{"id":75825,"date":"2024-08-14T06:00:57","date_gmt":"2024-08-14T10:00:57","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/geneveith\/?p=75825"},"modified":"2024-08-14T06:48:49","modified_gmt":"2024-08-14T10:48:49","slug":"who-proceeds-from-the-father-and-the-son-2","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/geneveith\/2024\/08\/who-proceeds-from-the-father-and-the-son-2\/","title":{"rendered":"“Who Proceeds from the Father and the Son”"},"content":{"rendered":"\n<\/head>

\"\"<\/a><\/p>\n

When we confess the Nicene Creed<\/a>, we say, \u201cI\u2029believe\u2029in\u2029the\u2029Holy\u2029Spirit,\u2029the\u2029Lord\u2029and\u2029giver\u2029of\u2029life,\u2029who\u2029proceeds\u2029from\u2029the\u2029Father\u2029and\u2029 the\u2029Son.\u201d\u00a0 Eastern Orthodox churches, though, say that the Holy Spirit just \u201cproceeds from the Father.\u201d<\/p>\n

That difference\u2013known as the filioque<\/em>, the Latin for \u201cand the Son\u201d\u2013 was one of the main reasons for the Great Schism of 1054<\/a>, in which Roman Catholicism and Eastern Orthodoxy split off from each other.<\/p>\n

\n

Now the Lutheran World Federation, the global organization consisting largely of liberal and state churches\u2013has issued a joint statement with representatives of Eastern Orthodoxy calling on churches to drop the filioque<\/em> from the Nicene Creed<\/a>.\u00a0 Instead, according to the LWF, Lutherans should just say that the Holy Spirit \u201cproceeds from the Father.\u201d<\/p>\n

Now this might seem a small issue to split the universal church over.\u00a0 And the LWF, of which most confessional Lutherans are not members, has become so ecumenical that its agreement with the Orthodox might not seem all that significant.<\/p>\n

But what is at stake with the filioque<\/em> is not so much the nature of the Holy Spirit but the nature of church authority:\u00a0 Is it church councils?\u00a0 The pope?\u00a0 Or the Bible?<\/p>\n

I would say that the Orthodox had good reason to split with Rome over the issue.\u00a0 And yet, there is good reason to retain the filioque<\/em>.<\/p>\n

The original text of the Nicene Creed<\/a>, as worked out in the Councils of Nicaea (325 A.D.) and Constantinople (381 A.D.), did not<\/em> contain the filioque<\/em>.\u00a0 In the West, though, beginning in the 8th century, \u201cand the Son\u201d was sometimes informally added.\u00a0 But in 1014, Pope Benedict VIII officially added the filioque<\/em> to the creed.<\/p>\n

But the original text had been approved by ecumenical<\/em> councils<\/a>.\u00a0 That is, councils attended by representatives of the entire universal church, both west and east.\u00a0 The eastern churches consider ecumenical councils to be authoritative.\u00a0 (Later, Rome would call councils of its own, such as the Council of Trent and Vatican II, which invited the participation only of Catholic bishops, excluding both the Orthodox and Protestants.)<\/p>\n

Now the Pope presumed to add the filioque<\/em><\/a>, without so much as consulting the Eastern churches.\u00a0 This was an assertion of papal authority over<\/em> that of Ecumenical Councils!\u00a0 It was also an assertion of Rome\u2019s authority over the Eastern churches.\u00a0 No wonder the Eastern churches could not abide the filioque<\/em>.\u00a0 They deny that they split the church.\u00a0 The pope did when, of his own volition, he added to the creed.<\/p>\n

To be sure, there are other aspects to the controversy<\/a>, with some theologians arguing that different understandings of the Trinity are at stake.\u00a0 That discussion, though, seems to have arisen mostly after the schism, with both sides giving theological reasons for their version of the creed.<\/p>\n

So shouldn\u2019t Protestants, particularly Lutherans, who, like the Orthodox, reject the authority of the Pope, reject his addition of the filioque<\/em>?<\/p>\n

Well, for Protestants, particularly Lutherans, the authority is neither the Pope (as it is for Roman Catholics) nor Ecumenical Councils (as it is for the Orthodox), but the Word of God.\u00a0 So for us, the question is what does the Bible say about the source of the Holy Spirit?<\/p>\n

Consider:<\/p>\n

And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Helper,\u00a0to be with you forever, (John 14:22)<\/span><\/span><\/p><\/blockquote>\n

The Father will send the Spirit because the Son asks Him to.<\/p>\n

\u201cBut when the Helper comes, whom I will send to you from the Father, the Spirit of truth, who proceeds from the Father, he will bear witness about me.\u00a0 (John 15:26)<\/p><\/blockquote>\n

Here the Son will send the Spirit, who \u201cproceeds\u201d from the Father.<\/p>\n

All of this is to say, the Holy Spirit \u201cproceeds\u2029from\u2029the\u2029Father\u2029and\u2029 the\u2029Son.\u201d\u00a0 (Other Biblical texts that apply to the filioque<\/em> controversy are John 16:7, John 20:22, Romans 8:9, Galatians 4:6, Philippians 1:19, and Revelation 22:1.)<\/p>\n

The original text of the Nicene Creed without the filioque<\/em>, as used by the Orthodox, isn\u2019t wrong.\u00a0 The Holy Spirit does proceed from the Father.\u00a0 \u00a0The Orthodox aren\u2019t being unorthodox when they say their version of the creed.\u00a0 But including the filioque<\/em> isn\u2019t unorthodox either.\u00a0 The Holy Spirit does proceed from the Son.<\/p>\n

When reciting the Creed and we say \u201cand the Son,\u201d we are confessing not only the Trinity, but also that both creeds and councils are subordinate to the Word of God.<\/p>\n

\u00a0<\/p>\n

HT:\u00a0 Steve Bauer, who also points to Jordan Cooper\u2019s video An Explanation and Defense of the Filioque (Intro to Trinitarian Theology) (youtube.com).<\/a><\/p>\n

\u00a0<\/p>\n

Illustration: The Holy Spirit coming from both the Father and the Son,<\/a> detail of the Boulbon Altarpiece, c.\u20091450. Originally from the high altar of the Chapelle Saint-Marcellin, Boulbon, France, now in the\u00a0Louvre, Paris.\u00a0 By anonymous \u2013 Paterm (2008-12-07), Public Domain, https:\/\/commons.wikimedia.org\/w\/index.php?curid=5781897<\/em><\/div>\n
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When we confess the Nicene Creed, we say that the Holy Spirit, “proceeds\u2029from\u2029the\u2029Father\u2029and\u2029 the\u2029Son.”\u00a0 But Eastern Orthodox churches say that the Holy Spirit just “proceeds from the Father.” That difference–known as the filioque, the Latin for “and the Son”– led to the split between Roman Catholicism and Eastern Orthodoxy. Now the Lutheran World Federation wants to drop the filioque. What this means.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":1281,"featured_media":75930,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"closed","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[8,10,11,20,47],"tags":[11859,15057,15060,2877,9970,1582],"class_list":["post-75825","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-bible","category-christ","category-church","category-history","category-theology","tag-eastern-orthodoxy","tag-filioque","tag-great-schism-of-1054","tag-lutheran-world-federation","tag-lutherans-and-orthodox","tag-nicene-creed"],"yoast_head":"\n"Who Proceeds from the Father and the Son"<\/title>\n<meta name=\"description\" content=\"When we confess the Nicene Creed, we say that the Holy Spirit, "proceeds\u2029from\u2029the\u2029Father\u2029and\u2029 the\u2029Son."\u00a0 But Eastern Orthodox churches say that the Holy Spirit just "proceeds from the Father." 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