{"id":48089,"date":"2020-05-23T15:36:16","date_gmt":"2020-05-23T19:36:16","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/admin.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/?p=48089"},"modified":"2020-05-23T15:39:13","modified_gmt":"2020-05-23T19:39:13","slug":"james-white-vs-the-catholic-verses-v-deceiver-dave","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/2020\/05\/james-white-vs-the-catholic-verses-v-deceiver-dave.html","title":{"rendered":"James White vs. “The Catholic Verses”: V: Deceiver Dave"},"content":{"rendered":"\n<\/head>

\"\"<\/p>\n

[book and purchase information<\/a>]<\/p>\n

***<\/p>\n

[originally from 1-1-05]<\/p>\n

***<\/p>\n

My Introduction to the Series<\/a>\u00a0[12-29-04]<\/p>\n

Part I: Binding Tradition<\/a>\u00a0[12-30-04]<\/p>\n

Part II: Rabbit Trail Diversion<\/a>\u00a0[12-30-04]<\/p>\n

Part III:\u00a0Ad Hominem<\/em><\/a>\u00a0[12-31-04]<\/p>\n

Part IV: I\u2019m an Ignorant Convert?<\/a> [12-31-04]<\/p>\n

Part V: Deceiver Dave<\/a> [1-1-05]<\/p>\n

Part VI: Penance\u00a0and Redemptive Suffering\u00a0<\/a>[1-2-05]<\/p>\n

***<\/p>\n

I know what many of you are thinking (scratching your head and shaking it in amazement): \u201cthis nonsense is a critique of Dave\u2019s book<\/em>???!!!\u201d Yes, all of this personal attack is in the midst of a supposed \u201ccritique.\u201d It is an exercise in intellectual self-destruction. The latest installment from Bishop \u201cDr.\u201d [???] White is his \u201cQuick Thought Regarding DA and Exegesis\u201d<\/a> (12-31-04), where he expresses his confusion and clueless noncomprehension of the replies I have been giving. Here are some highlights (his words in blue<\/span>):<\/p>\n

\u00a0. . . it seems to be pretty difficult to follow where he\u2019s going.<\/span><\/p>\n

. . . [he] simply assumes the Roman interpretation, ignores the need to do any exegesis at all, and after all that, does not avail himself of counter-exegesis when it is only two pages away from passages he cites in his book . . .<\/span><\/p>\n

I\u2019m confused as well by the fact that when I mentioned looking for an exegesis of Romans 4:6-8 (which seemingly is not forthcoming: I\u2019m sure I\u2019m not the only one who would like to see Mr. Armstrong\u2019s exegesis of the text) in A Biblical Defense of Catholicism<\/em> he accused me of changing the topic; but now I am told to look there for the positive exegesis of these passages from the Roman Catholic side. Which is it? Sorta hard to figure out, isn\u2019t it? Indeed it is.<\/span><\/p>\n

To which I reply: read my explanations again<\/em>. It\u2019ll come to you if you keep trying. Moving on, the next post White has blessed his readers with, is \u201cArmstrong\u2019s Reading List\u201d<\/a> (12-31-04), in response to my last post, where I had to prove that I had done some serious reading as a Protestant (!!!). This is an absolute classic gem of Bishop White\u2019s finely honed art of personal attack, obfuscation, and sophistry. I shall cite it in its entirety:<\/p>\n

Mr. Armstrong has provided a reading list on his blog.<\/span><\/p>\n

[see the previous installment<\/a> in this series for my lengthy list of books I have read or own]<\/p>\n

No; I provided a list of books I had read, and which are in my library: heavily-used for research (because White had ridiculously denied that I was well-read as a Protestant).<\/p>\n

In essence, this means that instead of blaming ignorance for his very shallow misrepresentations of non-Catholic theology and exegesis, we must now assert knowing deception.<\/span><\/p>\n

At this point, White has descended into virtual self-parody and high comedy. Having seen that his contention of my \u201cignorance\u201d was blown out of the water by a simple citation of the books I have read and\/or own, he faced a dilemma: the choice was (1) \u201cadmit that Armstrong actually knows something about Protestantism, so that I have been lying about him all these years,\u201d or (2) \u201cdeny that he is telling the truth about his reading and books.\u201d He chose (1) (well, the first clause, anyway), and decided to switch to the tactic of accusing me of \u201cknowing deception,\u201d<\/span> so as to \u201csave face\u201d (so he thinks).<\/p>\n

So far, DA has been unable to provide even the slightest meaningful defense of his own published statements and their refutation.<\/span><\/p>\n

No refutation has occurred (White has almost totally ignored the arguments in the book); what need of defense<\/em>, then? So, mostly I have been clarifying simple logic and facts.<\/p>\n

Which is really only marginally relevant to the real issue: hopefully, aside from demonstrating the exegetical bankruptcy of The Catholic Verses<\/em>, . . .<\/span><\/p>\n

Can I help it if White continually shows his inability to grasp the very nature and purpose of the book?<\/p>\n

. . . answers are being given to all those observing and learning how to speak the truth to those who likewise would handle the Word from the vantage point of tradition rather than allowing it to speak for itself with its own voice.<\/span><\/p>\n

Failing any logical argument, simply distort the other\u2019s belief and assert your own radically circular position . . .<\/p>\n

*****<\/p>\n

Total words: White: (minus his citation of my words): 492
\nTotal words: Armstrong: 377 (or 77% as many as White\u2019s)<\/p>\n

Grand Total thus far: White: 4762 \/ Armstrong: 2001 (or 42% as many as White\u2019s words, or White outwriting Armstrong by a 2.38 to one margin)<\/p>\n

My percentage of words over against White\u2019s, compared to his \u201caverage\u201d prediction: 0.04% (2001 actual, compared to a predicted 47,620 \/ 24 times less)<\/p>\n

Note Bishop White\u2019s statement on 12-29-04<\/a>, in commencing this present discussion:<\/p>\n

Now, of course, DA will respond with text files (liberally salted with URL\u2019s) that will average 10x the word count of anything I have to say. That\u2019s OK. I shall . . . let him take home the bragging rights to verbosity and bandwidth usage.<\/span><\/p><\/blockquote>\n

\u00a0<\/p>\n

***<\/p>\n

\u00a0<\/p>\n<\/body><\/html>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

[book and purchase information] *** [originally from 1-1-05] *** My Introduction to the Series\u00a0[12-29-04] Part I: Binding Tradition\u00a0[12-30-04] Part II: Rabbit Trail Diversion\u00a0[12-30-04] Part III:\u00a0Ad Hominem\u00a0[12-31-04] Part IV: I\u2019m an Ignorant Convert? [12-31-04] Part V: Deceiver Dave [1-1-05] Part VI: Penance\u00a0and Redemptive Suffering\u00a0[1-2-05] *** I know what many of you are thinking (scratching your head […]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":2331,"featured_media":48013,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[231],"tags":[855,2361,341,3715,2366,652],"class_list":["post-48089","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-anti-catholicism","tag-anti-catholic","tag-anti-catholicism","tag-anti-catholics","tag-catholic-protestant-debates","tag-james-white","tag-the-catholic-verses"],"yoast_head":"\nJames White vs. "The Catholic Verses": V: Deceiver Dave<\/title>\n<meta name=\"description\" content=\"Having shown Bishop "Dr." [???] James White what Protestant books I had read in the last installment, he switched his attack from my alleged "ignorance" to "knowing deception".\" 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Unsolicited correspondence has indicated many hundreds of conversions (or returns) to the Catholic faith as a result, by God's grace, of these writings. Dave's conversion story was published in the bestselling book \\\"Surprised by Truth\\\" (edited by Patrick Madrid; San Diego: Basilica Press, 1994). Sophia Institute Press has published six of his books: \\\"A Biblical Defense of Catholicism\\\" (Foreword by Fr. John A. Hardon, S. J., 1996 \/ 2003), \\\"The Catholic Verses\\\" (2004), \\\"The One-Minute Apologist\\\" (2007), \\\"Bible Proofs for Catholic Truths\\\" (2009), \\\"The Quotable Newman\\\" (editor: 2012), and \\\"Proving the Catholic Faith is Biblical\\\" (2015). He is co-author (with Dr. Paul Thigpen) of the inserts for \\\"The New Catholic Answer Bible\\\" (Our Sunday Visitor: 2005), and editor for \\\"The Wisdom of Mr. Chesterton: The Very Best Quotes, Quips, and Cracks from the Pen of G. K. 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Sophia Institute Press has published six of his books: \"A Biblical Defense of Catholicism\" (Foreword by Fr. John A. Hardon, S. J., 1996 \/ 2003), \"The Catholic Verses\" (2004), \"The One-Minute Apologist\" (2007), \"Bible Proofs for Catholic Truths\" (2009), \"The Quotable Newman\" (editor: 2012), and \"Proving the Catholic Faith is Biblical\" (2015). He is co-author (with Dr. Paul Thigpen) of the inserts for \"The New Catholic Answer Bible\" (Our Sunday Visitor: 2005), and editor for \"The Wisdom of Mr. Chesterton: The Very Best Quotes, Quips, and Cracks from the Pen of G. K. Chesterton\" (Saint Benedict Press \/ TAN Books: 2009). \"100 Biblical Arguments Against Sola Scriptura\" was published by Catholic Answers in May 2012. His \"Quotable Wesley\" compilation was published by (Protestant \/ Wesleyan publisher) Beacon Hill Press in April 2014. Several of his 49 books are bestsellers in their field. Dave maintains a popular personal Facebook page, a Facebook author page, and has a Twitter account as well. He offers almost all of his books in e-book form on his own Biblical Catholicism site (http:\/\/biblicalcatholicism.com\/), at a permanent deep discount: only $2.99 for ePub, mobi, and AZW, and $1.99 for PDF. His writing has been enthusiastically endorsed or recommended by many leading Catholic apologists, authors, and priests, including Dr. Scott Hahn, Fr. Peter M. J. Stravinskas, Marcus Grodi, Patrick Madrid, Steve Ray, Tim Staples, Devin Rose, Mike Aquilina, Al Kresta, Karl Keating, Fr. Dwight Longenecker, Brandon Vogt, Marcellino D'Ambrosio, and Fr. John A. Hardon, S. J. Dave has been happily married to his wife Judy since October 1984. 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