{"id":6870,"date":"2009-05-04T07:52:00","date_gmt":"2009-05-04T07:52:00","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/2009\/05\/rhetorical-creep\/"},"modified":"2015-01-01T15:00:29","modified_gmt":"2015-01-01T22:00:29","slug":"rhetorical-creep","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/markshea\/2009\/05\/rhetorical-creep.html","title":{"rendered":"Rhetorical creep"},"content":{"rendered":"<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC \"-\/\/W3C\/\/DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional\/\/EN\" \"http:\/\/www.w3.org\/TR\/REC-html40\/loose.dtd\">\n<html><head><meta http-equiv=\"content-type\" content=\"text\/html; charset=utf-8\"><meta http-equiv=\"content-type\" content=\"text\/html; charset=utf-8\"><\/head><body><p>A reader writes:<\/p>\n<blockquote><p><a href=\"http:\/\/www.catholicnewsagency.com\/new.php?n=15852\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"nofollow\">Dear God what have we come to?<\/a>  Once abortion is cast into the fiery dustbins of history from whence it came, will torture take its place as the next grave evil threatening our livelihood and well-being?<\/p>\n<p>What do these guys not get about Gaudium et Spes 27, CCC 2297, the bull of Pope Pius SVII, St. Nicholas I\u2019s ninth-century condemnation, the Sacred Tradition handed on by the apostles, etc\u2026?<\/p>\n<p>I just don\u2019t get how anyone could justify torture, ever.  Period.  I mean, isn\u2019t it obvious that it\u2019s bad to intentionally inflict pain on another person?<\/p>\n<p>We learned that in Kinder\u2026wait\u2026we didn\u2019t even have to learn that!  That intuition came built-in at birth.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n<p>FWIW, if there\u2019s anything the last six years have taught us, there are dozens and dozens of ways to rationalize evil.  Most Catholics never give the question of torture a thought, I\u2019ll wager, so their easy assumption that \u201cIt\u2019s probably okay sometimes: you know, to save New York and stuff\u201d is about all the farther the thought ever goes, just as the average Catholic would say they oppose abortion\u2013but still think it should be legal and wouldn\u2019t blame a woman in a tough spot for having one.  Our mind do not naturally want to dwell on such matters, so we make quick summary assessments and move on.  Here\u2019s a fairly average quick summary judgment from <a href=\"http:\/\/www.firstthings.com\/theanchoress\/2009\/05\/01\/dalai-lama-hearts-george-w-bush\/\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"nofollow\">just the other day<\/a>:<\/p>\n<blockquote><p>I think I am against [torture] but with this one exception: if I have a choice between saving say, 5 million lives in a nuke-contaminated Chicago or being able to say, \u201cbut at least we didn\u2019t waterboard that guy,\u201d I am inclined to think I would go for torture. The 5 million might still die, it\u2019s true, but at least I won\u2019t have to answer for standing idly by and watching it so that my morals might remain intact. I will take the chance that my moral failing in that instance will simply join my other moral failings in life, and then God and I will work that stuff out.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n<p>The refreshing thing about this post is that it is blessedly free of the normal mealy-mouthed rubbish about \u201cenhanced interrogation\u201d anywhere in this apologia for what the author frankly calls \u201ctorture\u201d.  Nor is there the intelligence-insulting pretense that waterboarding is not torture, much less waterboarding 183 times.  There is just the straight-up statement that in a tradeoff between torturing some goon and saving five million people, we should go ahead and torture, normative Church teaching about it being intrinsically immoral be damned.  And there is the equally refreshing and plain suggestion that only people with preening moralistic pride and no sense of proportion could possibly have a problem with approving such a supposedly clear moral choice.<\/p>\n<p>I like that.  You know where you stand.<\/p>\n<p>Only here\u2019s the the thing: such rhetoric does not stay still over time.  While Catholics have been quibbling over the meaning of torture for the past four years, reluctant to admit that they are, in fact, defending torture, non-Christians like <a href=\"http:\/\/www.weeklystandard.com\/Content\/Public\/Articles\/000\/000\/006\/400rhqav.asp?pg=2\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"nofollow\">Charles Krauthammer<\/a>, unfettered by the need for squaring torture with the circle of Catholic doctrine, have been frank about their insistence on the moral imperative of torture since 2005:<\/p>\n<blockquote><p>Let\u2019s take the textbook case. Ethics 101: A terrorist has planted a nuclear bomb in New York City. It will go off in one hour. A million people will die. You capture the terrorist. He knows where it is. He\u2019s not talking.<\/p>\n<p>Question: If you have the slightest belief that hanging this man by his thumbs will get you the information to save a million people, are you permitted to do it?<\/p>\n<p>Now, on most issues regarding torture, I confess tentativeness and uncertainty. But on this issue, there can be no uncertainty: Not only is it permissible to hang this miscreant by his thumbs. It is a moral duty.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n<p>No beating around the bush here.  No definitional mickey mouse games about \u201cWhat O what is torture?\u201d  Not even the fine-tuned jesuitical sophistries about whether torture is gravely evil.  Just the refreshing and straight forward claim that we must do evil (\u201cterrible things\u201d) that good may come of it.  He was, then, where the Catholic torture defenders are finally admitting they are now. And (note carefully) he expressly says that you should torture, not if you are absolutely certain your victim has the info, but if you have \u201cthe slightest belief\u201d he might.<\/p>\n<p>But that was four years ago.  How has Krauthammer progressed in his thinking?  Well, he is certainly still four-square in favor of torture.  However, now his rhetoric has changed.  Forget a <em>million <\/em>innocents.  <a href=\"http:\/\/www.washingtonpost.com\/wp-dyn\/content\/article\/2009\/04\/30\/AR2009043003108.html\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"nofollow\">Just one will do<\/a>:<\/p>\n<blockquote><p>An innocent\u2019s life is at stake. The bad guy you have captured possesses information that could save this life. He refuses to divulge. In such a case, the choice is easy.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n<p>So we\u2019re no longer even talking about the War on Terror.  Just ordinary police investigations for kidnapping or conspiracy to murder.  If you have \u201cthe slightest belief\u201d that torture might turn something up from your interrogation suspect, then torture away.<\/p>\n<p>So where does this instantly lead the moment our head clears from the visions of a new 9\/11?  To the obvious conclusion that, if you don\u2019t have the suspect in your grasp, you should be torturing his family members to a) find out where he is and b) (once you have established contact with him) make sure he understands you mean business if he won\u2019t cooperate, of course.  When his little girl starts to scream and beg for mercy over the cell phone link, he\u2019ll get the idea.<\/p>\n<p>You will naturally object that torturing wives and children to get information is unjust since they are innocent.  But, as Fr. Harrison has explained to us, while torture for punishment is intrinsically immoral, torture to \u201cobtain information\u201d is still (just barely possibly) legitimate.  And that\u2019s all most Catholic torture defenders have needed to conclude that torture is just fine to save lives: a \u201cprudential judgement\u201d according to some figures in Catholic media.  <\/p>\n<p>But, even if we don\u2019t worry your head about Fr. Harrison\u2019s fine-tune parsing of the Tradition and just go for Krauthammer\u2019s straight up claim that brutal practicality means you have to do evil to do good sometimes, you still arrive at the same point: since you have to do \u201cmorally poisonous\u201d things in order to defeat evil, what\u2019s one more morally poisonous thing?  <\/p>\n<p>Now, perhaps you are troubled by the notion of torturing a little girl in order to save one life?  Okay.  Forget saving a single life.  Get back to that beloved \u201csave New York\u201d scenario, with its common denunciation of moral idiots who can\u2019t see that saving five million people is worth the cost of torturing (and maybe accidently killing, oops!) one person.  Make that trade and, to quote the Anchoress:  Surely, you \u201cwon\u2019t have to answer for standing idly by and watching it so that [your] morals might remain intact\u201d? Surely, you \u201cwill take the chance that [your] moral failing in that instance will simply join [your] other moral failings in life, and then God and [you] will work that stuff out\u201d?<\/p>\n<p>So go ahead, you moral idiot!  Torture the kid if you have \u201cthe slightest belief\u201d it will save those lives.  You\u2019re not vindictive!  You\u2019re not doing it for punishment, but to save innocent lives!  What\u2019s one screaming child, begging for mercy, in the grand scheme of things?<\/p>\n<p>****<\/p>\n<p>Some time ago, Zippy wrote a piece called \u201c<a href=\"http:\/\/zippycatholic.blogspot.com\/2005\/11\/hypothetical-sin-and-pure-evil.html\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"nofollow\">Sinning by Hypotheticals<\/a>\u201c.  No small part of the \u201ctorture debate\u201d is that it urges and encourages Catholics to dwell on ways in which they might sin gravely while assuring their consciences that they are courageously making the \u201chard choices\u201d while pantywaists are wringing their hands about moral niceties.  That is, it is to <em>tempt people to approving of grave evil<\/em>.  The very first response to the Anchoress\u2019 apologia for torture was from a troubled soul who is tempted to conclude, \u201cI\u2019m willing to concede that sometimes, a grave evil is necessary.\u201d  <\/p>\n<p>The exact theological description of somebody who is struggling with that thought is \u201ctemptation\u201d.  It is obvious she does not *want* to conclude this (because her Christian training, particularly if she is a Catholic) includes the absolute insistence that this is a lie.  But the scenario, as presented, tempts her to believe this lie.<\/p>\n<p>She continues:<\/p>\n<blockquote><p>What scares me is the ideological creep. I think very few people would object to the nuclear holocaust scenario. What scares me is that more and more people seem to be clamoring for more strenuous methods to save a far smaller number. And where does that sliding scale stop? Two thousand years ago, the Sanhedrin turned over a suspected terrorist, already responsible for a riot outside the temple in Jerusalem, for torture and execution because to not do so would be to risk Roman wrath against all of Israel. Look, now, how we view them.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n<p>She does well to resist the \u201cideological creep\u201d and may God guide her away from the snare. The Holy Spirit is at work in that resistance. <\/p>\n<p>For what is being proposed, once you get past the cinematic appeals to pure emotion with the hairy thug and the ticking bomb about to destroy the glittering city, is indeed the logic that it is necessary for one person to die that a whole nation may not perish (as Caiaphas adroitly put it).  Of course, the Anchoress doesn\u2019t mean for it to go there.  She says, \u201cI don\u2019t want to kill the guy I\u2019m torturing. But I want to save 5 million lives.\u201d  And so, no doubt, she does.  She also doesn\u2019t mean for it to go to torturing innocents.  But here\u2019s the thing: In closely tailored hypothetical scenarios like Krauthammer\u2019s and the Anchoress\u2019, your victim is always the brutish SOB that nobody will miss. You don\u2019t want to kill him of course, because you are the Good Guy. And the reason he is your victim is because he\u2019s the guilty guy.  <\/p>\n<p>But in real life, there is no necessary correlation between the guilt of the torture victims and the amount of useful information torturing them might yield.  The Soviets could, no doubt, point to lots of times torturing the families of suspects (real murderous criminals, I mean, not mere political prisoners) yielded useful information PDQ.  But, despite what were no doubt good intentions on the part of many a dedicated enhanced interrogation practitioner, quite a number of innocents died once the state concluded that the Need of the Many outweigh the needs of the few.<\/p>\n<p>That\u2019s thing about all this: ideas have consequences.  Once you embrace \u201clet us do evil that good may come of it\u201d there\u2019s no final limit.  Like all the devil\u2019s Faustian bargains, it seems promising at the time, but payoff\u2019s a bitch.<\/p>\n<div class=\"blogger-post-footer\"><\/div>\n<\/body><\/html>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>A reader writes: Dear God what have we come to? Once abortion is cast into the fiery dustbins of history from whence it came, will torture take its place as the next grave evil threatening our livelihood and well-being? What do these guys not get about Gaudium et Spes 27, CCC 2297, the bull of [&hellip;]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":92,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[1],"tags":[],"class_list":["post-6870","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","hentry","category-uncategorized"],"yoast_head":"<!-- This site is optimized with the Yoast SEO plugin v21.1 - https:\/\/yoast.com\/wordpress\/plugins\/seo\/ -->\n<title>Rhetorical creep<\/title>\n<meta name=\"description\" content=\"A reader writes:Dear God what have we come to? 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