrid, Steve Ray, Tim Staples, Devin Rose, Mike Aquilina, Al Kresta, Karl Keating, Fr. Dwight Longenecker, Brandon Vogt, Marcellino D'Ambrosio, and Fr. John A. Hardon, S. J. Dave has been happily married to his wife Judy since October 1984. They have three sons and a daughter, and reside in southeast Michigan (metro Detroit).","sameAs":["https:\/\/biblicalcatholicism.com\/","https:\/\/www.facebook.com\/dave.armstrong.798","https:\/\/www.youtube.com\/@LuxVeritatisApologetics"],"url":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/author\/davearmstrong"}]}},"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/18692","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/2331"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=18692"}],"version-history":[{"count":0,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/18692\/revisions"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/18695"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=18692"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=18692"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=18692"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}