{"id":7461,"date":"2017-12-14T04:00:51","date_gmt":"2017-12-14T10:00:51","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/admin.patheos.com\/blogs\/johnbeckett\/?p=7461"},"modified":"2017-12-09T16:19:01","modified_gmt":"2017-12-09T22:19:01","slug":"conversations-oaks-pagan-qa","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/johnbeckett\/2017\/12\/conversations-oaks-pagan-qa.html","title":{"rendered":"Conversations Under the Oaks: A Pagan Q&#038;A"},"content":{"rendered":"<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC \"-\/\/W3C\/\/DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional\/\/EN\" \"http:\/\/www.w3.org\/TR\/REC-html40\/loose.dtd\">\n<html><head><meta http-equiv=\"content-type\" content=\"text\/html; charset=utf-8\"><meta http-equiv=\"content-type\" content=\"text\/html; charset=utf-8\"><\/head><body><p>Welcome to the first Conversations Under the Oaks, a new monthly Q&amp;A feature. I\u2019ve been responding to questions for as long as I\u2019ve been blogging, but this is the first time I\u2019ve actively solicited questions. This is your chance to ask me anything.<\/p>\n<p>I\u2019ve already responded to some questions. A few were brief enough for immediate answers. Some I\u2019ve already answered and could just post a link to an old blog post or two. One (on prayer) I\u2019m going to turn into its own full post next week. The rest are here.<\/p>\n<p>Questions have been edited for brevity \u2013 names are used where I have explicit permission.<\/p>\n<figure id=\"attachment_7464\" aria-describedby=\"caption-attachment-7464\" style=\"width: 782px\" class=\"wp-caption aligncenter\"><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-media.patheos.com\/blogs\/sites\/243\/2017\/12\/GCG-2016-22c.jpg\" rel=\"attachment wp-att-7464\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"size-full wp-image-7464\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-media.patheos.com\/blogs\/sites\/243\/2017\/12\/GCG-2016-22c.jpg\" alt=\"speaking at the 2016 OBOD Gulf Coast Gathering\" width=\"782\" height=\"411\"><\/a><figcaption id=\"caption-attachment-7464\" class=\"wp-caption-text\"><em>speaking at the 2016 OBOD Gulf Coast Gathering<\/em><\/figcaption><\/figure>\n<p><strong>I would like to hear about how you cleansed and warded your new office. What did that entail?<\/strong><\/p>\n<p>After 16 years in the same office, I moved to the other end of the building a couple weeks ago. I started by cleaning out the old office \u2013 I threw out a lot of old papers and junk I had accumulated. Before moving into the new office, I cleaned all the surfaces and cabinets. Never underestimate the power of good mundane cleaning!<\/p>\n<p>I did a brief sweep of the office, using my hand in place of a wand, moving the old energy around and out the door. I drew a pentagram over the door and charged it to protect me from any and all ill intent. Then I concluded with a prayer to the deities I\u2019m closest to, asking Their blessings and protection on this space.<\/p>\n<p>So far so good.<\/p>\n<p><strong>You occasionally mention on your blog that you are a priest of Danu and Cernunnos, which I assume, means that you have made vows to them, binding you to certain obligations.\u00a0 1) How did these relationships start? Did they ask you to be their priest first, or were you the one offering your services to them? 2) What kind of direct impact did this have on your life? Did anything change beyond that you are now bound to duty?<\/strong><\/p>\n<p>I\u2019ve written about the beginnings of my relationships with <a href=\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/johnbeckett\/2014\/06\/cernunnos.html\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\">Cernunnos<\/a> and <a href=\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/johnbeckett\/2013\/10\/danu.html\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\">Danu<\/a> before. They asked me to be Their priest, Cernunnos first (after many years of relationship building) and Danu later (that one came quickly).<\/p>\n<p>After accepting the obligations and making the vows (I made vows to both of Them at the same time), Their presence became constant and noticeable \u2013 They\u2019re never <em>not<\/em> there. The same is true of my relationship with the Morrigan. Although I am not Her priest, after I made <a href=\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/johnbeckett\/2017\/07\/an-oath-to-the-morrigan.html\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\">vows to serve Her<\/a>, She\u2019s never <em>not<\/em> there. I don\u2019t know how common that is among polytheists, so I wouldn\u2019t assume that would be the case with every person. But that\u2019s what it\u2019s been for me.<\/p>\n<p>The exact wording of my oaths and the content of the promises I made is sacred and not for publication. But you asked what changed \u2013 my answer is that Their presence went from occasional to constant.<\/p>\n<p><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-media.patheos.com\/blogs\/sites\/243\/2017\/12\/Morrigan-11.23.17.jpg\" rel=\"attachment wp-att-7466\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"aligncenter size-full wp-image-7466\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-media.patheos.com\/blogs\/sites\/243\/2017\/12\/Morrigan-11.23.17.jpg\" alt=\"Morrigan 11.23.17\" width=\"782\" height=\"411\"><\/a><\/p>\n<p><strong>What is your view of reincarnation? Does anything we do now have any effect later? Is there a process to reincarnation? At what point is it decided that we come back? Or are we just energy and eventually we remain as part of the whole?<\/strong><\/p>\n<p>Back in August I wrote <a href=\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/johnbeckett\/2017\/08\/one-pagans-thoughts-comes-death.html\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\">One Pagan\u2019s Thoughts on What Comes After Death<\/a>. That may address your question more fully than I can answer it here.<\/p>\n<p>I\u2019m inclined to believe in reincarnation, but it\u2019s a belief I hold very loosely. If I get to the Otherworld and I\u2019m told \u201cthat was it \u2013 you only get one life\u201d I\u2019ll be surprised but not shocked. So while I have some vague ideas about how reincarnation might work, I have nothing definitive I can tell you, and certainly nothing authoritative.<\/p>\n<p>The one question I will address directly is \u201cdoes anything we do now have any effect later?\u201d Every action has consequences. Rarely are those consequences formal, such as receiving a prize for winning a contest, or a judge handing down a sentence after someone is convicted of a crime. Rather, you touch a hot stove and you get burned. You smoke cigarettes and you get lung cancer (or maybe you don\u2019t \u2013 consequences aren\u2019t always predictable). You spend years practicing meditation and prayer and you find your life is more manageable \u2013 not easier, just easier to deal with.<\/p>\n<p>If reincarnation exists, we should expect that what we do in this life will carry over into our next life. Not as a reward or punishment, and not because of some great curriculum of \u201clessons\u201d we must learn, but because the future is always the consequence of the past.<\/p>\n<p>Does reincarnation continue eternally, or will we someday merge into one great Unity? I\u2019ve had radically different thoughts on that at different times in my life. Right now I\u2019m not very concerned with it, so I have no opinion to offer.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Danna: I\u2019ve realized that all the Deities I thought I worshipped really aren\u2019t \u201cthere\u201d anymore, if they ever were. Obviously, I wasn\u2019t that serious in my devotion of them. So my question is what do I do with their stuff: statues and the like? My thoughts are to donate them. I realize the Deities in question are probably not nearly as invested in this question since I never had a connection with them, honestly I never did the work to have a connection.\u00a0 <\/strong><\/p>\n<p>The context of your question makes it clear that when you say deities aren\u2019t \u201cthere\u201d you mean They\u2019re not present in your life, not that They don\u2019t exist.<\/p>\n<p>I think you\u2019re on the right track. Still, these are sacred items, and they should be disposed of reverently and respectfully. Donating them to someone for whom they would be inspirational or an aid to devotion would be ideal.<\/p>\n<p>If they were ever more than just statues (if they were truly dwelling places for Gods) you would need to find someone who would care for them on an on-going basis. That doesn\u2019t sound like it\u2019s the case here, though.<\/p>\n<p><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-media.patheos.com\/blogs\/sites\/243\/2017\/12\/Isis-06.07.15-06.jpg\" rel=\"attachment wp-att-7468\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"aligncenter size-full wp-image-7468\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-media.patheos.com\/blogs\/sites\/243\/2017\/12\/Isis-06.07.15-06.jpg\" alt=\"Isis 06.07.15 06\" width=\"782\" height=\"411\"><\/a><\/p>\n<p><strong>How do you handle people who have the ambition to be community leaders, but who are poison? Maybe they have mental health issues, maybe they are just too narcissistic. It is hard to exclude people when your basic desire is to be inclusive, but some people will tear your community apart. <\/strong><\/p>\n<p>This is hard.<\/p>\n<p>The short answer is to set high, clear standards, and then enforce them. If someone is toxic, they cannot be allowed into leadership positions. Sometimes they can be ignored or outvoted. The problem is that most Pagan organizations are perpetually short of leaders, so it\u2019s hard to say no to someone who\u2019s willing to do the work.<\/p>\n<p>A community without standards isn\u2019t a community, it\u2019s just a collection of individuals. And the first standard has to be that the community is more important than any one person. That means removing toxic individuals \u2013 gently if possible, forcefully if necessary \u2013 rather than allowing them to poison the community. It also means the healthy leaders have to be willing to have a confrontation when necessary. Which is also hard.<\/p>\n<p>It helps to have established leaders demonstrating healthy behaviors. Most toxic people aren\u2019t completely clueless \u2013 if they see they aren\u2019t going to get what they want, they\u2019ll keep moving.<\/p>\n<p>There is no silver bullet here. Just lots of hard and unpleasant work. Good luck.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Lorie: I am being pulled in two directions. One ancestor whispers of Romani knowledge through my Czechoslovakian grandmother and the other ancestors cry of my Welsh ancestry through my grandfather. I have studied half a year of OBOD materials from England and about 12 years of witchcraft through various sources. I need to land somewhere but I don\u2019t know where I belong yet. How do I reconcile this? <\/strong><\/p>\n<p><strong>One thing I find that I cannot be nudged on and that is my desire to practice alone. I feel much freer to give of myself in ritual if I am alone and I share constantly with my ancestors while I am alone. <\/strong><\/p>\n<p>I think you need to take a deeper look at your questions.<\/p>\n<p>Romani and Welsh aren\u2019t paths or traditions like OBOD or ADF or any of the witchcraft traditions. They\u2019re living, breathing cultures with their own languages, customs, and most importantly, people. They\u2019re communities. And that\u2019s at dire odds with your desire to practice alone.<\/p>\n<p>The handful of Welsh people I know have been very welcoming to those who want to come to Wales, learn the language, and participate in the culture. But they look rather unfavorably on those call themselves Welsh without doing any of those things.<\/p>\n<figure id=\"attachment_7470\" aria-describedby=\"caption-attachment-7470\" style=\"width: 782px\" class=\"wp-caption aligncenter\"><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-media.patheos.com\/blogs\/sites\/243\/2017\/12\/Wales-2014.jpg\" rel=\"attachment wp-att-7470\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"size-full wp-image-7470\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-media.patheos.com\/blogs\/sites\/243\/2017\/12\/Wales-2014.jpg\" alt=\"Anglesey, Wales - 2014\" width=\"782\" height=\"411\"><\/a><figcaption id=\"caption-attachment-7470\" class=\"wp-caption-text\"><em>Anglesey, Wales \u2013 2014<\/em><\/figcaption><\/figure>\n<p>I do not know any Romani people, but my understanding is that they are very guarded with their culture, and with good reason. They have been harassed and oppressed every place they\u2019ve ever lived and are justifiably untrusting of strangers.<\/p>\n<p>You say \u201cI don\u2019t know where I belong.\u201d This is a common feeling among those of us in North America. Our ancestors were cut off from their indigenous religions hundreds of years ago, but at least they had their land and cultures. We have neither. We have to form our own relationships with <a href=\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/johnbeckett\/2015\/10\/this-land-is-your-land.html\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\">the land where we are<\/a>, and with the people who are or who will become our families.<\/p>\n<p>I can\u2019t help you with the Romani, except to warn that if a book or other resource is written by someone who isn\u2019t Romani themselves, it\u2019s highly suspect.<\/p>\n<p>There\u2019s plenty of Welsh material available. Start with a good history \u2013 I read <em>A Concise History of Wales<\/em> by Geraint H. Jenkins. Read the Mabinogi. Read <a href=\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/johnbeckett\/2014\/04\/from-the-cauldron-born.html\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\"><em>From the Cauldron Born<\/em><\/a> by Kristoffer Hughes. If Wales calls to you, explore it further.<\/p>\n<p>And if it doesn\u2019t, if what you\u2019re looking for is a magical tradition and not a culture, that\u2019s OK. OBOD is a very good tradition. So is ADF. So are dozens of other Pagan groups and traditions and orders. But they\u2019re not living, breathing cultures.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Being Pagan is all about the experience, but when one is not going to get along with the concept of a tradition, how does one further one\u2019s growth? I just don\u2019t get the whole oath bound concept and have struggled my whole life trying to understand the need for any \u201cmile marker\u201d ceremonies be they mundane or spiritual.<\/strong><\/p>\n<p>Although experience is a very important part of my Paganism (which is why it\u2019s in the subtitle of <a href=\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/johnbeckett\/book\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\">my book<\/a>), I wouldn\u2019t say Paganism is all about the experience. Paganism is about many things, and I\u2019d put relationships at the top of that list. Some of our relationships are with Nature, some are with Gods and spirits, and some are with other people.<\/p>\n<p>Not all Pagan traditions are oath-bound. Some of those that are oath-bound have material that needs to be learned sequentially: you need to master the first degree before you try to tackle the second degree. Others involve experiences where vulnerability is required. Knowing that what happens in the circle will stay in the circle allows people to relax and participate fully.<\/p>\n<p>Our mainstream society does a very poor job with rites of passage, and thus we don\u2019t realize what we\u2019re missing. \u201cMile marker\u201d ceremonies reinforce the idea that our status has changed, and thus our rights and responsibilities have also changed. Many of these status changes happen gradually \u2013 we may not realize how much we\u2019ve changed. The ceremonies help draw a clear bright line between \u201cchild\u201d and \u201cadult\u201d or between \u201cdevotee\u201d and \u201cpriest,\u201d to name just two.<\/p>\n<p>One of the advantages of working within a tradition is being able to use that tradition\u2019s roadmap for growth. In OBOD you move from a non-member to Bard, from Bard to Ovate, from Ovate to Druid, and from Druid to Druid graduate (OBOD has no formal term for those who\u2019ve completed the Druid grade \u2013 I\u2019ve heard some use \u201cDruid graduate\u201d and I like it).<\/p>\n<p>If you aren\u2019t in a tradition, then you have to chart your own course. The upside is that you can design your own program from start to finish, emphasizing what you like and skipping what you don\u2019t. The downside is that you have to do the work to design your own program from start to finish. That also means you don\u2019t have the benefit of elders who\u2019ve already walked the same path. If you get stuck, you have to get yourself unstuck\u2026 and many don\u2019t.<\/p>\n<p>Some people are called to be solitary practitioners. Some are called to blaze their own trail. It can be done. But it\u2019s very hard.<\/p>\n<p>Thanks for all the questions. We\u2019ll do this again in January!<\/p>\n<\/body><\/html>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Here are the first set of questions and answers for Conversations Under the Oaks, a new monthly Pagan Q&#038;A feature. <\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":1129,"featured_media":7464,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[1],"tags":[1463,4,1465,5,8,1462],"class_list":["post-7461","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-uncategorized","tag-ask-me-anything","tag-pagan","tag-pagan-qa","tag-paganism","tag-polytheism","tag-qa"],"yoast_head":"<!-- This site is optimized with the Yoast SEO plugin v21.1 - https:\/\/yoast.com\/wordpress\/plugins\/seo\/ -->\n<title>Conversations Under the Oaks: A Pagan Q&amp;A<\/title>\n<meta name=\"description\" content=\"Here are the first set of questions and answers for Conversations Under the Oaks, a 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