{"id":44022,"date":"2020-01-29T14:50:36","date_gmt":"2020-01-29T18:50:36","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/admin.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/?p=44022"},"modified":"2026-06-06T00:41:26","modified_gmt":"2026-06-06T04:41:26","slug":"reply-to-a-rationalist-objection-to-marys-perpetual-virginity","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/2020\/01\/reply-to-a-rationalist-objection-to-marys-perpetual-virginity.html","title":{"rendered":"Reply to a Rationalist Objection to Mary’s Perpetual Virginity"},"content":{"rendered":"\n<\/head>

\"\"<\/p>\n

Essay 41 (my original manuscript, with some differences) from my book,\u00a0Proving the Catholic Faith is Biblical: From Priestly Celibacy to the Rosary: 80 Short Essays Explaining the Biblical Basis of Catholicism<\/a><\/i>\u00a0(July 2015)<\/p>\n

*****<\/p>\n

In Partu<\/em> virginity is the belief that Jesus was born miraculously, without the usual physical travail of childbirth. Mary\u2019s virginity was preserved in the biological sense: i.e., the hymen remained intact.<\/p>\n

Virginity, as classically understood, is not simply the absence of sexual activity (how we use the term today). It also had a literal physiological component (intact hymen). That\u2019s why, in order for the Blessed Virgin Mary to be a \u201cperpetual virgin\u201d in this sense, Jesus\u2019 birth (like His conception) had to be supernatural rather than natural.<\/p>\n

The whole thing is miraculous: conception; incarnation; in partu<\/em> birth, though being in Mary\u2019s womb for nine months obviously was \u201cnatural\u201d. This is what the Catholic Church has taught.<\/p>\n

A Catholic on another site described objections to this belief (in either agreement or perplexity over) and stated that it would render the placenta and umbilical cord irrelevant, making Mary\u2019s pregnancy \u201cappear as a fiction or myth or merely a play or a joke\u201d and indeed, \u201ccomical.\u201d<\/p>\n

He thought the traditional Catholic view (which he thought entailed no implantation of the embryo in Mary\u2019s uterus) was \u201crationally in-congruent and ridiculous.\u201d He concluded that he wouldn\u2019t be able to defend the Catholic dogma if someone asked him about it. The following was my (off-the-cuff) reply:<\/p>\n

Why would you think you have to explain every objection to every miracle that is believed in Christianity? These factors are no more \u201cridiculous\u201d than the virgin birth itself, if we are to rank levels of supposed \u201cimplausibility.\u201d<\/p>\n

This is a dogma. We believe in faith first; we don\u2019t have to \u201csolve every problem\u201d before we believe. That\u2019s not Christian faith, given by God\u2019s grace, but man-centered rationalism.<\/p>\n

There are always \u201cdifficulties\u201d and \u201cproblems\u201d in any large system of thought. That doesn\u2019t prevent people from believing in the tenets of same. This includes physical science, where there are a host of things that remain unexplained (e.g., what caused the Big Bang; whether light is a particle or a wave, how life began, the complete lack of evidence for life anywhere else, etc.). People don\u2019t disbelieve in the Big Bang because we can\u2019t explain everything<\/em> about it.<\/p>\n

Likewise with Catholic dogma. If even science requires faith and axiomatic presuppositions, how much more, religious faith, which is not identical to philosophy or reason in the first place? God could, for example, have simply made the placenta and umbilical cord disappear when the time came to be born (it doesn\u2019t mean they were never there or that there were no natural components). No biggie for Him: the One Who parted the Red Sea, created the universe, and performed a host of other miracles.<\/p>\n

This is the same sort of inconsistent thinking and false premise that causes folks to reject the physical, substantial presence of our Lord Jesus in the Eucharist, and Doubting Thomas to disbelieve that Jesus had risen, or those who won\u2019t believe unless they have some sign-miracle on demand.<\/p>\n

All of this requires faith, and faith comes through grace accepted in free will. One can come up with any number of possible theories dealing with the placenta, etc., but I refuse to accept the premise that holds that we must do that in order to believe the dogma, and solving this \u201cproblem\u201d is of little interest to me, even as an apologist. It\u2019s pretty low on the list of priorities.<\/p>\n

We\u2019d all be in very rough shape if our personal \u201cepistemology\u201d required us to know every jot and tittle of everything before we could believe it. Most things we do or believe in life we don\u2019t fully understand at all. One would have to argue that every<\/em> miracle is \u201cridiculous\u201d in this sense that is unable to be consistently sustained. God\u2019s eternity and self-existence is absurd, creatio ex nihilo<\/em> is, transubstantiation, Hypostatic Union, Resurrection; on and on it goes.<\/p>\n

So why should a different, \u201csuper-standard\u201d be applied to Christianity and particularly to Catholic dogma?<\/p>\n

***<\/p>\n

Related Reading:<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Why Believe in Mary\u2019s Perpetual Virginity?<\/a>\u00a0[2-28-04]<\/div>\n
*<\/div>\n
Mary\u2019s Perpetual Virginity \u201cIn Partu\u201d (a Miraculous, Non-Natural Childbirth) is a Binding Catholic Dogma<\/a>\u00a0(see also extensive\u00a0Facebook discussion<\/a>) [9-24-08; expanded on 9-21-15]<\/div>\n
*<\/div>\n
Catholics: \u201cSo<\/em>\u00a0Dogmatic About the Perpetual Virginity of Mary!\u201d + Confessional Lutheran Agreement\u00a0<\/a>[11-1-08]<\/div>\n
*<\/div>\n
<\/div>\n
Virgin Birth & Perpetual Virginity: \u201cAnti-Sex\u201d?<\/a>\u00a0[5-21-14]<\/div>\n
*<\/div>\n
Mary Was a Virgin During Jesus\u2019 Birth (In Partu<\/em>)<\/a>\u00a0[9-19-14; slight modifications and additions on 4-18-18]<\/div>\n
*<\/div>\n
\n
Catholic Virginity: \u201cAnti-Sex\u201d Viewpoint?<\/a>\u00a0[11-6-15]<\/div>\n
*<\/div>\n
Exchange on Miracles & Hyper-Rationalism<\/a>\u00a0[12-7-15]<\/div>\n
*<\/div>\n
\u201cHoly Ground\u201d & Mary\u2019s Perpetual Virginity\u00a0<\/a>[5-24-16]<\/div>\n
*<\/div>\n
Perpetual Virginity: Not \u201cIntuitive\u201d But Still True<\/a>\u00a0(see also the vigorous discussion with a deist in the combox underneath) [4-13-18]
\n*<\/div>\n<\/div>\n

***<\/p>\n

Unfortunately, Money Trees Do Not Exist<\/strong>:\u00a0<\/span>If you have been aided in any way by my work, or think it is valuable and worthwhile, please strongly consider financially supporting it (even $10 \/ month \u2014 a mere 33 cents a day \u2014 would be very helpful). I have been a full-time Catholic apologist since Dec. 2001, and have been writing Christian apologetics since 1981 (see\u00a0my Resume<\/a>).\u00a0My work has been proven (by God\u2019s grace alone) to be fruitful, in terms of changing lives (see the tangible evidences\u00a0from unsolicited \u201ctestimonies\u201d<\/a>).\u00a0I have to pay my bills like all of you: and have a (homeschooling) wife and three children still at home to provide for, and a mortgage to pay.<\/div>\n
*<\/div>\n
My book royalties from\u00a0three bestsellers in the field<\/a>\u00a0(published in 2003-2007) have been decreasing, as has my overall income, making it increasingly difficult to make ends meet.\u00a0 I provide over 2600 free articles here, for the purpose of your edification and education, and have\u00a0written 50 books<\/a>.\u00a0It\u2019ll literally be a struggle to survive financially until Dec. 2020, when both my wife and I will be receiving Social Security. If you cannot contribute, I ask for your prayers (and \u201clikes\u201d and links and shares). Thanks!<\/div>\n
*<\/div>\n
See my\u00a0information on how to donate<\/a>\u00a0(including 100% tax-deductible donations). It\u2019s very simple to contribute to my apostolate via PayPal, if a tax deduction is not needed (my \u201cbusiness name\u201d there is called \u201cCatholic Used Book Service,\u201d from my old bookselling days 17 or so years ago, but send to my email: apologistdave@gmail.com). Another easy way to send and receive money (with a bank account or a mobile phone) is through\u00a0Zelle<\/a>. Again, just send to my e-mail address.\u00a0May God abundantly bless you.<\/div>\n
*<\/div>\n

***<\/p>\n<\/body><\/html>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

Essay 41 (my original manuscript, with some differences) from my book,\u00a0Proving the Catholic Faith is Biblical: From Priestly Celibacy to the Rosary: 80 Short Essays Explaining the Biblical Basis of Catholicism\u00a0(July 2015) ***** In Partu virginity is the belief that Jesus was born miraculously, without the usual physical travail of childbirth. Mary\u2019s virginity was preserved […]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":2331,"featured_media":44025,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[45],"tags":[1600,1619,453,2357,508,3456,46,3455,469,503,2356,680,507,1008,3457,685,39,681,944,504,687],"class_list":["post-44022","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-blessed-virgin-mary","tag-always-virgin","tag-annunciation","tag-bethlehem","tag-blessed-virgin-mary","tag-catholic-mariology","tag-ever-virgin","tag-immaculate-conception","tag-in-partu-virginity","tag-incarnation","tag-marian-doctrine","tag-mariology","tag-mary-mother-of-jesus","tag-mother-of-god","tag-nativity","tag-our-lady","tag-perpetual-virginity","tag-perpetual-virginity-of-mary","tag-theotokos","tag-virgin-birth","tag-virgin-mary","tag-virginity-during-childbirth"],"yoast_head":"\nReply to a Rationalist Objection to 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Dave\u2019s apologetics and writing apostolate was the subject of a feature article in the May 2002 issue of \\\"Envoy Magazine.\\\" He served as the staff moderator at the Internet discussion forum for The Coming Home Network, from 2007-2010. Dave has been interviewed on many nationally syndicated Catholic radio shows, including \\\"Catholic Answers Live\\\" (twice), \\\"Faith and Family Live\\\" (Steve Wood), \\\"Kresta in the Afternoon,\\\" \\\"Son Rise Morning Show,\\\" \\\"Catholic Connection\\\" (Teresa Tomeo), and \\\"The Catholics Next Door.\\\" His large and popular website, \\\"Biblical Evidence for Catholicism,\\\" was online from March 1997 to March 2007, and received the 1998 Catholic Website of the Year award from \\\"Envoy Magazine.\\\" His blog of the same name (now transferred to Patheos), begun in February 2004, contains more than 1,500 papers, at least 500 debates or dialogues, and over 50 distinct \\\"index\\\" web pages. Unsolicited correspondence has indicated many hundreds of conversions (or returns) to the Catholic faith as a result, by God's grace, of these writings. Dave's conversion story was published in the bestselling book \\\"Surprised by Truth\\\" (edited by Patrick Madrid; San Diego: Basilica Press, 1994). Sophia Institute Press has published six of his books: \\\"A Biblical Defense of Catholicism\\\" (Foreword by Fr. John A. Hardon, S. J., 1996 \/ 2003), \\\"The Catholic Verses\\\" (2004), \\\"The One-Minute Apologist\\\" (2007), \\\"Bible Proofs for Catholic Truths\\\" (2009), \\\"The Quotable Newman\\\" (editor: 2012), and \\\"Proving the Catholic Faith is Biblical\\\" (2015). He is co-author (with Dr. Paul Thigpen) of the inserts for \\\"The New Catholic Answer Bible\\\" (Our Sunday Visitor: 2005), and editor for \\\"The Wisdom of Mr. Chesterton: The Very Best Quotes, Quips, and Cracks from the Pen of G. K. Chesterton\\\" (Saint Benedict Press \/ TAN Books: 2009). \\\"100 Biblical Arguments Against Sola Scriptura\\\" was published by Catholic Answers in May 2012. His \\\"Quotable Wesley\\\" compilation was published by (Protestant \/ Wesleyan publisher) Beacon Hill Press in April 2014. Several of his 49 books are bestsellers in their field. Dave maintains a popular personal Facebook page, a Facebook author page, and has a Twitter account as well. He offers almost all of his books in e-book form on his own Biblical Catholicism site (http:\/\/biblicalcatholicism.com\/), at a permanent deep discount: only $2.99 for ePub, mobi, and AZW, and $1.99 for PDF. His writing has been enthusiastically endorsed or recommended by many leading Catholic apologists, authors, and priests, including Dr. Scott Hahn, Fr. Peter M. J. Stravinskas, Marcus Grodi, Patrick Madrid, Steve Ray, Tim Staples, Devin Rose, Mike Aquilina, Al Kresta, Karl Keating, Fr. Dwight Longenecker, Brandon Vogt, Marcellino D'Ambrosio, and Fr. John A. Hardon, S. J. Dave has been happily married to his wife Judy since October 1984. 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Formerly a campus missionary, as a Protestant, Dave was received into the Catholic Church in February 1991, by the late, well-known catechist and theologian, Fr. John A. Hardon, S. J. Dave\u2019s articles have appeared in many influential Catholic periodicals, including \"This Rock\" (now called \"Catholic Answers Magazine\"), \"Envoy Magazine\" (Patrick Madrid), \"The Catholic Answer,\" \"The Coming Home Journal,\" \"Gilbert Magazine\" (American Chesterton Society), and \"The Latin Mass.\" He also writes a featured column for every issue of \"The Michigan Catholic\": published by the archdiocese of Detroit, and was editor for most of the apologetics tracts published by the St. Paul Street Evangelization apostolate. Dave\u2019s apologetics and writing apostolate was the subject of a feature article in the May 2002 issue of \"Envoy Magazine.\" He served as the staff moderator at the Internet discussion forum for The Coming Home Network, from 2007-2010. Dave has been interviewed on many nationally syndicated Catholic radio shows, including \"Catholic Answers Live\" (twice), \"Faith and Family Live\" (Steve Wood), \"Kresta in the Afternoon,\" \"Son Rise Morning Show,\" \"Catholic Connection\" (Teresa Tomeo), and \"The Catholics Next Door.\" His large and popular website, \"Biblical Evidence for Catholicism,\" was online from March 1997 to March 2007, and received the 1998 Catholic Website of the Year award from \"Envoy Magazine.\" His blog of the same name (now transferred to Patheos), begun in February 2004, contains more than 1,500 papers, at least 500 debates or dialogues, and over 50 distinct \"index\" web pages. Unsolicited correspondence has indicated many hundreds of conversions (or returns) to the Catholic faith as a result, by God's grace, of these writings. Dave's conversion story was published in the bestselling book \"Surprised by Truth\" (edited by Patrick Madrid; San Diego: Basilica Press, 1994). Sophia Institute Press has published six of his books: \"A Biblical Defense of Catholicism\" (Foreword by Fr. John A. Hardon, S. J., 1996 \/ 2003), \"The Catholic Verses\" (2004), \"The One-Minute Apologist\" (2007), \"Bible Proofs for Catholic Truths\" (2009), \"The Quotable Newman\" (editor: 2012), and \"Proving the Catholic Faith is Biblical\" (2015). He is co-author (with Dr. Paul Thigpen) of the inserts for \"The New Catholic Answer Bible\" (Our Sunday Visitor: 2005), and editor for \"The Wisdom of Mr. Chesterton: The Very Best Quotes, Quips, and Cracks from the Pen of G. K. Chesterton\" (Saint Benedict Press \/ TAN Books: 2009). \"100 Biblical Arguments Against Sola Scriptura\" was published by Catholic Answers in May 2012. His \"Quotable Wesley\" compilation was published by (Protestant \/ Wesleyan publisher) Beacon Hill Press in April 2014. Several of his 49 books are bestsellers in their field. Dave maintains a popular personal Facebook page, a Facebook author page, and has a Twitter account as well. He offers almost all of his books in e-book form on his own Biblical Catholicism site (http:\/\/biblicalcatholicism.com\/), at a permanent deep discount: only $2.99 for ePub, mobi, and AZW, and $1.99 for PDF. His writing has been enthusiastically endorsed or recommended by many leading Catholic apologists, authors, and priests, including Dr. Scott Hahn, Fr. Peter M. J. Stravinskas, Marcus Grodi, Patrick Madrid, Steve Ray, Tim Staples, Devin Rose, Mike Aquilina, Al Kresta, Karl Keating, Fr. Dwight Longenecker, Brandon Vogt, Marcellino D'Ambrosio, and Fr. John A. Hardon, S. J. Dave has been happily married to his wife Judy since October 1984. They have three sons and a daughter, and reside in southeast Michigan (metro Detroit).","sameAs":["https:\/\/biblicalcatholicism.com\/","https:\/\/www.facebook.com\/dave.armstrong.798","https:\/\/www.youtube.com\/@LuxVeritatisApologetics"],"url":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/author\/davearmstrong"}]}},"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/44022","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/2331"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=44022"}],"version-history":[{"count":0,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/44022\/revisions"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/44025"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=44022"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=44022"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=44022"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}