QUIJANO: All right. I\u2019d like to turn to our next segment now. And in this, I\u2019d like to focus on social issues. You have both been open about the role that faith has played in your lives. Can you discuss in detail a time when you struggled to balance your personal faith and a public policy position? Senator Kaine?<\/p>\n
KAINE: Yeah, that\u2019s an easy one for me, Elaine. It\u2019s an easy one. I\u2019m really fortunate. I grew up in a wonderful household with great Irish Catholic parents. My mom and dad are sitting right here. I was educated by Jesuits at Rockhurst High School in Kansas City. My 40th reunion is in 10 days.<\/p>\n
And I worked with Jesuit missionaries in Honduras, now nearly 35 years ago, and they were the heroes of my life. I try to practice my religion in a very devout way and follow the teachings of my church in my own personal life. But I don\u2019t believe in this nation, a First Amendment nation, where we don\u2019t raise any religion over the other, and we allow people to worship as they please, that the doctrines of any one religion should be mandated for everyone.<\/p>\n
For me, the hardest struggle in my faith life was the Catholic Church is against the death penalty and so am I. But I was governor of a state, and the state law said that there was a death penalty for crimes if the jury determined them to be heinous. And so I had to grapple with that.<\/p>\n
When I was running for governor, I was attacked pretty strongly because of my position on the death penalty. But I looked the voters of Virginia in the eye and said, look, this is my religion. I\u2019m not going to change my religious practice to get one vote, but I know how to take an oath and uphold the law. And if you elect me, I will uphold the law.<\/p>\n
And I was elected, and I did. It was very, very difficult to allow executions to go forward, but in circumstances where I didn\u2019t feel like there was a case for clemency, I told Virginia voters I would uphold the law, and I did.<\/p>\n
That was a real struggle. But I think it is really, really important that those of us who have deep faith lives don\u2019t feel that we could just substitute our own views for everybody else in society, regardless of their views.<\/p>\n
QUIJANO: Governor Pence?<\/p>\n
PENCE: Well, it\u2019s a wonderful question. And my Christian faith is at the very heart of who I am. I was also raised in a wonderful family of faith. It was a church on Sunday morning and grace before dinner.<\/p>\n
PENCE: But my Christian faith became real for me when I made a personal decision for Christ when I was a freshman in college. And I\u2019ve tried to live that out however imperfectly every day of my life since. And with my wife at my side, we\u2019ve followed a calling into public service, where we\u2019ve \u2014 we\u2019ve tried to \u2014 we\u2019ve tried to keep faith with the values that we cherish.<\/p>\n
And with regard to when I struggle, I appreciate, and \u2014 and \u2014 and \u2014 I have a great deal of respect for Senator Kaine\u2019s sincere faith. I truly do.<\/p>\n
KAINE: That\u2019s shared.<\/p>\n
PENCE: But for me, I would tell you that for me the sanctity of life proceeds out of the belief that \u2014 that ancient principle that \u2014 where God says before you were formed in the womb, I knew you, and so for my first time in public life, I sought to stand with great compassion for the sanctity of life.<\/p>\n
The state of Indiana has also sought to make sure that we expand alternatives in health care counseling for women, non-abortion alternatives. I\u2019m also very pleased at the fact we\u2019re well on our way in Indiana to becoming the most pro-adoption state in America. I think if you\u2019re going to be pro-life, you should \u2014 you should be pro- adoption.<\/p>\n
But what I can\u2019t understand is with Hillary Clinton and now Senator Kaine at her side is to support a practice like partial-birth abortion. I mean, to hold to the view \u2014 and I know Senator Kaine, you hold pro-life views personally \u2014 but the very idea that a child that is almost born into the world could still have their life taken from them is just anathema to me.<\/p>\n
And I cannot \u2014 I can\u2019t conscience about \u2014 about a party that supports that. Or that \u2014 I know you\u2019ve historically opposed taxpayer funding of abortion. But Hillary Clinton wants to \u2014 wants to repeal the longstanding provision in the law where we said we wouldn\u2019t use taxpayer dollars to fund abortion.<\/p>\n
So for me, my faith informs my life. I try and spend a little time on my knees every day. But it all for me begins with cherishing the dignity, the worth, the value of every human life.<\/p>\n
KAINE: Elaine, this is a fundamental question, a fundamental question. Hillary and I are both people out of religious backgrounds, from Methodist church experience, which was really formative for her as a public servant.<\/p>\n
But we really feel like you should live fully and with enthusiasm the commands of your faith. But it is not the role of the public servant to mandate that for everybody else.<\/p>\n
So let\u2019s talk about abortion and choice. Let\u2019s talk about them. We support Roe v. Wade. We support the constitutional right of American women to consult their own conscience, their own supportive partner, their own minister, but then make their own decision about pregnancy. That\u2019s something we trust American women to do that.<\/p>\n
And we don\u2019t think that women should be punished, as Donald Trump said they should, for making the decision to have an abortion.<\/p>\n
Governor Pence wants to repeal Roe v. Wade. He said he wants to put it on the ash heap of history. And we have some young people in the audience who weren\u2019t even born when Roe was decided. This is pretty important. Before Roe v. Wade, states could pass criminal laws to do just that, to punish women if they made the choice to terminate a pregnancy.<\/p>\n
I think you should live your moral values. But the last thing, the very last thing that government should do is have laws that would punish women who make reproductive choices. And that is the fundamental difference between a Clinton-Kaine ticket and a Trump- Pence ticket that wants to punish women who make that choice.<\/p>\n
PENCE: No, it\u2019s really not. Donald Trump and I would never support legislation that punished women who made the heartbreaking choice to end a pregnancy.<\/p>\n
KAINE: Then why did Donald Trump say that?<\/p>\n
PENCE: We just never would.<\/p>\n
KAINE: Why did he say that?<\/p>\n
PENCE: Well, look, it\u2019s \u2014 look, he\u2019s not a polished politician like you and Hillary Clinton. And so\u2026<\/p>\n
KAINE: Well, I would admit that\u2019s not a polished\u2026<\/p>\n
(CROSSTALK)<\/p>\n
PENCE: You know, things don\u2019t always come out exactly the way he means them.<\/p>\n
KAINE: Well, can I say\u2026<\/p>\n
PENCE: But I\u2019m telling you what the policy of our administration would be.<\/p>\n
KAINE: Great line from the \u2014 great line from the gospel of Matthew. From the fullness of the heart, the mouth speaks.<\/p>\n
PENCE: Yeah. KAINE: When Donald Trump says women should be punished or Mexicans are rapists and criminals\u2026<\/p>\n
PENCE: I\u2019m telling you\u2026<\/p>\n
KAINE: \u2026 or John McCain is not a hero, he is showing you who he is.<\/p>\n
PENCE: Senator, you\u2019ve whipped out that Mexican thing again. He \u2014 look\u2026<\/p>\n
KAINE: Can you defend it?<\/p>\n
PENCE: There are criminal aliens in this country, Tim, who have come into this country illegally who are perpetrating violence and taking American lives.<\/p>\n
KAINE: You want to \u2014 you want to use a big broad brush against Mexicans on that?<\/p>\n
PENCE: He also said and many of them are good people. You keep leaving that out of your quote. And if you want me to go there, I\u2019ll go there.<\/p>\n
But here\u2019s \u2014 there is a choice, and it is a choice on life. I couldn\u2019t be more proud to be standing with Donald Trump, who\u2019s standing for the right to life. It\u2019s a principle that \u2014 Senator Kaine \u2014 and I\u2019m very gentle about this, because I really do respect you \u2014 it\u2019s a principle that you embrace.<\/p>\n
And I have appreciated the fact that you\u2019ve supported the Hyde amendment, which bans the use of taxpayer funding for abortion, in the past, but that\u2019s not Hillary Clinton\u2019s view. People need to understand, we can come together as a nation. We can create a culture of life. More and more young people today are embracing life because we know we are \u2014 we\u2019re better for it. We can \u2014 like Mother Teresa said at that famous national prayer breakfast\u2026<\/p>\n
KAINE: This is important \u2014<\/p>\n
PENCE: \u2026 bring the \u2014 let\u2019s welcome the children into our world. There are so many families around the country who can\u2019t have children. We could improve adoption\u2026<\/p>\n
KAINE: But, Governor\u2026<\/p>\n
PENCE: \u2026 so that families that can\u2019t have children can adopt more readily those children from crisis pregnancies.<\/p>\n
KAINE: Governor, why don\u2019t you trust women to make this choice for themselves? We can encourage people to support life. Of course we can. But why don\u2019t you trust women? Why doesn\u2019t Donald Trump trust women to make this choice for themselves?<\/p>\n
That\u2019s what we ought to be doing in public life. Living our lives of faith or motivation with enthusiasm and excitement, convincing other, dialoguing with each other about important moral issues of the day\u2026<\/p>\n
PENCE: Because there are\u2026<\/p>\n
KAINE: \u2026 but on fundamental issues of morality, we should let women make their own decisions.<\/p>\n
PENCE: Because there is \u2014 a society can be judged by how it deals with its most vulnerable, the aged, the infirm, the disabled, and the unborn. I believe it with all my heart. And I couldn\u2019t be more proud to be standing with a pro-life candidate in Donald Trump.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n
There\u2019s a lot to unpack here. But before you take anyone else\u2019s word for it, I encourage to read and think through this exchange for yourself.<\/p>\n
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There’s a lot to unpack here. But before you take anyone else’s word for it, I encourage to read and think through this exchange for yourself.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":2779,"featured_media":487,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[180],"tags":[110,160,182,8,49,137,144,120],"class_list":["post-486","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-debates","tag-catholic-church","tag-christianity","tag-debates","tag-donald-trump","tag-hillary-clinton","tag-mike-pence","tag-tim-kaine","tag-vice-presidency"],"yoast_head":"\n
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