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This is an installment of my series of replies to an article by Dr. David Madison<\/a>:\u00a0a pastor in the Methodist Church for nine years, who has a PhD in Biblical Studies from Boston University. It\u2019s called,\u00a0\u201cThings We Wish Jesus Hadn\u2019t Said\u201d<\/a>\u00a0(Debunking Christianity<\/em>, 7-21-19). His words will be in\u00a0blue\u00a0<\/span>below. Dr. Madison makes several \u201cgeneric\u201d digs at Jesus and Christianity, in the written portion (it details a series of 12 podcasts):<\/p>\n A challenge for Christians: If you\u2019re so sure Jesus existed, then you have some explaining to do. A major frustration is that, while believers are indignant at all the talk about Jesus not existing, they don\u2019t know the issues that fuel the skepticism\u2014and are unwilling to inform themselves.<\/span><\/p>\n Yes, I\u2019m up to the \u201cchallenge.\u201d No problem at all. I\u2019m not threatened or \u201cscared\u201d by this in the slightest. It\u2019s what I do, as an apologist. The question is whether\u00a0Dr. Madison<\/em>\u00a0is up to interacting with\u00a0counter-critiques<\/em>? Or will he act like the voluminous anti-theist atheist polemicist Bob Seidensticker?: who directly challenged me in one of his own comboxes to respond to his innumerable attack-pieces against Christianity and the Bible, and then courageously proceeded to\u00a0utterly ignore<\/em>\u00a0my 35 specific critiques<\/a>\u00a0of his claims as of this writing. We shall soon see which course Dr. Madison will decide to take. Anyway, he also states in his post and combox:<\/p>\n [S]o many of the words of Jesus are genuinely shocking. These words aren\u2019t proclaimed much from the pulpit, . . . Hence the folks in the pews have absorbed and adored an idealized Jesus. Christian apologists make their livings refiguring so many of the things Jesus supposedly said.<\/span><\/p>\n The gospels are riddled with contradictions and bad theology, and Jesus is so frequently depicted as a cult fanatic\u2014because cult fanatics wrote the gospels. We see Jesus only through their theological filters. I just want to grab hold of Christian heads (standing behind them, with a hand on each ear) and force them to look straight ahead, unflinchingly, at the gospels, and then ask \u201cTell me what you see!\u201d uncoached by apologist specialists, i.e., priests and pastors, who\u2019ve had a lot of practice making bad texts look good. . . .\u00a0I DO say, \u201cDeal with the really bad stuff in the gospels.\u201d Are you SURE you\u2019ve not make a big mistake endorsing this particular Lord and Savior? That\u2019s the whole point of this series of Flash Podcasts, because a helluva lot of Christians would agree, right away, that these quotes are bad news\u2014if no one told then that they\u2019ve been attributed to Jesus.<\/span><\/p>\n Of course, Dr. Madison \u2014 good anti-theist atheist that he is \u2014 takes the view that we are not at all\u00a0sure<\/em>\u00a0whether Jesus in fact said\u00a0anything<\/em>\u00a0recorded in the Gospels in the first place. I don\u2019t play that game, because there is no end to it. It\u2019s like trying to pin jello to the wall. The atheist always has their convenient out (when refuted in argument about some biblical text) that Jesus never said it\u00a0anyway<\/em>\u00a0[wink wink and sly patronizing grin], and\/or that the biblical text in question was simply added later by dishonest ultra-biased Christian partisans and propagandists. It\u2019s a silly and ultimately intellectually dishonest game, and so I always refuse to play it with atheists or anyone else, because there is no way to \u201cwin\u201d with such an absurdly stacked, purely subjective deck.<\/p>\n In my defense of biblical texts, I start with the assumption that the manuscripts we have are quite sufficient for us to know what is in the Bible (believe it or not). Going on from there, I simply defend particular [supposedly \u201cdifficult\u201d] texts, and note with appropriate argumentation, that \u201chere, the Bible teaches so-and-so,\u201d etc. I deal with the texts\u00a0as they exist<\/em>. I don\u2019t get into the endlessly arbitrary, subjective games that atheists and theologically liberal biblical skeptics play with the texts, in their self-serving textual criticism.<\/p>\n Dr. Madison himself (fortunately) grants my outlook in terms of\u00a0practical<\/em>\u00a0\u201cx vs. y\u201d debate purposes:\u00a0\u201cFor the sake of argument, I\u2019m willing to say, okay, Jesus was real and, yes, we have gospels that tell the story.\u201d\u00a0<\/span>And in the combox:\u00a0\u201cSo, we can go along with their insistence that he did exist. We\u2019ll play on their field, i.e., the gospels.\u201d<\/span><\/p>\n Good! So we shall examine his cherry-picked texts and see whether his interpretations of them can stand up to scrutiny. He is issuing challenges, and I as an apologist will be dishing a bunch of my own right back to him. Two can play this game. I will be dealing honestly with his challenges. Will he\u00a0return<\/em>\u00a0the favor, and engage in serious and substantive dialogue? Again, we\u2019ll soon know what his reaction will be. A true dialogue is of a confident, inquisitive, \u201cnothing to fear and everything to gain\u201d\u00a0back-and-forth<\/em>\u00a0and\u00a0interactive<\/em>\u00a0nature, not merely \u201cships passing in the night\u201d or what I call \u201cmutual monologue.\u201d<\/p>\n *****<\/p>\n Dr. Madison\u2019s seventh podcast of twelve is entitled: \u201cOn Mark 4:11-12: Jesus taught in parables to keep people from repenting and being forgiven\u201d.<\/a> Here is the passage:<\/span><\/p>\n Mark 4:11-12<\/strong> (RSV)\u00a0And he said to them, \u201cTo you has been given the secret of the kingdom of God, but for those outside everything is in parables;\u00a0[12] so that they may indeed see but not perceive, and may indeed hear but not understand; lest they should turn again, and be forgiven.\u201d\u00a0<\/span><\/p><\/blockquote>\n Bizarre Jesus quote . . . Jesus teaches in parables so that people won\u2019t turn and be forgiven. . . . It clearly doesn\u2019t make sense at all. Is Jesus serious? Parables are meant to fool people, to keep them in the dark?<\/span><\/p>\n Mark 4:11-12\u00a0is a common scriptural \/ Hebraic way of expressing God\u2019s judgment and His providence (while not denying that ultimately men decide their own eternal fates, by either accepting or rejecting God\u2019s grace). Romans 1 explains it:<\/span><\/p>\n Romans 1:18-25<\/strong>\u00a0For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and wickedness of men who by their wickedness suppress the truth.\u00a0[19] For what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them.\u00a0[20] Ever since the creation of the world his invisible nature, namely, his eternal power and deity, has been clearly perceived in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse;\u00a0[21] for although they knew God they did not honor him as God or give thanks to him, but they became futile in their thinking and their senseless minds were darkened.\u00a0[22] Claiming to be wise, they became fools,\u00a0[23] and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images resembling mortal man or birds or animals or reptiles.\u00a0[24]\u00a0Therefore God gave them up in the lusts of their hearts to impurity, to the dishonoring of their bodies among themselves,\u00a0[25] because they exchanged the truth about God for a lie and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed for ever! Amen.<\/span><\/p><\/blockquote>\n Note that the onus lies upon the people who \u201csuppress the truth\u201d and are engaged in \u201call ungodliness and wickedness\u201d\u00a0(1:18). They choose in their own free will to disobey God,\u00a0then<\/em><\/strong>\u00a0the text says that \u201cGod gave them up in the lusts of their hearts to impurity\u201d (1:24). In other words, He didn\u2019t\u00a0cause<\/em>\u00a0their rebellion; He only\u00a0allowed<\/em>\u00a0them in their free choices, to rebel.<\/span><\/p>\n The same dynamic is seen in the juxtaposition between Pharaoh freely hardening his heart, which is then applied to\u00a0God<\/em>\u00a0(in a limited sense) doing it (which means that He\u00a0allowed<\/em>\u00a0it, in His providence; He didn\u2019t\u00a0ordain<\/em>\u00a0it). I\u00a0<\/span>explain this<\/a>\u00a0at length, in<\/span>\u00a0two papers<\/a>.<\/p>\n A fourth similar example occurs in the book of Job. Satan comes to God and challenges Him to allow him to torment Job. God responds, \u201cBehold, he is in your power; only spare his life\u201d (2:6; cf. 1:12). So it is clear that Satan is behind the direct persecution of Job. But later, the text refers to \u201call the evil that the LORD had brought upon him\u201d (42:11); that is (properly interpreted, with knowledge of the multitude of Hebrew literary devices),\u00a0allowed<\/em>\u00a0in His providence. Then it is reported (now literally) that God \u201crestored the fortunes of Job, . . . and the LORD gave Job twice as much as he had before\u201d (42:10) and \u201cblessed the latter days of Job more than his beginning\u201d (42:12).<\/span><\/p>\n 2 Thessalonians (written by St. Paul, as was Romans) is a fifth example, and it expresses precisely the same dynamic as we see in Romans 1 and the other three examples above. Men rebel in their wickedness (\u201cthey refused to love the truth and so be saved\u201d: 2:10). Then it is stated (as a forceful hyperbolic manifestation of God\u2019s providence and His permissive will) that \u201cGod sends upon them a strong delusion, to make them believe what is false,\u00a0so that all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness\u201d (2:11-12).<\/span><\/p>\n It\u2019s not a contradiction. This way of speaking is common in the Bible. When Paul talks about wicked men, he is being literal; but when He talks about God, it is hyperbolic and a form of sarcasm. 2:10 makes it quite clear what caused their damnation: \u201cthose who are to perish,\u00a0because they refused<\/em><\/strong>\u00a0to love the truth.\u201d Even 2:12 again reiterates that man\u2019s rebellion was the cause of the demise of the damned: not because God willed and ordained it from all eternity. The Gospel of John teaches the same thing:<\/span><\/p>\n John 12:37-40\u00a0<\/strong>Though he had done so many signs before them, yet they did not believe in him;\u00a0[38] it was that the word spoken by the prophet Isaiah might be fulfilled: \u201cLord, who has believed our report,\u00a0and to whom has the arm of the Lord been revealed?\u201d\u00a0[39] Therefore they could not believe. For Isaiah again said,\u00a0[40] \u201cHe has blinded their eyes and hardened their heart,\u00a0lest they should see with their eyes and perceive with their heart,\u00a0and turn for me to heal them.\u201d<\/span><\/p><\/blockquote>\n