{"id":4787,"date":"2014-11-25T08:26:49","date_gmt":"2014-11-25T14:26:49","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/?p=4787"},"modified":"2015-08-14T03:50:30","modified_gmt":"2015-08-14T08:50:30","slug":"are-traditional-views-of-deity-actually-deistic","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/2014\/11\/25\/are-traditional-views-of-deity-actually-deistic\/","title":{"rendered":"Are traditional views of \u201cdeity\u201d actually deistic?"},"content":{"rendered":"\n<\/head>

In this series<\/a>, we\u2019ve considered the fact that ancient Jews thought of monotheism in terms of \u201cdivine identity,\u201d<\/a> here\u2019s a question worth mulling over.<\/p>\n

Might traditional theological perspectives of God be implicitly deistic? $\"Heathens.$ <\/a><\/em><\/p>\n

Let\u2019s not forget that deism argues that God started the world but has since left it to run on its own. God does not involve himself in human affairs.Why would I ask the question?<\/p>\n

When we think of deity has mainly to do with \u201cwhat\u201d God is, we might also too sharply separate the physical world and God\u2019s realm. However, Rev 21\u201322 and Isa 65\u201365 are strong reminders that our ultimate hope is for the union of earth and heaven, i.e. God\u2019s throne room (cf. Ps 11:4; Isa 66:1).<\/p>\n

Many traditional apologetics and theologies create this sort of perspective when they dichotomize the \u201cmaterial\u201d world and \u201cspiritual\u201d things. Similarly, when we say the Bible represents human nature and divine nature as different \u201csubstances,\u201d we create our own apologetic problems and Christ\u2019s nature becomes an apparent logical contradiction.<\/p>\n

God enters our world!<\/strong><\/span><\/h1>\nBy contrast, what happens when we see deity in terms of \u201cdivine identity\u201d (my second post in the series<\/a>)? Our exegetical problems go away and we stumble on to fresh insights.<\/p>\n
For example, Richard Bauckham<\/a> directs our attention to Phil 2:8\u201311<\/p>\n
^{8 <\/sup><\/strong>And being found in human form, he humbled himself by becoming obedient to the point of death, even death on a cross. ^{9\u00a0<\/sup>Therefore<\/em><\/strong> God has highly exalted him and bestowed on him the name that is above every name, ^{10\u00a0<\/sup><\/strong>so that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, in heaven and on earth and under the earth, ^{11\u00a0<\/sup><\/strong>and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n}}}}
It is precisely because<\/strong> of Christ\u2019s humility as a human that he receives the praise due only to the one true God. Notice the \u201ctherefore\u201d in the sequence of thought.<\/p>\n
Recall that one distinctive of the \u201cdivine identity\u201d is that God engages in the things of our world!<\/p>\n
We need to heed this warning: Traditional Christian assumptions about \u201cdeity\u201d (being primarily about substance) may subtly oppose the Bible\u2019s view of God.<\/p>\n
I have a few questions for you.<\/p>\n
Even if, philosophically speaking, there is a \u201cmaterial\u201d difference between deity and non-deity, is it worth sacrificing the biblical emphasis on God\u2019s divine identity?<\/p>\n
What do you think?<\/p>\n
Do we create our own apologetic problems?<\/p>\n
\n
Photo Credit: Creative Commons 2.0\/en.wikipedia<\/span><\/p>\n<\/body><\/html>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"
In this series, we\u2019ve considered the fact that ancient Jews thought of monotheism in terms of \u201cdivine identity,\u201d here\u2019s a question worth mulling over. Might traditional theological perspectives of God be implicitly deistic? Let\u2019s not forget that deism argues that God started the world but has since left it to run on its own. God […]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":2368,"featured_media":6581,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[16],"tags":[173],"class_list":["post-4787","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-theology","tag-monotheism"],"yoast_head":"\nAre traditional views of \u201cdeity\u201d actually deistic?<\/title>\n<meta name=\"description\" content=\"In this series, we've considered the fact that ancient Jews thought of monotheism in terms of \u201cdivine identity,\u201d here\u2019s a question worth mulling over.\" \/>\n<meta name=\"robots\" content=\"index, follow, max-snippet:-1, max-image-preview:large, max-video-preview:-1\" \/>\n<link rel=\"canonical\" href=\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/2014\/11\/25\/are-traditional-views-of-deity-actually-deistic\/\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:locale\" content=\"en_US\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:type\" content=\"article\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:title\" content=\"Are traditional views of \u201cdeity\u201d actually deistic?\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:description\" content=\"In this series, we've considered the fact that ancient Jews thought of monotheism in terms of \u201cdivine identity,\u201d here\u2019s a question worth mulling over.\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:url\" content=\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/2014\/11\/25\/are-traditional-views-of-deity-actually-deistic\/\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:site_name\" content=\"Saving God\u2019s Face\" \/>\n<meta property=\"article:author\" content=\"https:\/\/www.facebook.com\/savinggodsface\" \/>\n<meta property=\"article:published_time\" content=\"2014-11-25T14:26:49+00:00\" \/>\n<meta property=\"article:modified_time\" content=\"2015-08-14T08:50:30+00:00\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:image\" content=\"https:\/\/wp-media.patheos.com\/blogs\/sites\/576\/2014\/11\/Slavic_neopaganism.jpg\" \/>\n\t<meta property=\"og:image:width\" content=\"500\" \/>\n\t<meta property=\"og:image:height\" content=\"335\" \/>\n\t<meta property=\"og:image:type\" content=\"image\/jpeg\" \/>\n<meta name=\"author\" content=\"Brad Vaughn\" \/>\n<meta name=\"twitter:card\" content=\"summary_large_image\" \/>\n<meta name=\"twitter:creator\" content=\"@savinggodsface\" \/>\n<meta name=\"twitter:label1\" content=\"Written by\" \/>\n\t<meta name=\"twitter:data1\" content=\"Brad Vaughn\" \/>\n\t<meta name=\"twitter:label2\" content=\"Est. reading time\" \/>\n\t<meta name=\"twitter:data2\" content=\"2 minutes\" \/>\n<script type=\"application\/ld+json\" class=\"yoast-schema-graph\">{\"@context\":\"https:\/\/schema.org\",\"@graph\":[{\"@type\":\"WebPage\",\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/2014\/11\/25\/are-traditional-views-of-deity-actually-deistic\/\",\"url\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/2014\/11\/25\/are-traditional-views-of-deity-actually-deistic\/\",\"name\":\"Are traditional views of \u201cdeity\u201d actually deistic?\",\"isPartOf\":{\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/#website\"},\"datePublished\":\"2014-11-25T14:26:49+00:00\",\"dateModified\":\"2015-08-14T08:50:30+00:00\",\"author\":{\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/#\/schema\/person\/c6033eb278ed95fcd5f10ce3ad21210c\"},\"description\":\"In this series, we've considered the fact that ancient Jews thought of monotheism in terms of \u201cdivine identity,\u201d here\u2019s a question worth mulling over.\",\"breadcrumb\":{\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/2014\/11\/25\/are-traditional-views-of-deity-actually-deistic\/#breadcrumb\"},\"inLanguage\":\"en-US\",\"potentialAction\":[{\"@type\":\"ReadAction\",\"target\":[\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/2014\/11\/25\/are-traditional-views-of-deity-actually-deistic\/\"]}]},{\"@type\":\"BreadcrumbList\",\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/2014\/11\/25\/are-traditional-views-of-deity-actually-deistic\/#breadcrumb\",\"itemListElement\":[{\"@type\":\"ListItem\",\"position\":1,\"name\":\"Home\",\"item\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/\"},{\"@type\":\"ListItem\",\"position\":2,\"name\":\"Are traditional views of \u201cdeity\u201d actually deistic?\"}]},{\"@type\":\"WebSite\",\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/#website\",\"url\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/\",\"name\":\"Saving God\u2019s Face\",\"description\":\"Doing Theology. Thinking Mission.\",\"potentialAction\":[{\"@type\":\"SearchAction\",\"target\":{\"@type\":\"EntryPoint\",\"urlTemplate\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/?s={search_term_string}\"},\"query-input\":\"required name=search_term_string\"}],\"inLanguage\":\"en-US\"},{\"@type\":\"Person\",\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/#\/schema\/person\/c6033eb278ed95fcd5f10ce3ad21210c\",\"name\":\"Brad Vaughn\",\"image\":{\"@type\":\"ImageObject\",\"inLanguage\":\"en-US\",\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/#\/schema\/person\/image\/\",\"url\":\"https:\/\/secure.gravatar.com\/avatar\/9bbbad5d972a1a8a5a150c7a99da188d?s=96&d=mm&r=g\",\"contentUrl\":\"https:\/\/secure.gravatar.com\/avatar\/9bbbad5d972a1a8a5a150c7a99da188d?s=96&d=mm&r=g\",\"caption\":\"Brad Vaughn\"},\"description\":\"Brad Vaughn (fka \u201cJackson Wu\u201d) currently teaches Humane Letters at the Arete Preparatory Academy in Arizona, having spent many years teaching at several colleges and universities. Originally from Texas, he spent 15 years in East Asia, where he helped found an accredited seminary for Chinese students. He has a B.S. in Applied Mathematics and an M.A. in Philosophy (both from Texas A&M), an M.Div (Gordon-Conwell), and a PhD in Theology from SEBTS. His research specializations include biblical contextualization, missiology, and the Bible\u2019s theology of honor and shame. In addition to various academic articles and essays, he has published 5 books, including Reading Romans with Eastern Eyes, The Cross in Context, Seeking God\u2019s Face, One Gospel for All Nations, and Saving God\u2019s Face. He enjoys reading, movies, exercising, sports, and playing games with his wife and 5 children.\",\"sameAs\":[\"https:\/\/savinggodsface.com\",\"https:\/\/www.facebook.com\/savinggodsface\",\"https:\/\/www.instagram.com\/savinggodsface\/\",\"https:\/\/www.linkedin.com\/in\/savinggodsface\/\",\"https:\/\/twitter.com\/savinggodsface\",\"https:\/\/www.youtube.com\/channel\/UCgSOQ-ezU4Knk2gBdEGRikg\"],\"url\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/author\/jackwu\/\"}]}<\/script>\n","yoast_head_json":{"title":"Are traditional views of \u201cdeity\u201d actually deistic?","description":"In this series, we've considered the fact that ancient Jews thought of monotheism in terms of \u201cdivine identity,\u201d here\u2019s a question worth mulling over.","robots":{"index":"index","follow":"follow","max-snippet":"max-snippet:-1","max-image-preview":"max-image-preview:large","max-video-preview":"max-video-preview:-1"},"canonical":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/2014\/11\/25\/are-traditional-views-of-deity-actually-deistic\/","og_locale":"en_US","og_type":"article","og_title":"Are traditional views of \u201cdeity\u201d actually deistic?","og_description":"In this series, we've considered the fact that ancient Jews thought of monotheism in terms of \u201cdivine identity,\u201d here\u2019s a question worth mulling over.","og_url":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/2014\/11\/25\/are-traditional-views-of-deity-actually-deistic\/","og_site_name":"Saving God\u2019s Face","article_author":"https:\/\/www.facebook.com\/savinggodsface","article_published_time":"2014-11-25T14:26:49+00:00","article_modified_time":"2015-08-14T08:50:30+00:00","og_image":[{"width":500,"height":335,"url":"https:\/\/wp-media.patheos.com\/blogs\/sites\/576\/2014\/11\/Slavic_neopaganism.jpg","type":"image\/jpeg"}],"author":"Brad Vaughn","twitter_card":"summary_large_image","twitter_creator":"@savinggodsface","twitter_misc":{"Written by":"Brad Vaughn","Est. reading time":"2 minutes"},"schema":{"@context":"https:\/\/schema.org","@graph":[{"@type":"WebPage","@id":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/2014\/11\/25\/are-traditional-views-of-deity-actually-deistic\/","url":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/2014\/11\/25\/are-traditional-views-of-deity-actually-deistic\/","name":"Are traditional views of \u201cdeity\u201d actually deistic?","isPartOf":{"@id":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/#website"},"datePublished":"2014-11-25T14:26:49+00:00","dateModified":"2015-08-14T08:50:30+00:00","author":{"@id":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/#\/schema\/person\/c6033eb278ed95fcd5f10ce3ad21210c"},"description":"In this series, we've considered the fact that ancient Jews thought of monotheism in terms of \u201cdivine identity,\u201d here\u2019s a question worth mulling over.","breadcrumb":{"@id":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/2014\/11\/25\/are-traditional-views-of-deity-actually-deistic\/#breadcrumb"},"inLanguage":"en-US","potentialAction":[{"@type":"ReadAction","target":["https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/2014\/11\/25\/are-traditional-views-of-deity-actually-deistic\/"]}]},{"@type":"BreadcrumbList","@id":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/2014\/11\/25\/are-traditional-views-of-deity-actually-deistic\/#breadcrumb","itemListElement":[{"@type":"ListItem","position":1,"name":"Home","item":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/"},{"@type":"ListItem","position":2,"name":"Are traditional views of \u201cdeity\u201d actually deistic?"}]},{"@type":"WebSite","@id":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/#website","url":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/","name":"Saving God\u2019s Face","description":"Doing Theology. Thinking Mission.","potentialAction":[{"@type":"SearchAction","target":{"@type":"EntryPoint","urlTemplate":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/?s={search_term_string}"},"query-input":"required name=search_term_string"}],"inLanguage":"en-US"},{"@type":"Person","@id":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/#\/schema\/person\/c6033eb278ed95fcd5f10ce3ad21210c","name":"Brad Vaughn","image":{"@type":"ImageObject","inLanguage":"en-US","@id":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/#\/schema\/person\/image\/","url":"https:\/\/secure.gravatar.com\/avatar\/9bbbad5d972a1a8a5a150c7a99da188d?s=96&d=mm&r=g","contentUrl":"https:\/\/secure.gravatar.com\/avatar\/9bbbad5d972a1a8a5a150c7a99da188d?s=96&d=mm&r=g","caption":"Brad Vaughn"},"description":"Brad Vaughn (fka \u201cJackson Wu\u201d) currently teaches Humane Letters at the Arete Preparatory Academy in Arizona, having spent many years teaching at several colleges and universities. Originally from Texas, he spent 15 years in East Asia, where he helped found an accredited seminary for Chinese students. He has a B.S. in Applied Mathematics and an M.A. in Philosophy (both from Texas A&M), an M.Div (Gordon-Conwell), and a PhD in Theology from SEBTS. His research specializations include biblical contextualization, missiology, and the Bible\u2019s theology of honor and shame. In addition to various academic articles and essays, he has published 5 books, including Reading Romans with Eastern Eyes, The Cross in Context, Seeking God\u2019s Face, One Gospel for All Nations, and Saving God\u2019s Face. He enjoys reading, movies, exercising, sports, and playing games with his wife and 5 children.","sameAs":["https:\/\/savinggodsface.com","https:\/\/www.facebook.com\/savinggodsface","https:\/\/www.instagram.com\/savinggodsface\/","https:\/\/www.linkedin.com\/in\/savinggodsface\/","https:\/\/twitter.com\/savinggodsface","https:\/\/www.youtube.com\/channel\/UCgSOQ-ezU4Knk2gBdEGRikg"],"url":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/author\/jackwu\/"}]}},"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/4787","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/2368"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=4787"}],"version-history":[{"count":0,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/4787\/revisions"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/6581"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=4787"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=4787"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jacksonwu\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=4787"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}