Interesting Conversation about Demons<\/title>\n<meta name=\"description\" content=\"A few days ago, Fr. Dwight Longenecker put up a little piece noodling the question of whether a mass murderer might by diagnosed by an exorcist as\" \/>\n<meta name=\"robots\" content=\"index, follow, max-snippet:-1, max-image-preview:large, max-video-preview:-1\" \/>\n<link rel=\"canonical\" href=\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/2012\/07\/interesting-conversation-about-demons.html\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:locale\" content=\"en_US\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:type\" content=\"article\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:title\" content=\"Interesting Conversation about Demons\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:description\" content=\"A few days ago, Fr. Dwight Longenecker put up a little piece noodling the question of whether a mass murderer might by diagnosed by an exorcist as\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:url\" content=\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/2012\/07\/interesting-conversation-about-demons.html\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:site_name\" content=\"Catholic and Enjoying It!\" \/>\n<meta property=\"article:published_time\" content=\"2012-07-27T07:17:18+00:00\" \/>\n<meta property=\"article:modified_time\" content=\"2014-12-30T22:35:43+00:00\" \/>\n<meta name=\"author\" content=\"Mark Shea\" \/>\n<meta name=\"twitter:card\" content=\"summary_large_image\" \/>\n<meta name=\"twitter:label1\" content=\"Written by\" \/>\n\t<meta name=\"twitter:data1\" content=\"Mark Shea\" \/>\n\t<meta name=\"twitter:label2\" content=\"Est. reading time\" \/>\n\t<meta name=\"twitter:data2\" content=\"3 minutes\" \/>\n<script type=\"application\/ld+json\" class=\"yoast-schema-graph\">{\"@context\":\"https:\/\/schema.org\",\"@graph\":[{\"@type\":\"WebPage\",\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/2012\/07\/interesting-conversation-about-demons.html\",\"url\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/2012\/07\/interesting-conversation-about-demons.html\",\"name\":\"Interesting Conversation about Demons\",\"isPartOf\":{\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/#website\"},\"datePublished\":\"2012-07-27T07:17:18+00:00\",\"dateModified\":\"2014-12-30T22:35:43+00:00\",\"author\":{\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/#\/schema\/person\/c1a9ac1e557d3c626974fd6692818ad5\"},\"description\":\"A few days ago, Fr. Dwight Longenecker put up a little piece noodling the question of whether a mass murderer might by diagnosed by an exorcist as\",\"breadcrumb\":{\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/2012\/07\/interesting-conversation-about-demons.html#breadcrumb\"},\"inLanguage\":\"en-US\",\"potentialAction\":[{\"@type\":\"ReadAction\",\"target\":[\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/2012\/07\/interesting-conversation-about-demons.html\"]}]},{\"@type\":\"BreadcrumbList\",\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/2012\/07\/interesting-conversation-about-demons.html#breadcrumb\",\"itemListElement\":[{\"@type\":\"ListItem\",\"position\":1,\"name\":\"Home\",\"item\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\"},{\"@type\":\"ListItem\",\"position\":2,\"name\":\"Interesting Conversation about Demons\"}]},{\"@type\":\"WebSite\",\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/#website\",\"url\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/\",\"name\":\"Catholic and Enjoying It!\",\"description\":\"Mark Shea's Blog: So That No Thought of Mine, No Matter How Stupid, Should Ever Go Unpublished Again!\",\"potentialAction\":[{\"@type\":\"SearchAction\",\"target\":{\"@type\":\"EntryPoint\",\"urlTemplate\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/?s={search_term_string}\"},\"query-input\":\"required name=search_term_string\"}],\"inLanguage\":\"en-US\"},{\"@type\":\"Person\",\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/#\/schema\/person\/c1a9ac1e557d3c626974fd6692818ad5\",\"name\":\"Mark Shea\",\"image\":{\"@type\":\"ImageObject\",\"inLanguage\":\"en-US\",\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/#\/schema\/person\/image\/\",\"url\":\"https:\/\/secure.gravatar.com\/avatar\/f287911f45adc932ad24ddbae3597ed5?s=96&d=mm&r=g\",\"contentUrl\":\"https:\/\/secure.gravatar.com\/avatar\/f287911f45adc932ad24ddbae3597ed5?s=96&d=mm&r=g\",\"caption\":\"Mark Shea\"},\"url\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/author\/markshea\"}]}<\/script>\n","yoast_head_json":{"title":"Interesting Conversation about Demons","description":"A few days ago, Fr. Dwight Longenecker put up a little piece noodling the question of whether a mass murderer might by diagnosed by an exorcist as","robots":{"index":"index","follow":"follow","max-snippet":"max-snippet:-1","max-image-preview":"max-image-preview:large","max-video-preview":"max-video-preview:-1"},"canonical":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/2012\/07\/interesting-conversation-about-demons.html","og_locale":"en_US","og_type":"article","og_title":"Interesting Conversation about Demons","og_description":"A few days ago, Fr. Dwight Longenecker put up a little piece noodling the question of whether a mass murderer might by diagnosed by an exorcist as","og_url":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/2012\/07\/interesting-conversation-about-demons.html","og_site_name":"Catholic and Enjoying It!","article_published_time":"2012-07-27T07:17:18+00:00","article_modified_time":"2014-12-30T22:35:43+00:00","author":"Mark Shea","twitter_card":"summary_large_image","twitter_misc":{"Written by":"Mark Shea","Est. reading time":"3 minutes"},"schema":{"@context":"https:\/\/schema.org","@graph":[{"@type":"WebPage","@id":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/2012\/07\/interesting-conversation-about-demons.html","url":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/2012\/07\/interesting-conversation-about-demons.html","name":"Interesting Conversation about Demons","isPartOf":{"@id":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/#website"},"datePublished":"2012-07-27T07:17:18+00:00","dateModified":"2014-12-30T22:35:43+00:00","author":{"@id":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/#\/schema\/person\/c1a9ac1e557d3c626974fd6692818ad5"},"description":"A few days ago, Fr. Dwight Longenecker put up a little piece noodling the question of whether a mass murderer might by diagnosed by an exorcist as","breadcrumb":{"@id":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/2012\/07\/interesting-conversation-about-demons.html#breadcrumb"},"inLanguage":"en-US","potentialAction":[{"@type":"ReadAction","target":["https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/2012\/07\/interesting-conversation-about-demons.html"]}]},{"@type":"BreadcrumbList","@id":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/2012\/07\/interesting-conversation-about-demons.html#breadcrumb","itemListElement":[{"@type":"ListItem","position":1,"name":"Home","item":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea"},{"@type":"ListItem","position":2,"name":"Interesting Conversation about Demons"}]},{"@type":"WebSite","@id":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/#website","url":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/","name":"Catholic and Enjoying It!","description":"Mark Shea's Blog: So That No Thought of Mine, No Matter How Stupid, Should Ever Go Unpublished Again!","potentialAction":[{"@type":"SearchAction","target":{"@type":"EntryPoint","urlTemplate":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/?s={search_term_string}"},"query-input":"required name=search_term_string"}],"inLanguage":"en-US"},{"@type":"Person","@id":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/#\/schema\/person\/c1a9ac1e557d3c626974fd6692818ad5","name":"Mark Shea","image":{"@type":"ImageObject","inLanguage":"en-US","@id":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/#\/schema\/person\/image\/","url":"https:\/\/secure.gravatar.com\/avatar\/f287911f45adc932ad24ddbae3597ed5?s=96&d=mm&r=g","contentUrl":"https:\/\/secure.gravatar.com\/avatar\/f287911f45adc932ad24ddbae3597ed5?s=96&d=mm&r=g","caption":"Mark Shea"},"url":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/author\/markshea"}]}},"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/37045","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/92"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=37045"}],"version-history":[{"count":0,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/37045\/revisions"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=37045"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=37045"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=37045"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}

{"id":37045,"date":"2012-07-27T00:17:18","date_gmt":"2012-07-27T07:17:18","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/?p=37045"},"modified":"2014-12-30T15:35:43","modified_gmt":"2014-12-30T22:35:43","slug":"interesting-conversation-about-demons","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/2012\/07\/interesting-conversation-about-demons.html","title":{"rendered":"Interesting Conversation about Demons"},"content":{"rendered":"\n<\/head>

A few days ago, Fr. Dwight Longenecker put up a little piece noodling the question of whether a mass murderer might by diagnosed by an exorcist as demonically possessed<\/a>, and looking at the general way in which priests who do that sort of ministry try to make evaluations, etc.\u00a0 It\u2019s a side of life most of us don\u2019t know too much about except from lurid movies, so it was nice to have a dispassionate view from somebody who knows a little about it.<\/p>\n

Then a day or two later, a fellow Patheosi who wrote a piece arguing that we should \u201c reject<\/a>\u201d the demonic possession narrative.\u00a0 This struck me as remarkably pre-emptive and close-minded. Why the rush to reject it without trial?\u00a0 Seems like the sensible thing, when confronted with an obviously demonic act, is to ask people familiar with the phenomenon of the demonic (ie. exorcists) if there might be a reason to do an exorcism.\u00a0 Obviously, it\u2019s not up to the state to do that (we do not, alas, live in so civilized a time).\u00a0 But if I were that guy\u2019s family I would want to call out every piece of heavy artillery\u2013medical, psychological, neurological *and* spiritual\u2013to save his soul.\u00a0 Considering the possibility of demonic involvement seems to me like complete common sense here.<\/p>\n

Somebody might reply, \u201cI think you would have to believe in demons to begin with, and you would have to be the kind of person willing to call other people demonic.\u201d<\/p>\n

I suppose. But in treating\u00a0 of the demonic, I think the sensible thing is to keep an open mind, not a closed one.\u00a0 Since there is nothing in the sciences or common sense to say the existence of fallen angels is impossible and there is plenty not merely in the Abrahamic religions\u00a0 but in paganism as well to testify to the reality of evil spirits, I see no reason not to consider the possibility. As to \u201ccalling other people demonic\u201d strictly speaking this has nothing to do with that.\u00a0 It would be more accurate to say that there is a possibility that he is demonized.\u00a0 Demons are demonic.\u00a0 People are human.\u00a0 Some people have been oppressed by demonis.\u00a0 Some have even been possessed by them.\u00a0 In the Catholic tradition, a possessed person would not actually be responsible for their actions.\u00a0 So if it were to turn out that the shooter was possessed, he would be exonerated of guilt.\u00a0 I am skeptical this is the case, but it\u2019s worth looking at.\u00a0 If he is (as I suspect) a willing cooperator with demonic influences, whether knowingly or unknowingly (and he sure as hell wasn\u2019t a willing cooperator with the Holy Spirit) then we are looking at really saying something negative about him personally because he was acting freely and with full possession of his faculties.\u00a0 In other words, it is much harsher to call him a grave sinner than to say he may have been demon possessed because a sinner is in the driver\u2019s seat, a possessed person is tied up in the trunk.<\/p>\n<\/body><\/html>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"