{"id":54114,"date":"2021-01-18T13:13:47","date_gmt":"2021-01-18T17:13:47","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/?p=54114"},"modified":"2021-01-18T13:13:47","modified_gmt":"2021-01-18T17:13:47","slug":"loftus-lies-22-paine-stanton-twain-were-not-atheists","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/2021\/01\/loftus-lies-22-paine-stanton-twain-were-not-atheists.html","title":{"rendered":"Loftus Lies #22: Paine, Stanton, & Twain Were NOT Atheists"},"content":{"rendered":"\n<\/head>

\"\"<\/p>\n

Even an unplugged clock is right twice a day. And it\u2019s relentlessly wrong<\/em>, too, for all but two minutes in a 24-hour day. Atheist author and polemicist John W. Loftus<\/a> cited G. K. Chesterton in his article, \u201c<\/a>Excerpt From \u201cUnapologetic: Why Philosophy of Religion Must End\u201d<\/a> (3-24-20): \u201cIf something is worth doing, it\u2019s worth doing badly.\u201d Then, lo and behold, he supported his own citation of this famous maxim by doing precisely that<\/strong><\/em>. He opined:<\/p>\n

My specialties are theology, philosophical theology and especially apologetics. I am an expert on these subjects even though it\u2019s very hard to have a good grasp of them all. . . . [a] theologically sophisticated intellectual . . .<\/p>\n

Look at just a very brief listing of historic famous American atheist authors . . . Women like Elizabeth Cady Stanton, Madalyn Murray O\u2019Hair and Ayn Rand. Men like Thomas Paine, Robert Ingersoll and Mark Twain, or scientists like the prolific Isaac Asimov and Carl Sagan.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n

The only problem is that Elizabeth Cady Stanton, Thomas Paine, and Mark Twain were not<\/strong> atheist<\/em>s! Loftus got three out of eight (38%) wrong. This is rather elementary stuff. It\u2019s tough to be this wrong in an age of almost instant verification or (disproof) with the remarkable searching capabilities of the Internet, and all the online books<\/p>\n

Elizabeth Cady Stanton<\/a> was (like Albert Einstein)<\/a> a pantheist<\/a> (\u201cgod is all\u201d):<\/p>\n

What we call God is the infinite ideal of humanity. The preposterous, ridiculous absurdity of supposing God so defined to be of the male sex, and to call God \u2018him,\u2019 does not need a word to make it apparent. This ideal which we all reverence, and for which we yearn, necessarily enfolds in One the attributes which, separated in our human race, express themselves in Manhood and Womanhood. . . .<\/p>\n

The sun moon & stars the constellations the days & nights, the seasons\u2026the centripetal & centrifugal forces, positive & negative magnetism, the laws of gravitation cohesion attraction are all immutable and unchangeable one & all moving in harmony together. God was to us sunshine, flowers, affection, all that is grand and beautiful in nature. . . .<\/p>\n

I think the next form of religion will be the \u2018Religion of Humanity,\u2019 in which men and women will worship what they see of the divine in each other. (Elizabeth Cady Stanton, cited at Pantheism.com<\/a>)<\/p><\/blockquote>\n

Thomas Paine<\/a>\u00a0was a deist. He stated in his work, Age of Reason<\/em> (Part First, Section 1<\/a>):<\/p>\n

I believe in one God, and no more; and I hope for happiness beyond this life. . . .<\/p>\n

. . .\u00a0man would return to the pure, unmixed and unadulterated belief of one God, and no more. [as a good and desirable thing]<\/span><\/p>\n

. . .\u00a0as if the way to God was not open to every man alike. . . .<\/p>\n

No one will deny or dispute the power of the Almighty to make such a communication, if he pleases.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n

More evidence of Paine\u2019s espousal of (non-atheist) deism<\/a>:<\/p>\n

Paine\u2019s deism\u2014the belief in God, but the eschewing of organized religion\u2014is often erroneously confused with atheism. (Jonathan Marker, \u201cThomas Paine\u2019s Attitudes Toward Religion Impacted His Legacy, Author Says\u201d<\/a>,\u00a0National Archives News<\/em>, 10-18-19)<\/p>\n

In\u00a0The Age of Reason<\/i>\u00a0he advocated\u00a0deism, promoted reason and free thought and argued against institutionalized religion in general and Christian doctrine in particular. (Wikipedia, \u201cThomas Paine\u201d<\/a>)<\/p>\n

[T]he only true religion is\u00a0Deism, by which I then meant, and mean now, the belief of one God, and an imitation of his moral character, or the practice of what are called moral virtues\u00a0\u2013 and that it was upon this only (so far as religion is concerned) that I rested all my hopes of happiness hereafter. So say I now\u00a0\u2013 and so help me God. (Thomas Paine, in\u00a0The Theological Works of Thomas Paine<\/i><\/a>, [1824], R. Carlile, p.\u00a0138)<\/p>\n

For a man so frequently called an atheist, Paine shows a remarkable confidence in the divine order of the creation. . . . The\u00a0Age of Reason<\/em>\u00a0is not an atheist tract, but a deist one. It combines scathing criticism of claims to authority for the bible by religious authorities, with an expression of confidence in a divinely ordered world, . . .<\/p>\n

Although the later parts of\u00a0Age of Reason<\/em>\u00a0descend into detailed interpretation and controversy, and lose much of their intuitive appeal, the first part is a powerful confession of rationalist faith in a divine creator whose design can be appreciated by man in the Bible of Creation, whose principles are eternal, . . . (Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy<\/em>, \u201cThomas Paine\u201d<\/a>)<\/p>\n

The only religion that has not been invented, and that has in it every evidence of divine originality, is pure and simple Deism. (Thomas Paine, The Complete Writings of Thomas Paine<\/em>, 2 vol., edited by P. S. Foner, Secaucus, New Jersey: The Citadel Press, 1945, Vol. I, 600; cited in the previous entry)<\/p>\n

The Theophilanthropists: A society founded by Paine and others in 1797. It was one of the first ethical societies of the world. It came from the Greek and meant, love of God and Man. The society met in a circle or a ring which symbolized an unbroken or unending devotion to God. The spirit of humanity was the basis for a moral life on earth. Theophilanthrophy was rooted in the spiritual philosophy of the Illuminati that Bonneville brought from Germany. God was responsible for creating the universe but not responsible for man\u2019s actions. Atheists are mistaken. They are short sighted because they ascribe everything they perceive to the innate properties of matter and ignore the rest by saying that matter is eternal. God creates everything, including the sun, stars, planets, etc. All the principles of science are of a divine origin. Those principles are eternal and immutable. They are immortal because they continue to exist after the matter that expresses them has dissolved. Man, being in the position to rationally apprehend these eternal principles, is himself immortal and his soul does not die when the body turns to dust. Man accounts to God for his belief and not to other men. The society studied Greek thinkers and poets as well as Confucius and other Chinese philosophers. The idea of the society was to encourage people to live a life of spiritual values and to come into harmony with God, Nature and Man. (James Tepfer, \u201cThe Religious and Political Philosophy\u00a0of Tom Paine\u201d<\/a>; see much much more related material in this article)<\/p><\/blockquote>\n

Nor was Mark Twain<\/strong> an atheist. I have written about his religious belief in another article of mine<\/a>. Philosopher David Hume<\/a> was not an atheist, either (see the proof).<\/p>\n

Related Reading<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

Dialogue w Atheist John Loftus on the Problem of Evil<\/a>\u00a0[10-11-06]<\/div>\n
*<\/div>\n
\n
Critique of Atheist John W. Loftus\u2019 \u201cDeconversion\u201d Story<\/a>\u00a0[10-15-06]<\/div>\n
*<\/div>\n
\n
Critique of Atheist John Loftus Regarding a Timeless God . . . And of Course, \u201cJittery John\u201d Again Explodes<\/a>\u00a0[11-30-06]<\/div>\n
\n
*<\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/div>\n
Atheist John Loftus Reacts to My Analysis of His \u201cDeconversion\u201d<\/a>\u00a0[12-6-06]<\/div>\n
*<\/div>\n
\n
\n
Reply to Atheist John Loftus\u2019 \u201cOutsider Test of Faith\u201d Series\u00a0<\/a>[9-30-07]<\/div>\n<\/div>\n
\n
*<\/div>\n
\n
\n
The Census, Jesus\u2019 Birth in Bethlehem, & History: Reply to Atheist John W. Loftus\u2019 Irrational Criticisms of the Biblical Accounts<\/a>\u00a0[2-3-11]<\/div>\n
*<\/div>\n<\/div>\n
John Loftus\u2019 Deconversion & Feuds with Atheists<\/a>\u00a0[10-9-15]<\/div>\n
\n
*<\/div>\n
\n
Loftus Atheist Error #1: Intro: \u201cWhy [He] Became an Atheist\u201d\u00a0<\/a>[9-3-19]<\/div>\n
*<\/div>\n
Loftus Atheist Error #2: 16-Page Deconversion Story\u00a0<\/a>[9-4-19]<\/div>\n
*<\/div>\n
Loftus Atheist Error #3: Scientism & a \u201cBetter [Pascal\u2019s] Wager\u201d\u00a0<\/a>[9-5-19]<\/div>\n
*<\/div>\n
Loftus Atheist Error #4: The Outsider Test for Faith<\/a>\u00a0[9-5-19]<\/div>\n
*<\/div>\n
Loftus Atheist Error #5: Origins, Flew\u2019s Deism, Anthropomorphism<\/a>\u00a0[9-9-19]<\/div>\n
*<\/div>\n
Loftus Atheist Error #6: Is God \u201cLove\u201d or a \u201cMoral Monster\u201d?\u00a0<\/a>[9-9-19]<\/div>\n
*<\/div>\n
Loftus Atheist Error #7: Christian Influence on Science\u00a0<\/a>[9-9-19]<\/div>\n
*<\/div>\n
Loftus Atheist Error #8: Ancient Jews, \u201cBody\u201d of God, & Polytheism\u00a0<\/a>[9-10-19]<\/div>\n
*<\/div>\n
Loftus Atheist Error #9: Bible Espouses Mythical Animals?<\/a>\u00a0[9-10-19]<\/div>\n
*<\/div>\n
Loftus Atheist Error #10: Prophet Jeremiah vs. Mosaic Law?\u00a0<\/a>[9-11-19]<\/div>\n
*<\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/div>\n

***<\/p>\n

Photo credit:<\/strong> Thomas Paine<\/span> [public domain \/ Wikimedia Commons<\/a>]<\/p>\n

***<\/p>\n<\/body><\/html>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

Even an unplugged clock is right twice a day. And it\u2019s relentlessly wrong, too, for all but two minutes in a 24-hour day. Atheist author and polemicist John W. Loftus cited G. K. Chesterton in his article, \u201cExcerpt From \u201cUnapologetic: Why Philosophy of Religion Must End\u201d (3-24-20): \u201cIf something is worth doing, it\u2019s worth doing […]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":2331,"featured_media":54117,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[124],"tags":[1045,4113,12847,12844,4109,647,1061,12853,4110,3503,12850,1046,4112,12841],"class_list":["post-54114","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-atheism-agnosticism","tag-deism","tag-deists","tag-elizabeth-cady-stanton","tag-falsely-claimed-atheists","tag-famous-atheists","tag-john-loftus","tag-john-w-loftus","tag-loftus","tag-mark-twain","tag-pantheism","tag-pantheists","tag-theism","tag-theists","tag-thomas-paine"],"yoast_head":"\nLoftus Lies #22: Paine, Stanton, & Twain Were NOT Atheists Loftus Lies #22: Paine, Stanton, & Twain Were NOT Atheists<\/title>\n<meta name=\"description\" content=\"Even an unplugged clock is right twice a day. 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Unsolicited correspondence has indicated many hundreds of conversions (or returns) to the Catholic faith as a result, by God's grace, of these writings. Dave's conversion story was published in the bestselling book \\\"Surprised by Truth\\\" (edited by Patrick Madrid; San Diego: Basilica Press, 1994). Sophia Institute Press has published six of his books: \\\"A Biblical Defense of Catholicism\\\" (Foreword by Fr. John A. Hardon, S. J., 1996 \/ 2003), \\\"The Catholic Verses\\\" (2004), \\\"The One-Minute Apologist\\\" (2007), \\\"Bible Proofs for Catholic Truths\\\" (2009), \\\"The Quotable Newman\\\" (editor: 2012), and \\\"Proving the Catholic Faith is Biblical\\\" (2015). He is co-author (with Dr. Paul Thigpen) of the inserts for \\\"The New Catholic Answer Bible\\\" (Our Sunday Visitor: 2005), and editor for \\\"The Wisdom of Mr. Chesterton: The Very Best Quotes, Quips, and Cracks from the Pen of G. K. 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Dwight Longenecker, Brandon Vogt, Marcellino D'Ambrosio, and Fr. John A. Hardon, S. J. Dave has been happily married to his wife Judy since October 1984. They have three sons and a daughter, and reside in southeast Michigan (metro Detroit).\",\"sameAs\":[\"https:\/\/biblicalcatholicism.com\/\",\"https:\/\/www.facebook.com\/dave.armstrong.798\",\"https:\/\/www.youtube.com\/@LuxVeritatisApologetics\"],\"url\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/author\/davearmstrong\"}]}<\/script>\n<!-- \/ Yoast SEO plugin. -->","yoast_head_json":{"title":"Loftus Lies #22: Paine, Stanton, & Twain Were NOT Atheists Loftus Lies #22: Paine, Stanton, & Twain Were NOT Atheists","description":"Even an unplugged clock is right twice a day. And it's relentlessly wrong, too, for all but two minutes in a 24-hour day. 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Atheist author and polemicist Atheist polemicist John Loftus named eight \"famous American atheist authors\" including Elizabeth Cady Stanton, Thomas Paine, and Mark Twain: none of whom were actually atheists.","og_url":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/2021\/01\/loftus-lies-22-paine-stanton-twain-were-not-atheists.html","og_site_name":"Biblical Evidence for Catholicism","article_author":"https:\/\/www.facebook.com\/dave.armstrong.798","article_published_time":"2021-01-18T17:13:47+00:00","og_image":[{"width":381,"height":452,"url":"https:\/\/wp-media.patheos.com\/blogs\/sites\/572\/2021\/01\/PaineThomas.jpg","type":"image\/jpeg"}],"author":"Dave Armstrong","twitter_card":"summary_large_image","twitter_misc":{"Written by":"Dave Armstrong","Est. reading time":"6 minutes"},"schema":{"@context":"https:\/\/schema.org","@graph":[{"@type":"WebPage","@id":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/2021\/01\/loftus-lies-22-paine-stanton-twain-were-not-atheists.html","url":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/2021\/01\/loftus-lies-22-paine-stanton-twain-were-not-atheists.html","name":"Loftus Lies #22: Paine, Stanton, & Twain Were NOT Atheists Loftus Lies #22: Paine, Stanton, & Twain Were NOT Atheists","isPartOf":{"@id":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/#website"},"datePublished":"2021-01-18T17:13:47+00:00","dateModified":"2021-01-18T17:13:47+00:00","author":{"@id":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/#\/schema\/person\/471eaa20e441eca4bb1ea50393cf632e"},"description":"Even an unplugged clock is right twice a day. And it's relentlessly wrong, too, for all but two minutes in a 24-hour day. Atheist author and polemicist Atheist polemicist John Loftus named eight \"famous American atheist authors\" including Elizabeth Cady Stanton, Thomas Paine, and Mark Twain: none of whom were actually atheists.","breadcrumb":{"@id":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/2021\/01\/loftus-lies-22-paine-stanton-twain-were-not-atheists.html#breadcrumb"},"inLanguage":"en-US","potentialAction":[{"@type":"ReadAction","target":["https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/2021\/01\/loftus-lies-22-paine-stanton-twain-were-not-atheists.html"]}]},{"@type":"BreadcrumbList","@id":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/2021\/01\/loftus-lies-22-paine-stanton-twain-were-not-atheists.html#breadcrumb","itemListElement":[{"@type":"ListItem","position":1,"name":"Home","item":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong"},{"@type":"ListItem","position":2,"name":"Loftus Lies #22: Paine, Stanton, & Twain Were NOT Atheists"}]},{"@type":"WebSite","@id":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/#website","url":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/","name":"Biblical Evidence for Catholicism","description":"Catholic biblical apologetics","potentialAction":[{"@type":"SearchAction","target":{"@type":"EntryPoint","urlTemplate":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/?s={search_term_string}"},"query-input":"required name=search_term_string"}],"inLanguage":"en-US"},{"@type":"Person","@id":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/#\/schema\/person\/471eaa20e441eca4bb1ea50393cf632e","name":"Dave Armstrong","image":{"@type":"ImageObject","inLanguage":"en-US","@id":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/#\/schema\/person\/image\/","url":"https:\/\/secure.gravatar.com\/avatar\/820e6db89734ae7a9e5dac8d498f5ac7?s=96&d=mm&r=g","contentUrl":"https:\/\/secure.gravatar.com\/avatar\/820e6db89734ae7a9e5dac8d498f5ac7?s=96&d=mm&r=g","caption":"Dave Armstrong"},"description":"Dave Armstrong is a Catholic author and apologist, who has been actively proclaiming and defending Christianity since 1981, and Catholicism in particular since 1991 (full-time since December 2001). Formerly a campus missionary, as a Protestant, Dave was received into the Catholic Church in February 1991, by the late, well-known catechist and theologian, Fr. John A. Hardon, S. J. Dave\u2019s articles have appeared in many influential Catholic periodicals, including \"This Rock\" (now called \"Catholic Answers Magazine\"), \"Envoy Magazine\" (Patrick Madrid), \"The Catholic Answer,\" \"The Coming Home Journal,\" \"Gilbert Magazine\" (American Chesterton Society), and \"The Latin Mass.\" He also writes a featured column for every issue of \"The Michigan Catholic\": published by the archdiocese of Detroit, and was editor for most of the apologetics tracts published by the St. Paul Street Evangelization apostolate. Dave\u2019s apologetics and writing apostolate was the subject of a feature article in the May 2002 issue of \"Envoy Magazine.\" He served as the staff moderator at the Internet discussion forum for The Coming Home Network, from 2007-2010. Dave has been interviewed on many nationally syndicated Catholic radio shows, including \"Catholic Answers Live\" (twice), \"Faith and Family Live\" (Steve Wood), \"Kresta in the Afternoon,\" \"Son Rise Morning Show,\" \"Catholic Connection\" (Teresa Tomeo), and \"The Catholics Next Door.\" His large and popular website, \"Biblical Evidence for Catholicism,\" was online from March 1997 to March 2007, and received the 1998 Catholic Website of the Year award from \"Envoy Magazine.\" His blog of the same name (now transferred to Patheos), begun in February 2004, contains more than 1,500 papers, at least 500 debates or dialogues, and over 50 distinct \"index\" web pages. Unsolicited correspondence has indicated many hundreds of conversions (or returns) to the Catholic faith as a result, by God's grace, of these writings. Dave's conversion story was published in the bestselling book \"Surprised by Truth\" (edited by Patrick Madrid; San Diego: Basilica Press, 1994). Sophia Institute Press has published six of his books: \"A Biblical Defense of Catholicism\" (Foreword by Fr. John A. Hardon, S. J., 1996 \/ 2003), \"The Catholic Verses\" (2004), \"The One-Minute Apologist\" (2007), \"Bible Proofs for Catholic Truths\" (2009), \"The Quotable Newman\" (editor: 2012), and \"Proving the Catholic Faith is Biblical\" (2015). He is co-author (with Dr. Paul Thigpen) of the inserts for \"The New Catholic Answer Bible\" (Our Sunday Visitor: 2005), and editor for \"The Wisdom of Mr. Chesterton: The Very Best Quotes, Quips, and Cracks from the Pen of G. K. Chesterton\" (Saint Benedict Press \/ TAN Books: 2009). \"100 Biblical Arguments Against Sola Scriptura\" was published by Catholic Answers in May 2012. His \"Quotable Wesley\" compilation was published by (Protestant \/ Wesleyan publisher) Beacon Hill Press in April 2014. Several of his 49 books are bestsellers in their field. Dave maintains a popular personal Facebook page, a Facebook author page, and has a Twitter account as well. He offers almost all of his books in e-book form on his own Biblical Catholicism site (http:\/\/biblicalcatholicism.com\/), at a permanent deep discount: only $2.99 for ePub, mobi, and AZW, and $1.99 for PDF. His writing has been enthusiastically endorsed or recommended by many leading Catholic apologists, authors, and priests, including Dr. Scott Hahn, Fr. Peter M. J. Stravinskas, Marcus Grodi, Patrick Madrid, Steve Ray, Tim Staples, Devin Rose, Mike Aquilina, Al Kresta, Karl Keating, Fr. Dwight Longenecker, Brandon Vogt, Marcellino D'Ambrosio, and Fr. John A. Hardon, S. J. Dave has been happily married to his wife Judy since October 1984. They have three sons and a daughter, and reside in southeast Michigan (metro Detroit).","sameAs":["https:\/\/biblicalcatholicism.com\/","https:\/\/www.facebook.com\/dave.armstrong.798","https:\/\/www.youtube.com\/@LuxVeritatisApologetics"],"url":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/author\/davearmstrong"}]}},"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/54114","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/2331"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=54114"}],"version-history":[{"count":0,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/54114\/revisions"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/54117"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=54114"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=54114"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=54114"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}