{"id":48367,"date":"2014-03-28T05:09:20","date_gmt":"2014-03-28T10:09:20","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jesuscreed\/?p=48367"},"modified":"2014-03-26T19:36:30","modified_gmt":"2014-03-27T00:36:30","slug":"young-restless-and-no-longer-reformed-2-john-frye","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jesuscreed\/2014\/03\/28\/young-restless-and-no-longer-reformed-2-john-frye\/","title":{"rendered":"Young Restless and No Longer Reformed (2) (John Frye)"},"content":{"rendered":"<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC \"-\/\/W3C\/\/DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional\/\/EN\" \"http:\/\/www.w3.org\/TR\/REC-html40\/loose.dtd\">\n<html><head><meta http-equiv=\"content-type\" content=\"text\/html; charset=utf-8\"><meta http-equiv=\"content-type\" content=\"text\/html; charset=utf-8\"><\/head><body><p><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-media.patheos.com\/blogs\/sites\/40\/2014\/03\/FromShepherdsNook.png\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"alignright size-full wp-image-48368\" title=\"FromShepherd'sNook\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-media.patheos.com\/blogs\/sites\/40\/2014\/03\/FromShepherdsNook.png\" alt=\"\" width=\"296\" height=\"251\"><\/a><\/p>\n<p style=\"text-align: left;\" align=\"center\"><em>Young, Restless, and no longer Reformed <\/em>Part 2<\/p>\n<p>We are reviewing Austin Fischer\u2019s <em><a href=\"http:\/\/www.amazon.com\/gp\/product\/1625641516\/ref=as_li_ss_tl?ie=UTF8&amp;camp=1789&amp;creative=390957&amp;creativeASIN=1625641516&amp;linkCode=as2&amp;tag=musionscieand-20\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"nofollow\">Young, Restless, and no longer Reformed: Black Holes, Love, and a Journey In and Out of Calvinism<\/a>.<\/em> I agree with Fischer\u2019s take on the biblical and pastoral weaknesses of Calvinism. I want to focus on four of his many excellent and provocative observations.<\/p>\n<p>First, no one becomes a Calvinist from just reading the Bible. To the YRRs who say, \u201cCalvinism is on every page of the Bible,\u201d I would like to see the concordance on that. On the other hand, the relational interplay between God (divine will) and people (human will) <em>is <\/em>almost on every page of the Bible. People have to be taught an interpretive, systematic grid based on a handful of beloved Calvinist texts that, like Kool-Aid in water, color the whole Bible. No one doubts that the Calvinist system is pristine, even intoxicating. It\u2019s like a theological creation of Lego pieces, so intricately interlocked. I do remember as a new Calvinist being deeply humbled by the system\u2019s definition of \u201csovereign grace.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Second, when you take away the Calvinist fig leaf woven with terms like \u201cmystery,\u201d \u201cpassing over,\u201d and \u201cantinomy,\u201d the naked God of the eternal, meticulous decree is not a God Who loves everyone; he selects only his elect. I like the way Austin dismantles the Calvinist two kinds of love (24-25). My opinion is that the game of arranging the <em>ordo salutis<\/em> is a task of presumptive humans trying to read the mind of God in eternity past. Many people are waking up to the \u201cunblinking cosmic stare\u201d (Dallas Willard) God created by any version of TULIP. I remember riding a tour bus in Mumbai, India, and seeing literally thousands of people up and down every street. I was in a city of millions of people who in the minds of many are reprobate, eternally damned to hell; decreed so by the God I worship; predestined to hell for God\u2019s glory. If that\u2019s so, then glory sounds like a treacherous word. \u00a0Fischer suggests the God of Calvinism becomes One Who is so turned in on himself for his own glory that he becomes the cosmic Black Hole (14-15).<\/p>\n<p>Third, many texts used to create systematic Calvinism have been shown to be misused. I think Fischer does a good job poking back at the Calvinist misuse of Romans 9 (and Gregory Boyd reclaims many misused texts in <em><a href=\"http:\/\/www.amazon.com\/God-War-Bible-Spiritual-Conflict\/dp\/0830818855\/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&amp;qid=1395084421&amp;sr=8-1&amp;keywords=god+at+war+gregory+boyd\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"nofollow\">God at War<\/a><\/em>). Austin\u2019s section on the Bible made impossible is provocative (33-35). The hermeneutical and theological gymnastics that Calvinists use to diffuse \u201cthe plain reading of Scripture\u201d is laughable, if not so seriously twisting the sacred text. Fischer suggests that these differing views of the same texts are traceable to bliks\u2014interpretive lenses through which everything is understood (81-82).<\/p>\n<p>Fourth, and for me most convincingly, Fischer makes clear that the Calvinist God is not the God we see in the face of Jesus Christ. Fischer writes, \u201c\u2026 [T]he crucified Jesus is both the <em>foundation and criticism<\/em> of all Christian theology. \u2026 And so, <em>plainly<\/em>, does the God on the cross look like the God of Calvinism\u201d (45)? Fischer makes a good case for the answer \u201cno.\u201d When we start with Jesus on the cross and work back and forward through the Bible, we do not meet the Platonic- concept-of-perfection-God espoused by Calvinism.<\/p>\n<p>Are there godly, kind Calvinists? Yes, I know many. Are there pesky Arminians and irritating open theists? I imagine there are. I like this from Fischer, \u201cI think Calvinists are right on some things, kind of wrong on some things, and really wrong on some things\u201d (90-91). Some years ago the senior pastor of a large Assembly of God Church told me this story. He met with the denominational leaders of the Christian Reformed Church to discuss church growth in West Michigan. The Assembly\u2019s pastor thanked the Reformed leaders for filling <em>his <\/em>church and many other Assemblies churches. The Reformed leaders were a little taken back, asking, \u201cHow did we do that?\u201d The pastor said, \u201cBy preaching your view of God so faithfully. Thank you. People from your churches flock to ours to escape a wrathful, unpleasable God and they find in our churches a God who so ravishingly loves them that he chases them down with passionate desire.\u201d We can argue Pelagianism, Arminianism, semi-Pelagianism, Open theism, and Calvinism <em>ad infinitum<\/em>. Yet, people, ordinary people, just want to know \u201cWhat kind of God is at the center of the universe?\u201d At the center of reality is there a meticulously determined decree or a \u201cLamb, looking as it if had been slain\u201d?<\/p>\n<p>I appreciate Austin Fischer and his book for sparking a fair and amiable conversation on such a vital topic: what is the nature and purpose of God?<\/p>\n<\/body><\/html>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Young, Restless, and no longer Reformed Part 2 We are reviewing Austin Fischer\u2019s Young, Restless, and no longer Reformed: Black Holes, Love, and a Journey In and Out of Calvinism. I agree with Fischer\u2019s take on the biblical and pastoral weaknesses of Calvinism. I want to focus on four of his many excellent and provocative [&hellip;]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":197,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[1],"tags":[],"class_list":["post-48367","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","hentry","category-uncategorized"],"yoast_head":"<!-- This site is optimized with the Yoast SEO plugin v21.1 - https:\/\/yoast.com\/wordpress\/plugins\/seo\/ -->\n<title>Young Restless and No Longer Reformed (2) (John Frye)<\/title>\n<meta name=\"description\" content=\"Young, Restless, and no longer Reformed Part 2 We are reviewing Austin Fischer\u2019s Young, Restless, and no longer Reformed: Black Holes, Love, and a Journey\" \/>\n<meta name=\"robots\" content=\"index, follow, max-snippet:-1, max-image-preview:large, max-video-preview:-1\" \/>\n<link rel=\"canonical\" href=\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jesuscreed\/2014\/03\/28\/young-restless-and-no-longer-reformed-2-john-frye\/\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:locale\" content=\"en_US\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:type\" content=\"article\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:title\" content=\"Young Restless and No Longer Reformed (2) (John Frye)\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:description\" content=\"Young, Restless, and no longer Reformed Part 2 We are reviewing Austin Fischer\u2019s Young, Restless, and no longer Reformed: Black Holes, Love, and a Journey\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:url\" content=\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jesuscreed\/2014\/03\/28\/young-restless-and-no-longer-reformed-2-john-frye\/\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:site_name\" content=\"Jesus Creed\" \/>\n<meta property=\"article:published_time\" content=\"2014-03-28T10:09:20+00:00\" \/>\n<meta property=\"article:modified_time\" content=\"2014-03-27T00:36:30+00:00\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:image\" content=\"http:\/\/wp.patheos.com.s3.amazonaws.com\/blogs\/jesuscreed\/files\/2014\/03\/FromShepherdsNook.png\" \/>\n<meta name=\"author\" content=\"Scot McKnight\" \/>\n<meta name=\"twitter:card\" content=\"summary_large_image\" \/>\n<meta name=\"twitter:label1\" content=\"Written by\" \/>\n\t<meta name=\"twitter:data1\" content=\"Scot McKnight\" \/>\n\t<meta name=\"twitter:label2\" content=\"Est. reading time\" \/>\n\t<meta name=\"twitter:data2\" content=\"4 minutes\" \/>\n<script type=\"application\/ld+json\" class=\"yoast-schema-graph\">{\"@context\":\"https:\/\/schema.org\",\"@graph\":[{\"@type\":\"WebPage\",\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jesuscreed\/2014\/03\/28\/young-restless-and-no-longer-reformed-2-john-frye\/\",\"url\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jesuscreed\/2014\/03\/28\/young-restless-and-no-longer-reformed-2-john-frye\/\",\"name\":\"Young Restless and No Longer Reformed (2) (John Frye)\",\"isPartOf\":{\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jesuscreed\/#website\"},\"datePublished\":\"2014-03-28T10:09:20+00:00\",\"dateModified\":\"2014-03-27T00:36:30+00:00\",\"author\":{\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jesuscreed\/#\/schema\/person\/5919e847c58ffe6efb5899fb61797252\"},\"description\":\"Young, Restless, and no longer Reformed Part 2 We are reviewing Austin Fischer\u2019s Young, Restless, and no longer Reformed: Black Holes, Love, and a Journey\",\"breadcrumb\":{\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jesuscreed\/2014\/03\/28\/young-restless-and-no-longer-reformed-2-john-frye\/#breadcrumb\"},\"inLanguage\":\"en-US\",\"potentialAction\":[{\"@type\":\"ReadAction\",\"target\":[\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jesuscreed\/2014\/03\/28\/young-restless-and-no-longer-reformed-2-john-frye\/\"]}]},{\"@type\":\"BreadcrumbList\",\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jesuscreed\/2014\/03\/28\/young-restless-and-no-longer-reformed-2-john-frye\/#breadcrumb\",\"itemListElement\":[{\"@type\":\"ListItem\",\"position\":1,\"name\":\"Home\",\"item\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jesuscreed\/\"},{\"@type\":\"ListItem\",\"position\":2,\"name\":\"Young Restless and No Longer Reformed (2) (John Frye)\"}]},{\"@type\":\"WebSite\",\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jesuscreed\/#website\",\"url\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jesuscreed\/\",\"name\":\"Jesus Creed\",\"description\":\"Scot McKnight on Jesus and orthodox faith in the 21st century\",\"potentialAction\":[{\"@type\":\"SearchAction\",\"target\":{\"@type\":\"EntryPoint\",\"urlTemplate\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jesuscreed\/?s={search_term_string}\"},\"query-input\":\"required name=search_term_string\"}],\"inLanguage\":\"en-US\"},{\"@type\":\"Person\",\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/jesuscreed\/#\/schema\/person\/5919e847c58ffe6efb5899fb61797252\",\"name\":\"Scot McKnight\",\"description\":\"Scot McKnight is a recognized authority on the New Testament, early Christianity, and the historical Jesus. 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