Those normal discussions don\u2019t receive many comments. But that\u2019s just the way it goes, I guess.<\/span><\/span><\/p>\nIt may, however, still be a positive \u201cconnection\u201d with the one person with whom I am having the pleasant discussion. I don\u2019t expect an atheist\u00a0to become a Catholic as a result of talking with me, but they\u00a0will know \u2014 if nothing else \u2014 that there are Christians out there who act very differently from the stereotype (true or false) of the \u201chypocritical, judgmental Christian.\u201d<\/span><\/span>
I will still call for the cessation of personal attacks and bigotry on\u00a0all<\/strong><\/em>\u00a0sides. I\u2019ve always done so, and will continue to do so.<\/span>
I understand personal attacks. As an apologist, I\u2019ve been attacked constantly (almost literally on a weekly basis) for 19 years, since I have been active online. 95% of these attacks come from fellow Christians. I\u2019ve been called every\u00a0conceivable type of insult imaginable. No one can come up with<\/em> an insult that hasn\u2019t been sent my way! I\u2019ve heard it all.<\/span>
But we all have to rise above that. If a person (Christian or atheist or moth catcher) is too sensitive and thus lashes out and insults others because he or she has been insulted, they ought to take stock and perhaps leave the Internet: at least for a time: a \u201ccooling-off\u201d period.<\/span>
To the extent that some<\/em>\u00a0atheists continue to exhibit this behavior, <\/span>I agree that it may\u00a0largely<\/em>\u00a0come from hurt and mistreatment at the hands of Christians, but it doesn\u2019t\u00a0excuse<\/em><\/strong>\u00a0abominable behavior.<\/span><\/span>
I\u00a0will continue to object to the massive amounts of atheist insults towards Christians as wrong, just as I will continue\u00a0<\/span><\/span>to object to the massive amounts of\u00a0Christian<\/em>\u00a0lies and insults about fellow Christians or about atheists, as I have always done.<\/span><\/span><\/p>\nAnd I will continue to seek out calm, congenial, non-hostile atheists, with whom I can engage in great dialogue. I\u2019ve met them already at Patheos.<\/p>\n
This is common ground (a resolve to not insult and broad-brush), and both sides can build upon it. It\u2019ll be a slow, frustrating process and progress, for sure, but I\u2019m willing to try. We have to agree on things like this in order for any constructive atheist-Christian discourse at all to be possible.\u00a0Both sides have to renounce the insults and poor behavior coming from their own ranks, as well as that coming from the other side.<\/span><\/p>\nI\u2019m here, trying my best, because I believe in dialogue and the power of truth, wherever it may lie. I\u2019m willing to take tons more darts and arrows, if that\u2019s what it takes to\u00a0occasionally dialogue with a thoughtful\u00a0atheist.<\/span><\/p>\nThat\u2019s worth it.\u00a0Any atheist is worth it, and I think I have Good News to share with them, if it can be received. But I never\u00a0push<\/em>\u00a0that. I\u2019m just saying that, as a Christian, I believe\u00a0that I have good news (a \u201cgospel\u201d) of joy and peace and personal fulfillment and the extraordinary Person, Jesus Christ, to share with anyone \u201cwho has ears to hear it,\u201d as the Bible says.<\/span><\/p>\nIt\u2019s quite striking that in all the avalanche of insults in a recent \u00a0atheist\u00a0combox that was initially directed towards me (that I initially responded to but have now withdrawn), we heard lots about (real or imagined) evil, idiotic, cold and callous wicked Christians, much\u00a0about pedophiles and hell, but very little about\u00a0Jesus Christ<\/strong>\u00a0(which is what Christianity is\u00a0all about<\/em>\u00a0in the end, and bottom line). <\/span><\/p>\nIt\u2019s not quite as\u00a0easy to insult Him, due to the profound and sublime beauty and inherent power and goodness of His sayings and how He behaved (with such love and compassion). Consequently, many atheists don\u2019t do that, but bypass the whole central issue\u00a0by absurdly denying His very historical existence.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\nI guess they think that Jesus is\u00a0too good to be true<\/em>. To the contrary, He is Perfectly Good, and the way, the truth, and the life. He\u2019s very real, and He is the light and hope of the world<\/span>.<\/p>\nThat\u2019s my message. I may not bring it up in dialogue with atheists very often, because, as I said, I don\u2019t push that; don\u2019t want anyone to feel \u201con the spot\u201d or \u201cuncomfortable\u201d (I remember the feeling well, from back in my pagan days in the 70s!). But it is always my bottom-line \u201cmessage\u201d whether I express it or not.<\/span><\/p>\nBut my immediate\u00a0message in this post is to make it clear that I think that self-righteous, condescending,\u00a0and cruel treatment of atheists by Christians has caused a great deal of hurt and pain, and that this is contemptible and reprehensible. If it helps at all, I heartily apologize on behalf of my fellow Christians. I think we too often exhibit a very poor image of what Christians should and ought to be.<\/span><\/p>\nJesus wouldn\u2019t have acted as the ones who treat atheists like this have acted, and that\u2019s one of our favorite Christian sayings or mottoes: \u201cwhat would Jesus<\/em> do?\u201d Jesus would never gloat over people who have chosen\u00a0to be separated from God in hell. He is reported to have wept over Jerusalem, because the people in it wouldn\u2019t accept God\u2019s mercy and direction.<\/p>\n<\/body><\/html>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"Photograph by \u201ccherylholt\u201d\u00a0[Pixabay\u00a0\/\u00a0public domain] * * * * * I\u2019m the first to freely admit that many Christians treat atheists atrociously. I\u2019m not one of them. I condemn\u00a0all\u00a0unjust and unfair insults, that anyone makes. Nor does Christian belief require that all atheists automatically go to hell. An atheist\u00a0can quite possibly be saved, as I have […]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":2331,"featured_media":3797,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[124],"tags":[267,258,1054,308,111],"class_list":["post-3814","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-atheism-agnosticism","tag-agnosticism","tag-atheism","tag-atheist-christian-dialogue","tag-ecumenism","tag-the-gospel"],"yoast_head":"\n
Legitimate Atheist Anger (Acknowledged by a Christian)<\/title>\n<meta name=\"description\" content=\"I regret that atheists are treated very harshly and poorly (abominably) by many Christians. The human tendency in all groups is to do so with the outsider.\" \/>\n<meta name=\"robots\" content=\"index, follow, max-snippet:-1, max-image-preview:large, max-video-preview:-1\" \/>\n<link rel=\"canonical\" href=\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/2015\/10\/legitimate-atheist-anger.html\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:locale\" content=\"en_US\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:type\" content=\"article\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:title\" content=\"Legitimate Atheist Anger (Acknowledged by a Christian)\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:description\" content=\"I regret that atheists are treated very harshly and poorly (abominably) by many Christians. 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Formerly a campus missionary, as a Protestant, Dave was received into the Catholic Church in February 1991, by the late, well-known catechist and theologian, Fr. John A. Hardon, S. J. Dave\u2019s articles have appeared in many influential Catholic periodicals, including \\\"This Rock\\\" (now called \\\"Catholic Answers Magazine\\\"), \\\"Envoy Magazine\\\" (Patrick Madrid), \\\"The Catholic Answer,\\\" \\\"The Coming Home Journal,\\\" \\\"Gilbert Magazine\\\" (American Chesterton Society), and \\\"The Latin Mass.\\\" He also writes a featured column for every issue of \\\"The Michigan Catholic\\\": published by the archdiocese of Detroit, and was editor for most of the apologetics tracts published by the St. Paul Street Evangelization apostolate. Dave\u2019s apologetics and writing apostolate was the subject of a feature article in the May 2002 issue of \\\"Envoy Magazine.\\\" He served as the staff moderator at the Internet discussion forum for The Coming Home Network, from 2007-2010. Dave has been interviewed on many nationally syndicated Catholic radio shows, including \\\"Catholic Answers Live\\\" (twice), \\\"Faith and Family Live\\\" (Steve Wood), \\\"Kresta in the Afternoon,\\\" \\\"Son Rise Morning Show,\\\" \\\"Catholic Connection\\\" (Teresa Tomeo), and \\\"The Catholics Next Door.\\\" His large and popular website, \\\"Biblical Evidence for Catholicism,\\\" was online from March 1997 to March 2007, and received the 1998 Catholic Website of the Year award from \\\"Envoy Magazine.\\\" His blog of the same name (now transferred to Patheos), begun in February 2004, contains more than 1,500 papers, at least 500 debates or dialogues, and over 50 distinct \\\"index\\\" web pages. Unsolicited correspondence has indicated many hundreds of conversions (or returns) to the Catholic faith as a result, by God's grace, of these writings. Dave's conversion story was published in the bestselling book \\\"Surprised by Truth\\\" (edited by Patrick Madrid; San Diego: Basilica Press, 1994). Sophia Institute Press has published six of his books: \\\"A Biblical Defense of Catholicism\\\" (Foreword by Fr. John A. Hardon, S. J., 1996 \/ 2003), \\\"The Catholic Verses\\\" (2004), \\\"The One-Minute Apologist\\\" (2007), \\\"Bible Proofs for Catholic Truths\\\" (2009), \\\"The Quotable Newman\\\" (editor: 2012), and \\\"Proving the Catholic Faith is Biblical\\\" (2015). He is co-author (with Dr. Paul Thigpen) of the inserts for \\\"The New Catholic Answer Bible\\\" (Our Sunday Visitor: 2005), and editor for \\\"The Wisdom of Mr. Chesterton: The Very Best Quotes, Quips, and Cracks from the Pen of G. K. Chesterton\\\" (Saint Benedict Press \/ TAN Books: 2009). \\\"100 Biblical Arguments Against Sola Scriptura\\\" was published by Catholic Answers in May 2012. His \\\"Quotable Wesley\\\" compilation was published by (Protestant \/ Wesleyan publisher) Beacon Hill Press in April 2014. Several of his 49 books are bestsellers in their field. Dave maintains a popular personal Facebook page, a Facebook author page, and has a Twitter account as well. He offers almost all of his books in e-book form on his own Biblical Catholicism site (http:\/\/biblicalcatholicism.com\/), at a permanent deep discount: only $2.99 for ePub, mobi, and AZW, and $1.99 for PDF. His writing has been enthusiastically endorsed or recommended by many leading Catholic apologists, authors, and priests, including Dr. Scott Hahn, Fr. Peter M. J. Stravinskas, Marcus Grodi, Patrick Madrid, Steve Ray, Tim Staples, Devin Rose, Mike Aquilina, Al Kresta, Karl Keating, Fr. Dwight Longenecker, Brandon Vogt, Marcellino D'Ambrosio, and Fr. John A. Hardon, S. J. Dave has been happily married to his wife Judy since October 1984. They have three sons and a daughter, and reside in southeast Michigan (metro Detroit).\",\"sameAs\":[\"https:\/\/biblicalcatholicism.com\/\",\"https:\/\/www.facebook.com\/dave.armstrong.798\",\"https:\/\/www.youtube.com\/@LuxVeritatisApologetics\"],\"url\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/author\/davearmstrong\"}]}<\/script>\n<!-- \/ Yoast SEO plugin. -->","yoast_head_json":{"title":"Legitimate Atheist Anger (Acknowledged by a Christian)","description":"I regret that atheists are treated very harshly and poorly (abominably) by many Christians. 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Formerly a campus missionary, as a Protestant, Dave was received into the Catholic Church in February 1991, by the late, well-known catechist and theologian, Fr. John A. Hardon, S. J. Dave\u2019s articles have appeared in many influential Catholic periodicals, including \"This Rock\" (now called \"Catholic Answers Magazine\"), \"Envoy Magazine\" (Patrick Madrid), \"The Catholic Answer,\" \"The Coming Home Journal,\" \"Gilbert Magazine\" (American Chesterton Society), and \"The Latin Mass.\" He also writes a featured column for every issue of \"The Michigan Catholic\": published by the archdiocese of Detroit, and was editor for most of the apologetics tracts published by the St. Paul Street Evangelization apostolate. Dave\u2019s apologetics and writing apostolate was the subject of a feature article in the May 2002 issue of \"Envoy Magazine.\" He served as the staff moderator at the Internet discussion forum for The Coming Home Network, from 2007-2010. Dave has been interviewed on many nationally syndicated Catholic radio shows, including \"Catholic Answers Live\" (twice), \"Faith and Family Live\" (Steve Wood), \"Kresta in the Afternoon,\" \"Son Rise Morning Show,\" \"Catholic Connection\" (Teresa Tomeo), and \"The Catholics Next Door.\" His large and popular website, \"Biblical Evidence for Catholicism,\" was online from March 1997 to March 2007, and received the 1998 Catholic Website of the Year award from \"Envoy Magazine.\" His blog of the same name (now transferred to Patheos), begun in February 2004, contains more than 1,500 papers, at least 500 debates or dialogues, and over 50 distinct \"index\" web pages. Unsolicited correspondence has indicated many hundreds of conversions (or returns) to the Catholic faith as a result, by God's grace, of these writings. Dave's conversion story was published in the bestselling book \"Surprised by Truth\" (edited by Patrick Madrid; San Diego: Basilica Press, 1994). Sophia Institute Press has published six of his books: \"A Biblical Defense of Catholicism\" (Foreword by Fr. John A. Hardon, S. J., 1996 \/ 2003), \"The Catholic Verses\" (2004), \"The One-Minute Apologist\" (2007), \"Bible Proofs for Catholic Truths\" (2009), \"The Quotable Newman\" (editor: 2012), and \"Proving the Catholic Faith is Biblical\" (2015). He is co-author (with Dr. Paul Thigpen) of the inserts for \"The New Catholic Answer Bible\" (Our Sunday Visitor: 2005), and editor for \"The Wisdom of Mr. Chesterton: The Very Best Quotes, Quips, and Cracks from the Pen of G. K. Chesterton\" (Saint Benedict Press \/ TAN Books: 2009). \"100 Biblical Arguments Against Sola Scriptura\" was published by Catholic Answers in May 2012. His \"Quotable Wesley\" compilation was published by (Protestant \/ Wesleyan publisher) Beacon Hill Press in April 2014. Several of his 49 books are bestsellers in their field. Dave maintains a popular personal Facebook page, a Facebook author page, and has a Twitter account as well. He offers almost all of his books in e-book form on his own Biblical Catholicism site (http:\/\/biblicalcatholicism.com\/), at a permanent deep discount: only $2.99 for ePub, mobi, and AZW, and $1.99 for PDF. His writing has been enthusiastically endorsed or recommended by many leading Catholic apologists, authors, and priests, including Dr. Scott Hahn, Fr. Peter M. J. Stravinskas, Marcus Grodi, Patrick Madrid, Steve Ray, Tim Staples, Devin Rose, Mike Aquilina, Al Kresta, Karl Keating, Fr. Dwight Longenecker, Brandon Vogt, Marcellino D'Ambrosio, and Fr. John A. Hardon, S. J. Dave has been happily married to his wife Judy since October 1984. 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<\/a><\/p>\n