{"id":54433,"date":"2021-01-28T15:14:14","date_gmt":"2021-01-28T19:14:14","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/?p=54433"},"modified":"2021-01-28T15:15:12","modified_gmt":"2021-01-28T19:15:12","slug":"should-catholic-women-teach-men-yes","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/2021\/01\/should-catholic-women-teach-men-yes.html","title":{"rendered":"Should Catholic Women Teach Men? YES!"},"content":{"rendered":"\n<\/head>

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From the Coming Home Network forum. Someone asked, initially:<\/span><\/div>\n
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An evangelical friend asked me what I thought of 1 Timothy 2:12 \u2018I permit no woman to teach or to have authority over a man.\u2019 So what to think? We have women at all kinds of staff positions, including various teaching roles in our parish and diocese. In my parish, all but one staff position is a woman (plus the priest makes two).<\/span><\/div>\n<\/blockquote>\n<\/div>\n
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For the roles and vocation of women, I would strongly recommend anyone reading Pope John Paul II\u2019s Apostolic Letter,<\/span> Mulieris Dignitatem<\/em><\/a> (On the Dignity and Vocation of Wome<\/em>n) from 15 August 1988.<\/span><\/div>\n<\/div>\n
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Some of the statements from St. Paul about women have an immediate cultural context, which means they aren\u2019t binding for all time (and the Church has obviously interpreted them as such). Women can\u2019t be priests, because Christ designated that as a male-only vocation, but they have many prominent roles in the Church. This is especially, obviously true in the case of saints like St. Teresa of Calcutta (Mother Teresa), St. Th\u00e9r\u00e8se of Lisieux, St. Teresa of Avila, St. Hildegard of Bingen, and St. Catherine of Siena (the last four being Doctors of the Church). The Blessed Virgin Mary is the very highest creature God ever made: far higher than any created man.<\/span><\/div>\n
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So I think\u00a0 women teachers at a parish (not to mention lector or acolyte) is no sweat for God. Women do most of the lay work on a parish level because men are too selfish and lazy to do it.<\/span><\/div>\n
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The magisterium is all men (popes, bishops, and both in council), but that doesn\u2019t exhaust the teaching capacity in the Church at all. It only exhausts the \u201cofficial\u201d or \u201cdogmatic\u201d teaching capacity. We still have female nuns, teachers, DRI\u2019s, Bible study leaders, prayer group leaders, professors of theology, apologists and catechists, authors, administrative positions, etc., let alone saints and doctors of the Church. How could a Doctor of the Church not teach a man???!!!\u00a0<\/span><\/div>\n
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Not to mention what we dense men who are married learn from our wives practically every day . . .\u00a0<\/span><\/div>\n
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A woman on the Coming Home board asked:<\/span><\/div>\n<\/div>\n
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At the same time, as someone said, I would not have the ability to supersede whatever the real teachers, a member of the priesthood (all male) say in matters of doctrine (a fancy word for teaching). Nor would I want to.<\/span><\/div>\n<\/blockquote>\n<\/div>\n
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If your priest or bishop spoke that which was clearly, undeniably heresy and contrary to the teaching of the Church, you would have as much right as any man to rebuke them, according to Church teaching. You not only can do that, but should (and should want to). Now, be sure to have everything you are contending documented to a tee, and let it be an extremely rare occurrence, and show the utmost respect and deference to the offices and persons involved, but rest assured that you or any layperson can do this.<\/span><\/div>\n
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St. Catherine of Siena was known to give popes an earful. St. Joan of Arc called a spade a spade, too, didn\u2019t she?, which is why she is so universally admired, even by non-Catholic skeptics like Mark Twain and George Bernard Shaw.<\/span><\/div>\n<\/div>\n
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Of course you can\u2019t change what is truly Catholic dogma, but no man can, either, so that is a moot point in this discussion of \u201cwomen as teachers.\u201d All laypeople, male or female, are in the same submission to official, dogmatic Church teaching.<\/span><\/div>\n<\/div>\n
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The same woman wondered what it \u201cmeans in terms of man and woman being created in the image of God. What is my place in all this, as a woman?\u201d I replied:<\/span><\/div>\n<\/div>\n
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You\u2019re created in the image of God, just as a man is. I think it is interesting that God has revealed Himself \u201canthropopathically\u201d in feminine, motherly terms also:<\/span><\/div>\n<\/div>\n
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Isaiah 42:13-14<\/strong> (RSV) The LORD goes forth like a mighty man, like a man of war he stirs up his fury; he cries out, he shouts aloud, he shows himself mighty against his foes. For a long time I have held my peace, I have kept still and restrained myself; now I will cry out like a woman in travail, I will gasp and pant.<\/span><\/div>\n<\/blockquote>\n<\/div>\n
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Isaiah 46:3-4<\/strong> \u201cHearken to me, O house of Jacob, all the remnant of the house of Israel, who have been borne by me from your birth, carried from the womb; even to your old age I am He, and to gray hairs I will carry you. I have made, and I will bear; I will carry and will save. (cf. Jer 3:19-20; 2 Cor 6:18)<\/span><\/div>\n<\/div>\n
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Isaiah 49:14-15<\/strong> But Zion said, \u201cThe LORD has forsaken me, my Lord has forgotten me.\u201d \u201cCan a woman forget her sucking child, that she should have no compassion on the son of her womb? Even these may forget, yet I will not forget you. (cf. Matthew 23:37-38)<\/span><\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/blockquote>\n
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Isaiah 66:13<\/strong> As one whom his mother comforts, so I will comfort you; you shall be comforted in Jerusalem. (cf. Ps 131:2-3)<\/span><\/div>\n<\/blockquote>\n<\/div>\n
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Technically, God (the Father) is neither male nor female, being a spirit. He has both aspects in His nature, which is why we both are made in His image and reflect Him. Even psychologists and those who talk about the four temperaments will say that a balanced person has both feminine and masculine characteristics in the right proportion, depending on their gender.<\/span><\/div>\n
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Women tend to excel in certain characteristics and men do in others. But we both have to have some of what the opposite gender \u201cspecializes\u201d in to be balanced, rounded human beings.<\/span><\/div>\n
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That\u2019s extremely evident in Jesus Himself. He could coddle children, weep over Lazarus\u2019 death (even though He knew He was gonna raise Him shortly after), and express the utmost tenderness, and also furiously overturn the moneychangers\u2019 tables and denounce the Pharisees in quite \u201cmasculine\u201d fashion, and speak truth to power.<\/span><\/div>\n
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I sure hope that I am nurturing and compassionate when my child comes to me, emotionally or physically hurt (in fact, my wife Judy always claims I am more of that sort than she is, which is quite debatable, but it\u2019s true that I\u2019m a much more \u201chuggy\u201d type). Yet we see that as a \u201cfeminine\u201d characteristic. And I would hope my wife disciplines our children when they do something wrong, when I am not around (which we categorize as more of the father\u2019s role: she does do so).<\/span><\/div>\n
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Even the \u201cGod the Father\u201d terminology is anthropopathic, in part, I believe (though these are very deep waters and I am not qualified to go down that road). In His relation to us He reveals Himself as a Father; also God the Father in relation to the Son. But God also possesses what we regard as typically \u201cfeminine\u201d characteristics.<\/span><\/div>\n
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Bottom line: no women priests, by the design of our Lord, but plenty of teaching opportunities for women in the Catholic Church, and the very highest, most exalted, venerated place for any creature is reserved for a woman: the Blessed Virgin Mary. The female saints (including four Doctors of the Church) have much to teach any man. If that is \u201canti-woman\u201d just because we agree with Jesus that the priesthood is confined to men, then I confess I am out to sea as to the \u201creasoning\u201d processes involved.<\/span><\/div>\n
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(originally posted on 1-16-09)<\/span><\/p>\n

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Photo credit:<\/strong> <\/span>St. Th\u00e9r\u00e8se of Lisieux (1873-1897): Doctor of the Church.<\/span> [public domain]<\/p>\n

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***<\/p>\n<\/body><\/html>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

From the Coming Home Network forum. Someone asked, initially: An evangelical friend asked me what I thought of 1 Timothy 2:12 \u2018I permit no woman to teach or to have authority over a man.\u2019 So what to think? We have women at all kinds of staff positions, including various teaching roles in our parish and […]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":2331,"featured_media":54436,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[131,123],"tags":[1003,1976,809,12925,919,1813,163,931,920,2585,1927,597,2586,2463,12919,12922,596,918,592,2584,922,930],"class_list":["post-54433","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-church-ecclesiology","category-sexuality-and-gender-issues","tag-alter-christus","tag-apostles","tag-bishops","tag-catholic-women","tag-chauvinism","tag-church-hierarchy","tag-ecclesiology","tag-female-priests","tag-feminism","tag-gender","tag-gender-roles","tag-holy-orders","tag-men-and-women","tag-misogyny","tag-mulieris-dignitatem","tag-on-the-dignity-and-vocation-of-women","tag-ordination","tag-patriarchy","tag-priests","tag-sexism","tag-unisexism","tag-women-priests"],"yoast_head":"\nShould Catholic Women Teach Men? 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Unsolicited correspondence has indicated many hundreds of conversions (or returns) to the Catholic faith as a result, by God's grace, of these writings. Dave's conversion story was published in the bestselling book \\\"Surprised by Truth\\\" (edited by Patrick Madrid; San Diego: Basilica Press, 1994). Sophia Institute Press has published six of his books: \\\"A Biblical Defense of Catholicism\\\" (Foreword by Fr. John A. Hardon, S. J., 1996 \/ 2003), \\\"The Catholic Verses\\\" (2004), \\\"The One-Minute Apologist\\\" (2007), \\\"Bible Proofs for Catholic Truths\\\" (2009), \\\"The Quotable Newman\\\" (editor: 2012), and \\\"Proving the Catholic Faith is Biblical\\\" (2015). He is co-author (with Dr. Paul Thigpen) of the inserts for \\\"The New Catholic Answer Bible\\\" (Our Sunday Visitor: 2005), and editor for \\\"The Wisdom of Mr. Chesterton: The Very Best Quotes, Quips, and Cracks from the Pen of G. K. Chesterton\\\" (Saint Benedict Press \/ TAN Books: 2009). \\\"100 Biblical Arguments Against Sola Scriptura\\\" was published by Catholic Answers in May 2012. His \\\"Quotable Wesley\\\" compilation was published by (Protestant \/ Wesleyan publisher) Beacon Hill Press in April 2014. Several of his 49 books are bestsellers in their field. Dave maintains a popular personal Facebook page, a Facebook author page, and has a Twitter account as well. He offers almost all of his books in e-book form on his own Biblical Catholicism site (http:\/\/biblicalcatholicism.com\/), at a permanent deep discount: only $2.99 for ePub, mobi, and AZW, and $1.99 for PDF. His writing has been enthusiastically endorsed or recommended by many leading Catholic apologists, authors, and priests, including Dr. Scott Hahn, Fr. Peter M. J. Stravinskas, Marcus Grodi, Patrick Madrid, Steve Ray, Tim Staples, Devin Rose, Mike Aquilina, Al Kresta, Karl Keating, Fr. Dwight Longenecker, Brandon Vogt, Marcellino D'Ambrosio, and Fr. John A. Hardon, S. J. Dave has been happily married to his wife Judy since October 1984. They have three sons and a daughter, and reside in southeast Michigan (metro Detroit).\",\"sameAs\":[\"https:\/\/biblicalcatholicism.com\/\",\"https:\/\/www.facebook.com\/dave.armstrong.798\",\"https:\/\/www.youtube.com\/@LuxVeritatisApologetics\"],\"url\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/author\/davearmstrong\"}]}<\/script>\n<!-- \/ Yoast SEO plugin. -->","yoast_head_json":{"title":"Should Catholic Women Teach Men? YES! Should Catholic Women Teach Men? YES!","description":"From the Coming Home Network forum. Someone asked, initially: An evangelical friend asked me what I thought of 1 Timothy 2:12 'I permit no woman to teach Catholic women are indispensable, and of course they teach men. 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Formerly a campus missionary, as a Protestant, Dave was received into the Catholic Church in February 1991, by the late, well-known catechist and theologian, Fr. John A. Hardon, S. J. Dave\u2019s articles have appeared in many influential Catholic periodicals, including \"This Rock\" (now called \"Catholic Answers Magazine\"), \"Envoy Magazine\" (Patrick Madrid), \"The Catholic Answer,\" \"The Coming Home Journal,\" \"Gilbert Magazine\" (American Chesterton Society), and \"The Latin Mass.\" He also writes a featured column for every issue of \"The Michigan Catholic\": published by the archdiocese of Detroit, and was editor for most of the apologetics tracts published by the St. Paul Street Evangelization apostolate. Dave\u2019s apologetics and writing apostolate was the subject of a feature article in the May 2002 issue of \"Envoy Magazine.\" He served as the staff moderator at the Internet discussion forum for The Coming Home Network, from 2007-2010. Dave has been interviewed on many nationally syndicated Catholic radio shows, including \"Catholic Answers Live\" (twice), \"Faith and Family Live\" (Steve Wood), \"Kresta in the Afternoon,\" \"Son Rise Morning Show,\" \"Catholic Connection\" (Teresa Tomeo), and \"The Catholics Next Door.\" His large and popular website, \"Biblical Evidence for Catholicism,\" was online from March 1997 to March 2007, and received the 1998 Catholic Website of the Year award from \"Envoy Magazine.\" His blog of the same name (now transferred to Patheos), begun in February 2004, contains more than 1,500 papers, at least 500 debates or dialogues, and over 50 distinct \"index\" web pages. Unsolicited correspondence has indicated many hundreds of conversions (or returns) to the Catholic faith as a result, by God's grace, of these writings. Dave's conversion story was published in the bestselling book \"Surprised by Truth\" (edited by Patrick Madrid; San Diego: Basilica Press, 1994). Sophia Institute Press has published six of his books: \"A Biblical Defense of Catholicism\" (Foreword by Fr. John A. Hardon, S. J., 1996 \/ 2003), \"The Catholic Verses\" (2004), \"The One-Minute Apologist\" (2007), \"Bible Proofs for Catholic Truths\" (2009), \"The Quotable Newman\" (editor: 2012), and \"Proving the Catholic Faith is Biblical\" (2015). He is co-author (with Dr. Paul Thigpen) of the inserts for \"The New Catholic Answer Bible\" (Our Sunday Visitor: 2005), and editor for \"The Wisdom of Mr. Chesterton: The Very Best Quotes, Quips, and Cracks from the Pen of G. K. Chesterton\" (Saint Benedict Press \/ TAN Books: 2009). \"100 Biblical Arguments Against Sola Scriptura\" was published by Catholic Answers in May 2012. His \"Quotable Wesley\" compilation was published by (Protestant \/ Wesleyan publisher) Beacon Hill Press in April 2014. Several of his 49 books are bestsellers in their field. Dave maintains a popular personal Facebook page, a Facebook author page, and has a Twitter account as well. He offers almost all of his books in e-book form on his own Biblical Catholicism site (http:\/\/biblicalcatholicism.com\/), at a permanent deep discount: only $2.99 for ePub, mobi, and AZW, and $1.99 for PDF. His writing has been enthusiastically endorsed or recommended by many leading Catholic apologists, authors, and priests, including Dr. Scott Hahn, Fr. Peter M. J. Stravinskas, Marcus Grodi, Patrick Madrid, Steve Ray, Tim Staples, Devin Rose, Mike Aquilina, Al Kresta, Karl Keating, Fr. Dwight Longenecker, Brandon Vogt, Marcellino D'Ambrosio, and Fr. John A. Hardon, S. J. Dave has been happily married to his wife Judy since October 1984. They have three sons and a daughter, and reside in southeast Michigan (metro Detroit).","sameAs":["https:\/\/biblicalcatholicism.com\/","https:\/\/www.facebook.com\/dave.armstrong.798","https:\/\/www.youtube.com\/@LuxVeritatisApologetics"],"url":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/author\/davearmstrong"}]}},"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/54433","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/2331"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=54433"}],"version-history":[{"count":0,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/54433\/revisions"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/54436"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=54433"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=54433"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=54433"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}