{"id":5757,"date":"2012-11-07T17:47:50","date_gmt":"2012-11-07T22:47:50","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/?p=5757"},"modified":"2012-11-08T17:44:31","modified_gmt":"2012-11-08T22:44:31","slug":"dennetts-thesis-isnt-evidence-for-very-interesting-claims","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/2012\/11\/dennetts-thesis-isnt-evidence-for-very-interesting-claims.html","title":{"rendered":"Dennett&#8217;s Thesis isn&#8217;t Evidence for Very Interesting Claims"},"content":{"rendered":"<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC \"-\/\/W3C\/\/DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional\/\/EN\" \"http:\/\/www.w3.org\/TR\/REC-html40\/loose.dtd\">\n<html><head><meta http-equiv=\"content-type\" content=\"text\/html; charset=utf-8\"><meta http-equiv=\"content-type\" content=\"text\/html; charset=utf-8\"><\/head><body><p><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-media.patheos.com\/blogs\/sites\/84\/2012\/11\/religious-evolution.jpg\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"aligncenter size-full wp-image-5759\" title=\"religious evolution\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-media.patheos.com\/blogs\/sites\/84\/2012\/11\/religious-evolution.jpg\" alt=\"\" width=\"255\" height=\"198\"><\/a><\/p>\n<p><em>This post is part of\u00a0<a href=\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/2012\/11\/reading-dennetts-breaking-the-spell-index-post.html\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\">a series discussing Daniel Dennett\u2019s\u00a0<\/a><\/em><a href=\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/2012\/11\/reading-dennetts-breaking-the-spell-index-post.html\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\">Breaking the Spell<\/a><em>.<\/em><\/p>\n<p>The main thrust of Daniel Dennett\u2019s\u00a0<em><a href=\"http:\/\/www.amazon.com\/gp\/product\/0143038338\/ref=as_li_qf_sp_asin_il_tl?ie=UTF8&amp;camp=1789&amp;creative=9325&amp;creativeASIN=0143038338&amp;linkCode=as2&amp;tag=unequyoked-20\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"nofollow\">Breaking the Spell<\/a><\/em> is that the history of religion is not\u00a0incompatible\u00a0with evolutionary theory. \u00a0That sounds a lot less exciting than an attack on religion, but it\u2019s what the book is actually about. \u00a0Dennett\u2019s book doesn\u2019t mount up any direct evidence against the truth claims of religion, but it does make the argument that religion is something you might be reasonably likely to observe in a world where there was no god. \u00a0That means the mere existence of religion is not strong evidence for the existence of god. \u00a0Fine and dandy.<\/p>\n<p>But that\u2019s not really so big a claim. \u00a0This is the same basic argument that evolutionary scientists have over a seemingly maladaptive trait or altruism. \u00a0Is this phenomenon the kind of thing we really\u00a0<em>wouldn\u2019t\u00a0<\/em>expect to see given what we know about evolution? \u00a0There are a variety of ways to try to explore these questions. \u00a0Sometimes we can play around with simpler analogues in species that reproduce and evolve swiftly and come up with general rules (like sex-signalling can turn into an our of control arms race). \u00a0Sometimes we can monkey around within a population and see what animals are using as signals (playing different parts of song to see which are mating calls and which are alerts, showing college students silhouettes with different waist to hip ratios). \u00a0And sometimes, we\u2019re just using our imagination, to see if there\u2019s a plausible path from a precursor creature to the behavior we know today.<\/p>\n<p>I\u2019m not knocking that method, mind you. \u00a0It can help us make predictions that we can test using the fossil or\u00a0artifact\u00a0record. \u00a0But Dennett does tend to treat it as a little more definitive than I would. \u00a0A plausible path from A to B may be more of a testament to human ingenuity than to the\u00a0likelihood\u00a0of a certain cultural practice emerging due to evolutionary cruft.<\/p>\n<p>At a certain point in the book, Dennett admits that all the data and speculation he\u2019s mounting up doesn\u2019t have much to say about the truth claims (metaphysical, historical, or ethical) of any\u00a0religion:<\/p>\n<blockquote><p>\u201cNotice, too, that this [universality] leaves wide open the possibility that divination\u2026 is a mutualist meme because it\u2019s <em>true<\/em> \u2026After all, the reason why water is deemed essential to life in every human culture is that it <em>is<\/em> essential to life. For the moment, though, my point is just that divination, which appears just about everywhere in human culture\u2026 could be understood as a natural phenomenon, paying for itself in the biological coin of replication, whether or not it is actually a source of reliable information\u201d<\/p><\/blockquote>\n<p>The obvious next question is how you would test whether divination is a cultural\u00a0replicator\u00a0because it\u2019s a guide to truth or whether it\u2019s remains popular for some other reason. \u00a0Dennett comes round to this question for the god proposition near the end of the book, and I\u2019ll hit that section tomorrow. \u00a0But before we tackle those specific arguments, I think I\u2019ve got a handy inversion to explain why the kind of evidence Dennett is gathering isn\u2019t that relevant to an atheist vs theist argument.<\/p>\n<p>Dennett asks repeatedly \u201c<em>Cui bono<\/em>?\u201d \u00a0Who benefits from a particular cultural practice? \u00a0How is it paying for itself, is the currency increased access to food? Mates? Resistance to disease? \u00a0But if a cultural practice benefiting people is a cue that it\u2019s stated claims aren\u2019t trustworthy, because they can be explained away, than we\u2019re heading into really wacky epistemological territory.<\/p>\n<p>\u201cYou can totally trust my philosophy, because living it is nearly impossible, really lowers the chance you\u2019ll reproduce, and takes a major toll on your health. \u00a0It\u2019s so\u00a0evolutionarily\u00a0disadvantageous it is \u00a0sustained only by our\u00a0commitment\u00a0to Truth, no matter the cost!\u201d<\/p>\n<p>I foresee a <a href=\"http:\/\/en.wikipedia.org\/wiki\/Stylites\" class=\" decorated-link\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"nofollow\">Stylite<\/a> boom. \u00a0Reserve your pillars now.<\/p>\n<p>\u00a0<\/p>\n<\/body><\/html>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>This post is part of\u00a0a series discussing Daniel Dennett\u2019s\u00a0Breaking the Spell. The main thrust of Daniel Dennett\u2019s\u00a0Breaking the Spell is that the history of religion is not\u00a0incompatible\u00a0with evolutionary theory. \u00a0That sounds a lot less exciting than an attack on religion, but it\u2019s what the book is actually about. \u00a0Dennett\u2019s book doesn\u2019t mount up any direct [&hellip;]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":127,"featured_media":5759,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[6,8],"tags":[82],"class_list":["post-5757","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-atheism","category-reviewsrecommendations","tag-evo-psych"],"yoast_head":"<!-- This site is optimized with the Yoast SEO plugin v21.1 - https:\/\/yoast.com\/wordpress\/plugins\/seo\/ -->\n<title>Dennett&#039;s Thesis isn&#039;t Evidence for Very Interesting Claims<\/title>\n<meta name=\"description\" content=\"This post is part of\u00a0a series discussing Daniel Dennett&#039;s\u00a0Breaking the Spell. The main thrust of Daniel Dennett&#039;s\u00a0Breaking the Spell is that the history\" \/>\n<meta name=\"robots\" content=\"index, follow, max-snippet:-1, max-image-preview:large, max-video-preview:-1\" \/>\n<link rel=\"canonical\" href=\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/2012\/11\/dennetts-thesis-isnt-evidence-for-very-interesting-claims.html\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:locale\" content=\"en_US\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:type\" content=\"article\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:title\" content=\"Dennett&#039;s Thesis isn&#039;t Evidence for Very Interesting Claims\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:description\" content=\"This post is part of\u00a0a series discussing Daniel Dennett&#039;s\u00a0Breaking the Spell. The main thrust of Daniel Dennett&#039;s\u00a0Breaking the Spell is that the history\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:url\" content=\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/2012\/11\/dennetts-thesis-isnt-evidence-for-very-interesting-claims.html\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:site_name\" content=\"Unequally Yoked\" \/>\n<meta property=\"article:published_time\" content=\"2012-11-07T22:47:50+00:00\" \/>\n<meta property=\"article:modified_time\" content=\"2012-11-08T22:44:31+00:00\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:image\" content=\"https:\/\/wp-media.patheos.com\/blogs\/sites\/84\/2012\/11\/religious-evolution.jpg\" \/>\n\t<meta property=\"og:image:width\" content=\"255\" \/>\n\t<meta property=\"og:image:height\" content=\"198\" \/>\n\t<meta property=\"og:image:type\" content=\"image\/jpeg\" \/>\n<meta name=\"author\" content=\"Leah Libresco\" \/>\n<meta name=\"twitter:card\" content=\"summary_large_image\" \/>\n<meta name=\"twitter:label1\" content=\"Written by\" \/>\n\t<meta name=\"twitter:data1\" content=\"Leah Libresco\" \/>\n\t<meta name=\"twitter:label2\" content=\"Est. reading time\" \/>\n\t<meta name=\"twitter:data2\" content=\"3 minutes\" \/>\n<script type=\"application\/ld+json\" class=\"yoast-schema-graph\">{\"@context\":\"https:\/\/schema.org\",\"@graph\":[{\"@type\":\"WebPage\",\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/2012\/11\/dennetts-thesis-isnt-evidence-for-very-interesting-claims.html\",\"url\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/2012\/11\/dennetts-thesis-isnt-evidence-for-very-interesting-claims.html\",\"name\":\"Dennett's Thesis isn't Evidence for Very Interesting Claims\",\"isPartOf\":{\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/#website\"},\"datePublished\":\"2012-11-07T22:47:50+00:00\",\"dateModified\":\"2012-11-08T22:44:31+00:00\",\"author\":{\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/#\/schema\/person\/17ee17592b35b40040d5f5f7ea5ab464\"},\"description\":\"This post is part of\u00a0a series discussing Daniel Dennett's\u00a0Breaking the Spell. The main thrust of Daniel Dennett's\u00a0Breaking the Spell is that the history\",\"breadcrumb\":{\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/2012\/11\/dennetts-thesis-isnt-evidence-for-very-interesting-claims.html#breadcrumb\"},\"inLanguage\":\"en-US\",\"potentialAction\":[{\"@type\":\"ReadAction\",\"target\":[\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/2012\/11\/dennetts-thesis-isnt-evidence-for-very-interesting-claims.html\"]}]},{\"@type\":\"BreadcrumbList\",\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/2012\/11\/dennetts-thesis-isnt-evidence-for-very-interesting-claims.html#breadcrumb\",\"itemListElement\":[{\"@type\":\"ListItem\",\"position\":1,\"name\":\"Home\",\"item\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\"},{\"@type\":\"ListItem\",\"position\":2,\"name\":\"Dennett&#8217;s Thesis isn&#8217;t Evidence for Very Interesting Claims\"}]},{\"@type\":\"WebSite\",\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/#website\",\"url\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/\",\"name\":\"Unequally Yoked\",\"description\":\"\",\"potentialAction\":[{\"@type\":\"SearchAction\",\"target\":{\"@type\":\"EntryPoint\",\"urlTemplate\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/?s={search_term_string}\"},\"query-input\":\"required name=search_term_string\"}],\"inLanguage\":\"en-US\"},{\"@type\":\"Person\",\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/#\/schema\/person\/17ee17592b35b40040d5f5f7ea5ab464\",\"name\":\"Leah Libresco\",\"image\":{\"@type\":\"ImageObject\",\"inLanguage\":\"en-US\",\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/#\/schema\/person\/image\/\",\"url\":\"https:\/\/secure.gravatar.com\/avatar\/20e1e6a3a94c4e7928687804a41d888d?s=96&d=mm&r=r\",\"contentUrl\":\"https:\/\/secure.gravatar.com\/avatar\/20e1e6a3a94c4e7928687804a41d888d?s=96&d=mm&r=r\",\"caption\":\"Leah Libresco\"},\"description\":\"Leah is the author of Arriving at Amen and Building the Benedict Option. Her further writing can be found at leahlibresco.com.\",\"url\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/author\/leahlibresco\"}]}<\/script>\n<!-- \/ Yoast SEO plugin. -->","yoast_head_json":{"title":"Dennett's Thesis isn't Evidence for Very Interesting Claims","description":"This post is part of\u00a0a series discussing Daniel Dennett's\u00a0Breaking the Spell. The main thrust of Daniel Dennett's\u00a0Breaking the Spell is that the history","robots":{"index":"index","follow":"follow","max-snippet":"max-snippet:-1","max-image-preview":"max-image-preview:large","max-video-preview":"max-video-preview:-1"},"canonical":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/2012\/11\/dennetts-thesis-isnt-evidence-for-very-interesting-claims.html","og_locale":"en_US","og_type":"article","og_title":"Dennett's Thesis isn't Evidence for Very Interesting Claims","og_description":"This post is part of\u00a0a series discussing Daniel Dennett's\u00a0Breaking the Spell. The main thrust of Daniel Dennett's\u00a0Breaking the Spell is that the history","og_url":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/2012\/11\/dennetts-thesis-isnt-evidence-for-very-interesting-claims.html","og_site_name":"Unequally Yoked","article_published_time":"2012-11-07T22:47:50+00:00","article_modified_time":"2012-11-08T22:44:31+00:00","og_image":[{"width":"255","height":"198","url":"https:\/\/wp-media.patheos.com\/blogs\/sites\/84\/2012\/11\/religious-evolution.jpg","type":"image\/jpeg"}],"author":"Leah Libresco","twitter_card":"summary_large_image","twitter_misc":{"Written by":"Leah Libresco","Est. reading time":"3 minutes"},"schema":{"@context":"https:\/\/schema.org","@graph":[{"@type":"WebPage","@id":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/2012\/11\/dennetts-thesis-isnt-evidence-for-very-interesting-claims.html","url":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/2012\/11\/dennetts-thesis-isnt-evidence-for-very-interesting-claims.html","name":"Dennett's Thesis isn't Evidence for Very Interesting Claims","isPartOf":{"@id":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/#website"},"datePublished":"2012-11-07T22:47:50+00:00","dateModified":"2012-11-08T22:44:31+00:00","author":{"@id":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/#\/schema\/person\/17ee17592b35b40040d5f5f7ea5ab464"},"description":"This post is part of\u00a0a series discussing Daniel Dennett's\u00a0Breaking the Spell. The main thrust of Daniel Dennett's\u00a0Breaking the Spell is that the history","breadcrumb":{"@id":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/2012\/11\/dennetts-thesis-isnt-evidence-for-very-interesting-claims.html#breadcrumb"},"inLanguage":"en-US","potentialAction":[{"@type":"ReadAction","target":["https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/2012\/11\/dennetts-thesis-isnt-evidence-for-very-interesting-claims.html"]}]},{"@type":"BreadcrumbList","@id":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/2012\/11\/dennetts-thesis-isnt-evidence-for-very-interesting-claims.html#breadcrumb","itemListElement":[{"@type":"ListItem","position":1,"name":"Home","item":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked"},{"@type":"ListItem","position":2,"name":"Dennett&#8217;s Thesis isn&#8217;t Evidence for Very Interesting Claims"}]},{"@type":"WebSite","@id":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/#website","url":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/","name":"Unequally Yoked","description":"","potentialAction":[{"@type":"SearchAction","target":{"@type":"EntryPoint","urlTemplate":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/?s={search_term_string}"},"query-input":"required name=search_term_string"}],"inLanguage":"en-US"},{"@type":"Person","@id":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/#\/schema\/person\/17ee17592b35b40040d5f5f7ea5ab464","name":"Leah Libresco","image":{"@type":"ImageObject","inLanguage":"en-US","@id":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/#\/schema\/person\/image\/","url":"https:\/\/secure.gravatar.com\/avatar\/20e1e6a3a94c4e7928687804a41d888d?s=96&d=mm&r=r","contentUrl":"https:\/\/secure.gravatar.com\/avatar\/20e1e6a3a94c4e7928687804a41d888d?s=96&d=mm&r=r","caption":"Leah Libresco"},"description":"Leah is the author of Arriving at Amen and Building the Benedict Option. Her further writing can be found at leahlibresco.com.","url":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/author\/leahlibresco"}]}},"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/5757","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/127"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=5757"}],"version-history":[{"count":0,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/5757\/revisions"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/5759"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=5757"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=5757"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/unequallyyoked\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=5757"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}