{"id":3382,"date":"2008-10-19T13:51:00","date_gmt":"2008-10-19T13:51:00","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/religionprof\/2008\/10\/when-christians-disagree-church-and-state\/"},"modified":"2008-10-19T13:51:00","modified_gmt":"2008-10-19T13:51:00","slug":"when-christians-disagree-church-and-state","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/religionprof\/2008\/10\/when-christians-disagree-church-and-state.html","title":{"rendered":"When Christians Disagree: Church and State"},"content":{"rendered":"<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC \"-\/\/W3C\/\/DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional\/\/EN\" \"http:\/\/www.w3.org\/TR\/REC-html40\/loose.dtd\">\n<html><head><meta http-equiv=\"content-type\" content=\"text\/html; charset=utf-8\"><meta http-equiv=\"content-type\" content=\"text\/html; charset=utf-8\"><\/head><body><p>Today in my <a href=\"http:\/\/crookedcreekbaptistchurch.blogspot.com\/2008\/10\/church-and-state.html\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"nofollow\">Sunday School class<\/a> we finished our introductory topic on the Bible in the \u201cWhen Christians Disagree\u201d series. We looked at the example of circumcision, which in Genesis 17 is quite plainly said to be a permanent and absolute condition of membership in the covenant people, even for those not actually descended from Abraham. We then turned to Acts 15 and looked at how the church (or at least <em>part <\/em>of the church) decided that it was going to do something different than what a plain reading of Genesis 17 would require. Reading Acts and Paul\u2019s letters as Scripture, it can be hard for Christians to put themselves in the situation of the time in which they were written, when these texts were not yet Scripture, and were making the case for something that seemed to many to represent a departure from Scripture.<\/p>\n<p>In Acts 15, as also in Galatians, the argument seems to allow experience to trump Scripture. God had shown acceptance of Gentiles by pouring out the Holy Spirit on them while uncircumcised. If God had accepted them in this way, who are we to impose other requirements upon them? To get a sense of how this argument seemed to many Jewish Christians in the first century, one may usefully compare the topic of homosexuality, in connection with which many today might make a similar argument\u2026<\/p>\n<p><a href=\"https:\/\/hiscrivener.files.wordpress.com\/2008\/07\/church-state.jpg\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"nofollow\"><img decoding=\"async\" alt=\"\" src=\"https:\/\/hiscrivener.files.wordpress.com\/2008\/07\/church-state.jpg\" border=\"0\"><\/a>As we turn to various topics on which Christians disagree, there are <a href=\"http:\/\/notes-from-offcenter.com\/2008\/10\/19\/church-diversity-and-representation\/\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"nofollow\">other factors<\/a> beside the Bible that we\u2019ll need to consider, such as reason, tradition, and experience. The Bible can of course be thought of in different ways: as a source of writings which are authoritative on Christian doctrine and practice, or as a source or writings which allow us to see examples of how the earliest Church worked through issues, themselves making use of Scripture, reason, tradition and experience.<\/p>\n<p>The biggest news is perhaps that we have chosen our next major topic for the \u201cWhen Christians Disagree\u201d series: \u201cChurch and State\u201d. It was on our list, and seems particularly timely (we\u2019ll probably finish with the topic in early November). We will begin next week. We did not have a chance to discuss what we\u2019d read to prepare, but I\u2019d suggest that, in addition to the <a href=\"http:\/\/www.telecomtally.com\/blog\/2008\/10\/adams_to_jefferson_on_the_ten_commandments.html\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"nofollow\">Ten Commandments<\/a> and some of the places where Paul and Revelation mention those in authority, we should also read the <a href=\"http:\/\/www.law.cornell.edu\/constitution\/constitution.billofrights.html\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\">first amendment <\/a>to the U.S. Constitution, since that is a key component in the distinctive form that debates on this topic take in an American context.<\/p>\n<div class=\"blogger-post-footer\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" width=\"1\" height=\"1\" src=\"https:\/\/blogger.googleusercontent.com\/tracker\/7622297540113836091-3461892234947149466?l=exploringourmatrix.blogspot.com\" alt=\"\"><\/div>\n<\/body><\/html>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Today in my Sunday School class we finished our introductory topic on the Bible in the \u201cWhen Christians Disagree\u201d series. We looked at the example of circumcision, which in Genesis 17 is quite plainly said to be a permanent and absolute condition of membership in the covenant people, even for those not actually descended from [&hellip;]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":136,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[1],"tags":[],"class_list":["post-3382","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","hentry","category-uncategorized"],"yoast_head":"<!-- This site is optimized with the Yoast SEO plugin v21.1 - https:\/\/yoast.com\/wordpress\/plugins\/seo\/ -->\n<title>When Christians Disagree: Church and State<\/title>\n<meta name=\"description\" content=\"Today in my Sunday School class we finished our introductory topic on the Bible in the &quot;When Christians Disagree&quot; series. We looked at the example of\" \/>\n<meta name=\"robots\" content=\"index, follow, max-snippet:-1, max-image-preview:large, max-video-preview:-1\" \/>\n<link rel=\"canonical\" href=\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/religionprof\/2008\/10\/when-christians-disagree-church-and-state.html\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:locale\" content=\"en_US\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:type\" content=\"article\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:title\" content=\"When Christians Disagree: Church and State\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:description\" content=\"Today in my Sunday School class we finished our introductory topic on the Bible in the &quot;When Christians Disagree&quot; series. We looked at the example of\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:url\" content=\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/religionprof\/2008\/10\/when-christians-disagree-church-and-state.html\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:site_name\" content=\"Religion Prof: The Blog of James F. 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