{"id":52650,"date":"2014-05-22T00:38:26","date_gmt":"2014-05-22T07:38:26","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/?p=52650"},"modified":"2014-12-29T00:18:21","modified_gmt":"2014-12-29T07:18:21","slug":"kevin-obrien-14","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/2014\/05\/kevin-obrien-14.html","title":{"rendered":"Kevin O&#8217;Brien&#8230;"},"content":{"rendered":"<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC \"-\/\/W3C\/\/DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional\/\/EN\" \"http:\/\/www.w3.org\/TR\/REC-html40\/loose.dtd\">\n<html><head><meta http-equiv=\"content-type\" content=\"text\/html; charset=utf-8\"><meta http-equiv=\"content-type\" content=\"text\/html; charset=utf-8\"><\/head><body><p>\u2026<a href=\"http:\/\/thwordinc.blogspot.com\/2014\/05\/anatomy-of-dissent-or-how-to-rebel.html\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"nofollow\">struggles with living in a Church where so many Catholic still waste so much time on trying to figure out how close they can get to torturing people instead of trying to figure out how to treat prisoners humanely and get the intel we need.<\/a><\/p>\n<p>It\u2019s astonishing to hear \u201cprolife\u201d Christians, who worship a torture victim, still straining credulity to come up with rationalizations for tiptoeing as close as possible to committing sins worthy of the everlasting fires of hell.   It comes back, once again, to the divide in moral theology between those whose underlying question is \u201cHow can we do what is right with as little violence as possible?\u201d and those who ask (whether they realize it or not) \u201cWhen do we *get* to inflict violence?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>One of the marks of deep corruption in the discussion, as Kevin notes, is the perpetual insistence on seeking a \u201cdefinition\u201d of torture while simultaneously insisting that no definition can ever be found or ever be adequate, leaving the Pusher for Mortal Sin free to test the boundaries and see how far we can go in the infliction of suffering.  Such <a href=\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/2009\/05\/the-definition-game.html\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\">Definition Games <\/a>were a staple of the torture arguments over the past decade and were aptly summed up by Tom Kreitzberg as \u201c<a href=\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/2006\/12\/14694.html\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\">making the case for fog<\/a>\u201c.  Indeed, the persistent advocates for the use of torture sneeringly took the mantle <a href=\"http:\/\/coalitionforfog.blogspot.com\/\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"nofollow\">Coalition for Fog <\/a>to themselves.<\/p>\n<p>It\u2019s not really super-complicated:  Don\u2019t ask \u201cHow close can I get to mortal sin?\u201d  Ask \u201cHow do I obey Jesus and act like a saint?\u201d  Easy to understand.  Hard to do.<\/p>\n<\/body><\/html>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>\u2026struggles with living in a Church where so many Catholic still waste so much time on trying to figure out how close they can get to torturing people instead of trying to figure out how to treat prisoners humanely and get the intel we need. It\u2019s astonishing to hear \u201cprolife\u201d Christians, who worship a torture [&hellip;]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":92,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[1],"tags":[7,571],"class_list":["post-52650","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","hentry","category-uncategorized","tag-doings-on-other-blogs","tag-the-divide-in-catholic-moral-theology"],"yoast_head":"<!-- This site is optimized with the Yoast SEO plugin v21.1 - https:\/\/yoast.com\/wordpress\/plugins\/seo\/ -->\n<title>Kevin O&#039;Brien...<\/title>\n<meta name=\"description\" content=\"...struggles with living in a Church where so many Catholic still waste so much time on trying to figure out how close they can get to torturing people\" \/>\n<meta name=\"robots\" content=\"index, follow, max-snippet:-1, max-image-preview:large, max-video-preview:-1\" \/>\n<link rel=\"canonical\" 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