Christian Rapper Preaches at a Public Middle School in South Carolina

Read this message from the ACLU and try not to get furious:

Recently, a South Carolina middle school held a worship rally that sought to convert students to Christianity. The worship rally took place during an in-school assembly and featured a Christian rapper, a sermon delivered by a local minister, and volunteers who prayed with students, urging the students to accept Jesus Christ. The school district may be planning to hold similar rallies at other schools.

More specifically, New Heights Middle School in Jefferson, South Carolina invited Christian rapper B-SHOC (a.k.a. Bryan Edmonds) to speak at an assembly on September 1^st. Here’s how that went down (the relevant part begins at the 3:04 mark):

He actually posted that video and then quickly removed it when he realized how much trouble it was going to cause. The video above is the FFRF’s copy of it. I love the Internet… 🙂

Normally, when schools officials who want to proselytize to children invite Christian groups to perform at assemblies, the groups talk about ethics, or staying off of drugs, etc… then they invite children to the local church later that night so they can really proselytize.

This school doesn’t even bother to have a cover.

The Freedom From Religion Foundation can’t believe how bad this case is:

The foundation’s attorney, Rebecca Markert, termed the event “the most egregious” she’s seen in her three years with the non-profit group she said was founded in 1976 to protect the constitutional separation of church and state. Markert said her organization has dealt with dozens of events, mainly in the South, where churches or religious groups seek to enter schools to hold assemblies and talk about a secular issue, such as bullying, alcohol use or drug addiction.

“They speak about that issue, then they invite the kids to an evening pizza event at their local church,” she said. “But this is the most blatant event I have seen, an assembly held during the school day.”

Even worse is when B-SHOC reveals that the school’s principal was guilty of breaking the law at the 3:58 mark:

And so your principal looked at me and I said, “How are you getting away with this?” And he said, “I’m not.” He said, “I’m tired of being a hypocrite. I’m tired of playing the game.” And he said, “I want these kids to know that eternal life is real and I don’t care what happens to me, they gonna hear it today.” And then I got so pumped up! It was that Braveheart moment, like “Just do something, dude, and I will follow you!”

…

And listen, whether you agree with it or disagree with it, I was preaching today and I saw one of the teachers looking at me and shaking her head like, “no. No, no, no.” And I never get mad because they speak about evolution. I tell people all the time, if you teach evolution five days a week, nine months out of the year, then let me have 30 minutes to tell them that Jesus loves them. And I will win because the message of Christ is much deeper, better, stronger and more powerful.

Umm… even in the best of public schools, no one teaches evolution every day. Even if they did, it’s no excuse to push a misguided faith onto gullible young minds. They deserve to be educated, not indoctrinated.

FFRF has already sent the district a letter of complaint (PDF) outlining this Establishment Clause violation. It’s not the only one, either. On the tenth anniversary of the 9/11 attacks, the same school put crosses on the front lawn to symbolize the victims (who, apparently, were all Christian in their fantasy world).

Furthermore, the school promoted a Christian “See You at the Pole” event on the school’s website as if it were sponsored by the school itself and not, say, a Christian club.

It’s pretty clear that administrators at this school are more interested in treating the building as a church instead of a public school and they deserve to be punished for it. My lawsuit teeth are salivating.

The district has not responded back yet… but I can’t wait to hear their excuses. Or maybe their apologies.

Anonymous

This is a principal that deserves to lose his job.
Anonymous

This is a principal that deserves to lose his job.
GentleGiant

I don’t know what’s the most egregious offence… the assembly or the white wannabe gangsta rapper with his Jesus lyrics.
Okay, so the assembly is clearly the winner, but that dude isn’t far behind.
And I don’t even like gangsta rap. :-p
GentleGiant

I don’t know what’s the most egregious offence… the assembly or the white wannabe gangsta rapper with his Jesus lyrics.
Okay, so the assembly is clearly the winner, but that dude isn’t far behind.
And I don’t even like gangsta rap. :-p
almightygod

Here is the contact information for the principal:

Larry Stinson
Phone: 843-658-6830Email: lstinson@chesterfield.k12.sc.us
almightygod

Here is the contact information for the principal:

Larry Stinson
Phone: 843-658-6830Email: lstinson@chesterfield.k12.sc.us
almightygod

Here is the contact information for the principal:

Larry Stinson
Phone: 843-658-6830Email: lstinson@chesterfield.k12.sc.us
logophile

though strictly true, I would say “no one teaches evolution every day” is not quite the full story. Since so much of what we know about science is founded on evolution, some classes really could claim to teach it every day. semantics, I know. part of what I like about this site.
logophile

though strictly true, I would say “no one teaches evolution every day” is not quite the full story. Since so much of what we know about science is founded on evolution, some classes really could claim to teach it every day. semantics, I know. part of what I like about this site.
Matto the Hun

And this guy thinks he a fucking hero for doing this. Disgusting.
This is why religious belief is dangerous. If you are convinced it’s real and that it is the moral authority, then why wouldn’t you break the law, why wouldn’t you not care that someone else has a different belief. To hell with all that because what you are doing is morally right.Of course the opposite is true, you’re a selfish prick who doesn’t give a damn about other’s beliefs, couldn’t care about the law or constitution. It also shows the danger of science/evolution denials and creationism. If you don’t under stand the science of evolution, if you accept religious creationism, then it is likely you view the teaching of evolution as the teaching of atheism or something like atheism. Of course this is not the case, but when dickheads like this principal believe this it further props up the excuses they make to prey on other people’s children.
Matto the Hun

And this guy thinks he a fucking hero for doing this. Disgusting.
This is why religious belief is dangerous. If you are convinced it’s real and that it is the moral authority, then why wouldn’t you break the law, why wouldn’t you not care that someone else has a different belief. To hell with all that because what you are doing is morally right.Of course the opposite is true, you’re a selfish prick who doesn’t give a damn about other’s beliefs, couldn’t care about the law or constitution. It also shows the danger of science/evolution denials and creationism. If you don’t under stand the science of evolution, if you accept religious creationism, then it is likely you view the teaching of evolution as the teaching of atheism or something like atheism. Of course this is not the case, but when dickheads like this principal believe this it further props up the excuses they make to prey on other people’s children.
Johannsone

Meanwhile a billion kids in China did math … hilarious. 30 minutes to teach the power of Christ. Oh no, no, no is right. Hope God helps him keep his job or maybe “He” has a bigger plan for him, which is always the excuse when one loses their job for keeping the faith and keeping it real dog. This is such bullshit. My son probably would have walked out or called bullshit. He’s been sent to the office before for asking that morning prayer group NOT be held on the bus. He won, but still gets called a “homo” to this day.
This is just a blatant disregard to the rules. Rules you ask your students to uphold. That makes you a hypocrite. Idiot.
almightygod

Also, the school board contact info: http://www.chesterfield.k12.sc.us/school_board.html
Tom

I especially like how he says that he doesn’t get mad that they’re teaching evolution as though that somehow makes him better than other people.

Congratulations, dude, you aren’t mad that the teach SCIENCE in a SCHOOL. Let me see if I can find the medal you get for that.
Refused

I almost would suggest to fight stupid with stupid and create leaflets (falsely) stating this person(oid) is an abortion doctor… you know, the good ones, with address etc…
I KNOW that this is very unethical of course, but I could not get this idea out of my head fsor.
Trace

My sister in law, who was a principal in a public school, would see nothing wrong with that. She believes that non Christian parents should have nothing to complain about since they should have more influence over their kids than schools do…or something along those lines.

She of course is very active in her (Christian) church…
Andrew Hall

Three words come to mind: Ice, Ice, baby.
Tasuret

You know what I need to see before I die? B-SHOC vs Greydon Square in a rap battle.
Tasuret

Praise the lawd, he brings goodies
GentleGiant

Word (to your mother?)!
GentleGiant

Word!
mcmoyer

boy, I’d love to see some Islamic org try to get equal time at that school…
Richard Wade

I tell people all the time, if you teach evolution five days a week,
nine months out of the year, then let me have 30 minutes to tell them that Jesus loves them.

NOT WITH TAXPAYERS’ MONEY! Not with publicly-funded facilities. Not with publicly-funded staff. Not with the actual or implied endorsement of a department of the local government. Not with a captive audience.

If you want 30 minutes to sell your religion, then YOU PAY FOR IT. Pay for your own assembly hall, pay for your own advertising, pay for your own liability insurance, pay for your own staff, and then preach to your heart’s content to the people who voluntarily show up.

This is theft. The misappropriation of funds. You are a thief. You made everybody pay for you to promote your particular religion, whether they share your beliefs or not. You owe the citizens of Jefferson a lot of money.

And I will win because the message of Christ is much deeper, better, stronger and more powerful.

You will lose the lawsuit that you richly deserve. The school district will lose money that should buy books, materials, and maintenance. The students have already lost by being given a third-rate education growing up in a world that depends on good science more every day. They’ll be the unskilled manual laborers for the rest of the world. Thanks to your anti-intellectual retrogression, the U.S. is rapidly becoming a third world country.

Enjoy your brief illusion of victory. You’ll soon be in the bread line with these kids you have failed.
Anonymous

I guess this is a new low. But they are in the majority. All they need to do is say they are sorry and hope to not get caught next time. They might think eventually groups like FFRF or the ACLU might go away or give up. They could be right, so this next court case I think the argument has to be made that their school board, administration and teachers need to be taught about the laws of this country and cash penalties and damages need to be assessed to deter this from happening again!
Anonymous

THIS.
Anonymous

There are days when I can’t believe I live in a country where not only is this done but that the people who do it are proud that they are breaking laws and are not at all ashamed of themselves for the theft they perpetrate.

But then I look around and I realize it’s true. And it makes me very sad.
nathan lee

The activist atheistic crowd was handed a silver platter of a case. It’s so easy looking it kind’ve… meh. This is one step away form the principle saying in a mandatory school assembly “if you don’t believe that jesus was a superhuman zombie god, get out of school.”
Anonymous

Because there is so much extra money set aside for public schools to fight lawsuits. Especially since this is settled law, and if they had any sense that would be realized.
Anonymous

I hate my state sometimes. This is settled law, and there is no money to spend defending any action that are this unconstitutional.
Clint Zehner

Adverbs to your third-cousin?
Justin A Smith

It would be all over Fox News the school would be called the terror school and it would be proof of encroaching Sharia Law.
Joshua Zelinsky

So, has anyone found any parents/kids at the school who objected? Getting standing here without that will be tough. If there are any such parents though this school can get fried.
Anonymous

They didn’t break the law. They put the law in a blender, set it to high and then let rip with a “Praise the Lawd!”.

I know we have a 1-4 level scale, but this deserves a special prize for outright, blatant disregard for the Constitution. They not only break the law, they know they’re breaking the law. The “rapper” sings the praises of the principal for saying that he knew he was breaking the law and was going to do it anyway and then later he celebrates being in a PUBLIC school.

Apologies are not going to be enough and neither will be a promise not to do it again. The principal needs to be fired, as well as any other administrator who signed off on this. This needs to be very, very expensive for the school district. They obviously have no respect for the Constitution (yay, just who you want teaching children), so you have to hit them the only place they’ll care: their funding.
guest

Oh this is it – every word of it – especially the reduction of the USA to a nation of ignorant laborers. Could this be the conservative plan?
How I wish statements like Richard Wade’s above would be prominently featured on every possible form of media. Will America wake up? Can the people even wake up anymore?
Anonymous

Agree completely. Firing is the only (temporary) solution for this particular case. Of course, anyone involved in the firing will be deemed a heathen and the principal becomes a martyr for their cause, but I don’t give a rat’s ass. They must be taught, in no uncertain terms, that the religious education and soul-saving they desire cannot occur on public school grounds during school hours, utilizing school money in any way, shape, or form. B-DUDE and the minister and the principal should reimburse the school district for this nonsense… hit them where it hurts, in their wallet, until they understand that brainwashing captive children with religion on the public school’s dime is breaking the law.
GregFromCos

Here is a copy of FFRF’s letter:

http://ffrf.org/uploads/legal/newheights_letter.pdf

It says they have concerned local citizens, but no, mention of parents of students at New Heights.
cr0sh

What I can’t believe is that “B-SHOC” is actually still doing this dreck, especially after his stint with “Icy Hot Stuntaz”. I think I would slink off to do something a bit more quiet (like – work at a McDonalds or something) had I been a part of such a long-running meme-of-ridicule at Fark.

I guess it goes to prove that even bad promotion is still worth something – maybe. Perhaps the drumming from the lawsuit will teach him something that mocking from the ‘tubes couldn’t (doubt it, though).

I’ll give him this, though: “Staying and playing” after being part of one of the funniest memes on the net shows that he at least has dedication to his craft (and I’m not dissing on rap – I love the stuff – and I have no clue how good/bad his talent is, either)…
Rich Wilson

Their district website is also in violation of the American with Disabilities Act. The single most important piece of information to a blind user is the phone number, and yet it’s only embedded in an image with no alternate textual format.
Rich Wilson

The Chesterfield County School District is committed to a policy of nondiscrimination on the basis of age, handicap, national origin, race or sex in its educational programs, activities or employment practices.

There are at least two things missing from that list.
Dos Ekans

And if we’re really lucky it’ll end with a table-flipping. 😉
Curt Cameron

A minor factual point of clarification – the guy who implicated the school’s principal in that video was not the rapper B-SHOC, it was a guy named Christian Chapman, who is apparently something like a promoter for the B-SHOC rap show.
Anonymous

I do not think it wise for people of faith to play the victim card. Public school is not the venue for preaching– constitutionally nor strategically. Better to have a love apologetic than shovering a message down people’s throats
Annie

Do we know if the school paid the rapper and his crew? This video illustrates two important things: Christians are morally corrupt, and they prey on children.
Rich Wilson

Because of this, people in public schools are going to get to know who Jesus Christ is

Ya, because without this, kids in SC would have no idea who Jesus Christ is.
Elliott776

Yea! I’d like to see that!
Annie

Well said. I think a firing of the principal would be the appropriate message to send out to others who have his level of power and perhaps share his ability to completely ignore the law.
Suburban Sweetheart

This is absolutely disgusting. Anyone who had any part in this deserves to be fired, sued & prosecuted to the fullest extent.
Gordon Duffy

I dont get why they need standing if this is illegal. Would it be ok to burn the schol to the ground if nobody dared come forward to complain?
Lisaloo

Several weeks ago, I accompanied my jr high kids to an evening event of “Team Impact” after they saw the short program in school. It was held at the school with one of the local churches sponsering the event. I was raised in a Lutheran/Catholic home and I have NEVER heard anything like the stuff (being nice) that came out of their mouths. Threats of hell, promises to never feel lonely or empty inside again, etc….complete with altar call….I was expecting some kind of upbeat Jesus loves you message…what a total shock! I had one of my kids in tears. On the upside…we had a very positive talk about the separation of church and state and what we believe (or don’t believe).
Joshua Zelinsky

Oh. Wow. Um. So it isn’t that odd to not see “sexual orientation” omitted, but omitting religion? There’s standard boilerplate for these things. So not including it by itself is decent evidence of serious problems at the school. I really hope that this ends up going to trial. These people look like that amazing intersection of people you get at things like the Dover trial where they are too stupid to disguise what they are doing until they get to trial. Then they lie like crazy.
Joshua Zelinsky

The United States has some of the strictest standing rules of any country. This is in contrast to some other countries which have much weaker or no standing rules. For example, Israel has essentially no concept of standing so anyone who thinks an injustice has occurred can bring a suit. (Tangent: Israel also has no notion of writs of certiorari so everything can be appealed to the Supreme Court if one is stubborn enough. It seems that the legal system is set up to fit a fair number of stereotypes about what you’d expect when Jews run a legal system.) Much of Europe does have standing rules but they are much weaker.

The case of burning a school down would be different because that would probably be a criminal issue, where the prosecutors make the decision and standing isn’t necessary.

There have been conflicting precedents about whether being a taxpayer is sufficient to have standing to deal with your money going to unconstitutional issues. Many of the current justices take an extremely narrow interpretation especially when the action is being taken by a state of federal government. Since this is a local issue, being a taxpayer may be sufficient, if they can show that actual funds were spent rather than just student time.

The standing precedents are a serious problem that allows our rights to be trampled and they need to be reformed.

Disclaimer: IANALBMMFMAYO (I am not a lawyer but most of my family members are. Yay osmosis.)
Rich Wilson

I’ve been wondering this. There was a recent case in AZ in which the court upheld the state’s right to issue a tax credit for sending kids to private schools. i.e. very thinly disguised voucher program. The court ruled that the taxpayer plant ifs lacked standing. Although, this was the “just because you pay taxes doesn’t mean you get to complain about how taxes are spent”.
I would hope (but not assume) that this case might be different.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/04/04/supreme-court-upholds-arizona-school-vouchers/

Edit:
ah, here’s the AU PR
http://www.au.org/media/press-releases/archives/2011/04/au-condemns-supreme-court.html
John J. Ronald

Thanks for this clarification. I predict standing will probably not be a problem in this particular case, but the issue of taxpayer standing and the courts’ narrowing interpretation thereof just make me grit my teeth and grind them in frustration. It’s rather like the justices demanding to be shown which bean caused the fart while ignoring the growing stink in the room…the wall of separation and secular civil society begin to die a “death by a thousand cuts” as a result of these constant denials of taxpayer standing vis a vis atheists making church-state separation complaints…
Meme642

What burns me is the digg at evolution….wtf!??!
Anonymous

Wow, as if these children don’t hear about Jesus Christ all day in South Carolina.. geez

but logophile you are right, they don’t teach evolution everyday. Where do they come up with that stuff.
Demonhype

That’s what my mom said a long time ago, though she’ll deny it today (as she does with everything she’s ever been proven wrong about). I told her that that doesn’t give her the right to indoctrinate other people’s kids in school, that leaving people be is the default, and if you want your kids to learn about Jesus it belongs at church or sunday school. It’s not the school’s business to reinforce or validate your faith, much less indoctrinate other people’s kids.

I also asked her how she’d feel if Muslims were doing that. She smugly stated that if Muslims were the majority religion, she wouldn’t have any problem because she’d “have enough influence over her own kids” that she wouldn’t worry about it. I told her how disgusting it is when Christians like her pretend to be so generous as long as the situation is just a hypothetical. Then I told her that she might genuinely believe that–right up until her little girl skips home with her lunch pail and informs her that Jesus was not crucified, that Jesus is neither the son of God nor God himself, and anyone who believes that will burn in hell forever. Then she’d put on her Sunday best and march her ass right to the school, knock on the principal’s door, and demand they stop teaching her children that the major tenets of her religion are evil. She pouted and stopped talking, which is an indication that she knows I’m right. And since then she has denied that she ever thought that or said that.
Reasongal

I sent him an email – in addition to many things, I politely but scathingly advised him that he is guilty of intellectual rape, essentially trapping those kids in there, personally modelling violation of the law, and indulging his “savior-identity” and hubris. God, I am pissed.
Justin

And the superintendent of Chesterfield County Schools:

John E. Williams843-623-2175jwilliams@chesterfield.k12.sc.us
Reve

Oh, hey! That “See You at the Pole” event — my high school (as well as the middle school) is participating in that, too. For the past couple weeks, there have been posters up in the halls and students with T-shirts and badges passing out flyers. I found out about it when a classmate gave me one. (This event involves gathering around the flagpole to pray before school, and it seems to be legal as long as the school itself doesn’t actively encourage/discourage participation.)

That same classmate invited me to her church youth group meeting (after asking me if I was Christian, to which I said no). I went, because I said I would… and apparently she’s in charge of “recruiting” other students, and had a list of people she was supposed to invite! The pastor at the church was encouraging everyone to bring their fellow students to the event, telling them to be Prayer Warriors and all that as he couldn’t come down and talk to the school himself.

I live in a pretty conservative little town, but this whole thing is still a bit of a shock to me…
NathanDST

Smart money’s on Greydon. I subjected myself to a few of B-Shoc’s songs on YouTube, and Greydon has more substance and better lyrics (not just because of the subject matter; Greydon’s just flat out has better lyrical skill).
NathanDST

You’ll soon be in the bread line with these kids you have failed.

Probably not. There’s going to be people willing to listen to him even if he does personally get hit hard by a settlement — maybe even especially if he does.

Unfortunately.
Gordon Duffy

I do’t see the difference because this is criminal!
Joshua Zelinsky

This isn’t criminal though. Violations of rights are generally civil not criminal. And with good reason, if they were criminal among other problems the burden of evidence that a violation had taken place would be a lot higher. In a criminal trial, the standard is beyond a reasonable doubt. In a civil trial it is just preponderance of the evidence. The civil nature also allows specific injunctions and damages to the wronged party.
Anonymous

I looked up a few numbers. The School District says their annual spending per student is $9097. With 180 days per school year, and perhaps 6 hours instructional time per day, that gives a cost per student per hour of around $8.50. (Yes, I know, overly simplistic, but I only had a few minutes.)

That middle school has 598 students. He said they got 30 minutes, but with getting the kids in and out of the assembly, I would estimate that each child lost at least 45 minutes out of their day. Working that out, this clown stole $3,800 worth of instructional time from the taxpayers of that district. Theft indeed.
Anonymous

I looked up a few numbers. The School District says their annual spending per student is $9097. With 180 days per school year, and perhaps 6 hours instructional time per day, that gives a cost per student per hour of around $8.50. (Yes, I know, overly simplistic, but I only had a few minutes.)

That middle school has 598 students. He said they got 30 minutes, but with getting the kids in and out of the assembly, I would estimate that each child lost at least 45 minutes out of their day. Working that out, this clown stole $3,800 worth of instructional time from the taxpayers of that district. Theft indeed.
Anonymous

I looked up a few numbers. The School District says their annual spending per student is $9097. With 180 days per school year, and perhaps 6 hours instructional time per day, that gives a cost per student per hour of around $8.50. (Yes, I know, overly simplistic, but I only had a few minutes.)

That middle school has 598 students. He said they got 30 minutes, but with getting the kids in and out of the assembly, I would estimate that each child lost at least 45 minutes out of their day. Working that out, this clown stole $3,800 worth of instructional time from the taxpayers of that district. Theft indeed.
Anonymous

Yup… in their circles, his persecution will turn him into a martyr for their religious cause… right up there with Joan of Arc. /eyeroll
CassieSteeleFan

no one was forced to come to this event, people came at their own freewill. and they didn’t ‘force’ those kids to get saved, they chose for themselves. and the crosses r just symbolizing the victims of 9/11. and fyi, that principle was the best thing to happen to that school in years…knows all the kids by name…and that is a huge school.
Jeff

As a labor worker myself and atheist, I don’t appreciate your generalization of us all as ignorant, we deserve more respect than that. Without us this country can not function and I think it shows more ignorance to look down on those of us willing to do jobs you do not want to do.
Rich Wilson

As one of my Christian friends rightly pointed out, that’s a very broad brush. A lot of Christians are aghast at this. Americans United has a LOT of Christian members.
Derrik Pates

Seriously? They weren’t bodily forced, but you’re in school, you’re not really given a lot of choice. However, as others have pointed out, how would you like it if it was your kids’ school, and they were teaching a denomination of Christianity you disagreed with? Or Islam? Buddhism? Zoroastrianism? Shinto? I’m guessing you wouldn’t be too happy. Same principle. It’s taxpayer money going to promoting a specific religion, which as others have pointed out, is *not legal*.

Please go read the First Amendment, and read up on the Treaty of Tripoli. Yes, the majority in this country is Christian, but that doesn’t mean that the government can force it down anyone’s throat. Public schools are agents of the government. If you want your kid brought up in a religious school, cough up for private school. Otherwise, this is not the public schools’ job, and for very good reason. You should be happy about this – no one’s forcing you (or your kids) to believe anything you don’t want, you get to choose whatever religion you like. Otherwise go live in a theocracy – but guess what, you can’t pick your religion then…
Rebel Yurack

“See You at the Pole” has been going on for a looooooooooooong time in the Southern states at least. I “attended” one about 15 years ago (ouch) in middle school in Georgia. I’m not sure how long before that they were holding them. Sad to say they almost got me with it all. Fortunately I persevered and ended up where I am today: a happy and aware Atheist!
Rich Wilson

Here’s a press release from AU today about what is and isn’t legal about SYATP.

http://blog.au.org/2011/09/27/see-you-at-the-church-state-wall-flagpole-prayer-organizers-must-play-by-the-rules/
Rebel Yurack

And listen, whether you agree with it or disagree with it, I was preaching today and I saw one of the teachers looking at me and shaking her head like, “no. No, no, no.” And I never get mad because they speak about evolution.

The teacher probably wasn’t shaking her head because she disagreed with B-SHOC. She was likely saying “no” because she was intelligent enough to understand the first amendment, and the problems the district was about to face because of this. I’m willing to be she was embarrassed and angry about what this principal had the audacity to do. I’m also willing to bet her reaction didn’t have anything to do with evolution.
Annie

I agree Rich, and tried to choose my words to stress that those two things were what videos like this teach the outside world… even though the makers felt just the opposite.
Annie

I think they lifted their commitment statement from a Cracker Barrel restaurant… so we can add plagiarism to the list too! 😉
Rich Wilson

oh man, I was all over the tubs in ’01, and I somehow missed that http://www.wiggaz.com/misc/icyhotstuntaz.php
Tex

also if the fire department showed up to the fire alarm during their sound check, how much of the taxpayers money was wasted by having them show up? If Im remembering properly I thought if there wasnt a fire they were supposed to call the department so they didnt have to send multiple trucks and could instead just send over enough people to check on the situation. Not hope they showed up with an invitation to do a show at their church.
Tex

not to mention its un-Christ like to break the law. After all, give unto Cesar that which is Cesar’s…
Rich Wilson

Ah. Got it. It’s about what the video says, not about your opinion. I completely missed that.
Annie

I just reread my original comment, and it wasn’t very clear… my apologies.
JK

That is actually talking about taxes….
Anonymous

Praise be to God that there still exist a few christians who are willing to preach the gospel no matter what the cost.
Richard Wade

Especially when the “cost” is paid by someone else, whether they’re willingly paying the cost or not. The cost of the assembly hall, the staff, the insurance, the wasted instruction time, the electricity, and everything else necessary for that thief to foist his little guerrilla sermon onto those kids was not approved by the taxpayers who paid for it all. They paid for a school to teach their kids language, science, history and math. They didn’t pay to teach them that the majority should force beliefs onto the minority. With the complicity of the principal and the school board staff, he dishonestly and illegally hijacked the school to use it for a purpose for which it was not intended.

You’re basically saying that you approve of stealing, lying, betraying the trust of the public, forcing things on the unwilling, intimidating through coercion, and breaking the law in order to “preach the gospel.” You have the ethics of a Somalian pirate. Lay all that at the feet of Jesus and explain to him how that kind of behavior “glorifies” him.
JustSayin’

Are taxes not something regulated by law?
JustSayin’

Your anecdote is funny, Demonhype, but in an exasperating sort of way. I know this mindset all too well. I repeatedly used to get roped into arguing with my Baptist grandfather over prayer in schools. He refused to see the point that it was MANDATORY prayer that was banned, not voluntary.

But closer to your point, my partner has had the same conversation with his Baptist mother as you’ve had with yours. And when he mentioned the same hypothetical situation that you did, all she could must as a response was, “Well, that’s just silly.”

Ah, religion. “Mine is perfectly logical, but yours is nonsense,” seems to be the line of thinking (for lack of a better term).
Mandi

Yeah, it is quite disgusting that the school would bring in someone to push religion on kids. It’s scary enough being a young atheist without having a public school shove their religion on students. I’m a seventeen year old senior and I remember being the only student in my class to debate against prayer in public school. The other students shouted at me and told me that I should go somewhere else because America was a Christian nation. Besides, shouldn’t the school be having speakers come in that have something to do with a certain subject that is taught? I remember my sophomore year we had an evolutionary biologist come in and talk to us in our biology class about her work with Darwin’s finches. I couldn’t care less about evolution before she came in and spoke. Schools should get speakers that get students interested in academics, not speakers who want to rap about Jesus and murder our brain cells.
Everettattebury

I think a fun response to SYATP would be a “See you at the Pentagram”
Amy

They did have a choice. That choice is currently being investigated. Some say they were to be sent to ISS others say Library.. Either way it wasn’t much of a choice.. I don’t know many children that would opt out of going to a concert vs. where ever they were to go. Furthermore, did you watch the video? They rehearsed how the saving was to go down… Huge point not all of the 9/11 victims were christian. Mr. Stinson did turn the school around, and I don’t believe he really meant to cause harm to any of the kids, but guess what it did. After that rally my son and other kids were harassed, bullied and they are still going through it now. I am in full support of the school board making sure this doesn’t happen again, but if they can’t or wont then there are other organizations that are speaking up that will. What Mr. Stinson did was wrong on alot of levels. What is good for one may not be good for others. This was planned but it wasn’t told about to the school board. They already said they had no idea what was going on, but Stinson said they did and he had their support. Wrong!
Amy

I am one of them that object, and I know of several others including teachers that do also.
Amy

Your right, but they are investigating whether or not the principal used school funds to pay B-Shoc to perform. That would make it criminal.
Joshua Zelinsky

Great! Ok. Next question: Is there anything the rest of us can do to help out?
Artsy

Why don’t you ask what the school was like before this principal. You would find out that the parents, teachers and students respect him. Their test scores have improved! The rapper created this problem by boasting!
NathanDST

Nooooooo, the *principal* created this problem by bringing in the rapper to proselytize, violating the First Amendment. The rapper contributed by going along with it.

And if the principal is somehow responsible for increased test scores, that’s great. However, it in no way absolves him of his actions in this case.
Tim Miller

Good answer, good answer….